Tippett's Gone - READ RULES BEFORE POSTING

[knobby]

No you didn't read my post did you

Veterans are included in team list of 40 and we get a compo pick for Knights

That makes 1 draft pick ......hope someone can show me the errors of my ways

Did you do the math ?? Currently we have 34 main list (incluing Crouch) + 2 vets = 4 picks

Not sure if we have to use the Knights compo pick ?

ps - The list of 42 on the AFC website includes Crouch as well, so you have double counted, that might e the answer to your problem.

 

[King Elvis]

Agreed, didn't want.

You guys head Nobes on 5AA??

Sounded very pissed off, and very resolute.

 

[CroCop]

Here is Tom Mitchell , refer link above
Kieren Jack, Dan Hannebery & Luke Parker are all so alike and this Mitchell is a clone of the three as well . Wouldnt think they needall of them and would be nice if they gave Mitchell to adelaide. We could do with a lefty . Would still rather prefer Rohan as Crouch will play the role Mitchell can play

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Did you do the math ?? Currently we have 34 main list + 2 vets = 4 picks (one of which will be Crouch)

Not sure if we have to use the Knights compo pick ?

ps - The list of 42 on the AFC website includes Crouch as well, so you have double counted, that might e the answer to your problem.

Yes thanks for that

BUT yes we have to use the Knights pick this year .......so that still makes only 2 selections in this ND when we're required to make 3 ...and that's without any extra picks gained from the Tippett Deal

 

[Elder van Berlo]

No you didn't read my post did you

Veterans are included in team list of 40 and we get a compo pick for Knights

That makes 1 draft pick ......hope someone can show me the errors of my ways

The problem is that you have mashed rookies (Callinan and McIntyre) in with the others. Callinan and McIntyre were not on our primary list this year. They were rookies who were upgraded mid-year - they automatically go back onto the rookie list and need to be either upgraded, retained as rookies or delisted altogether like every other rookie on the list.

Primary list can have 38 players. Additionally, you can have up to 2 veterans outside that list. This year, we only had 1 veteran (Doughty), so our primary list was effectively 39. Next year, we will have 2 veterans (any 2 of Rutten, REilly and Johncock) so we can have a list of 40.

Gone from this year's primary list are: Doughty, Symes and Knights. Upgraded to next year's list is Crouch.

So we can have 1 extra player next year, we've lost 3 and gained 1, so right now we need 3 more players on the senior list. Obviously, this will change depending on deals in the next couple of weeks. We know we will lose at least Tippett.

But if the draft was tomorrow, we would have 3 picks to use. At this stage, we have 19, 40 and 59, so we would use those. Say we got an end of 2nd round draft pick for Knights, we would have (ignoring other FA compo picks) 19, 40, 43 and 60. But we would only have the space on our list to be able to use 3 picks, so 60 drops off the end and we would have 19, 40 and 43. So the Knights compo pick doesn't take up a spot on the list per se - rather it just means we get in and out of the draft quicker.

Clear as mud?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Here is Tom Mitchell , refer link above
Kieren Jack, Dan Hannebery & Luke Parker are all so alike and this Mitchell is a clone of the three as well . Wouldnt think they needall of them and would be nice if they gave Mitchell to adelaide. We could do with a lefty . Would still rather prefer Rohan as Crouch will play the role Mitchell can play

That's what i have been saying

 

[JP Sauce]

Surely you don't have to use free agency compo picks if you don't want to? What if you've already got 3 or 4 picks better than the compo one?

 

[macca23]

Surely you don't have to use free agency compo picks if you don't want to? What if you've already got 3 or 4 picks better than the compo one?

Interesting question.

The rules state that they cannot be banked for future years, and must be used in the year that they are given.

Whether there is an unsaid "If they are to be used at all" aspect to them or whether its manadatory to use them - no idea!!

