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Status Quo

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THE CAT WRANGLER

THE CAT WRANGLER

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I would have hoped that we would have been more pro active in the trade period after all we have lost the best player in the comp.

Apart from the Mooney & Ottens deals we have been pretty bad in this area however our drafting has been very good.

Our main problem being is that we never give up anything of value and expect to get Pavlich in return.Blake and gamble will barely get us a pick we would even use ?

We need to move on someone that has currency like SJ ,or Mackie and secure some first round picks.I ma wary of buying damaged goods however we always seem to be too nice.

I don't want to go back to the bad days of trading for hacks like Mitchell White,David loats,Marty McKinnon,Justin Murphy,tim Hargraves,Brett spinks,Kent Kingsley etc

I just think we all maybe looking at our list through rose colored glasses and we maybe suprised how far some of the old guys can slip next year.
 
I don't think you can trade your way to a good team. SJ and Mackie are core Geelong players, IMO. One team players hopefully. I can't see a profit in trading players like that.

Fev for Bradshaw?
 
Geelong have got where they are by drafting and developing from within. I dont think its in our culture to bring in big name outsiders or to trade out loyal members of our team. We will help if people want out, but we don't seem to push people out the door like other clubs, it seems to go both ways, the clubs shows and expects loyatly in return. Which I personally love.

A big name trade would be good, but not at the expense of of the team or our clubs culture.
 
I thought they may have been more active but lets be honest there is not much out there this year. Because of the GC there are hardly any decent players out of contract. Its easy to say move players on but the GC are pretty much the only team that will give up first round picks of any worth this year.
 

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My wild speculation is that GEE will have one last shot with this list and with a new coach playing a similar game. Probably will not win us a flag, but who knows. 2012 will be official rebuild (with possibly the introduction of a tweeked game plan) and with 2 lovely 1st round draft picks awaiting us at the end of the season. Given where the list will be at in 2012 that may well be 3 1st round draft picks awaiting us at the end of that season. Mere speculation, i realize, but my moneys on that.
 
Apparently it is Gary jnrs fault. He didn't tell the club early enough. Earlier than what is unclearas he was contracted until the end of October 2010
 
Balme said on SEN this morning that you need a lot i'm planning to pull off a successful trade. Reading between the lines Ablett screwed us over.
 
cant really do much when your best player and coach just leave a few days before trade week

i think we will just draft in players and trade the guys that want to leave

see what happens next year

I'm sure some of our older guys will be looking to retire to GWS if we dont improve next year.
 
But the club knew that Ablett was a chance to go so why didn't they have a contingency plan , why didn't they have a plan for him staying and one for going. Isn't this what a good business would do, it is called risk management.
And it is nonsense to say that they didn't have time, they had a week to work out the salary cap. How hard can that be, they know how much Ablett earned, they only have ?? 40 more players and a whole payroll system and staff that can tell them what is left over.
Nah, another reason to have ago at Ablett. What will be next we wonder.
 

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Turkey Tom said:
If the older guys like Milburn are going to go around again they should know that they may not be automatic senior selections any more. The new coach SHOULD be giving the younger guys like T.Hunt, Gillies etc.. regular games in the seniors.
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The Magpies have shown the way here. They went for youth with Fraser, O'Bree, Lockyer, Medhurst, Davis and one or two others used as top up players spending a large part of the year in the VFL. We should follow that successful example.
 
Ammo Man said:
The Magpies have shown the way here. They went for youth with Fraser, O'Bree, Lockyer, Medhurst, Davis and one or two others used as top up players spending a large part of the year in the VFL. We should follow that successful example.
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Exactly.

If we don't we'll have 12 blokes retire in 2012/2013 and no one to replace them because they've all left already to seek more gametime. Recipe for disaster.

No status quo for 2011 thankyou.
 
