The Darling Question

[wc_eagles_since86]

Fellow fans, supporters, stat-chasers, armchair coaches and anyone who I've forgotten,


I realise the following thread may cause some offense to Darling aficionados, to clarify I feel no ill-will towards the man, loved him for the 2018 season which he contributed to immensely, but I thought this topic deserved it's own thread.

I go in and out (not a reference to Alex De Large) when talking about Darling. His 3rd quarter repaid his performance in the GF. However, it seems that his first half performance from the GF has carried over into the 2019 season. Was that an omen for things to come?

I thought his effort vs. the Demons was valid, but lackluster. Kennedy is working absolutely overtime (as he always does) but I feel the pressure on Kennedy is 10 fold this season because Darling is just not a valid target if you're looking for someone to kick it to. He can't be relied upon to mark, create and kick goals (his tackling and work-rate isn't under question from me here: he seems to be ok, not great in those two areas). God forbid, that Kennedy were to ... I won't even say it out of fear of jinxing, we'd be dead in the water considering Darling is not a viable option.

I fear that we have no one to fill his role. Who could we replace him with because despite his form, he's hard to replace. Allen cannot fill his shoes alone, he's far too immobile which is not something I can say about Darling who is a very mobile (when he puts it on) large forward. Allen is not so nimble.

I pass this on to you for debate, comments and let's keep it civil...

 

[TY24]

Darling has all the tools to be the best forward in the comp by some margin, and we saw that in the first half of last season. His biggest problem is between the ears.

The main criticisms of him pre-2018 were that he didn’t go hard at the ball and use his body, which is what’s crept back into his game. He needs to remember that he’s one of the biggest, strongest forwards going around and that he crash packs and contests. At the moment he’s got the body of a key forward but the mentality of a small Ryan/Rioli type forward. He looks scared to crash packs and win the hard footy at the moment, which is what won him so many plaudits last season. That game against Richmond looked like his coming of age, maybe it wasn’t.

We saw flashes of his best against Gold Coast, most likely after having a rocket put up him by Graham at half time.

We all know what he’s capable of, he just needs to get his head in the game and he’ll be back. It might happen this week, it might take him being dropped to the WAFL for him to realise what he needs to change.

I hope the beast isn’t far away from being unchained, because watching him dominate last year was awe-inspiring.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[HoneyBadger35]

I’m not entirely sure of the premise of the post. Darling’s down on form, but there’s no actionable strategy out of it. He’s too good to not play, but he’s not good enough in his current form to be an All-Australian forward when JK retired. We’re not going to trade him. We’re not going to delist him. He’s just got to find form in the AFL side.

Darling had a career best 10 week run last season that threatened to (almost single handedly) deliver us the minor premiership. Post injury, he wasn’t quite as good, and 2019 has been seriously frustrating for him. We have to stick with him, that’s the only solution. The forwardline balance should hopefully pick up now that Willie’s back, so I think it’s just an important angle to watch in the back half of the season, but it’s not really actionable as of yet.

When JK goes, it seems impossible to think the club goes with any strategy that doesn’t involve some mix of Darling, Allen and possibly Brander. Darling would have first dibs at the 1A forward spot.

 

[squashface]

Darling2Midfield

 

[eagleskickass]

We say we don't have anyone to replace him but then in the same breath we suggest he isn't cutting the mustard. I wonder if, perhaps, someone like a Waterman could play a role there? We've brought him in a couple of times but he's had to play behind Kennedy, Darling & Allen up forward. He's not quite the strong marking type that Darling is but he works hard. A forward line as follows may be a better fit?

Allen Kennedy Ryan
Cripps Waterman Rioli

Potentially even switch Allen / Waterman, or Rioli to the pocket, Waterman as a half forward and Allen as the CHF?

Obviously other players would rotate through there.

If Darling finds WAFL form, he'd put pressure on Waterman, who seems a step above when he plays WAFL (but hasn't found a role when playing AFL)

 

[FKASC]

It truly is a curious case

 

[LittleGreekGod]

Fellow fans, supporters, stat-chasers, armchair coaches and anyone who I've forgotten,


I realise the following thread may cause some offense to Darling aficionados, to clarify I feel no ill-will towards the man, loved him for the 2018 season which he contributed to immensely, but I thought this topic deserved it's own thread.

I go in and out (not a reference to Alex De Large) when talking about Darling. His 3rd quarter repaid his performance in the GF. However, it seems that his first half performance from the GF has carried over into the 2019 season. Was that an omen for things to come?

I thought his effort vs. the Demons was valid, but lackluster. Kennedy is working absolutely overtime (as he always does) but I feel the pressure on Kennedy is 10 fold this season because Darling is just not a valid target if you're looking for someone to kick it to. He can't be relied upon to mark, create and kick goals (his tackling and work-rate isn't under question from me here: he seems to be ok, not great in those two areas). God forbid, that Kennedy were to ... I won't even say it out of fear of jinxing, we'd be dead in the water considering Darling is not a viable option.

