Analysis The Small Things

[edgie]

It's almost as if it's too simple...



Yeah those experiencing chronic institutionalised oppression can be finicky little darlings sometimes.

I'm not them though. I'm a straight white male. I'm ready, and when they are ready, and it will take a lot of time and change still, we can do it together. It's the straight white men who continue to bring up the past that is the biggest anchor on the whole thing.

 

[I Dont Care]

Why would it take a generation or two? What you're talking about is a literal miracle, so you might as well claim it can be done with the snap of your fingers.

It took thousands of years to ingrain what we have today into our psyche, I couldn't imagine us all changing from the inside out to be tolerant of difference for at least another few hundred years, I mean oppression of women would predate racialism, it comes too natural that we are different. One step at a time the little changes come

 

[SilenceOz]

I think making this place more female friendly is easy.

If someone posts a news article/photo about a woman/girl.

Dont comment on her rack/how hot/how ugly she is.

Just stick to the story/accomplishment she made.

 

[El_Scorcho]

Brock is exactly right. For equality to really work going forward, we need to wipe the slate clean. Intolerance and objectification in past times as an argument/point of view has to be forgotten to truly move ahead.

Til then, it isn't a case of double standards, just different standards. Cause everybody is different, right?

Sent from my Lumia 800 using Tapatalk

You can't just forget historical context. You can't. Not with racism, not with sexism, not with any sort of oppression. Historical context is everything.

It's nice in theory but you can't get rid of something so ingrained.

I think you're missing the point about people bringing up double standards. As I've said before when various issues get brought up on this board, I'm all for everyone having equal rights. That means we don't cherry pick at all and have a completely unbiased view from this point on. If we don't, we have a ' well you had more cake last week so I'll have more than you this week' which just oscillates who is getting the raw end of the deal. If we want to move forward with sexism, racism etc - we need to take the higher ground, otherwise we are just as bad as the problem.

I remember reading this on the chive a few years back and it literally stopped me in my tracks about all of these types of arguments.

Edit: that doesn't mean I like what Gayle did, I don't, I'm just dumbfounded when this happens in reverse and no one blinks.
View attachment 205012

There is an important difference.

McLaughlin is a professional woman doing a professional job in a male dominated industry. Even then, she is constantly judged on her looks. She broke onto the scene as "the hot chick from the Fox Sports soccer coverage", and she's had to work really ****ing hard to shake that tag and be respected for what she does.

What Gayle did was effectively reduce this hardworking, dedicated and talented sports journalist to a piece of meat. It would be totally different if she had come up and flirted with him or had spoken with him beforehand about giving the viewers something interesting to talk about, but that's not what happened. She went up and tried to conduct a professional and entertaining interview as a boundary rider and was blindsided with a sexual advance broadcast on national TV, in which Gayle effectively talked about her as if she was his prize for making runs.

Sharapova doing the same thing is absolutely not the same, because the male journalist who was lucky enough to be on the end of her flirting hasn't had to deal with an entire career worth of being judged on how he looks. Sharapova has. McLaughlin has.

I work in a field where I deal with a shitload of domestic violence and I absolutely agree that female on male domestic violence happens and it can be really scary. But this isn't domestic violence, this is sexual objectification, and we still live in a world where a woman is automatically judged more harshly than a man depending on how she looks. All the time.

You can't just wipe the slate clean. It doesn't work like that. You can't wipe literally thousands of years of women being subservient to men away and pretend it doesn't exist, when it's still an integral part of how society works in 2016. It shouldn't be, and we're getting better, but we're getting better because people stand up and speak out against the sort of degrading shit that Gayle pulled on McLaughlin.

 

[charcolechaddy]

I think making this place more female friendly is easy.

If someone posts a news article/photo about a woman/girl.

Dont comment on her rack/how hot/how ugly she is.

Just stick to the story/accomplishment she made.

Easy, don't use a pick of yourself in a bikini and no one will comment at all.

We have several female poster that most poster wouldn't even know they are female .

 

[Lagooner]

You can't just forget historical context. You can't. Not with racism, not with sexism, not with any sort of oppression. Historical context is everything.

It's nice in theory but you can't get rid of something so ingrained.



There is an important difference.