ATSAM said:
But the club knew that Ablett was a chance to go so why didn't they have a contingency plan , why didn't they have a plan for him staying and one for going. Isn't this what a good business would do, it is called risk management.
And it is nonsense to say that they didn't have time, they had a week to work out the salary cap. How hard can that be, they know how much Ablett earned, they only have ?? 40 more players and a whole payroll system and staff that can tell them what is left over.
Nah, another reason to have ago at Ablett. What will be next we wonder.
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AGREE with all of that. Heard Balme's comment and felt really p'd off. What a cop-out. Pies and Saints have just played a GF in extra time and showed more activity than our SLUGGARDS. In the past that may have been acceptable as we had a near full and complete list, but not so now.

We all know we have an ageing SLOW list , near the end of its lifespan, and we could have looked more seriously at our deficiencies and bolstered our list with a Tambling, or a Sherman, etc. etc. and no, I'm not related to Gary Ayres. Sounds like the malaise and lethargy afflicting Bomber is infectious. Either that or we are truly not interested in improving our list next year but maybe go all out in 2012 when we can make the most of the Ablett picks and whatever we get for finishing down the ladder in 2011.
 
Ammo Man said:
The Magpies have shown the way here. They went for youth with Fraser, O'Bree, Lockyer, Medhurst, Davis and one or two others used as top up players spending a large part of the year in the VFL. We should follow that successful example.
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Agreed.

In fact, we should follow their example much further, and consider ourselves in precisely the same position they were seven years ago. What they have done since the end of the 2003 season should be a lesson for all of us.
 

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VEEDUBS said:
AGREE with all of that. Heard Balme's comment and felt really p'd off. What a cop-out. Pies and Saints have just played a GF in extra time and showed more activity than our SLUGGARDS. In the past that may have been acceptable as we had a near full and complete list, but not so now.

We all know we have an ageing SLOW list , near the end of its lifespan, and we could have looked more seriously at our deficiencies and bolstered our list with a Tambling, or a Sherman, etc. etc. and no, I'm not related to Gary Ayres. Sounds like the malaise and lethargy afflicting Bomber is infectious. Either that or we are truly not interested in improving our list next year but maybe go all out in 2012 when we can make the most of the Ablett picks and whatever we get for finishing down the ladder in 2011.
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Seems to me you are really getting stuck into a management group that have supplied us with a fantastic list and great oversight of that list during the past 4 years.

Balme said it. Where do you get the idea he is lying. Cook, Costa, Balme, and Wells become incompetent overnight. Gee, when did that happen?


If I was a top flight midfielder and my management said to me Geelong is interested in me any time before late August, I would ask them a question: what would my role be if Gazza stays. And what would my salary be if Gazza stays.

Our people would have to say something different to that scenario. "You get less gametime, less money if he stays. We might want you only if he goes."

If that guy is getting other offers, how do you think we would go? I'm sure most would be 90% tied up well before October.

Opposition team to a player we might want: "Don't worry about Geelong. You sign over there, and if Gary stays, you will have to play out of position. They don't know whats happening over there. Its a pig in a poke. We want you. We will guarantee you the position. We guarnteee you this payment. They can't do that. Their hands are tied because of Gary."

They couldn't have a contingency plan the way it panned out because opposition clubs could always have made a more attractive offer to players we might have wanted.

And remember, Gary's story to the public and his club is that he had not made up his mind until the the day before the Carji. I think the real negotiating for trade week goes on some time before.
 
xraycat said:
Geelong have got where they are by drafting and developing from within. I dont think its in our culture to bring in big name outsiders or to trade out loyal members of our team. We will help if people want out, but we don't seem to push people out the door like other clubs, it seems to go both ways, the clubs shows and expects loyatly in return. Which I personally love.

A big name trade would be good, but not at the expense of of the team or our clubs culture.
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This, 100%
 
RegHickeyStand said:
Seems to me you are really getting stuck into a management group that have supplied us with a fantastic list and great oversight of that list during the past 4 years.

Balme said it. Where do you get the idea he is lying. Cook, Costa, Balme, and Wells become incompetent overnight. Gee, when did that happen?


If I was a top flight midfielder and my management said to me Geelong is interested in me any time before late August, I would ask them a question: what would my role be if Gazza stays. And what would my salary be if Gazza stays.