I fear that we have no one to fill his role. Who could we replace him with because despite his form, he's hard to replace. Allen cannot fill his shoes alone, he's far too immobile which is not something I can say about Darling who is a very mobile (when he puts it on) large forward. Allen is not so nimble.

I pass this on to you for debate, comments and let's keep it civil...

I feel that there has been a lot of unfair criticism for Darling and Kennedy to a lesser extent.
The change to a defensive mindset by a lot of opposition teams this year has caused a massive reduction on goal scoring this season particularly by tall marking forwards.
The Kennedy (18) and Darling (16) combination has produced 34 goals .(Only bettered by Cameron and Finlayson with 51.)
Others Tall Forwards
- Hawkins has 23
- Brown 22
- Lynch 22 on the back of 2 big games
- Membray and Bruce 29 in total
- Hipwood (the next big thing 16, McStay 11
- MIA McGovern 14
- Walker Big Tex has 16 and Jenkins nowhere in site
- Naughton 15
- The Hero Hogan 8 with a massive 6 from Lobb ($1.6 Million Duo)
- Mason the Yank 3 with nowhere to run and Minocek on 15
- Franklin as yet to be found
- plus Roughy on 8 and Gunston on 10

Other than Cameron, most KPF's are on target for between 40 and 50 goals this season. I suggest that this downturn in goal kicking has resulted from the return to wholesale flooding and cutting off space for all forward to lead into.
The AFL in its wisdom decided to introduce a 6 6 6 plan to increase goal scoring Ha Ha ha. Instead a few of the lower ranked teams and also some of the mid and top teams believed that a return to the foods will hold off the onslaught.
The tall marking forwards have been hit the hardest, Jenkins and Mason are prime examples of players who have disappeared from site as that type of player who needed space to run into to use their big frames and be effective.

But getting back to Darling who like Kennedy and McGovern are seriously being targeted by illegal tactics or arm slapping , arm grabbing and blocking.
WCE are now the most hunted team in the AFL as well and there is a whole lot of other tactics at play to stop us every week but we need to put our trust in the coaches who have got us this far.
The flood was introduced to stop the dominance of Hawthorn a few years back,
It failed then and it will fail again. The flood and run game cannot be sustained for four quarters in most games, and certainly not over a full season.
The games will open up again and the forwards will take marks again and all will be good again in Eagle land.

 

[jatz14]

We say we don't have anyone to replace him but then in the same breath we suggest he isn't cutting the mustard. I wonder if, perhaps, someone like a Waterman could play a role there? We've brought him in a couple of times but he's had to play behind Kennedy, Darling & Allen up forward. He's not quite the strong marking type that Darling is but he works hard. A forward line as follows may be a better fit?

Allen Kennedy Ryan
Cripps Waterman Rioli

Potentially even switch Allen / Waterman, or Rioli to the pocket, Waterman as a half forward and Allen as the CHF?

Obviously other players would rotate through there.

If Darling finds WAFL form, he'd put pressure on Waterman, who seems a step above when he plays WAFL (but hasn't found a role when playing AFL)

Replace Darling with a hard working pleb? Yeah - Nah.

 

[MIKE85]

I'll be honest, I skimmed through most of the above posts, because I don't think anything written will convince me that anything other than sticking with him is the best option.

We've had a massive reduction in our forward 50 entries so far this season (missing NNs influence in the centre) and when we do go inside 50, our efficiency has been well below what it was last year, as far as actually hitting up a target, rather than the woosha days of bomb it in high and hope for a screamer. He's suffering because of it.

We also had Waterman play for the first half of last season, and he seemed to play that more traditional hit up half forward role, leaving Darling deeper forward. This year we've put Allen in, but kept him pretty deep, meaning Darling seems to caught in between at times, and our connection at half forward has been shocking also.

He's too good a player to leave out of the side. If the talk of NN coming back and playing depp forward for the most part, that'll free up Darling to dominate some third rate defender and get some confidence back. He'll be right. Without checking stats, I'd assume his average goals per season would still be bloody good compared to other teams' second or third forward options.

 

[ChampRevesby]

Straighten your damn arms.

