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They were pretty low membership wise, so was North, but after 93, they were really on their own at the bottom of the membership ladder
Article The Tale of Fitzroy and the Merger
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They were pretty low membership wise, so was North, but after 93, they were really on their own at the bottom of the membership ladder
evo
Let's hit the f*ken road!
In my opinion, they would now have a bigger supporter base than North or Footscray.
In the late 70s early 80s they were developing a presence it what was still an fairly new exploding suburban region of Doncaster-Templestowe much the way Footscray and North are gaining a presence in Melton, Hoppers Crossing, Caroline Springs. It was their primary recruiting zone and most of their quality players were coming from the area - Roos, Pert, Osborne etc. However it takes a decade or two for those kids to become members and have families of their own.
With the demise of Fitzroy, Melbournes eastern suburbs were left to be carved up by Hawthorn and Richmond. Collingwood and Carlton, took the North-East expansion corridor. The eastern suburbs have been some of the fastest growing footy demographics, not only in Melbourne but all of Australia. As witnessed by the fact the Hawks and Tiges have some of the largest membership bases in the league, despite both also being broke around the same time Fitzroy was.
I coach juniors around the area and it is interesting how many dads in their late 30s, early 40sI talk to these days who say they barracked for fitzroy as a kid but either gave up on the AFL or barrack for Richmond or Hawthorn.
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- Moderator
- #53
Fitzroy could have survived and prospered. Fitzroy in 1992-93 was a very competitive side and with a bit more support could have become a very good team in 1994 and beyond. Crowds of 50,000 and above for some Fitzroy games in 1992 and 1993, as well as crowds of above 25,000 for pre-season games showed that the club could attract spectators, if competitive.
In 1996 Fitzroy was $2.7 million in debt and was ejected from the competition as a result. In 1996 the AFL apparently had $12 million to spend for mergers (Fitzroy-North/Brisbane & Melbourne-Hawthorn), but couldn't prop up Fitzroy to the tune of $1.2 million. 1996 Fitzroy chairman Dyson Hore-Lacy has stated quite categorically on a number of occasions that if Fitzroy had been able to access an extra million dollars from sponsors or some other source in 1996, they would not have sought a merger with North Melbourne, Brisbane or anyone else. Since then, beginning in 2002, other Melbourne based clubs have received tens of millions of dollars from the Competitive Balance Fund and other AFL sources.
A selection of figures for example:
2002: Western Bulldogs - $1 million
2003: Western Bulldogs - $1 million, North Melbourne - $1 million
2004: Western Bulldogs - $1.5 million, North Melbourne - $1 million
2005: Melbourne $1.5 million + $1.5 million retrospectively, Western Bulldogs $1.5 million, North Melbourne $1 million.
2006: Carlton - $2.1 million
2007: Western Bulldogs $1.7 million, North Melbourne $1.4 million, Melbourne $1 million, Sydney Swans $0.7 million, Richmond $0.4 million, Hawthorn $0.25 million, Port Adelaide $0.25 million
2008: Melbourne - $250,000, Western Bulldogs $1.7 million, North Melbourne $1.4 million
2009: Melbourne - $1 million, Port Adelaide - $1 million
Totals 2002-2009
Western Bulldogs - $8.4 million
North Melbourne - $5.8 million
Melbourne - $5.25 million
Carlton - $2.1 million
Had Fitzroy received the same amount of money in 1996 as any of the above four clubs they would:
1. have NOT sought a merger and continued to field a team independently in the AFL.
2. have paid off their only secured creditor - Nauru to whom they owed $1.25 million - which meant an administrator would not have been appointed
3. have redeveloped Brunswick Street Oval as a permanent training base. (This step already had the approval of the Fitzroy Council and needed $250,000 to bring it to fruition).
4. have paid 100% of the cap - thereby being able to retain their players and remain competitive.
5. have developed their recruiting zone out Balwyn and Doncaster way, thereby developing a significant supporter base and increaing their membership (particularly if they were competitive).
In 1996 Fitzroy was $2.7 million in debt and was ejected from the competition as a result. In 1996 the AFL apparently had $12 million to spend for mergers (Fitzroy-North/Brisbane & Melbourne-Hawthorn), but couldn't prop up Fitzroy to the tune of $1.2 million. 1996 Fitzroy chairman Dyson Hore-Lacy has stated quite categorically on a number of occasions that if Fitzroy had been able to access an extra million dollars from sponsors or some other source in 1996, they would not have sought a merger with North Melbourne, Brisbane or anyone else. Since then, beginning in 2002, other Melbourne based clubs have received tens of millions of dollars from the Competitive Balance Fund and other AFL sources.
A selection of figures for example:
2002: Western Bulldogs - $1 million
2003: Western Bulldogs - $1 million, North Melbourne - $1 million
2004: Western Bulldogs - $1.5 million, North Melbourne - $1 million
2005: Melbourne $1.5 million + $1.5 million retrospectively, Western Bulldogs $1.5 million, North Melbourne $1 million.
2006: Carlton - $2.1 million
2007: Western Bulldogs $1.7 million, North Melbourne $1.4 million, Melbourne $1 million, Sydney Swans $0.7 million, Richmond $0.4 million, Hawthorn $0.25 million, Port Adelaide $0.25 million
2008: Melbourne - $250,000, Western Bulldogs $1.7 million, North Melbourne $1.4 million
2009: Melbourne - $1 million, Port Adelaide - $1 million
Totals 2002-2009
Western Bulldogs - $8.4 million
North Melbourne - $5.8 million
Melbourne - $5.25 million
Carlton - $2.1 million
Had Fitzroy received the same amount of money in 1996 as any of the above four clubs they would:
1. have NOT sought a merger and continued to field a team independently in the AFL.
