Discussion Thoughts at the Bye

Remove this Banner Ad

"The year of exploration," "I haven't coached him year," and various other similar statements that Lyon has made are not excuses or cop outs or platitudes. RTB wants to see which players respond, and how they respond, to the pressure of playing winning footy against different teams in different conditions. Of course he's already got feedback from Enright and others who've been around a bit longer, but not in playing the style or game plan he wants them to play to win finals footy.

There will be ups and downs. We reverted to type against the Hawks and, like me, everyone hates the "traditional" softness we've seen for a decade. I don't expect we'll see too much more of that for the rest of the season.

It might take us a couple of years to assemble a team that can go deep into finals. I expect that we'll see that beginning to emerge after the bye.

Windy, for instance, isn't really getting his "running patterns" right at Sandy. Sandy is a very different team playing at a very different level to AFL football. What he is doing is being given the freedom to attack the football as a prime permanent midfielder to see how he goes when he is responsible for his own decisions, rather than only as a strictly limited "role" player. And he seems to be doing it as expected, very well.

The majority of the other young players at Sandy are coming back from injuries and haven't had proper off seasons. They probably won't be available, or ready, this year. But, by then our coaches will know where, and how, they want them to play to replace some of our older players who will be let go.

I'm not worried that much about where we finish this year. Finals would be great for everyone and it should happen. What I really want though is to see far better decision making during the course of a game. I want some poise and players both providing and choosing different options especially going into the forward 50. We still stuff up so many forward entries by not being clean in our delivery. And like everyone else I want a much improved midfield.
 
This is the shitty thing, we are almost too far down the road to start again. We need to be really creative and over achieve in the draft and trades now and try to patch up a leaky ship. Finding bargain priced Steele types partially developed, state league fillers, and free agnates that can fill holes.

We need someone who can design a list made for finals in the next few years and pay to get the best staff possible to pick the eyes out of the draft.
Sounds a bit ike the RTB playing lists from Ross' previous St Kilda stint.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

My only issue with this and the whole "year of exploration" concept is that Ross isn't really practising what he's preaching.

It's the same one paced midfield, we aren't really trying anything different.
I'm happy to let that slide till next week. It's important to establish a base from which to experiment but Ross has a history of sticking with GOP's that should be rotated out, so we'll see.
 
Exactly. Our leadership group consists of people that have never been in a position to have to reach higher... that's because there's never been expectations on them, and it shows. NONE of them know how to lead (with the exception of Sinc's who has had to fight, spit and claw his way to be what he is now, and Wilkie...the rest should be canned) it has been the easiest job in footy playing for the Saints since the year 2013. Leaders have swagger, Steele might have the right sounding surname, but he ain't the man to follow.
Wood, Sinc's, Wilkie. That is the leadership group right there. Three guys that give a s**t and that the team trusts. Maybe Crouch, he at least busts himself most weeks.
Whoever it was that said that Lyon and Steele don't seem to gel is 100% on the mark I reckon. Lyon has had Fyffe, and Riewoldt.. two dudes with serious swagger. Steele (who I genuinely like AS A PLAYER) must look second rate in comparison.
If you want players to reach higher and meet expectation, you need a core of players who will never roll over and retract their balls into their gut. Membrey, Steele, and Ross can be mentors...but not leaders.
You're deluding yourself about this. Sinclair is not a leader, neither is Crouch nor Wood who is obviously a legend none the less. Doogs tries but is probably too dumb and Seb also tries but comes up short. Steele in fact was more vocal onfield when Gears was still around and though l had him pegged as future Capitan even then, his introverted nature has him tied to the ground and l don't see it in him anymore. Members is great but not a shade of kent anout the bloke either.
Wilkie is clearly the best leader of men amongst an inadequate group. Probably Hayes the next. Both premiership captains as young men in the SANFL.
It's a sad state of affairs but it's what ypu get from drafting a generation of introverts. Not one in house developed leader.
Windhager is the next great hope by a country mile, or potentially even the Pou. It makes sense to keep Steele and Wilkie at the top of the tree till one of these boys hits the age in a few years, but there's SFA on the shelf otherwise.
 