 

[WaynesWorld19]

The problem is that you have mashed rookies (Callinan and McIntyre) in with the others. Callinan and McIntyre were not on our primary list this year

They were rookies who were upgraded mid-year - they automatically go back onto the rookie list and need to be either upgraded, retained as rookies or delisted as rookies like every other rookie on the list..

No took that into account - 42 listed on website minus rookie upgrades = 40

Primary list can have 38 players. Additionally, you can have up to 2 veterans outside that list.

2013 I am informed is list of 40 INCLUDING up to 4 veterans

This year, we only had 1 veteran (Doughty), so our primary list was effectively 39. Next year, we will have 2 veterans (any 2 of Rutten, REilly and Johncock) so we can have a list of 40.

Gone from this year's primary list are: Doughty, Symes and Knights. Upgraded to next year's list is Crouch.

Correct PLUS add an extra compo pick for Knights

So we can have 1 extra player next year, we've lost 3 and gained 1, so right now we need 3 more players on the senior list. Obviously, this will change depending on deals in the next couple of weeks. We know we will lose at least Tippett.

No we had 40 this year (inc veterans) + 2 upgraded Rookies
Lose 3 - Doughty, Symes and Knights PLUS add Crouch + Compo Knights Pick = ?

But if the draft was tomorrow, we would have 3 picks to use. At this stage, we have 19, 40 and 59, so we would use those. Say we got an end of 2nd round draft pick for Knights, we would have (ignoring other FA compo picks) 19, 40, 43 and 60. But we would only have the space on our list to be able to use 3 picks, so 60 drops off the end and we would have 19, 40 and 43. So the Knights compo pick doesn't take up a spot on the list per se - rather it just means we get in and out of the draft quicker.

That makes sense IF we have 3 ND picks .....but forgetting the Knights compo pick we still only have 2 picks

I must seriously be missing something?

 

[BrissyCrow]

Fine i'll explain it,

Jetta is more important to our gameplan than Tippett,
Our list has just shown, literally less than 2 weeks ago that it can win a GF.
If we had lost then some of your trades may be better received (as far as Parker or Grundy goes).

Tippett is uncontracted, and wants to come to us, what his value is, is irrelevent, the majority of Swans supporters would prefer we dont get him if it involves trading away too much quality. Swans recruitment staff are fairly confident they wont need to get rid of any premiership players.

If we can get him cheap then great, welcome addition, should improve our forward line, if not then also great, we look forwards to the improvement of Sam Reid and Tommy Walsh to improve our forward line.

In addition to the recent premiership you have problems based on the fact that, of the 22 that played 7 are 29 or older, which gives them limited trade value, but also increases the value of our fringe players (at least the first 7) TO US as they will be needed to fill these positions in the immediate future.

Tippett is no doubt being chased, but the harm of breaking up a premiership team, especially if noone wants to go, may be a price too high in most Swans supporters eyes.

Whatever our recruitment personnel do, Im sure they will try their best to accommodate a deal without paying overs.

Whilst your explanation is appreciated and may male some sense there is one flaw. Sydney wanted Tippett so much that they offered him $1m. They knew they would have to offer up something of value to the Crows and if they didnt know that then they never planned it well. If it werent for your $1m deal then Tippett would be going to either Brisbane or the GC.

So the Swans own actions dictate that the Crows need to be comphensated.

 

[Elder van Berlo]

2013 I am informed is list of 40 INCLUDING up to 4 veterans

Ok then, next year is 40. We had 39 this year. Same result as what I said above. We need 1 more on our senior list next year than we had this year.

Correct PLUS add an extra compo pick for Knights

The compo pick is not a person. It is not on our list. Draft picks only take up a spot on the list when they are used to select players in the draft.

No we had 40 this year (inc veterans)

No we didn't. We had 39 including one veteran.

+ 2 upgraded Rookies

You need to forget about rookies. The upgraded rookies are now back on the rookie list. They have no effect on how many picks we have in the national draft.

Lose 3 - Doughty, Symes and Knights

Well done

PLUS add Crouch + Compo Knights Pick = ?

