Team without the Four Oldies

[crows dude]

Craigy said what would the side look like without the four veterans. Well that sounds like fun.

F Tippett Walker Douglas
HF Knights Stevens Porplysia
C Dangerfield Reilly Mckay
HB Davis Bock Jaensch
B Petrenko Rutten Johncock

Ruck
Maric
Vince
Thompson

Interchange
Gunston
Mckernan
Van Berlo
Schmidt


Hows that

 

[Riggy1]

Porplysia
Mckay
Mckernan
Van Berlo

Someone needs a visit to the spelling thread.

 

[Vader]

Craigy said what would the side look like without the four veterans. Well that sounds like fun.

F Tippett Walker Douglas
HF Knights Stevens Porplysia
C Dangerfield Reilly Mckay
HB Davis Bock Jaensch
B Petrenko Rutten Johncock

Ruck
Maric
Vince
Thompson

Interchange
Gunston
Mckernan
Van Berlo
Schmidt


Hows that

That would be nice, if Knights, Dangerfield and Mackay weren't currently MIA through injury. Who are the next 3 players on your list? You might want to replace Gunston with Cook as well.

Even without the replacements for the 3 injured players, your team still contains 5 players with less than 10 games experience (Davis, Jaensch, Gunston, Schmidt and McKernan). Throw in another 3 untried players and we're talking about a team which wouldn't even defeat Richmond.

 

[crowman86]

Gunna on the bench after 2 senior games... Goes to show how much we really do need a few of those golden oldies around still.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Craigy said what would the side look like without the four veterans. Well that sounds like fun.

F Tippett Walker Douglas
HF Knights Stevens Porplysia
C Dangerfield Reilly Mckay
HB Davis Bock Jaensch
B Petrenko Rutten Johncock

Ruck
Maric
Vince
Thompson

Interchange
Gunston
Mckernan
Van Berlo
Schmidt


Hows that

I smell... flag

Well, maybe not. Exciting in patches but we wouldn't want to get an injury or two

 

[cmndstab]

I smell... flag

Well, maybe not. Exciting in patches but we wouldn't want to get an injury or two

Don't be too concerned, we've got some great veterans like McLeod, Goodwin and Edwards just running around in the SANFL

 

[Pariah]

Not bad. Here's mine for when we get a few players back:

F: Douglas* Walker Thompson*
HF: Knights* Tippett Porplyzia*
C: Jaensch* Dangerfield* MacKay
HB: Stevens* Bock Johncock*
B: Petrenko Rutten Davis*

Ruck: Maric Vince* Van Berlo*
Interchange: McKernan* Reilly* Sellar* Sloane
Emergencies: Young* Armstrong Gunston

* Rotate through various positions.

 

[Vader]

That's still a VERY young and inexperienced team:

• The only 100+ game players you've listed are Rutten, Bock, Johncock, van Berlo, Reilly and Thompson.
• In contrast, the following currently have 10 games or less - Jaensch, Davis, McKernan, Sloane, Martin, Gunston
• The following (others) currently have 50 games or less - Petrenko, Sellar, Walker, Dangermouse, Otten, Mackay, Tippett

I can't see us losing all 5 of our 30+ players AND Stevens as well. Stevens will definitely be on the list in 2011 and 1 or 2 of the veterans will be as well (probably McLeod).

The team you've named would almost certainly finish in the bottom 4 on the ladder.

PS - you've named McKernan on the bench and the emergency list.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

PS - you've named McKernan on the bench and the emergency list.

Corey's making a comeback

 

[taylor_walker_13]

I liked this from Robbo of the Hearld Sun in Melbourne:

NEIL CRAIG and THE CROWS


Is in a complex situation with his older players who aren't really the problem, but who aren't really the future either.

Craig said he would continue to play them, which tells us the Crows haven't quite got the depth they have been telling us all.

Does he play out the season with all the old blokes - McLeod, Burton, Edwards and the skipper Goodwin - or get games into the kids?