That doesn't make much sense. I think both will be back to their best but we ned to have some ready to go depth if we are planning on paying finals next year. Otherwise we are vulnerable to injury to the midfield.
Their best now won't be their best of a few years back
 
You're deluding yourself about this. Sinclair is not a leader, neither is Crouch nor Wood who is obviously a legend none the less. Doogs tries but is probably too dumb and Seb also tries but comes up short. Steele in fact was more vocal onfield when Gears was still around and though l had him pegged as future Capitan even then, his introverted nature has him tied to the ground and l don't see it in him anymore. Members is great but not a shade of kent anout the bloke either.
Wilkie is clearly the best leader of men amongst an inadequate group. Probably Hayes the next. Both premiership captains as young men in the SANFL.
It's a sad state of affairs but it's what ypu get from drafting a generation of introverts. Not one in house developed leader.
Windhager is the next great hope by a country mile, or potentially even the Pou. It makes sense to keep Steele and Wilkie at the top of the tree till one of these boys hits the age in a few years, but there's SFA on the shelf otherwise.
My thoughts on Wood is that the young blokes seem to love him, and he seems great at including them and imparting standards and professionalism. They're at least leadership traits...and Jesus, we need to protect the kids from a leadership mired in mediocrity. It's a way of trying to stop the rot. It's not to have him as captain as such, more to have him in the group as a buffer from the blokes that think it's all right to coast through their career without giving a s**t.
Sinc's I had in there, just because he came from the rookie list and had spent a lot of time on the fringes before turning into a AA gun. He's the "inspirational story" among them. Hayes I hadn't thought of, poor bastard hasn't been able to take a trick since his initial injury. He has a bit of bastard in him too, so if he can get it together and string some games like his first one, I'd be open to having an enforcer among the blokes mentioned.
Agree Doogs, despite the gesticulating skills, is probably a can short of a six pack.
Crouch, I can see your point. I just like the way he cracks in.
Wilkie, well that just speaks for itself. He has leadership DNA and will probably usurp Steele at some stage.
I'd like to see some alternatives to what we've got.
Interesting though what you say about Steele being more vocal than Gears. I wouldn't have known...it just kind of hammers the point though, that he is not best suited to the role as captain. If he can be vocal and more direct when he's not having to be the main dude, then he should give the responsibility to Wilks, and go into the support cast.
 
Sneak into the finals?

They are 4 games outside the 8 😂

Yes, I might revise that comment after the week Hawthorn have had and the crap that they are dishing up today. Lets hope the 200 point barrier is beaten today. Bottom 4 for the next 4 years I reckon.

Goes to show having Finnis at the helm for so many years meant the scandals were few and far between. Lets hope it continues that way.
 
The idea that we only have Plan A is interesting. I’m glad they got Plan A because none was evident last year. To go to Plan B or even C would have to be a work in progress. Or maybe didn’t even start as they tried to embed a basic system.

The coaching fraternity talk about developing layers and that has to take time. I am only surmising this but I think we have come a fair way. And Ross seems to be complaining lately that he doesn’t have the team for the hours he needs.

I went into the year hoping for signs of improvement with system and individuals. I have seen that. The last month has been disappointing but maybe not unexpected.

More improvements in the second half of the year is what I hope for. And a bit of flexibility to adjust within a game. Going to be good at times with some dips in performance. We are ahead of where I thought we’d be to be honest.
 
This is why i take the piss with gifs and let others do all the sense talk
Its been a long long road and ive seen it all before and ive lost count how many times that is.

Mids has always been the prob
Look at the fwds we have had over thirty years
Only twice did we have a half decent mid brigade delivering to them........and we still lost the last dance

100% we have steadfastly refused to build a strong midfield for as long as I can remember. It's just not something we do and it's quite baffling.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

The idea that we only have Plan A is interesting. I’m glad they got Plan A because none was evident last year. To go to Plan B or even C would have to be a work in progress. Or maybe didn’t even start as they tried to embed a basic system.

