Stats questions

[worbod]

This week WAFL club Claremont Tigers appointed former Richmond and Fremantle player Ashley Prescott as their senior coach for 2021. Prescott previously coached Claremont from 2004-2007, returning an amazing 13 years after his last coaching tenure at this club. Obviously the world is a very different place now from what it was back then.

At AFL/VFL level, does anyone know of any cases of coaches who returned for a second tenure at a club so many years after the first, or any other similar examples in the SANFL, VFL/VFA or WAFL?

Technically Ron Barassi coached Melbourne for one game on a fill-in basis in 1964 and then returned in a full-time capacity in 1981.
Haydn Bunton junior coached Subiaco from 1968 to 1972 before returning in 1984 (until 1992).
Neil Kerley had a 19-year gap with West Adelaide. He finished a coaching stint in 1962 and then returned in 1981 (until 1984, then again in 1992 & 1993).
It looks like the daddy of them all is John Todd who coached South Fremantle in 1959, then came back from 1966 to 1968, and then, 27 years later, coached South Freo again from 1995 to 1998.

 

[Ron The Bear]

At AFL/VFL level, does anyone know of any cases of coaches who returned for a second tenure at a club so many years after the first, or any other similar examples in the SANFL, VFL/VFA or WAFL?

Longest gaps in days

Days	Coach	Club	Date	Previous
8701	Titus, Jack	Rich	1965-05-08	1941-07-12
7189	Harris, Dick D.	Rich	1964-04-18	1944-08-12
6139	Barassi, Ron D.	Melb	1981-03-28	1964-06-06
6132	Hughes senior, Frank	Melb	1965-07-24	1948-10-09
5341	Matthews, J. Herbie	Syd	1954-04-17	1939-09-02
5334	Cazaly, Roy	Syd	1937-04-24	1922-09-16
4955	Rose, Bob	Coll	1985-03-29	1971-09-04
3976	Leonard, Johnny	Syd	1943-07-31	1932-09-10
3570	Sutton, Charlie	W.B.	1967-04-15	1957-07-06
3541	Jesaulenko, Alex	Carl	1989-06-09	1979-09-29
3248	Hickey, Reg	Geel	1949-04-16	1940-05-25
3157	Rattray, Gordon	Fitz	1937-04-24	1928-09-01
3143	Stephen, Bill	Fitz	1979-04-07	1970-08-29

The top two filled in for the ill Len Smith, having previously captain-coached in Dyer's absence on state duty.

Barassi mentioned above filled in for Norm Smith and didn't play on the day.

Checker Hughes returned for a single game during the Norm Smith crisis.

Herbie Matthews had the longest break between full-time stints and didn't coach at another VFL club in the interim, beating Cazaly by a week.

Rose had the longest break as full-time non-playing coach.

 

[Ron The Bear]

The only AFL player I could find close to this was Mark Mickan, who played in the debut season for the Brisbane Bears in 1987 and the Adelaide Crows in 1991.

David Brown - Adel 1991/P.A. 1997

From early VFL

Dick Condon & Charlie Pannam - Coll 1897/Rich 1908
Martin Larkin - played at both Footscray and Hawthorn in 1925

 

[North park]

Looking at the 2021 coaches, 6 have won premierships and mostly early in their coaching careers.

Chris Scott

Chris Scott

Age

47

Ht

182cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.6

4star

K

11.2

4star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.1

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

0.4

3star

No current season stats available

D

13.2

4star

K

10.2

4star

HB

3.0

3star

M

2.2

3star

T

2.8

5star

G

0.4

3star

won in his first season (2011), John Longmire (2012) and Luke Beveridge (2016) in their second season, Alastair Clarkson (2008) in his fourth season and Adam Simpson (2018) in his fifth season. Only Damien Hardwick in his eighth season (2017) took some time to win his first premiership.

Looking back over the past 50 years, all the great coaches won a premiership early in their coaching careers - Hafey, Barassi, Kennedy, Jeans, Sheedy, Matthews. Malthouse won his first premiership in his ninth season (1992) although it was only his third season at West Coast.

How do Hardwick and Malthouse compare to other premiership coaches:

- what is the most seasons before a coach won his first premiership?

- what is the most seasons at one club before a coach won his first premiership?

 

[Ron The Bear]

How do Hardwick and Malthouse compare to other premiership coaches:

- what is the most seasons before a coach won his first premiership?

- what is the most seasons at one club before a coach won his first premiership?

In terms of individual seasons where a coach presided over one or more games:

9th Malthouse
8th Blight, Thompson, Hardwick
7th Smith, Walls
6th McHale, Hughes, Jeans, Williams

Some great names there.

