The Great Pokie Conspiracy (Or How Hawthorn ruined the West)

[The_Wookie]

AFL looking for govt investment to make Etihad and environs more attractive and presumably more profitable.

Now we hear the AFl has discovered its pokies conscience, wanting to lessen reliance on them.

Linked? I think so for two reasons:
-govt may be applying pressure in return for investment
-now the AFL has a ground in Melbourne, it ought to be able to make core busisness for clubs more profitable, thus less reliant on aPokies

The AFL indicated years ago that it would prefer clubs werent involved in pokies.

 

[Gigantor]

AFL looking for govt investment to make Etihad and environs more attractive and presumably more profitable.

Now we hear the AFl has discovered its pokies conscience, wanting to lessen reliance on them.

Linked? I think so for two reasons:
-govt may be applying pressure in return for investment
-now the AFL has a ground in Melbourne, it ought to be able to make core busisness for clubs more profitable, thus less reliant on aPokies

I would welcome that.

Hawthorn vacating the poorer, down trodden western suburbs would be a good start.

 

[NoobPie]

I would welcome that.

Hawthorn vacating the poorer, down trodden western suburbs would be a good start.

Hawthorn are the gold standard in Pokies. I was unaware of their presence in Melbourne's west...

https://hurlingpeoplenow.wordpress.com/2016/09/

Apparently they also went against the AFL's wishes in their most recent deal with Tasmania, who's government they get millions each year from (the poorest state that receives a massive fiscal transfer from the rest of the country)


What a putrid football club

 

[Pessimistic]

Hawthorn are the gold standard in Pokies. I was unaware of their presence in Melbourne's west...

https://hurlingpeoplenow.wordpress.com/2016/09/

Apparently they also went against the AFL's wishes in their most recent deal with Tasmania, who's government they get millions each year from (the poorest state that receives a massive fiscal transfer from the rest of the country)


What a putrid football club

guaranteed eddie would have three times the disputes with the AFL than the hawks.

does that make him and Collingwood three times as putrid?

PS this aint the forum for petty 'my club is better than yours' theres a bay for that

 

[Gigantor]

And woe to the poor western suburbs who would never have ever seen a pokie machine if those nasty Hawks hadnt set up shop.

Those with below-average incomes are the most susceptible to pokie addiction.

They need to reduce the number of pokies in the poor, down trodden western suburbs, and Hawthorn taking away its pokies from there would be an excellent start.

 

[Pessimistic]

They'd have the same disposable as the outer east. AND they have the airport, the racing, Werribee zoo

The southern star - the only observation wheel in the world with nothing but a freeway and a shopping centre to 'observe'

 

[NoobPie]

Why? The Tasmanian Government was clear that they wanted Hawthorn, despite an offer from North for more games.



ref: http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/sor...rned-tassie-deal/story-e6frf33l-1225954177112

In fact the Tasmanian government liked the Hawks so much, they upped the offer the next time it came around. You earn that kind of loyalty after actually sticking around for 15 or more years, during which time North have played in Sydney, Canberra, Gold Coast, Hobart, and tried for Ballarat.

And woe to the poor western suburbs who would never have ever seen a pokie machine if those nasty Hawks hadnt set up shop.

Well, I think that the Hawks only presence in the poorest part of melbourne being gaming machines is pretty putrid

 

[The_Wookie]

Those with below-average incomes are the most susceptible to pokie addiction.

They need to reduce the number of pokies in the poor, down trodden western suburbs, and Hawthorn taking away its pokies from there would be an excellent start.

Why single out hawthorn? There are plenty of other entities out there - including other AFL clubs - with pokies ventures in the west.

 

[Gigantor]

Why single out hawthorn? There are plenty of other entities out there - including other AFL clubs - with pokies ventures in the west.

1. Hawthorn has a large revenue base.
2. It already siphons off significant money from the smallest and poorest state in Australia.
3. It's main constituency is the well-heeled of Melbourne's East.
4. Those with a below average income, such as live in the downtrodden West, are the most susceptible to gambling addiction, and since Hawthorn doesn't need the money, it wold be a grand gesture to close down its pokie operations out West, and focus its energies on the other side of town, where there are fewer gambling problems.

 

[Pessimistic]

Caroline springs? McMansion central?