The coaching fraternity talk about developing layers and that has to take time. I am only surmising this but I think we have come a fair way. And Ross seems to be complaining lately that he doesn’t have the team for the hours he needs.

I went into the year hoping for signs of improvement with system and individuals. I have seen that. The last month has been disappointing but maybe not unexpected.

More improvements in the second half of the year is what I hope for. And a bit of flexibility to adjust within a game. Going to be good at times with some dips in performance. We are ahead of where I thought we’d be to be honest.

The comment about only having them for 15 hours each week between games (including weights and massages) was quite pointed. I also think that's a sham. 15 hours a week outside of game day? GAGF honestly, we all spend more than 15 hours a week just on here venting! How much are these guys getting paid?!
 
Still think we're going OK though. Need to see more flexibility from the coaching dept especially in selection, can't stand seeing the same players inked into that midfield every week. Also teams have been getting up for us, planning for us after the strong start. How we respond after the bye is going to be massive.
 
The comment about only having them for 15 hours each week between games (including weights and massages) was quite pointed. I also think that's a sham. 15 hours a week outside of game day? GAGF honestly, we all spend more than 15 hours a week just on here venting! How much are these guys getting paid?!
He drops these little things into his interviews doesn’t he? Never dull. But he’s making a point to someone.
 
It's never dull and he's clearly intelligent. I just hope he's not too stubborn, but I have faith and think he's out best bet for sure.

I think it was only the week after the fitness guy got sacked that Ross openly canned the rehab process in terms of a specific player lol, so yeah, he does say things for people to hear!
 
The comment about only having them for 15 hours each week between games (including weights and massages) was quite pointed. I also think that's a sham. 15 hours a week outside of game day? GAGF honestly, we all spend more than 15 hours a week just on here venting! How much are these guys getting paid?!
surely that must be pretty standard across all clubs though?
I find it hard to believe we would be an outlier.

But yes, I was quite shocked to hear it was only 15 hours.
 
Still think we're going OK though. Need to see more flexibility from the coaching dept especially in selection, can't stand seeing the same players inked into that midfield every week. Also teams have been getting up for us, planning for us after the strong start. How we respond after the bye is going to be massive.


We really only have 2 mids in reserve and one has 2 games and one played 24. Jones is reserve too but looks cooked. We are also hoping our 17 game veteran can take one of this spots with no drop off.

You can't play what you don't draft. There has been a list management failure over a long period that leaves us vulnerable to injury to a couple of players which inevitably happens every year.
 
surely that must be pretty standard across all clubs though?
I find it hard to believe we would be an outlier.

But yes, I was quite shocked to hear it was only 15 hours.
If it’s standard then why can other clubs do more with the same? This is the key question that always holds us back.
 
If it’s standard then why can other clubs do more with the same? This is the key question that always holds us back.
Because they have more talent?
And others do worse with the same.
All I’m saying is that’s it’s probably very similar at each club. As Ross says - all the high performance stuff- ruling the roost.
How many hours, how much kicking practice etc etc
 
Because they have more talent?
And others do worse with the same.
All I’m saying is that’s it’s probably very similar at each club. As Ross says - all the high performance stuff- ruling the roost.
How many hours, how much kicking practice etc etc
I just mean why don't we get more talented people who can do more with the same amount? They're not using the time effectively
 
Now that is going to be a crap post because I can't remember where I heard it from one of our players and give it's Saturday night and I'm watching a good game of footy I can't be arsed looking it up.
The player who may or not have been in first few years (see above) said that he has been able to switch off better because he was doing a day a week at a trade. Said he thought it was helping him play better. My vague memory is that I thought he had been. Sat night though so 🤷‍♂️
 
We really only have 2 mids in reserve and one has 2 games and one played 24. Jones is reserve too but looks cooked. We are also hoping our 17 game veteran can take one of this spots with no drop off.

You can't play what you don't draft. There has been a list management failure over a long period that leaves us vulnerable to injury to a couple of players which inevitably happens every year.

Yeah that's fair. We've been allergic to developing a midfield unit since the Ball Hayes Dal days.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top