At one club:

8th Thompson, Hardwick
6th McHale, Hughes, Jeans, Williams
5th Worrall, Davis, Matthews, Worsfold, Simpson

 

[JuniorWatch]

Is Bryce Gibbs the only player to go at #1 in 2 drafts?

 

[35Daicos]

Is Bryce Gibbs the only player to go at #1 in 2 drafts?

AFL Draft Picks Broken Down by Pick Number - Draftguru

National Draft Pick #1 - Draftguru
Rookie Draft Pick #1 - Draftguru
Pre-Season Draft Pick #1 - Draftguru
Mid-Season Draft Pick #1 - Draftguru

Jack Martin

21

Jack Martin

Age

29

Ht

186cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.2

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

6.3

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

3.7

5star

G

0.9

4star

D

14.9

4star

K

7.9

3star

HB

7.0

4star

M

4.3

4star

T

3.6

4star

G

1.1

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

4.6

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.6

3star

was pick #1 in the Mini Draft held at the end of 2012 (I think 2 players were taken), and again #1 in the 2020 Pre-Season Draft (held at the end of 2019 - one of 2 players taken). So he probably counts as a two-time number 1 selection! I can't see anyone else who qualifies.

 

[emuboy]

Players change teams for a variety of reasons all the time. Sometimes the player moves are successful, others not. Which are some examples of players who switched clubs and their tenure with the new club only lasted one season, before they immediately moved to a third club (or more rarely went back to the original team)? This doesn't include players who had a one year tenure at a new club and this was their last season, for example veteran Doug Hawkins who went from Footscray to Fitzroy for a final season in 1995, or Paul Hudson

Paul Hudson

Age

53

Ht

185cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.0

3star

K

8.9

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

4.2

4star

T

1.0

3star

G

2.0

5star

No current season stats available

D

13.4

4star

K

8.2

4star

HB

5.2

4star

M

3.8

4star

T

0.6

3star

G

0.2

3star

who ended his stellar career with Hawthorn and the Bulldogs with a final season at Richmond in 2002.

Some examples I can think of are:

Richard Osborne - Moved from Fitzroy after 11 seasons at the Lions in 1982-1992 to Sydney for the 1993 season, then to Footscray in 1994 where he played for 3 seasons, before joining Collingwood for 2 final seasons in 1997 & 1998.

Terry Wallace - Left Hawthorn for Richmond after the 1986 season, but Wallace's tenure at the Tigers was just one season in 1987, before he went to the Bulldogs in 1988-1991.

Stewart Wigney - Traded from Footscray Bulldogs to Sydney Swans after the 1991 season, but after just 1 season for 1 game in Sydney in 1992, Wigney departed for Adelaide for 1993 & 1994, and later played at Richmond.

Barry Mitchell - Mitchell's signature was highly sought after when he left the struggling Swans at the end of the 1992 season. The Magpies won it, but Mitchell's tenure at Collingwood in 1993 was not successful, and Mitchell moved to Carlton for 1994 which worked out better for Mitchell and the Blues.

Brendan Krummel, Chris Groom & Craig Nettlebeck - All were players in Fremantle's first season in 1995, joining the Dockers from West Coast, Adelaide and Sydney respectively. But by the end of the season all had departed, transferring respectively to Hawthorn, North Melbourne and Melbourne.

Justin Murphy - Murphy was traded from Carlton to Geelong after the 2000 season, but after just 1 season at the Cats in 2001 Murphy returned to Carlton in 2002.

 

[RedmanWasHere]

Jonathan Giles

Jonathan Giles

Age

36

Ht

201cm

Wt

101kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.1

3star

K

7.3

3star

HB

3.9

3star

CL

3.3

5star

HO

23.1

5star

No current season stats available

D

13.4

4star

K

8.6

4star

HB

4.8

4star

CL

2.8

5star

HO

23.6

5star

switched from Essendon to West Coast at the end of 2015.

He last played for GWS in 2014.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Daryl Cumming played in 8 consecutive grand finals at Richmond for 7 premierships - 4 x U19, 2 x reserves, 1 x senior and 1 x losing senior GF.

After a decade and life membership at Richmond, he played one season each at Melbourne, North Melbourne and South Melbourne.

 

[emuboy]

Daryl Cumming played in 8 consecutive grand finals at Richmond for 7 premierships - 4 x U19, 2 x reserves, 1 x senior and 1 x losing senior GF.

After a decade and life membership at Richmond, he played one season each at Melbourne, North Melbourne and South Melbourne.

Another intriguing question, how many players played for Melbourne, North Melbourne and South Melbourne/Sydney in their careers?

Paul Bryce played for North, went to Melbourne and then to Sydney in the late 1980s and early 1990s, while Ron Barassi coached all three clubs; any others?

 

[Ron The Bear]

Another intriguing question, how many players played for Melbourne, North Melbourne and South Melbourne/Sydney in their careers?