Our people would have to say something different to that scenario. "You get less gametime, less money if he stays. We might want you only if he goes."

If that guy is getting other offers, how do you think we would go? I'm sure most would be 90% tied up well before October.

Opposition team to a player we might want: "Don't worry about Geelong. You sign over there, and if Gary stays, you will have to play out of position. They don't know whats happening over there. Its a pig in a poke. We want you. We will guarantee you the position. We guarnteee you this payment. They can't do that. Their hands are tied because of Gary."

They couldn't have a contingency plan the way it panned out because opposition clubs could always have made a more attractive offer to players we might have wanted.

And remember, Gary's story to the public and his club is that he had not made up his mind until the the day before the Carji. I think the real negotiating for trade week goes on some time before.
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Everything you say is spot-on. Yesterday, we were talking at the A- League game, Heart was awesome, and Balme's comments were brought up, and we were discussing contingency plans and scenarios for Ablett staying and going, like has been mentioned already, and the fact that Pies already, days after a GF win, are more active in the trade period. So I was a little peeved, as were others, but I'll retract most of that given Balme was talking about not being able to settle other players deals etc. So you are right. I only heard about what Balme said 2nd hand, and it was a little out of context, now that I have all the interview.

But Status Quo is the norm.
 
VEEDUBS said:
We all know we have an ageing SLOW list , near the end of its lifespan, and we could have looked more seriously at our deficiencies and bolstered our list with a Tambling, or a Sherman, etc. etc. and no, I'm not related to Gary Ayres. Sounds like the malaise and lethargy afflicting Bomber is infectious. Either that or we are truly not interested in improving our list next year but maybe go all out in 2012 when we can make the most of the Ablett picks and whatever we get for finishing down the ladder in 2011.
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I wouldn't say our list is slow. The two Varcoes, Byrnes, Wojo, Hogan, Motlop and Christensen are all quick, Moons and Pods are deceptively quick off the mark, Scarlo's no slouch, and the likes of Duncan, Menzel, Selwood and Kelly are all deceptively quick too.

The thing that has stuffed us up in recent years has been our over reliance on handball. In 2007, we averaged 211 kicks and 171 handballs. This year we averaged 215 kicks and 209 handballs. If you want to compare that to the other teams who finished top four this season, Collingwood averaged 218 kicks and 163 handballs, St.Kilda 214 kicks and 180 handballs and the Bulldogs 220 kicks and 169 handballs, In other words, we had a similar number of kicks to the other top 4 sides, but averaged at least 30 handballs a game more.

Maybe the reason we're beginning to look slow is because we've become more reliant on lateral handballs rather than long kicks like we did in 2007. After all, it doesn't matter if you have 22 Tom Hawkins out there, if they manage to move the ball quickly via long kicks, they'll look quicker than a team of 22 Varcoes who just choose to run the ball.
 
winty said:
I wouldn't say our list is slow. The two Varcoes, Byrnes, Wojo, Hogan, Motlop and Christensen are all quick, Moons and Pods are deceptively quick off the mark, Scarlo's no slouch, and the likes of Duncan, Menzel, Selwood and Kelly are all deceptively quick too.

The thing that has stuffed us up in recent years has been our over reliance on handball. In 2007, we averaged 211 kicks and 171 handballs. This year we averaged 215 kicks and 209 handballs. If you want to compare that to the other teams who finished top four this season, Collingwood averaged 218 kicks and 163 handballs, St.Kilda 214 kicks and 180 handballs and the Bulldogs 220 kicks and 169 handballs, In other words, we had a similar number of kicks to the other top 4 sides, but averaged at least 30 handballs a game more.

Maybe the reason we're beginning to look slow is because we've become more reliant on lateral handballs rather than long kicks like we did in 2007. After all, it doesn't matter if you have 22 Tom Hawkins out there, if they manage to move the ball quickly via long kicks, they'll look quicker than a team of 22 Varcoes who just choose to run the ball.
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Actually reminds me of '06. Remember? The sideways or backwards handball which killed momentum :)

Only difference is, in 2010 we had alot more confidence and our skills had improved...
 

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