For the future, it has to be the latter, despite Craig fearing what line-up would run out on to the park without the senior players.

Some would say, tough cheese, because the club wanted all of them to play on, believing they were still a contender. They were wrong.

It's best all those champs are gradually relieved of their duties this season instead of it being a lump cull at the end.

As for the much-hyped group of players underneath them, it's time to show your worth.

 

[relapse]

That's still a VERY young and inexperienced team:

• The only 100+ game players you've listed are Rutten, Bock, Johncock, van Berlo, Reilly and Thompson.
• In contrast, the following currently have 10 games or less - Jaensch, Davis, McKernan, Sloane, Martin, Gunston
• The following (others) currently have 50 games or less - Petrenko, Sellar, Walker, Dangermouse, Otten, Mackay, Tippett

I can't see us losing all 5 of our 30+ players AND Stevens as well. Stevens will definitely be on the list in 2011 and 1 or 2 of the veterans will be as well (probably McLeod).

The team you've named would almost certainly finish in the bottom 4 on the ladder.

PS - you've named McKernan on the bench and the emergency list.

I agree regarding Stevens, I also would have pushed for Dogga to stay, but his form has been horrible so the Torney rule must come nto play.

We cant afford to amplify the mistake this year by keeping two 35 year old players next year. We can carry 1 out of the four IMO, but Craig made the call and deicded to move away from the club's plan to stagger the retirements so we are just going to have to wear losing pretty much all of them at the same time.

It's upto form and desire as to who wants it out of McLeod and Goody (have no problems with them both seeing out the season in the side before the club makes a decision), but I would go into 2011 with only 1 player out of our 5 players over 30.

 

[Alex99]

It doesn’t really matter what’s happening in round 7, 8 or even 9 with the senior players because changes are not going to be made, even if we lose 2 out of the next 3 games. However the important part of the equations is what happens in round 18, 19, 20, 21 and 22. That’s what will count for 2011.

My team for last 4 round – shall everybody become fit enough to play.

F: McKernan ~ Walker ~ Thompson
HF: Henderson ~ Tippett ~ Knights
C: Douglas ~ Dangerfield ~MacKay
HB: Van Berlo ~ Bock ~ Johncock
B: Petrenko ~ Rutten ~ Davis
Ruck: Maric ~ Vince ~ Porplyzia
Interchange: Reilly ~ Sellar ~ Sloane ~ Stevens
Emergencies: Young ~ Talia~ Cook ~ Jaensch

If i saw that side line up, i would be so excited and positive it would be like Christmas for a 7 year old. Then my excitement would come back for the future. Current line up - no excitment at all. Going to games is like a chore

 

[TheLeftFist8]

No-one in their right mind would go into next week without all 5 vets (that's the all or nothing thinking that the club seems to be boxed into).

If that was the case, here would be our side NEXT WEEK (to which i would add Goodwin, McLeod, Edwards in place of the last 3 on the bench).

B: Bock, Rutten, Johncock
HB: van Berlo, Davis, Schmidt
C: Douglas, Vince, Cook
HF: Jaensch, Stevens, Porplyzia
FF: Tippett, Walker, Petrenko
1R: Maric, Reilly, S.Thompson
Int: McKernan, Armstrong, Young, Wright

Injured: Craig, Dangerfield, Henderson, Hentschel, Jacky, Knights, Mackay, Martin, Moran, Otten, Sellar, Shaw, Sloane, Symes

Leftover: Griffin, Gunston, Talia, L.Thompson


Round 1 next year could be more interesting (I'd still have McLeod also, plus look at a couple of trades to get new mids into the team)

B: Davis, Rutten, Johncock
HB: Mackay, Bock, Symes
C: Martin, Dangerfield, Otten
HF: Knights, Sellar, Porplyzia
F: Tippett, Walker, Cook
1R: Maric, Vince, S.Thompson
Int: Moran, Reilly, van Berlo, Jaensch

Leftover: McKernan, Schmidt, Douglas, Stevens, Petrenko, Henderson, Armstrong, Young, Wright, Craig, Shaw, Sloane, Talia, Gunston, L.Thompson,

 

[Geoffa32]

It doesn’t really matter what’s happening in round 7, 8 or even 9 with the senior players because changes are not going to be made, even if we lose 2 out of the next 3 games. However the important part of the equations is what happens in round 18, 19, 20, 21 and 22. That’s what will count for 2011.