McLaughlin is a professional woman doing a professional job in a male dominated industry. Even then, she is constantly judged on her looks. She broke onto the scene as "the hot chick from the Fox Sports soccer coverage", and she's had to work really ******* hard to shake that tag and be respected for what she does.

What Gayle did was effectively reduce this hardworking, dedicated and talented sports journalist to a piece of meat. It would be totally different if she had come up and flirted with him or had spoken with him beforehand about giving the viewers something interesting to talk about, but that's not what happened. She went up and tried to conduct a professional and entertaining interview as a boundary rider and was blindsided with a sexual advance broadcast on national TV, in which Gayle effectively talked about her as if she was his prize for making runs.

Sharapova doing the same thing is absolutely not the same, because the male journalist who was lucky enough to be on the end of her flirting hasn't had to deal with an entire career worth of being judged on how he looks. Sharapova has. McLaughlin has.

I work in a field where I deal with a shitload of domestic violence and I absolutely agree that female on male domestic violence happens and it can be really scary. But this isn't domestic violence, this is sexual objectification, and we still live in a world where a woman is automatically judged more harshly than a man depending on how she looks. All the time.

You can't just wipe the slate clean. It doesn't work like that. You can't wipe literally thousands of years of women being subservient to men away and pretend it doesn't exist, when it's still an integral part of how society works in 2016. It shouldn't be, and we're getting better, but we're getting better because people stand up and speak out against the sort of degrading shit that Gayle pulled on McLaughlin.

Great post Scorch, well said.

The importance and significance of history cannot be understated, and as members and supporters of Port Adelaide, we above all others on this site should understand this.

 

[charcolechaddy]

Great post Scorch, well said.

The importance and significance of history cannot be understated, and as members and supporters of Port Adelaide, we above all others on this site should understand this.

We act like all this is in the past, there would be more people oppressed in the world at this current moment than any time in history.

We are all slaves to the rich on one way or another we are just lucky we live here.

 

[SilenceOz]

Easy, don't use a pick of yourself in a bikini and no one will comment at all.

Were talking about Bigfooty here man,
If a woman posts a bikini photo of herself on FB, instagram, snapchat and wants compliments sure go ahead.
If someone else is posting about a woman's AFL league do we all need to start the "dat ass" comments?

That's what this thread was started for.

You can enjoy looking at women sure go ahead, but if it's not relevant to the topic does it need to be said?
The woman's "physical attributes" doesn't need to be brought up though when the discussion is about an accomplishment or a hypothetical football league.

 

[charcolechaddy]

I'm sorry so this thread is only to talk about comments made about woman's football anyway Blah!

 

[Jonts]

Try working with sexist bogans they're the demographic that all of the compare sunrise to this and co videos are hitting

I know none of them are on here

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Easy, don't use a pick of yourself in a bikini and no one will comment at all.

We have several female poster that most poster wouldn't even know they are female .

I have never seen a pic of Caroline Wilson or Rebecca Wilson in a bikini. I don't recall them ever trading on looks. Yet they are subject to some of the most vile sexist abuse you will see whenever they write an article a sub-group of the sporting population disagrees with.

 

[Andre]

I have never seen a pic of Caroline Wilson or Rebecca Wilson in a bikini. I don't recall them ever trading on looks. Yet they are subject to some of the most vile sexist abuse you will see whenever they write an article a sub-group of the sporting population disagrees with.

Not on this board, which the recent crusade to the holy land is aimed at. Caroline Wilson would be this boards favourite journalist, as she knows her stuff and isn't blinded by the past (in this case football, but it's a good attitude in general). Rebecca Wilson is just a rabid Rubgy fan who will latch on any proposition to lash the AFL, justified or not. She's Rowe or KG level idiot, who just happens to be a female.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

on queue that mole Bec Wilson!.

that interview was pure entertainment, which is exactly who C Gayle is... If you don't follow him on twitter I suggest you do. Very funny person.

Not on this board, which the recent crusade to the holy land is aimed at. Caroline Wilson would be this boards favourite journalist, as she knows her stuff and isn't blinded by the past (in this case football, but it's a good attitude in general). Rebecca Wilson is just a rabid Rubgy fan who will latch on any proposition to lash the AFL, justified or not. She's Rowe or KG level idiot, who just happens to be a female.