Someones poverty radar is about two decades behind

 

[Pessimistic]

Apologies everyone for me letting the trolls in

 

[Our Game]

1. Hawthorn has a large revenue base.
2. It already siphons off significant money from the smallest and poorest state in Australia.
3. It's main constituency is the well-heeled of Melbourne's East.
4. Those with a below average income, such as live in the downtrodden West, are the most susceptible to gambling addiction, and since Hawthorn doesn't need the money, it wold be a grand gesture to close down its pokie operations out West, and focus its energies on the other side of town, where there are fewer gambling problems.

I think you will find its not the so called down trodden west any more and its the fastest growing area in Victoria
A great time for the doggies to gain a lot more local support

 

[telsor]

1. Hawthorn has a large revenue base.
2. It already siphons off significant money from the smallest and poorest state in Australia.
3. It's main constituency is the well-heeled of Melbourne's East.
4. Those with a below average income, such as live in the downtrodden West, are the most susceptible to gambling addiction, and since Hawthorn doesn't need the money, it wold be a grand gesture to close down its pokie operations out West, and focus its energies on the other side of town, where there are fewer gambling problems.

5. If Hawthorn closed moved all it's pokies out of the area, other organisations would move in, making no actual difference.

 

[The_Wookie]

1. Hawthorn has a large revenue base.
2. It already siphons off significant money from the smallest and poorest state in Australia.
3. It's main constituency is the well-heeled of Melbourne's East.
4. Those with a below average income, such as live in the downtrodden West, are the most susceptible to gambling addiction, and since Hawthorn doesn't need the money, it wold be a grand gesture to close down its pokie operations out West, and focus its energies on the other side of town, where there are fewer gambling problems.

1. Collingwood has a large revenue base too, and a large part of that is pokies revenue.
2. Siphons? The Government willingly contributes the money and believes that it brings in more money to the state than it gives. This argument is crap.
3. Its main constituency? You have some sort of proof of this? Before 2008 they were just mid range, success brought them a lot more, including 10,000 tasmanian members. Its not just a local code with local support any more.
4. Even if Hawthorn closed its gambling operations - despite having no legal reason to do so, someone else would open them - especially since Hawthorn makes a fair bit of money from them. Gestures mean nothing if the law doesnt change.

 

[The_Wookie]

I think you will find its not the so called down trodden west any more and its the fastest growing area in Victoria
A great time for the doggies to gain a lot more local support

I grew up there in the late 80s and it wasnt downtrodden then.

 

[Gigantor]

I grew up there in the late 80s and it wasnt downtrodden then.

1. Collingwood has a large revenue base too, and a large part of that is pokies revenue.
2. Siphons? The Government willingly contributes the money and believes that it brings in more money to the state than it gives. This argument is crap.
3. Its main constituency? You have some sort of proof of this? Before 2008 they were just mid range, success brought them a lot more, including 10,000 tasmanian members. Its not just a local code with local support any more.
4. Even if Hawthorn closed its gambling operations - despite having no legal reason to do so, someone else would open them - especially since Hawthorn makes a fair bit of money from them. Gestures mean nothing if the law doesnt change.

I bet you there are more pokies per head of population in the Western suburbs than you find in the Eastern suburbs.

I bet you the residents of the Western suburbs lose more of their disposable income to pokies than the residents of the Eastern suburbs (and by a big margin I might add).

And yes, Hawthorn's constituency is primarily the Eastern suburbs, the prosperous, leafy Eastern suburbs. They deliberately target the Western suburbs because lower educated, lower income people are more likely to put their money into pokies. Clearly, if you are putting a greater percentage of your disposable income into pokies, you are more likely to be experiencing a gambling problem.

In other words, Hawthorn are profiting from the misery of others, far, far away from where they are domiciled and the crucial point is that they don't have to do it.

 

[The_Wookie]

I bet you there are more pokies per head of population in the Western suburbs than you find in the Eastern suburbs.

I bet you the residents of the Western suburbs lose more of their disposable income to pokies than the residents of the Eastern suburbs (and by a big margin I might add).

Id like to see some stats on that before I bet on anything.

And yes, Hawthorn's constituency is primarily the Eastern suburbs, the prosperous, leafy Eastern suburbs. They deliberately target the Western suburbs because lower educated, lower income people are more likely to put their money into pokies.

I mean sure, until you remember that almost half of Hawthorns pokie operations are in the eastern suburbs.

Clearly, if you are putting a greater percentage of your disposable income into pokies, you are more likely to be experiencing a gambling problem.

Thats not exactly Hawthorns problem.