 

[tigger_ferret]

I feel that there has been a lot of unfair criticism for Darling and Kennedy to a lesser extent.
The change to a defensive mindset by a lot of opposition teams this year has caused a massive reduction on goal scoring this season particularly by tall marking forwards.
The Kennedy (18) and Darling (16) combination has produced 34 goals .(Only bettered by Cameron and Finlayson with 51.)
Others Tall Forwards
- Hawkins has 23
- Brown 22
- Lynch 22 on the back of 2 big games
- Membray and Bruce 29 in total
- Hipwood (the next big thing 16, McStay 11
- MIA McGovern 14
- Walker Big Tex has 16 and Jenkins nowhere in site
- Naughton 15
- The Hero Hogan 8 with a massive 6 from Lobb ($1.6 Million Duo)
- Mason the Yank 3 with nowhere to run and Minocek on 15
- Franklin as yet to be found
- plus Roughy on 8 and Gunston on 10

Other than Cameron, most KPF's are on target for between 40 and 50 goals this season. I suggest that this downturn in goal kicking has resulted from the return to wholesale flooding and cutting off space for all forward to lead into.
The AFL in its wisdom decided to introduce a 6 6 6 plan to increase goal scoring Ha Ha ha. Instead a few of the lower ranked teams and also some of the mid and top teams believed that a return to the foods will hold off the onslaught.
The tall marking forwards have been hit the hardest, Jenkins and Mason are prime examples of players who have disappeared from site as that type of player who needed space to run into to use their big frames and be effective.

But getting back to Darling who like Kennedy and McGovern are seriously being targeted by illegal tactics or arm slapping , arm grabbing and blocking.
WCE are now the most hunted team in the AFL as well and there is a whole lot of other tactics at play to stop us every week but we need to put our trust in the coaches who have got us this far.
The flood was introduced to stop the dominance of Hawthorn a few years back,
It failed then and it will fail again. The flood and run game cannot be sustained for four quarters in most games, and certainly not over a full season.
The games will open up again and the forwards will take marks again and all will be good again in Eagle land.

Agree with most of this, for the most part his intent is pretty good, although I thought a little down against Melbourne.

I think he is just hoping if he keeps working hard things will click, much like the rest of the team. Yeo started slow this year but had a beast of a game this week, Shuey has been solid but has not really broken a game open yet (2 awesome goals on the weekend is close), Gaff is starting to build and getting more cleaner ball on the outside rather than blind kicks around the corner.

I think both Darling and JK will break a game open soon enough.

 

[MIKE85]

Yeah agreed. The forwards are suffering from having below par service compared to last season. Once the mids click into gear a little more, the forwards will come into it more. It'll happen. I'd much rather be not playing great in May, but still be equal third, than have no room for improvement. There's a heap of upside.

 

[eagleskickass]

Replace Darling with a hard working pleb? Yeah - Nah.

Well at the moment Darling seems to be fulfilling the role of 'pleb' so perhaps adding a 'hardworking' in the short term and sending Darling to wake up in the WAFL might help?

 

[MIKE85]

Darling's clearly a confidence player, so I don't know if dropping him would get the desired result.

I know there shouldn't be any free rides in the team, but Simmo said himself, he knows the players well, they're all different, and some respond to different things, and some need different things to others to motivate them.

He let Ryan leave the pre season camp because it was too hard for him, not sure many other players would be afforded the same luxury, yet it showed Ryan that his coach understands him, and has his back. The day of the hard ass coach are dead, and it's more about mamaging all the different personalities and trying to get the best out of them.

Might sound soft, but I honestly don't think dropping Darling would have the result some people think it would. Sticking by him more likely will.

 

[Dark Sharks]

He makes it very easy for his own supporters to dislike him

You know how Josh Jenkins is a laughing stock and nobody who watches AFL takes him seriously?

Hard to tell, but i can only presume Darling is our version. Gee he must be funny to watch as an oppo supporter.

 

[TY24]

He makes it very easy for his own supporters to dislike him

You know how Josh Jenkins is a laughing stock and nobody who watches AFL takes him seriously?

Hard to tell, but i can only presume Darling is our version. Gee he must be funny to watch as an oppo supporter.

I don't think he's quite on the same level as Jenkins but he's our version of Jenkins without doubt.

I know the Freo board like poking fun at Darling despite the fact that they sold the farm for two forwards who aren't even close to his level.

It's easy to forget that Darling is 5th on our all time goal kicking list at the age of 26, sometimes we take him for granted. He's been more or less a 2 goal per game forward since day one.

 

[MIKE85]

Darling averages 1.9 goals per game. Tom Hawkins 2.0, the great Pavlova, also 2.0 a game. Buddy averages 2.6, JK 2.5.

Darling Marks - 5.1, TH - 5.9, PAV - 5.8, Buddy - 5.5, JK - 5.9

Darling tackles per game 3.0, TH - 2.0, Pav - 2.3, Buddy - 2.6, JK - 2.3

That's just a quick stat check against a few other forwards.

Granted those guys have played more games than Jack, but he's tracking well, As above, we take him for granted at times, but I can guarantee, every single team in the country would play him in their best 22, absolutely no question.