As a moderator I've seen enough instances of sexist abuse of Caro Wilson on these boards, both this one and other team and general AFL boards to know your comment holds water about as well as a colander. Caro might be flavour of the month now but all it takes is one slip and out comes the angry mob.

As for Bec Wilson, see above from only a few pages earlier in this thread. Maybe a tamer version of what can be viewed when posters are in full cry but nonetheless straight into a sexist slur. She might be considered to be a rugby-loving idiot but abuse of her will inevitably degenerate to sexist language. You only have to read the couple of articles I linked about abuse of women on the internet to see how easily it comes back to an attack on gender.

And this is hardly a crusade to the holy land but asking people to show some respect and keep criticism away from the 'isms'. We've even in the past asked posters to moderate their comments on players. Again just basic respect. Is that so difficult?

 

[Andre]

As a moderator I've seen enough instances of sexist abuse of Caro Wilson on these boards, both this one and other team and general AFL boards to know your comment holds water about as well as a colander. Caro might be flavour of the month now but all it takes is one slip and out comes the angry mob.

As for Bec Wilson, see above from only a few pages earlier in this thread. Maybe a tamer version of what can be viewed when posters are in full cry but nonetheless straight into a sexist slur. She might be considered to be a rugby-loving idiot but abuse of her will inevitably degenerate to sexist language. You only have to read the couple of articles I linked about abuse of women on the internet to see how easily it comes back to an attack on gender.

And this is hardly a crusade to the holy land but asking people to show some respect and keep criticism away from the 'isms'. We've even in the past asked posters to moderate their comments on players. Again just basic respect. Is that so difficult?

So he called her ugly. How is this different to the many times Rowe has been called fat and ugly, G. Cornes called Wrinkles and senile (ageist) or KG a stuttering old fool? If he'd said she had no right to comment as a woman or she got more abuse (Rowe and G. Cornes have copped much worse) you'd have a point. Treating everyone the same means start pulling up everyone who calls Rowe stupid or accept we can both praise and make abusive comments on all journalists, as long as the comment isn't explicitly about their gender (and I'd call Rowe an ugly mole of a man and most here would agree).

 

[1954]

The very nature of television presenting regardless of gender is largely based on the individuals appearance.

There have been some fairly average looking blokes, (Lionel Williams and Ernie Sigley are a couple of examples ), but they have been gone from our screens for decades, and I suspect that many male presenters today are judged under the same `shallow ' rules as their female counterparts of years gone by.

As for any male who doesn't believe that the majority of modern women don't judge him on his appearance first, sorry but you are kidding yourself bigtime.
It's called chemistry, and it's been making the world go around for 1,000's of years.

As for Chris Gayle, he certainly hasn't helped his situation with his comments since the `Mel ' incident.

 

[Eddie Dingle]

...As for Chris Gayle, he certainly hasn't helped his situation with his comments since the `Mel ' incident.

I think the one thing that is no longer is dispute is that Chris Gayle is an idiot.

 

[LFC2010]

As a moderator I've seen enough instances of sexist abuse of Caro Wilson on these boards, both this one and other team and general AFL boards to know your comment holds water about as well as a colander. Caro might be flavour of the month now but all it takes is one slip and out comes the angry mob.

As for Bec Wilson, see above from only a few pages earlier in this thread. Maybe a tamer version of what can be viewed when posters are in full cry but nonetheless straight into a sexist slur. She might be considered to be a rugby-loving idiot but abuse of her will inevitably degenerate to sexist language. You only have to read the couple of articles I linked about abuse of women on the internet to see how easily it comes back to an attack on gender.

And this is hardly a crusade to the holy land but asking people to show some respect and keep criticism away from the 'isms'. We've even in the past asked posters to moderate their comments on players. Again just basic respect. Is that so difficult?

Just wow, I've heard it all now.
I thought we had a freedom of speech in this country, I guess not anymore!

 

[Lagooner]

The very nature of television presenting regardless of gender is largely based on the individuals appearance.

There have been some fairly average looking blokes, (Lionel Williams and Ernie Sigley are a couple of examples ), but they have been gone from our screens for decades, and I suspect that many male presenters today are judged under the same `shallow ' rules as their female counterparts of years gone by.