In other words, Hawthorn are profiting from the misery of others, far, far away from where they are domiciled and the crucial point is that they don't have to do it.

Hawthorn are a national business, this isnt the 80s anymore, they arent restricted to locales. And crucially what they are doing is within the legal framework as laid down by the Parliament of Victoria.

 

[Gigantor]

Hawthorn are a national business, this isnt the 80s anymore, they arent restricted to locales. And crucially what they are doing is within the legal framework as laid down by the Parliament of Victoria.

But on this particular issue, we are not just talking business (noting that footy is a unique form of business), we are talking morals and ethics, and it strikes me as unethical that a wealthy club like Hawthorn, domiciled in the prosperous, leafy East, should profit from the misery of the poor, uneducated and downtrodden citizens of the West.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Id like to see some stats on that before I bet on anything.



I mean sure, until you remember that almost half of Hawthorns pokie operations are in the eastern suburbs.



Thats not exactly Hawthorns problem.



Hawthorn are a national business, this isnt the 80s anymore, they arent restricted to locales. And crucially what they are doing is within the legal framework as laid down by the Parliament of Victoria.

This link should help you

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&...DZ1WC9JjtNj2n6dFQ&sig2=aeMFVPtPAZAUXUciyap-Yg

Generally speaking he is right that the number of machines in poorer suburbs outweighs that for wealthy suburbs

 

[Garlic muncher]

This link should help you

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&...DZ1WC9JjtNj2n6dFQ&sig2=aeMFVPtPAZAUXUciyap-Yg

Generally speaking he is right that the number of machines in poorer suburbs outweighs that for wealthy suburbs

You gotta fish where the fish are

 

[Gigantor]

This link should help you

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&...DZ1WC9JjtNj2n6dFQ&sig2=aeMFVPtPAZAUXUciyap-Yg

Generally speaking he is right that the number of machines in poorer suburbs outweighs that for wealthy suburbs

Thank you, most of us talk in generalisations, but I thought such studies had been undertaken, even if I didn't have them on tap.

 

[Kwality]

But on this particular issue, we are not just talking business (noting that footy is a unique form of business), we are talking morals and ethics, and it strikes me as unethical that a wealthy club like Hawthorn, domiciled in the prosperous, leafy East, should profit from the misery of the poor, uneducated and downtrodden citizens of the West.

To be fair the Hawks aren't the only AFL club with pokies out in the west, off the top Carlton in Laverton & the Cats in Point Cook.

 

[Our Game]

But on this particular issue, we are not just talking business (noting that footy is a unique form of business), we are talking morals and ethics, and it strikes me as unethical that a wealthy club like Hawthorn, domiciled in the prosperous, leafy East, should profit from the misery of the poor, uneducated and downtrodden citizens of the West.

When has morals and ethics come into running a business? and the AFL and its clubs are now one hell of a big business. Its all about profit and the moment you lose sight of that you go broke!
If people are stupid enough to lose their money by playing the pokies then thats their problem same as smokers that know cigarettes can cause all sorts of diseases that lead to an early death but still keep smoking.

 

[Gigantor]

To be fair the Hawks aren't the only AFL club with pokies out in the west, off the top Carlton in Laverton & the Cats in Point Cook.

Well, Point Cook is just about the last stop in outer SW Melbourne before you get to Geelong, so that's understandable.

The Eastern suburbs of Melbourne continue for dozens of kms - this is Hawthorn's constituency, but, as we have established, there are more machines in lower-income suburbs than are found in higher-income suburbs, and Hawthorn has made a deliberate decision to focus on the other side of town because low income earners are more likely to use pokies than the higher income citizens found closer to Hawthorn's home.

I'm just putting it out there that I find it distasteful.

 

[Gigantor]

When has morals and ethics come into running a business? and the AFL and its clubs are now one hell of a big business. Its all about profit and the moment you lose sight of that you go broke!
If people are stupid enough to lose their money by playing the pokies then thats their problem same as smokers that know cigarettes can cause all sorts of diseases that lead to an early death but still keep smoking.

It's interesting you would mention pokies and smoking in the same post.

You are sort of making the argument for me.

My view is not about pokies per se, it's about piling up machines in the lower-income suburbs of Melbourne, taking advantage of such people, in particular, by a club which is domiciled on the other side of town. Like the problem of smoking, let's take some steps to minimise the damage. One self-regulatory step could be to ask Hawthorn to focus its gambling activities in its own neck of the woods.