My team for last 4 round – shall everybody become fit enough to play.

F: McKernan ~ Walker ~ Thompson
HF: Henderson ~ Tippett ~ Knights
C: Douglas ~ Dangerfield ~MacKay
HB: Van Berlo ~ Bock ~ Johncock
B: Petrenko ~ Rutten ~ Davis
Ruck: Maric ~ Vince ~ Porplyzia
Interchange: Reilly ~ Sellar ~ Sloane ~ Stevens
Emergencies: Young ~ Talia~ Cook ~ Jaensch

If i saw that side line up, i would be so excited and positive it would be like Christmas for a 7 year old. Then my excitement would come back for the future. Current line up - no excitment at all. Going to games is like a chore

No love for Schmidt. Last weeks game impressed me. He would be in my best under 30s side.

 

[WAG]

I'm sorry, after looking at your team I can't take you seriously.

You've got Walker at FF ! WTF are you thinking ???

 

[dplggr47]

well, obviously our team would look crap without the ALL the veterans... i think most fans had had enough of Burton and possibly Doughty.

i don't think fans are calling for all of them to retire, or all of them to be dropped...
i think out of Goodwin, Edwards and McLeod, 1 or 2 will retire. i'd be a bit surprised if all 3 retired, but i'd understand. McLeod seems like the most likely to continue, followed by Edwards.

out of Burton and Doughty, i'd prefer Burton retire at years end, but i don't think he will. i think at least 1 of them should go at years end though.

 

[Pariah]

Stevens will definitely be on the list in 2011 and 1 or 2 of the veterans will be as well (probably McLeod).

The team you've named would almost certainly finish in the bottom 4 on the ladder.

PS - you've named McKernan on the bench and the emergency list.[/quote]

I agree that Stevens and Bunji will probably be there next year but just because a player is contracted it doesn't mean he's above delisting. Just ask Tom Lee. He had a year to go on his contract but was still delisted.
I made a few corrections on my team. Having said that there's no chance of Stevo getting the boot.

 

[SydCrow]

F: McKernan ~ Walker ~ Thompson
HF: Henderson ~ Tippett ~ Knights
C: Douglas ~ Dangerfield ~MacKay
HB: Van Berlo ~ Bock ~ Johncock
B: Petrenko ~ Rutten ~ Davis
Ruck: Maric ~ Vince ~ Porplyzia
Interchange: Reilly ~ Sellar ~ Sloane ~ Stevens
Emergencies: Young ~ Talia~ Cook ~ Jaensch

you have neatly highlighted the problems with our list

our forward line (particularly if Knights is a long term injury) and our midfield

 

[Elder van Berlo]

well, obviously our team would look crap without the ALL the veterans... i think most fans had had enough of Burton and possibly Doughty.

i don't think fans are calling for all of them to retire, or all of them to be dropped...
i think out of Goodwin, Edwards and McLeod, 1 or 2 will retire. i'd be a bit surprised if all 3 retired, but i'd understand. McLeod seems like the most likely to continue, followed by Edwards.

out of Burton and Doughty, i'd prefer Burton retire at years end, but i don't think he will. i think at least 1 of them should go at years end though.

This. Craig is throwing up a massive straw man by saying "what will our team look like without all these players"? The real question is "what will our team look like if we drop the vets who aren't pulling their weight"?

And the real answer is "maybe no better but maybe slightly to moderately better in the short term, but with a hell of a lot more upside".