Paul Bryce played for North, went to Melbourne and then to Sydney in the late 1980s and early 1990s, while Ron Barassi coached all three clubs; any others?

Shane Zantuck and Doug Koop who both played at South when they were still South.

 

[worbod]

Dale Morris played 253 games and ended with one premiership and one Brownlow vote. For players with at least 100 games, are there any with 2 premierships and 2 Brownlow votes, or 3 premierships and 3 Brownlow votes, or maybe 4 and 4, 5 and 5?

 

[Lensen]

Dale Morris played 253 games and ended with one premiership and one Brownlow vote. For players with at least 100 games, are there any with 2 premierships and 2 Brownlow votes, or 3 premierships and 3 Brownlow votes, or maybe 4 and 4, 5 and 5?

Beau McDonald is a 2 flags 2 votes guy but not 100 games
Dylan Grimes a current 3 flag 3 votes player and Kamdyn McIntosh 2 flags 2 votes, but obviously not yet done

 

[Ron The Bear]

Dale Morris played 253 games and ended with one premiership and one Brownlow vote. For players with at least 100 games, are there any with 2 premierships and 2 Brownlow votes, or 3 premierships and 3 Brownlow votes, or maybe 4 and 4, 5 and 5?

In addition to the above

2 & 2 - Matthew Capuano, Peter Caven, Scott Maginness, Jim Baird
3 & 3 - Horrie Edmonds (David Astbury 3 & 1)
4 & 4 - no players
5 & 5 - Charlie Dibbs (half his career played prior to 3-2-1 system)

 

[GrahamClayton]

What is the highest team score in VFL/AFL history when a team scored the same number of points in each half?

 

[35Daicos]

What is the highest team score in VFL/AFL history when a team scored the same number of points in each half?

172 has occurred 3 times (86 points x2):
Geelong - 1935 Rd. 10:


Hawthorn - 1976 Rd. 3:


Richmond - 1982 Rd. 3:


On 678 occasions a team's second half score has matched it's first half score (6 times in 2020).

 

[GrahamClayton]

AFLW player Alison Drennan is playing at her third different club in three consecutive seasons - North Melbourne (2019), St Kilda (2020) and Gold Coast (2021).
How many VFL/AFL players have achieved this feat, and has anyone played for four different clubs in four consecutive seasons?

 

[RedmanWasHere]

AFLW player Alison Drennan is playing at her third different club in three consecutive seasons - North Melbourne (2019), St Kilda (2020) and Gold Coast (2021).
How many VFL/AFL players have achieved this feat, and has anyone played for four different clubs in four consecutive seasons?

Jonathan Giles.

2014 = GWS.
2015 = Essendon.
2016 = West Coast.

Ben Hudson.

2011 = Footscray.
2012 = Brisbane.
2013 = Collingwood.

Dale Kickett.

1990 = Fitzroy.
1991 = West Coast.
1992 = St Kilda.

 

[worbod]

AFLW player Alison Drennan is playing at her third different club in three consecutive seasons - North Melbourne (2019), St Kilda (2020) and Gold Coast (2021).
How many VFL/AFL players have achieved this feat, and has anyone played for four different clubs in four consecutive seasons?

This is not 100 percent AFL related, but one of my favourite football trivia questions is "Which player finished his career by playing for six separate clubs in six seasons?"

The answer is Peter McKenna:

1975 Collingwood (VFL)
1976 Devonport (NWFU)
1977 Carlton (VFL)
1978 Geelong West (VFA)
1979 Port Melbourne (VFA)
1980 Northcote (VFA)

 

[Ron The Bear]

Dale Kickett.

1990 = Fitzroy.
1991 = West Coast.
1992 = St Kilda.

Kickett actually crossed to Essendon in the mid-year draft in 1993, despite not playing a game that year, so 4 in 4 years. Freo in 1995 made it 5 in 6.

Other 4 in 4s:

Charlie Anderson (1924-27) - Ca/Sy/Ri/WB
Daryl Cumming (1976-79) - Ri/Me/NM/SM
Mark Athorn (1989-92) - WB/Fi/Sy/Ca
John Cunningham (1991-4) - Ha/Co/Me/Ge - only played senior footy at Geelong (2 games in 1995)

 

[worbod]

What is the highest total of goals kicked in a match by a 15 year old, 16 year old, 17 year old, etc?

 

[Ron The Bear]

What is the highest total of goals kicked in a match by a 15 year old, 16 year old, 17 year old, etc?