2. have paid off their only secured creditor - Nauru to whom they owed $1.25 million - which meant an administrator would not have been appointed
3. have redeveloped Brunswick Street Oval as a permanent training base. (This step already had the approval of the Fitzroy Council and needed $250,000 to bring it to fruition).
4. have paid 100% of the cap - thereby being able to retain their players and remain competitive.
5. have developed their recruiting zone out Balwyn and Doncaster way, thereby developing a significant supporter base and increaing their membership (particularly if they were competitive).
- Sep 19, 2006
- 48,113
- 50,688
- AFL Club
- North Melbourne
- Other Teams
- Rotor Volgograd, The Exers
For whatever reason Fitzroy did not have friends at AFL house when they needed them.
- Feb 21, 2006
- 20,735
- 19,581
- AFL Club
- Melbourne
- Other Teams
- Turtles, NYJets, Celtics, Tottenham
Under Oakley the AFL was intent on getting rid of several Vic clubs whether by merger, relocation or bankruptcy. Fitzroy was just the lowest hanging fruit.
I have heard story’s in the past that part of Fitzroy decline was due to the fact that it was getting screwed over by the Fitzroy Cricket Club who managed there home ground Brunswick Street and also held the liquor license, also the Council would not help them with ground developments back in the 50’s 60’s and after 1965 they had to co-tenant at Princess Park 1966-1968 before then moving to Junction Oval in 1969? This was home till 1984? Before two years at Victoria Park and then moving back to Princess Park which always put the club in a weak financial position with game day revenue.
I wonder where the Lions would have been if the Preston City Council had of allowed them to take up a forty year lease at Preston City Oval in the early 60’s
I wonder where the Lions would have been if the Preston City Council had of allowed them to take up a forty year lease at Preston City Oval in the early 60’s
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- Moderator
- #57
That is correct.
Carlton actually sent Fitzroy a bill one year for the use of their ground. That year the Club didn't make a cent from ground revenue.
Possibly better. But the VFL's ground rationalisation of the early 80s, may well have meant they found themselves in the same position. Still they could have had a regular and permanent training base.
- Apr 29, 2013
- 1,766
- 4,143
- AFL Club
- St Kilda
Fitzroy was a proud club, and its demise was created by AFL powerbrokers who didn't have any sense of the passion, loyalty and inter-generational commitment that has actually driven the growth of footy. I was proud to see some of their games with champion players like Bernie Quinlan and Mick Conlan.
The fans deserved better.
The fans deserved better.
- Moderator
- #60
Certainly in the medium term. The Club wants to be a regular participant in A Grade VAFA and win a few premierships there. They aim to become one of the biggest and most well supported amateur clubs in Victoria. One hundred years of VFL-AFL participation and a link with the Brisbane Lions will hopefully give them a good basis. They just need a bit more savvy marketing at the moment in my view.
Yes, my family and a lot of my friends are "sympathisers' with Fitzroy.
Certainly could target a large market and if Fitzroy were to somehow become a VFL team one day they would be a clear 2nd team for quite a few supporters.
Not even worth pursuing I don't think. The VFL is a sick joke, it's just a reserves league that rightly draws zero interest.
Until a proper city or statewide football COMPETITION is formed, the VAFA or local footy is the place to be.
I wonder if Fitzroy has considered the Northern FL... it might sound somewhat shallow but perhaps the ability to serve alcohol could assist in making the club a real destination for locals on a Saturday afternoon - it's a fantastic old ground. All done responsibly of course.
It does create the need to pay players though.
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- Moderator
- #63
Personal preference I guess. I prefer the red, gold and blue jumper.
Just about the best colour scheme for a footy club I reckon - can't believe no AFL club wears it.
- Moderator
- #65
Power Raid
We Exist To Win Premierships
Fitzroy ended up with the same fate as south Melbourne. Were the reasons for the same outcome the same?
- Moderator
- #67
Not quite the same fate. South Melbourne no longer exists as South Melbourne. They're in Sydney and still in the AFL.
Fitzroy still exists as Fitzroy. Not in the AFL, but still in Melbourne as an independent football club.
You mean like Brisbane (for Victorian games) and Adelaide (with a navy blue).
Brisbane wear it a few times a year.
It's the royal blue that makes it IMO. Surprised Adelaide didn't claim it post 96 (unless there was something in the merger agreement prohibiting another club from doing so).
Power Raid
We Exist To Win Premierships
Fair point
Do you recognise Brisbane as an extension of Fitzroy?
FTR: I don't recognise the new Port Magpies as part of Port's 1870 history.
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- #70
By their own agreement, Brisbane are the custodians of Fitzroy's AFL identity, in the AFL. That's why I support them in the AFL.
The Brisbane Lions are not the same club as Fitzroy. The Brisbane Lions are also not the product of a merger between Fitzroy and the Bears. The Brisbane Lions are a rebranded Brisbane Bears. As I have said, many many times on these boards THE Fitzroy Football Club (which was established in 1883) still exists in its own right in Melbourne and currently plays in the VAFA.
chargers 09
Premiership Player
Be a while off before that happens.
chargers 09
Premiership Player
VAFA clubs are allowed to serve grog. Just not during games.
- Feb 14, 2002
- 17,797
- 6,858
- AFL Club
- Brisbane Lions
- Other Teams
- Lexton, Northcote Park
Which is as it should be.
I think your main drawing factor, being a football club, would be games of football.
The grog just might be a nice addition.
chargers 09
Premiership Player
There are some pretty big nights/functions at VAFA clubs, where one of the main drawing cards is alcohol.