Again, the compo pick is just a draft pick. It doesn't affect how many positions on the list we need to fill in the draft. It just affects the order in which we make our picks.

So overall - we started with 39. Lost 3 = 36. Gained 1 = 37. We need to get to 40 - so as it stands we need 3 more.

That makes sense IF we have 3 ND picks .....but forgetting the Knights compo pick we still only have 2 picks

The concept is the same regardless of how many picks we have. Theoretically, we can have 20 picks and go all the way to pick 300. We have x number of picks. We keep picking in the order set down - whatever that ends up being - until we have had our x picks. Once they are done, we are out of the draft. We may well not even end up using the Knights compo pick.

 

[feenix67]

According to team list on website ....we have 42 players inc Callinan & Mcintyre

Take them off and it's 40

Out: Doughty, Symes, Knights, Tippett
In: Crouch, compo pick Knights, player & pick Tippett (or 2 picks?)

My Reckoning 1 free draft pick for national draft

Using your example of ins (and remembering you double counted Crouch):

39 - 4 players = 35
add Crouch and "Player" = 37
add Knights pick plus Tippett pick = 39

so we will have Knights pick, Tippett pick, plus one other = 3 picks

 

[ftmch]

Frankly, all this stuff about the "Bloods Culture" seems a mile overstated to me. I don't really think there is any such thing as the "Bloods Culture" - or if there is, it's a name for something pretty much every club in the league already has.

Sydney have not been as successful as they are because of some kind of mystical culture. They've been as successful as they are because they've been well managed, well coached, and their players have gotten the most out of themselves.

Couldn't agree more Stabby. Much respect for Sydney for how they go about it and what they achieve, but the intonation that they possess some form of cultural superiority is just bollocks.

I'm a firm believer that they benefit massively in luring and retaining players by being able to offer a utopian blend of big city lifestyle, while maintaining relative anonymity.

And to top it off, the AFL give them an extra 10% on their salary cap to do it.

 

[NTRabbit]

The concept is the same regardless of how many picks we have. Theoretically, we can have 20 picks and go all the way to pick 300. We have x number of picks. We keep picking in the order set down - whatever that ends up being - until we have had our x picks. Once they are done, we are out of the draft. We may well not even end up using the Knights compo pick.

Knights compo pick will either be 41 (band 3) or 43 (band 4), which in either case would be our third selection, pushing our pick 59 out to an unlikely fourth selection. Possible the compensation pick will be 62 (band 5), but very unlikely. All based on current order, which will clearly inflate once the other Free Agency picks are inserted, and if we get earlier picks in trades.

 

[feenix67]

3 picks will be fine if they're all in the first round

 

[Tippett2Goal]

Whilst your explanation is appreciated and may male some sense there is one flaw. Sydney wanted Tippett so much that they offered him $1m. They knew they would have to offer up something of value to the Crows and if they didnt know that then they never planned it well. If it werent for your $1m deal then Tippett would be going to either Brisbane or the GC.

So the Swans own actions dictate that the Crows need to be comphensated.

Lets not get into this, but Tippett is not on $1million a year, and repeating this misinformation hurts reasonable discussion more than it helps due to the emotiveness of the number.

No doubt Sydney knew they would have to compensate Crows, however they would also know he is uncontracted and can specify where he wants to go, meaning there is a good chance he can be picked up for below market value. (no I'm not suggesting White and 22, but equally you shouldn't be expecting pick 4 and 22)

Your club has committed to dealing with the Swans and have 0 intention of letting him go to PSD, equally the Swans want him and wouldn't like to be relying on PSD. So it can be reasonably expected that some form of deal will be done which will result in Tippett at Sydney.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Ok then, next year is 40. We had 39 this year. Same result as what I said above. We need 1 more on our senior list next year than we had this year.

The compo pick is not a person. It is not on our list. Draft picks only take up a spot on the list when they are used to select players in the draft.

