The next Melbourne stadium

[Cyclops]

What exactly do you see as the problem with Docklands ?

If I may, its been a terrible waste of money from the start.

London redeveloped their Docklands area that was wrecked after WW2 and some profits were made, so thats the dream other cities chase. Our Docklands was a place where artists had semi-legal studios and raves took place in abandoned and condemned warehouses.

Kennett set up a Docklands authority as part of his "Big Build" prequel and huge sums were borrowed to prime the pump of a boom that didn't really happen. The whole redevelopment has been plagued by poor planning, basically an ugly and inhospitable place eg the Melbourne Star, a ferris wheel that doesn't move.

There was an "influencer" in my circle who tried to steer every social event to this windy smelly lifeless hole. I never had a good time there, every venue was an "instant classic" marketing heavy value lite.

More recently I've heard the occupancy rates remain catastrophically low, with whole floors of echoing buildings being occupied by rave organisers (so they never really went away) and meth labs that go undetected for months. Is this true?

The Docklands build was part of this, a load of money to force a result, but the ground was oriented north south, and the sun doesn't get in, and the tenants experience decades of bad luck with injury that is in no way related to the god awful surface. One flag between them since they moved there? North, Essendon, Footscray, Carlton and St Kilda are all just unlucky that's all.

On a side note this seems to be similar to the Hobart set up. Harbour front stadium sounds so sexy, why wouldn't you build a big stadium by the sea? Surely salt air is good for buildings? And it won't be that expensive...

 

[RedV3x]

If I may, its been a terrible waste of money from the start.

At least converting it to AFL use prevented it from being a white elephant.

 

[Cyclops]

At least converting it to AFL use prevented it from being a white elephant.

If the AFL owns the land then it was a smart investment from that pov, selling it off will bring a return when the time comes.

If we get a more competent admin then footy is a vote grabber, should be able to use taxpayer money for a rebuild or upgrade.

One of the worst grounds atm though.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Still think a sell off, proper Docklands redevelopment and a new stadium at Gosch’s will be the way forward. It makes sense.

I think it would also lead to less “home grounds” for Melbourne clubs. Every club would play at both stadiums.

 

[Cyclops]

Still think a sell off, proper Docklands redevelopment and a new stadium at Gosch’s will be the way forward. It makes sense.

I think it would also lead to less “home grounds” for Melbourne clubs. Every club would play at both stadiums.

Theres a decent transport hub around the G already, so there's some sense to the idea.

The current state govg have spent all the bikies so it won't happen soon.

I feel like a more suburban ground, with a rail loop and decent parking is more attractive and spreads the bets more, but that will cost way more, so it highly unlikely.

 

[Mr north man]

Theres a decent transport hub around the G already, so there's some sense to the idea.

The current state govg have spent all the bikies so it won't happen soon.

I feel like a more suburban ground, with a rail loop and decent parking is more attractive and spreads the bets more, but that will cost way more, so it highly unlikely.

So if this ground is built how big would it be 50K,55K or 60k? will it have a Roof on it? And who would play there?
It’s a shame Sandown Racecourse is off the market that would have be the ideal ground close to EastLink to go North and South and if a MonoRail had been built on the Princess Highway side would even been better Waverley Park Mark 2.0

 

[Johnny Bananas]

If I may, its been a terrible waste of money from the start.

London redeveloped their Docklands area that was wrecked after WW2 and some profits were made, so thats the dream other cities chase. Our Docklands was a place where artists had semi-legal studios and raves took place in abandoned and condemned warehouses.

Kennett set up a Docklands authority as part of his "Big Build" prequel and huge sums were borrowed to prime the pump of a boom that didn't really happen. The whole redevelopment has been plagued by poor planning, basically an ugly and inhospitable place eg the Melbourne Star, a ferris wheel that doesn't move.

There was an "influencer" in my circle who tried to steer every social event to this windy smelly lifeless hole. I never had a good time there, every venue was an "instant classic" marketing heavy value lite.

More recently I've heard the occupancy rates remain catastrophically low, with whole floors of echoing buildings being occupied by rave organisers (so they never really went away) and meth labs that go undetected for months. Is this true?

The Docklands build was part of this, a load of money to force a result, but the ground was oriented north south, and the sun doesn't get in, and the tenants experience decades of bad luck with injury that is in no way related to the god awful surface. One flag between them since they moved there? North, Essendon, Footscray, Carlton and St Kilda are all just unlucky that's all.

On a side note this seems to be similar to the Hobart set up. Harbour front stadium sounds so sexy, why wouldn't you build a big stadium by the sea? Surely salt air is good for buildings? And it won't be that expensive...

This is what happens when things are built for investors, rather than being built with the idea of a community in mind, including residents who aren't wealthy but can still afford to live there. Urban planning should never be left primarily to the free market because they'll try to suck as much money out of it as possible, to the detriment of the quality of life. And perhaps trying to suck as much money out of the article aas possible is part of why the stadium is oriented the way it is. Football also suffers when money is prioritised over it.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I feel like a more suburban ground, with a rail loop and decent parking is more attractive and spreads the bets more, but that will cost way more, so it highly unlikely.

When you say rail loop, do you mean like the SRL, or smaller loops or branches like Flemington Racecourse and Sydney Olympic Park? I'd argue the latter are poor value for money because they don't get much use outside of events.

 

[Cyclops]

When you say rail loop, do you mean like the SRL, or smaller loops or branches like Flemington Racecourse and Sydney Olympic Park? I'd argue the latter are poor value for money because they don't get much use outside of events.

The plan from the 1950s was to link what are now the Mernda and Greensie lines with a two way loop, so trains would run out both ways, to a site out somewhere not too far from I think McLeod?

 

[Johnny Bananas]

The plan from the 1950s was to link what are now the Mernda and Greensie lines with a two way loop, so trains would run out both ways, to a site out somewhere not too far from I think McLeod?

Won't happen now. I'm sure whatever corridor was reserved for it has been built over.

If the AFL want a suburban ground with rail access, they should buy land near a planned SRL station, or in a place where the government could be persuaded to add an extra SRL station (eg near Northland). That will rectify some of the accessibility problem.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

So if this ground is built how big would it be 50K,55K or 60k? will it have a Roof on it? And who would play there?
It’s a shame Sandown Racecourse is off the market that would have be the ideal ground close to EastLink to go North and South and if a MonoRail had been built on the Princess Highway side would even been better Waverley Park Mark 2.0

I think a new ground would be between 50k and 60k, the same as Docklands.

Built with money from the sale of Docklands.

It would be a stones throw from the MCG so I think all clubs would play there, bigger games would be at the G and the second tier games at the new stadium.

Richmond Station and a section of Swan St and Brunton Ave (west of Punt Road) could be sunk and a precinct built over the top to allow for easy access from Yarra Park and the MCG straight to the new stadium.

Depending how far you wanted to sink the train lines, you could open up a lot of space along the southern side of Brunton Avenue for commercial and residential development - this would be lucrative and significantly offset government investment in the new precinct and stadium. Same with the train lines east of Punt Road to Swan St.

Sandown wouldn’t happen - but it wouldn’t need a monorail, it has a train station. And it’s only three stops from a major SRL interchange at Clayton.