Autopsy Saints v Dees

[beside the seaside]

I'd love to see Nas and Hall on the ball more but at the same time they kicked nearly half our goals last week. The forwards need to kick more goals. The thing with Van Rooyen aside from getting looks is he finished them. If Owens could kick he's be an amazing forward but really he's clearly not going to solve that so move him into the middle where he looked damaging in the last quarter.

Forwards need to start finishing their work or we are going nowhere. It's the difference between winning and losing and also that effective tackle stat is damning, must improve that this week.

 

[gringo2011]

Latrelle aBsoLuTeLy LiT uP the G did he Korn? Hahahaha

You could easily see the high potential so it's a fair argument. I really wanted Flanders but I think he's looking C grade at this point. He's a lot like Rylie Bonner. Just does too many fundamental errors and doesn't win his own ball. He's starting to look like he might have been a good player in a good side with no more levels to go to up. At $900k per year you want some level of value for money and not a project GOP. He's closer to Byrnes than Max Hall.

 

[gringo2011]

phantom13 genuine question, what are your thoughts on Caminiti after the weekend? Apologies if you mentioned it earlier

He had a mare but we need to hope he's had a bad day because we don't have many other options unless Marshall drops back.

I thought he was exposed one out a lot which shouldn't happen so easily. Our back 6 structures look all over the place. Silvagni, Wilkie and Hammer were all in the same frame on TV. You only get that when they don't trust each other to do the basics.

 

[gringo2011]

He's gonna play every game then get delisted at the end of the year, the Riley Bonner role they call it.

Bonner was probably better early in the season but he would go long at every opportunity and I think it must have been something he was told not to do.

I think Nas should go back to HB for a while and feed him into the mids slowly. Move LOC into Webster's old role when fit and move Tauru out or shove Hammer forward. The back 7 is diabolical this year.

 

[gringo2011]

Sack SoS

I actually do think he should be on notice. Especially if we've over paid for some B grade top ups. It will bite at some point and has potential to breed internal resentment if it fails.

 

[gringo2011]

Lose this week and its sack the Boss time.

We are almost certain to lose and there is no way they sack him yet. Probably under zero pressure until west coast now.

 

[gringo2011]

Yeh that’s essentially where I’ve landed.

To be fair I don’t think I’ve ever suggested he’s going to become Harris Andrews, I just think he can be a perfectly suitable big bodied lockdown role player in a good structure and system and I maintain that.

We don’t have the defensive structure or system in the last 2 games though (noting I thought he was absolutely fine v Collingwood)

His best comparison would be Liam Jones.

 

[gringo2011]

Now that I've had 24 hours to get over this result......

I'm not feeling anything like as upset.

Look, we've lost two very close games.

Across 240 minutes of footy, the biggest lead we've had is 15 points and the furthest behind we've fallen is 18.

In this free flowing new season, that's about as close as games can get.

We were +23 inside 50s vs Collingwood and +70 disposals vs Melbourne.

Both opponents scored too easily off our turnovers. We didn't execute well enough, around the ground or in front of goal. That resulted in being opened up and our opponents scoring efficiently.

But small, achievable improvements in that area should see tight losses turn into wins.

I've lost the anger and fallen into familiar despair. Just lost the faith that this is a quick turnaround. We still have an ordinary list profile and lots of semi developed and unreliable kids. A lot of hot and cold mid career guys and lacking a Max King sized forward.

 

[gringo2011]

Microscope goes on Flanders when Nas isn't in there.

You can't have a midfield going with Flanders, Macrae and Phillipou. Pou isn't yet the maximum damage, burst athlete we sometimes make him out to be. He often plays quite one paced, but is good in a phone box. So when there's no Nas, it's glaringly obvious we don't have the forward half damage player we need.

If NWM is going to shift between lines then Hall has to play way more midfield time, and Macrae loses his spot. A one-paced midfield profile won't cut it. And I actually think Windhager is better for us off half back than through mids right now. He's been our best thus far.

Macrae looks like a dinosaur. Slow extractors are out of fashion for a reason. Better to feed games into Garcia. We need an extractor like Phillipou or Macrae but definitely not 2 at once.

Dow would actually be a better option than Macrae. He's quite quick but shitty kick. If he can feed the outsiders he'd be handy.

 

[j123]

Can’t both be true?
I don’t have a horse in the race btw, think he’s being misused and if you cross the white line you’re fit

Anyone's who's ever played any competitive sport knows that "if you cross the white line you're fit" is not true at all

 

[Sully111]

Macrae looks like a dinosaur. Slow extractors are out of fashion for a reason. Better to feed games into Garcia. We need an extractor like Phillipou or Macrae but definitely not 2 at once.

Dow would actually be a better option than Macrae. He's quite quick but shitty kick. If he can feed the outsiders he'd be handy.

It's the area Owens should have been trained in from the start. Get the ball, get it out.

 

[gringo2011]

Hall has a massive tank and he’s way fitter than last year.

To be fair, he’s so valuable around goals though, he just doesn't miss “the snap god”

I would move The Viking forward, and start Chitto, Nas & Hall in the guts.

We need 3 of him. He's the best inside 50 kick we have and the prototype modern high half forward who moves up with the play, also our best kick on goal and an excellent inside mid.