No we didn't. We had 39 including one veteran.

You need to forget about rookies. The upgraded rookies are now back on the rookie list. They have no effect on how many picks we have in the national draft.

Well done

Again, the compo pick is just a draft pick. It doesn't affect how many positions on the list we need to fill in the draft. It just affects the order in which we make our picks.

So overall - we started with 39. Lost 3 = 36. Gained 1 = 37. We need to get to 40 - so as it stands we need 3 more.

The concept is the same regardless of how many picks we have. Theoretically, we can have 20 picks and go all the way to pick 300. We have x number of picks. We keep picking in the order set down - whatever that ends up being - until we have had our x picks. Once they are done, we are out of the draft. We may well not even end up using the Knights compo pick.

Yep you're spot on .....Crouch being on the list currently and Knights compo pick confused me

If our current picks are at this stage, 19, 40 and 59 ....we assume any extra Tippett pick will make 59 and Knights compo pick redundant
Getting draft picks a waste if we're not going to use them?

 

[Elder van Berlo]

3 picks will be fine if they're all in the first round

Exactly. If we get 2 picks in the first round for Tippett, it's highly likely Hamish Ogilvie will be enjoying a pina colada by the pool by the time the Knights compo pick comes around.

 

[BrissyCrow]

I'm struggling to think of many from Adelaide supporters (other than FAITH) that have either. Maybe we should ban everyone except FAITH from posting in this thread?

I'd like to think that I havent posted crap.

 

[Elder van Berlo]

Yep you're spot on .....Crouch being on the list currently and Knights compo pick confused me

If our current picks are at this stage, 19, 40 and 59 ....we assume any extra Tippett pick will make 59 and Knights compo pick redundant
Getting draft picks a waste if we're not going to use them?

Glad we got there in the end

And you're right about redundant draft picks. I suppose they can then be on-traded to clubs for which they wouldn't be redundant.

 

[BrissyCrow]

(no I'm not suggesting White and 22) Agree
(but equally you shouldn't be expecting pick 4 and 22) Disagree

Your club has committed to dealing with the Swans and have 0 intention of letting him go to PSD, equally the Swans want him and wouldn't like to be relying on PSD. So it can be reasonably expected that some form of deal will be done which will result in Tippett at Sydney.[/quote]

If a player like Wellingham can go for pick 17 and that deal was done quickly, then I would say that Tippett would go for 4 plus 22.

 

[King Elvis]

This one?
Hows this then. Sydney - Tippett GWS - Mitchell 19, 22 Adelaide - 2, Giles Then we go bang and grab Toumpas and we've got our quality.

Have to say that is the best one iv'e seen to date, everyones a winner.
Would Mitchell want to go to GWS?

That's pretty damned good, Mitchell was F/S right? Would've gone first round if not?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Glad we got there in the end

And you're right about redundant draft picks. I suppose they can then be on-traded to clubs for which they wouldn't be redundant.

In reality then Tippett picks for example are simply upgrading existing picks ...if we're not going to use all?
Where does that leave callinan?

 

[macca23]

That's pretty damned good, Mitchell was F/S right? Would've gone first round if not?

Quigley's mock draft rated him at #10.

Definitely would have been a first rounder.

 

[The Big Sauce]

As it stands now we are looking like being bent over.

Guys who have been worth more this week.

Tom Lee + some bum change = Pick 13
Wellingham = Pick 17
Caddy = First round compo pick + shuffling of latter picks.

Of those only one should be around the ball park for Kurt & that's Caddy (only due to draft position, not necessaroly results).

Wellingham & Caddy had left their clubs. Wellingham named a club.

Hell at this point it looks like Collingwood will get more for a contracted Dawes at this point, which just shouldn't be the case.

How do we fix this? How do we get the best deal for Adelaide?

Sydney's reputation as fair traders is being shot to absolute shit as this goes on an BigFooty have banned the word that most aptly describes what they are trying to do to us.