 

[relapse]

I liked this from Robbo of the Hearld Sun in Melbourne:

NEIL CRAIG and THE CROWS


Is in a complex situation with his older players who aren't really the problem, but who aren't really the future either.

Craig said he would continue to play them, which tells us the Crows haven't quite got the depth they have been telling us all.

Does he play out the season with all the old blokes - McLeod, Burton, Edwards and the skipper Goodwin - or get games into the kids?

For the future, it has to be the latter, despite Craig fearing what line-up would run out on to the park without the senior players.

Some would say, tough cheese, because the club wanted all of them to play on, believing they were still a contender. They were wrong.

It's best all those champs are gradually relieved of their duties this season instead of it being a lump cull at the end.

As for the much-hyped group of players underneath them, it's time to show your worth.

I still maintain that we have made a rod for our own back by focussing so much on the senior group for the past couple of years and I think this may have contributed to the stagnanation over the last few years of our second tier players.

Craig's mindset IMO has been focussed too much on the senior playing group being the ones carrying the weight of the club and being steadfast that the senior group need to be the ones instilled as the main leaders at the club. Even this year he made the comment that our success this year will be driven by McLeod, Burton, Edwards and Goodwin. Has this created a mindset amongst the players where the future leaders at the club feel like they are caught behind a glass ceiling and feel as though they arent required to take the next step on the field because they feel that they are not put in a position yet to do so ?

It just seems that every promising young player at the club is not taking the next step as a leader at the club. Scott Thompson is a great example, he came over here and leadership roles were being discussed and to many he had leadership written all over him yet he has been ignored by the club as a leader. The club has made a stand that he doesnt have leadership qualities, yet the Gold Coast are chasing him due to his age and feel that he would be a good leadership type player at their club. So is Thompson actually a potential leader that we have overlooked and has been a victim of the mindset to keep the seniors in leadership role or are the Gold Coast making a mistake flagging Thompson as a potential leader ??

I just wonder that if club moved the leadership to the younger players a year or two ago hypothetically would Thompson, as captain of the AFC, be the same struggling stagnant Thompson that is playing now, would VB be taking a much more vital role in leadership if he was vice to Thompson and was surrounded by a younger leadership group ?

I also dont buy the theory that young players can be leaders without having a leadership role, the senior players have the respect to be able to be viewed as a leader without being part of the leadership group, but I just cant see a 24 year old player not in the leadership group actually questioning Goody's leadership and I cant see them being anything but a subservient player under the captain.

 

[crowsup]

I still maintain that we have made a rod for our own back by focussing so much on the senior group for the past couple of years and I think this may have contributed to the stagnanation over the last few years of our second tier players.

Craig's mindset IMO has been focussed too much on the senior playing group being the ones carrying the weight of the club and being steadfast that the senior group need to be the ones instilled as the main leaders at the club. Even this year he made the comment that our success this year will be driven by McLeod, Burton, Edwards and Goodwin. Has this created a mindset amongst the players where the future leaders at the club feel like they are caught behind a glass ceiling and feel as though they arent required to take the next step on the field because they feel that they are not put in a position yet to do so ?


It just seems that every promising young player at the club is not taking the next step as a leader at the club. Scott Thompson is a great example, he came over here and leadership roles were being discussed and to many he had leadership written all over him yet he has been ignored by the club as a leader. The club has made a stand that he doesnt have leadership qualities, yet the Gold Coast are chasing him due to his age and feel that he would be a good leadership type player at their club. So is Thompson actually a potential leader that we have overlooked and has been a victim of the mindset to keep the seniors in leadership role or are the Gold Coast making a mistake flagging Thompson as a potential leader ??

I just wonder that if club moved the leadership to the younger players a year or two ago hypothetically would Thompson, as captain of the AFC, be the same struggling stagnant Thompson that is playing now, would VB be taking a much more vital role in leadership if he was vice to Thompson and was surrounded by a younger leadership group ?

