The Real Membership Numbers

[Hawkk]

Probably a fair point, though the Demons do have a $40 Demons-MCC Supporter package that allows MCC-Demon supporters to be included in the Melbourne tally.

 

[JD-Roo]

But hey - I get a Rick the Rock sticker..

What the......???

 

[Scodog10]

Yeah nah. Some people 'defected' to Freo back in 95.

Most just watch on tv.

No problems. Would you have any inclination of just how many don't bother with the waiting list?

 

[Scotland]

I imagine when the new stadium is finished WC will maintain a membership base in the region of 40-45k. The same people who will pay $400 a year to only go to a couple of games will probably pay $400 a year to ensure they have a decent seat for the couple of games they want to go to.

The new stadium is a govt investment. WC aren't paying for it, so there should be access to the community. If it's sold out from day 1 with WC members then it's a bit of a lemon, even if fantastic for the club and WA footy revenues.

 

[The Falcon Strike]

This is why I don't really get it when supporters of either West Coast or Freo either promote the idea of a third WA team or say that a 60,000 seat stadium isn't enough. Firstly the jump from 40,000 seats to 60,000 is still pretty big, and outside of Derbies it will still be a pretty hard ask to fill the stadium, and secondly why would a supporter of either side want to dissipate their own financial power by bringing a 3rd side?

Because supporters actually want to go to games.

I'd imagine a supporter would rather the club only get $10M in membership revenue if they got to go to a game.

The thing to remember is - each of the 10,000 odd on the waiting list are entitled to 4 tickets. I personally have a rookie membership on top and will be taking 5.

There is the potential for that 10,000 to actually be around 30,000 in actual numbers.

Not to mention - there is talk of the 60,000 seat stadium holding over 5-10,000 for general admission. As such - the eagles may only be able to add an additional 10,000 people, which might be only a third of the waiting list.

70,000 should be the minimum in my eyes - they won't fill it every week - but the extra supply will lead to more affordable football access - at the moment the WAFC has us by the balls.

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

https://membership.essendonfc.com.au/packages/view/121

I'd say most clubs have this sort of thing now. Carlton has one too. Its for people who cant get to games but still want the membership benefits.

I understand what it is, I just wonder why Essendon has 13,500 non-access members, whereas Carlton (for example) only has 5,000.

 

[Righteo]

Not initially - people will flock to memberships as soon as they can get them after being starved for so long.

Over the ensuing years they will realise they can get walk-ups and then memberships will wane. As they wane and more walk ups are available, the club might actually have to become competitive.

At the moment the WA AFL footy goer subsidises all footy in this state. We don't have the AFL funding our grassroots.

The thought of being able to spend $80 and get a family of 4 into a game under GA and support my side if a pipedream.

I wonder if we'll face the same problem as we do now, the % of non-attending seated members that don't bother to contact the club for on-selling purposes, I still feel like even with a 60-70k seat stadium there'll still be 5-10k empty seats every week. Not sure what the system currently in place is because if I don't go I just give my card to a mate, do you have to contact them to give them a certain amount of notice that you can't go?

 

[Hawkk]

I imagine when the new stadium is finished WC will maintain a membership base in the region of 40-45k. The same people who will pay $400 a year to only go to a couple of games will probably pay $400 a year to ensure they have a decent seat for the couple of games they want to go to.

The new stadium is a govt investment. WC aren't paying for it, so there should be access to the community. If it's sold out from day 1 with WC members then it's a bit of a lemon, even if fantastic for the club and WA footy revenues.

You'll be about to 'do' a Collingwood + Hawthorn + Richmond though and sell a heap of reduced game memberships (3 game Blockbuster and the like)

A 60,000 capacity would easily allow you to boost your membership to 80,000 in the glorified pissing contest

 

[The Falcon Strike]

I wonder if we'll face the same problem as we do now, the % of non-attending seated members that don't bother to contact the club for on-selling purposes, I still feel like even with a 60-70k seat stadium there'll still be 5-10k empty seats every week. Not sure what the system currently in place is because if I don't go I just give my card to a mate, do you have to contact them to give them a certain amount of notice that you can't go?