Age (Rounded)	Age	Goals	Player	Club	Year	Rd	Opp
15	15y342d	3	Maguire, Mick	Ri	1910	2	Me
	15y347d	3	Watson, Tim	Es	1977	13	Sy
16	16y230d	6	Madden, Simon	Es	1974	20	NM
17	17y152d	7	Lee, Dick	Co	1906	14	Me
	17y277d	7	Watson, Tim	Es	1979	2	St
	17y346d	7	Hamilton, Shane	Ge	1988	18	Sy
18	18y301d	14	Strang, Doug	Ri	1931	2	NM
19	19y188d	14	Longmire, John	NM	1990	14	Me
20	20y92d	13	Davie, Harry	Me	1925	14	Ca
	20y359d	13	Lloyd, Matthew	Es	1999	3	Sy
21	21y261d	15	Pratt, Bob	Sy	1934	3	Es
	21y274d	15	Templeton, Kelvin	WB	1978	13	St
22	22y361d	16	McKenna, Peter	Co	1969	19	Sy
23	23y73d	16	Hudson, Peter	Ha	1969	5	Me
24	24y108d	14	Robertson, Harold	Sy	1919	12	St
25	25y298d	18	Fanning, Fred	Me	1947	19	St
26	26y96d	15	Lockett, Tony	St	1992	13	Sy
27	27y262d	17	Dunstall, Jason	Ha	1992	7	Ri
28	28y297d	17	Coventry, Gordon	Co	1930	12	Fi
29	29y157d	16	Lockett, Tony	Sy	1995	19	Fi
30	30y155d	12	Lockett, Tony	Sy	1996	19	Ri
31	31y286d	15	Coventry, Gordon	Co	1933	11	Es
32	32y327d	14	Coventry, Gordon	Co	1934	14	Ha
	32y226d	14	Ablett senior, Gary	Ge	1994	8	Sy
33	33y63d	11	Vallence, Harry	Ca	1938	15	Fi
	33y35d	11	Quinlan, Bernie	Fi	1984	21	NM
34	34y75d	10	Titus, Jack	Ri	1942	3	Co
35	35y230d	10	McNamara, Dave	St	1922	17	Ge
36	36y215d	8	Cloke, David	Ri	1991	24	Ca
37	37y332d	6	Harvey, Brent	NM	2016	3	Me
38	38y28d	4	Harvey, Brent	NM	2016	12	Ge
	38y20d	4	Harvey, Brent	NM	2016	11	Ri
39	39y14d	3	Leith, Jack	Me	1911	17	Un
40	40y8d	0	Fletcher, Dustin	Es	2015	7	NM
	40y17d	0	Fletcher, Dustin	Es	2015	8	Br
	40y23d	0	Fletcher, Dustin	Es	2015	9	Ri
42	42y339d	1	Cumberland, Vic	St	1920	6	Co
43	43y13d	0	Cumberland, Vic	St	1920	12	Ge
	43y27d	0	Cumberland, Vic	St	1920	13	Es
	43y34d	0	Cumberland, Vic	St	1920	14	Me
	43y41d	0	Cumberland, Vic	St	1920	15	Co
	43y48d	0	Cumberland, Vic	St	1920	16	Sy

 

[worbod]

Now how about the highest total of goals kicked in a season by a 15 year old, 16 year old, 17 year old, etc?

 

[Ron The Bear]

Now how about the highest total of goals kicked in a season by a 15 year old, 16 year old, 17 year old, etc?

By age at last game of season

Age	Goals	Player	Club	Year	Gms
15	7	Maguire, Mick	Ri	1910	15
	7	Watson, Tim	Es	1977	16
16	22	Bromage, Keith	Co	1954	15
17	51	Grant, Chris	WB	1990	20
18	77	Lockett, Tony	St	1984	20
19	98	Longmire, John	NM	1990	22
20	100	Coleman, John	Es	1949	21
21	127	Pratt, Bob	Sy	1934	21
22	150	Pratt, Bob	Sy	1934	21
23	120	Hudson, Peter	Ha	1969	19
24	146	Hudson, Peter	Ha	1970	22
25	150	Hudson, Peter	Ha	1971	24
26	132	Lockett, Tony	St	1992	22
27	127	Wade, Doug	Ge	1969	21
28	145	Dunstall, Jason	Ha	1992	23
29	123	Dunstall, Jason	Ha	1993	21
30	121	Lockett, Tony	Sy	1996	22
31	124	Ablett senior, Gary	Ge	1993	17
32	128	Ablett senior, Gary	Ge	1994	25
33	129	Ablett senior, Gary	Ge	1994	25
34	88	Coventry, Gordon	Co	1935	21
35	78	Lynch, Alastair	Br	2003	22
36	72	Coventry, Gordon	Co	1937	19
37	24	Harvey, Brent	NM	2015	25
38	36	Harvey, Brent	NM	2016	23
39	3	Leith, Jack	Me	1911	3
40	1	Fletcher, Dustin	Es	2015	7
43	1	Cumberland, Vic	St	1920	10