 

[bergholt]

I come from old school roots, but if a player is told it is safe to fail, they will inevitably fail. What is wrong with the fear of being dropped or , god forbid, given an old fashioned bake. If a player runs to their manager Curnow style and says they got yelled at in front of the group, then you pull out that weed and next player up.

haha I guess you haven't managed any Gen Zs

 

[gringo2011]

It's the area Owens should have been trained in from the start. Get the ball, get it out.

One of the few actually scoring ATM.

 

[Sully111]

One of the few actually scoring ATM.

He can still spend some time up forward. We need a bull in the midfield. A Dangerfield, Cripps, Fyfe type. He's the one.

Every time Mitch goes in there to ruck there's a different energy.

 

[gringo2011]

And yet as a senior player kicked across the face of goal with a loopy kick to our player that was put under pressure and we conceded a goal. He had the short kick to the closer unmarked player but didn't take it.

I know it was one of many so not just him but we need our senior players to stop doing absolutely brain dead things for a start. The skill error was secondary to the wrong decision in that case.

And I'll line up each of our senior players and give them a bake for costing close to a 6 goal turnaround in both defense and attack.

It feels like we have gifted a game of football, two weeks in a row through a lack of care and consideration. That's what i'd be banging on about all week. Give them the "Plough" treatment about "hounerable" losses.

I have noticed over 2 weeks that we just don't find space or look for it. Both Pies and Dees look to run into open space so teammates have options. We provide nothing for each other. Hill and Byrnes the only two that obviously do it. Wood used to be very good too. Hill only goes risky because nothing else is available.

 

[karaoke]

haha I guess you haven't managed any Gen Zs

As a side note to that, we want our young players to ‘take the game on’ not be fearing the ‘what if I muck this up’ scenario. Hence the safe to fail approach.

I’ve always been of the thought we’ll see 2 parts to the year, the first being us used to playing with each other, the other being when we put this aspect of our game together.

Still thinking we make finals at this point.

Also, I think the footage of Flanders in the offseason series answering Ross’ questions about structure was telling. I think our younger mids are still in a learning stage about what to do in certain stages of game patterns/times. Hence still getting hurt on turnovers due to the lack of set up behind the ball.

OTTNO

 

[The Punter]

This is not effort. I’m sorry but anyone who says the players don’t care doesn’t have a clue.

Now the question remains. Is it the players, game plan or both. Are we jelling, are we switched on?

Being switched on is a demonstration of sufficient care. And here's what I said:

I have lots of thoughts and I'm really pissed off 14 hours afterwards, but here is the crux of it for me:

They don't care enough.

All the easy dropped marks demonstrated a lack of concentration and care.

They don't care enough. As I said yesterday, I stand by this assessment through what I saw at the ground on Sunday.

 

[Mav3rick]

Reported this morning we had several players come in with flu like symptoms, including TDK. Didn’t come from the saints apparently so must’ve been the players managers I guess.

Thought Wilkie didn’t look right at all movement wise, hopefully bounces back this week. GWS just got thumped, they’re gettable.

 

[stavro#4]

We are almost certain to lose and there is no way they sack him yet. Probably under zero pressure until west coast now.

Under the pinnacle of the Boss. His sides would turn up this week and just win.

Stripping everything back. That’s what I’m judging him on this week. His ability to get these boys to the line and ready to go this week.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

You could easily see the high potential so it's a fair argument. I really wanted Flanders but I think he's looking C grade at this point. He's a lot like Rylie Bonner. Just does too many fundamental errors and doesn't win his own ball. He's starting to look like he might have been a good player in a good side with no more levels to go to up. At $900k per year you want some level of value for money and not a project GOP. He's closer to Byrnes than Max Hall.

Not a fair, nor salient argument in the slightest.
Imagine the fans if we went another flighty indigenous small forward. Laughable to suggest it as an alternative.

Flanders has been quite poor but if his floor is 28 @ 80% then it’s no disaster. Zoom out.

Kane is obsessed with US pundits (which are just blokes who yell opinions over each other) and is trying so very hard to become that here. Same bloke who said the Uwlands are the best brothers in the comp btw.

Love you dearly

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Anyone's who's ever played any competitive sport knows that "if you cross the white line you're fit" is not true at all

Except I have and I just said it
Of course it’s not literally true, but if you’re on field everything else is noise

 

[PJays]

GWS just got thumped, they’re gettable.

These are the players they're missing

Taylor - their sole AA last year
Green - Reigning B&F
Cadman - Kicked 44 goals
Bedford
Daniels
Kelly
Jones

 

[phantom13]

His best comparison would be Liam Jones.

I think Jones had more peel off intercept capacity at his peak, i think he was quite good for the dogs in his second stint for a year.

I reckon hes almost more Mick Martyn/Zac Dawson. I dont want the ball in his hands and if he gets it i want him handballing, i want him D50 taking the oppos best and biggest and just wearing him like a ****ing blanket.

Let Wilkie and JSOS do the smart peel off intercept work, Camma has one role and one role only. Do that and you build a defense around it.

 

[MordySaint]

Under the pinnacle of the Boss. His sides would turn up this week and just win.

Stripping everything back. That’s what I’m judging him on this week. His ability to get these boys to the line and ready to go this week.

We have had a problem getting up for games for over a decade now. You can literally tell within the first 5 minutes if we are on or off. It's a major problem.

It's not RTB's fault, it was ongoing with Richo and Ratten.

We have tried everything from meditation, theme songs to running out right before the bounce.

Time to strip it back and just focus on the football, the peripheral stuff just gets in the way