As for any male who doesn't believe that the majority of modern women don't judge him on his appearance first, sorry but you are kidding yourself bigtime.
It's called chemistry, and it's been making the world go around for 1,000's of years.

As for Chris Gayle, he certainly hasn't helped his situation with his comments since the `Mel ' incident.

There are still some pretty old male news anchors knocking about and it's undeniably harder for a woman of similar vintage to occupy these positions.

I think it's pretty clear that it's not a level playing field out there.

 

[Lagooner]

Just wow, I've heard it all now.
I thought we had a freedom of speech in this country, I guess not anymore!

Freedom of speech is not a licence to say whatever you want without repercussions. You can say what you want and others can challenge it and vicky verky.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Just wow, I've heard it all now.
I thought we had a freedom of speech in this country, I guess not anymore!

Has your post been deleted?

 

[charcolechaddy]

I have never seen a pic of Caroline Wilson or Rebecca Wilson in a bikini. I don't recall them ever trading on looks. Yet they are subject to some of the most vile sexist abuse you will see whenever they write an article a sub-group of the sporting population disagrees with.

I was more refering to people who post on BF, the biggest thing with comments made by faceless posters is just that, they can say what ever they want with no one to hold them accountable.

Where Caro has gained respect is she deals with facts , she writes about story's instead of becoming the story.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

So he called her ugly. How is this different to the many times Rowe has been called fat and ugly, G. Cornes called Wrinkles and senile (ageist) or KG a stuttering old fool? If he'd said she had no right to comment as a woman or she got more abuse (Rowe and G. Cornes have copped much worse) you'd have a point. Treating everyone the same means start pulling up everyone who calls Rowe stupid or accept we can both praise and make abusive comments on all journalists, as long as the comment isn't explicitly about their gender (and I'd call Rowe an ugly mole of a man and most here would agree).

He called her a mole. A specific sexist insult. He didn't call her fat, ugly, senile or wrinkly all non-gender specific.

 

[DaTBird187]

You can't just forget historical context. You can't. Not with racism, not with sexism, not with any sort of oppression. Historical context is everything.

It's nice in theory but you can't get rid of something so ingrained.



There is an important difference.

McLaughlin is a professional woman doing a professional job in a male dominated industry. Even then, she is constantly judged on her looks. She broke onto the scene as "the hot chick from the Fox Sports soccer coverage", and she's had to work really ******* hard to shake that tag and be respected for what she does.

What Gayle did was effectively reduce this hardworking, dedicated and talented sports journalist to a piece of meat. It would be totally different if she had come up and flirted with him or had spoken with him beforehand about giving the viewers something interesting to talk about, but that's not what happened. She went up and tried to conduct a professional and entertaining interview as a boundary rider and was blindsided with a sexual advance broadcast on national TV, in which Gayle effectively talked about her as if she was his prize for making runs.

Sharapova doing the same thing is absolutely not the same, because the male journalist who was lucky enough to be on the end of her flirting hasn't had to deal with an entire career worth of being judged on how he looks. Sharapova has. McLaughlin has.

I work in a field where I deal with a shitload of domestic violence and I absolutely agree that female on male domestic violence happens and it can be really scary. But this isn't domestic violence, this is sexual objectification, and we still live in a world where a woman is automatically judged more harshly than a man depending on how she looks. All the time.

You can't just wipe the slate clean. It doesn't work like that. You can't wipe literally thousands of years of women being subservient to men away and pretend it doesn't exist, when it's still an integral part of how society works in 2016. It shouldn't be, and we're getting better, but we're getting better because people stand up and speak out against the sort of degrading shit that Gayle pulled on McLaughlin.

Yes, thank god we have things nowadays like Tinder to strike a blow for the objectification of the sexes.

 

[charcolechaddy]

I never knew mole was gender specifically offending.

I reckon we need a spread sheet.

Where is REH!

 

[Eddie Dingle]

I never knew mole was gender specifically offending.

I reckon we need a spread sheet.

Where is REH!

John Halbert taught an old publican mate who had a pub in North Adelaide and called him wart all the way through school.

Is wart gender specific?