Not sure with Freo - but with WC you have to let them know by about Wednesday.

You get 50% of the ticket back towards your next years membership

 

[invinciBlues]

I understand what it is, I just wonder why Essendon has 13,500 non-access members, whereas Carlton (for example) only has 5,000.

Well, they do have voting rights. Maybe Hirdy is stacking the deck against Little to get himself the top spot at Windy Hill.

Reading over that, although I meant it as sarcasm I wouldn't bat an eyelash if it was the case.

 

[Scodog10]

Yeah, wasn't meaning to have it come across as spiteful of bitter at all.

Just makes me laugh when clubs talk about 'breaking records'. I would love to see the numbers over the last 10 years and see how each type of membership has evolved over time.

It didn't come across as such, to me anyway

FWIW what really has gotten up my goat is that Collingwood are offer a $90 digital membership for interstate and regional supporters which allows you to stream our games plus a hat and a scarf (or something similar). Anyone that signs up for this package is included as a member.

It just makes a mockery of membership numbers, IMO.

 

[Scotland]

70,000 should be the minimum in my eyes - they won't fill it every week - but the extra supply will lead to more affordable football access - at the moment the WAFC has us by the balls.

I would probably go for 70k because the cost increase from 60k to 70k is marginal in the scheme of the project construction.

I would also cap membership at say 55k or 60k and (if possible) enable the tenant clubs to sell tickets in the remaining 10-15k areas direct, so there is a potential benefit to the club from selling walk-ups.

 

[Righteo]

Not sure with Freo - but with WC you have to let them know by about Wednesday.

You get 50% of the ticket back towards your next years membership

That seems like reasonable incentive to me, I guess people by and large are just too apathetic/lazy to do it.

 

[Scotland]

That seems like reasonable incentive to me, I guess people by and large are just too apathetic/lazy to do it.

Even though West Coast have been anywhere from first to last in the last decade or two I've never had any trouble finding people wanting to go.

If you don't go and don't give your tickets to someone you're basically paying $40 just to deny someone else access. Absurd.

 

[Scotland]

You'll be about to 'do' a Collingwood + Hawthorn + Richmond though and sell a heap of reduced game memberships (3 game Blockbuster and the like)

A 60,000 capacity would easily allow you to boost your membership to 80,000 in the glorified pissing contest

I have no problem with us doing this as long as it doesn't detract from the 11 game season ticket holders who have funded the club for the last 20 years.

If we can turn 40,000 x $40 x 11 into 40,000 x $40, 11 + 5,000 x $50 x 3 for example then it's a win. We don't want to go losing real members though.

 

[The Falcon Strike]

That seems like reasonable incentive to me, I guess people by and large are just too apathetic/lazy to do it.

I have access to most games - my old man has 4 tickets he won't let go of, even though only 2 go every week.

He just finds out who wants to go to what game and onsells the games he can't find anyone for.

But it does highlight the problem - he's had 4 tickets for 28 years and has gone from his late 30's to his mid 60s.

The majority of WC seated members would be over 50 as they are the ones who got tickets ages ago.

I'm hoping with the new stadium they decide to sell 3, 5, 6 game membership packages.

I'd love for a 5 game family membership - it would be perfect.

However from a club point of view - it is a lot easier selling 50,000 11 game memberships than it is selling 70,000 of mix and match memberships and managing the seating allocation

 

[clogged]

That high proportion of GWS members that are reduced game members would probably be ACT members. Unless the 8 game Sydney-only membership is counted as reduced game as well.

 

[Billy ray]

Even though West Coast have been anywhere from first to last in the last decade or two I've never had any trouble finding people wanting to go.