Maybe he won't get any better, maybe he will, but what's he produced so far stacks up against some of the better key forwards of his generation

 

[flamingEMBERS]

Darling's clearly a confidence player, so I don't know if dropping him would get the desired result.

I know there shouldn't be any free rides in the team, but Simmo said himself, he knows the players well, they're all different, and some respond to different things, and some need different things to others to motivate them.

He let Ryan leave the pre season camp because it was too hard for him, not sure many other players would be afforded the same luxury, yet it showed Ryan that his coach understands him, and has his back. The day of the hard ass coach are dead, and it's more about mamaging all the different personalities and trying to get the best out of them.

Might sound soft, but I honestly don't think dropping Darling would have the result some people think it would. Sticking by him more likely will.

I don't know about this bottom statement. We stuck fat in '16-17 and he didn't turn it around until the start of '18. Why not try something different.

 

[jatz14]

Well at the moment Darling seems to be fulfilling the role of 'pleb' so perhaps adding a 'hardworking' in the short term and sending Darling to wake up in the WAFL might help?

You sold Waterman on the basis of, doesn't take a mark like Darling, but works very hard. You know that describes Masten as well.

 

[Smithy06]

Darling's clearly a confidence player, so I don't know if dropping him would get the desired result.

I know there shouldn't be any free rides in the team, but Simmo said himself, he knows the players well, they're all different, and some respond to different things, and some need different things to others to motivate them.

He let Ryan leave the pre season camp because it was too hard for him, not sure many other players would be afforded the same luxury, yet it showed Ryan that his coach understands him, and has his back. The day of the hard ass coach are dead, and it's more about mamaging all the different personalities and trying to get the best out of them.

Might sound soft, but I honestly don't think dropping Darling would have the result some people think it would. Sticking by him more likely will.

One of the smartest comments I’ve seen on this forum

 

[Dylan82]

I still stand by what I have posted previously in regard to the form of Darling:

​

Flowers for Jack: The tragic tale of how a rubber-chested crustacean became the most dominant player in the competition, only to have it wither away.​

Jack Darling was a talent failing to deliver upon potential in addition to developing a reputation for going completely missing in key matches. Then something happened. In 2018 he started to clunk everything and kick goals. It mattered not who was assigned to mark him as he dominated them all in a manner not seen since peak Carey. Exactly one year ago, Darling was without question the best and most influential player in the competition. Despite periods of injury, before the start of the 2019 season he remained the best player for his position across all teams. Now after just six matches he has slipped down five places for position and his overall ranking is approaching 80. For the first time since his debut year in 2011, he has gone scoreless for consecutive weeks.​

Just how can a player rise and fall so rapidly in such a manner?​

Darling requires fast and direct ball movement otherwise he becomes completely non-effective. Put it this way, you could consider Darling as the anti-McGovern. McGovern has a near-psychic ability to judge where the ball will be ahead of others – sometimes to the point where is moving into position before the ball is even kicked. Darling is the antithesis of that – he reads the ball incredibly late for a key forward. If the incoming ball movement and subsequent kick are rapid and unwavering, he is able to overcome this and take opposition defences apart. However, if the ball gets delayed up the ground, he will be beaten to its eventual arrival by his defensive marker almost every time.​

Without markedly improved ball movement it cannot be expected that we will see any major turnaround in Darling’s current form slump.​

​

 

[twinkletoes#17]

I feel like Darling is close to getting it together. Is doing a lot of work, but not getting the classic forward stats (marks and goals which are most important). Tackling last week was good, as was his work rate and goal assists.

Nobody currently not in the team is capable of matching Darling when he is on.

I would rather we keep Darling in hoping he hits his straps than replace him with someone who even at their best has nowhere near the same impact.

 

[Asapartyhat]

Darling at 26years old and on track to have played between 190 and 195 games by the end of the season is the Eagle most likely to be the the first to play 300 games.
I can't remember which Eagle but one of our players has said (paraphrasing)if you want to play three hundred games get your self to a plodder club where you can cruise for years without risking much injury wear and tear.If you want to give it everything you have and play finals regularly and burn out before getting old then a club like the Eagles is the best choice.
I would like to see Darling go harder more consistently I suppose.

 

[wc_eagles_since86]

Some really interesting food for thought here.

My intention wasn't to bodily function on Darling as a player, merely to spark debate and read some more insightful opinions than mine, thanks for the reading.

If Darling does indeed grow in confidence and return to form, which I hope will be before finals time, the Eagles will soar, pun intended.

 

[Off Tap]

Does it seem that Darling is out of position a lot of the time when he's going for a mark?

I notice that he runs under the ball a fair few times a game and it goes over his head.

Is that poor delivery, poor time timing or a bit of both?