I also dont buy the theory that young players can be leaders without having a leadership role, the senior players have the respect to be able to be viewed as a leader without being part of the leadership group, but I just cant see a 24 year old player not in the leadership group actually questioning Goody's leadership and I cant see them being anything but a subservient player under the captain.

The problem with your reasoning is that you believe that you can make leaders. All you have to do is to tell someone he / she is now the leader.

Apart from the fact that the AFC leaders are selected by the players themselves and not by the club, a real leader would, virtually , be appointed by default. As they say; the cream always raises to the top.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I would have liked to see some of the older guys remove themselves from the leadership vote this season. Goodwin, Doughty plus Edwards and McLeod... these guys are always going to be leaders anyway because they are experienced, professional, respected footballers. It doesn't matter whether there is a c next to their name or not.

This year would have been the perfect time to usher in some new leadership, while we still had a senior core to support them and take some pressure off.

Would have been good for whichever players took on the roles plus better for the oldies to reduce some of the focus on them.

 

[CroCop]

you have neatly highlighted the problems with our list

our forward line (particularly if Knights is a long term injury) and our midfield

I know most of the threads are for our team this year but Im going to do one for what i wish our team looks like next year.

F: Porplyzia ~ Walker ~ Jaensch
HF: Henderson ~ Tippett ~ Knights
C: Mackay ~ Dangerfield ~Douglas
HB: Otten ~ Bock ~ Johncock
B: Sloane ~Rutten ~ Van Berlo
Ruck: Maric ~ Vince ~ Thompson
Interchange: Reilly ~ Sellar ~ Petrenko ~ Shaw ~ Stevens ~ Griffin ~ Gunston ~ Young
Emergencies: The rest

 

[CroCop]

I know most of the threads are for our team this year but Im going to do one for what i wish our team looks like next year.

F: Porplyzia ~ Walker ~ Jaensch
HF: Henderson ~ Tippett ~ Knights
C: Mackay ~ Dangerfield ~Douglas
HB: Otten ~ Bock ~ Johncock
B: Sloane ~Rutten ~ Van Berlo
Ruck: Maric ~ Vince ~ Thompson
Interchange: Reilly ~ Sellar ~ Petrenko ~ Shaw ~ Stevens ~ Griffin ~ Gunston ~ Young
Emergencies: The rest

I need to change that team. I forgot about my favourite player Brodie Martin. He moves Douglas to the bench.

F: Porplyzia ~ Walker ~ Jaensch
HF: Henderson ~ Tippett ~ Knights
C: Mackay ~ Dangerfield ~ B. Martin
HB: Otten ~ Bock ~ Johncock
B: Sloane ~Rutten ~ Van Berlo
Ruck: Maric ~ Vince ~ Thompson
Interchange: Douglas~ Reilly ~ Sellar ~ Petrenko ~ Shaw ~ Stevens ~ Griffin ~ Gunston ~ Young
Emergencies: The rest

 

[jenny61_99]

I would have liked to see some of the older guys remove themselves from the leadership vote this season. Goodwin, Doughty plus Edwards and McLeod... these guys are always going to be leaders anyway because they are experienced, professional, respected footballers. It doesn't matter whether there is a c next to their name or not.

This year would have been the perfect time to usher in some new leadership, while we still had a senior core to support them and take some pressure off.

Would have been good for whichever players took on the roles plus better for the oldies to reduce some of the focus on them.

McLeod isn't in the leadership group (by choice I believe), although he still considers himself a role model for all the young indigenous boys. Clearly the captain has to be, so until he's no longer captain you really can't expect him to relinquish that role. Edwards, Burton and Doughty are in there, as are VB, Symes, Stevens and Rutten. I wouldn't mind seeing a Dangerfield and/or Tippett in there to replace maybe Birdman and Doughty. Edwards by virtue of his seniority should remain until he retires. Bock obviously was overlooked due to his indiscretion and Thompson has apparently never been seen by his peers as leadership material.