If you don't go and don't give your tickets to someone you're basically paying $40 just to deny someone else access. Absurd.

ahem, guilty as charged on this one. i was an eagles member since 1989 and by and large went to all 11 home games from then to 2010.
then in 2011 i started to travel a bit for work to qld, and i would sometimes get friends to come but often, as it was one ticket only, it often did not get taken so seat was empty. then they brought the seat resale thing in and for about 10-15 games it was available, it was only resold 5 times, mostly because it was 1 seat only and a lot of people want to go with a mate. i moved permanently to the gold coast back in 2012, and for the second half of that year plus all of 2013 it was mostly an empty seat like i say even with resale program.

i contemplated holding it and paying $400-$500 a year in case i ever come back to perth and want a seat, or in new stadium, but decided to just let it go (im one of the 2% churn factor).

i spoke to a mate the other day and he said despite being available for a new member, its been empty all year, most likely because it is one seat.
i think the eagles should look at where empty one seats are and shove people along a seat or two to free up some pairs of seats....

 

[Scodog10]

Just to touch on the table Hawkk posted earlier again.

The decision by Essendon to move to Etihad and Carlton's lack of success over the past 10-15 years are starting to show in their membership figures.

The fact that they're 20,000+ adult members behind Collingwood as well as behind Richmond and Hawthorn by decent chunks is an eye opener into how these things can change due to poor form or average decisions off field. Especially when in the scheme of things the difference in support between Carton, Essendon and those 3 clubs is somewhat negligible.

Unfortunately I can't find an easy solution for Essendon because I don't believe they can or will move from Etihad in the short term, but Carlton might be able to get the ball rolling if they can get it together onfield to get those 50,000+ members required to move to the G.

They likely have a number of adult members that will jump on the bandwagon (as all clubs do) it's just a matter of engaging with them.

 

[The King!]

The North Melbourne breakdown is particularly interesting.

For all the bleating about record membership - as expected, the "increase" is purely driven by three-game Hobart members.

So? Isnt that showing it was a good idea

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Therefore my question for any West Australians that may have some knowledge of it is how many supporters have either decided to defect to Fremantle or not bothered with the waiting list because it's so long? I'd imagine the number would be in the 10's of thousands.

From my (minimal) experience, it happens, but it's not quite a defection. The people I know who have done it are still absolutely West Coast supporters, but they're Fremantle members. I asked about this on Big Footy a while back and apparently they've even got a name for them out in WA: 'Freagles'.

 

[boncer34]

Yes and no.

They are membership figures - so gate receipts are largely irrelevant.

Except those of us who have to "upgrade" to nab a seat.

 

[cammo78]

So? Isnt that showing it was a good idea

If it continues - yes - but what happens to these members if/when they achieve their aim of playing all their home games in Melbourne?

You think they are going to pony up for memberships to games they can't attend (which is the whole reason they have bought them in the first place)?

I'd wager not.

 

[shotgun_blues]

Who cares really?

Premierships won will only ever be the stat that matters in the end.

 

[SJ]

Melbourne is worse.

By adult members they have the 7th largest membership in the league (24316) but across concession and juniors they have the lowest numbers in Victoria (2573 + 4146)

This isn't surprising given historically they are pretty big club but if you look at their numbers amongst indicators of youthful support (facebook, twitter, supercoach etc.) they are far lower than where they have historically featured.

Classic sign of an aging support base.

As a point of reference, 27% of Hawthorn's members are supposedly juniors (its probably closer to 20.5%) while just 13% of Melbourne fans are juniors - which is the lowest in Victoria.

With respect to Richmond, they've got a pretty healthy junior base with 18.3% of members being juniors.

The problem with Melbourne is that the last generation to see success is now at grandparent age. But their children didn't see any success. And neither have their children.

At least with Richmond, current parents of children grew up with success - so although they won't have the 'success premium' that a Geelong has (support from the latest generation due to success), they do have the 'parent premium' for now.

Hawthorn has both of these advantages creating huge junior support.

Melbourne has neither.