Analysis What's Actually wrong?

[blue shark]

Sydney Swans are the the best example of where we need to head, coming from a similar gameplan, to Longmuir
adapting to rule changes, making a better mousetrap after getting destroyed by hawks in a GF.
They dont have the best ruckmen in the league, only one superstar Tall forward, it is their toughness inside/outside
skilled mid/flankers, and teamwork that makes so formidable.
Funny how the Swans let Jetta go, and now hawks are the same with Hill, coincidence?
Whats wrong with Freo, one word Soft.

 

[PapaJ]

Im amazed we can't develop a play from a kick in. Its just kick sideways or play on and kick to about 65m out.

That's just the fall back when all else isn't working. All else isn't working, so we see it a lot. The times this year we've played with some confidence, even in the losses, we see a bit more dynamism from deep in the back half.

It's all a bit of snowball effect.
- A complete break-down in stoppage play (and by that I don't just mean winning the initial ball, but getting something resembling purposeful clearance)
- leads to loss of ball control at breakdowns
- shows up a TERRIBLE ability to cover the spread when we fail to control the ball
- puts pressure on the defenders which means they become less trusting of the 'system'
- which means they become a bit myopic in their focus (e.g. just worrying about 'their man') instead of working as an integrated unit
- which means they're not in good position when/if we get the ball back
and so on.

Here's another:
- Not hitting a target on a turnover in defensive 50
- encourages players to suck deeper into contested play in the defensive 50 to 'save goals'
- then don't/can't work hard enough when we get possession
- makes hitting targets out of 50 harder
- causes turnovers
- draws players further into defensive 50 as a reactive action
- and so on.

That's the sort of thing I see teams out of form doing and we do it a lot.

tl;dr:
We lack confidence, we play shit, that causes confidence to drop, which means we play even worse.

The only way to fix this is a massive amount of work in the off-season (from coaches and players) to reset things including team confidence.

 

[Ragtooth]

tl;dr thread but IMO it’s coaching. The major shakeup of our 2015 coaches have FAILED. Of the players that were out there 16 of the 22 players are good enough to play finals/grand finals. And of the 6 other players who haven’t had finals experience I rate quite highly (Yarran, Weller, Langdon, Collins etc..). When coached well, our group of players have shown they are good enough.

Midfield Coaches HAVE DRASTICALLY FAILED. Webb and Eastaugh can move on. We miss Kirk badly! Even when we had Fyfe, Sandi, Mundy, Barlow at the start of the season, the Bulldogs, Gold Coast and West Coast just ‘walked’ it out of the centre and got smashed in the midfield all over, it used to be our strongest asset. Now, it’s pathetic. Our stoppages are ok but the opposition get it out of the centre way too easily. On the weekend against the Swans, there were several times that we didn’t even have enough players in the centre square just before the bounce, with Mundy and Clarke screaming to De Boer or D Pearce to run in! How can we have a professional centre set up if there aren’t even enough players! That’s Under 12s Footy. Obviously something isn’t sinking into the players tiny little skulls and it boils down to POOR COACHING. How many times this year has our defence tried to clear the ball from our D50 only to kick it to a bunch of walking mids with their hands in the air. WTF! Very little run from any midfielder.

It really looks like the players are not confident at the role their playing. We look slow because we don’t know whether to go backwards or up the line. There is no instinct because the players don’t know where we will be. Last year we seemed to ‘know’ that there will be a player running past or up the line and could deliver the ball even if we didn’t look. That is what the best teams do. That is what we used to do! This year we are going “Do I go here, no, wait, what was it again, go backwards, no, oh dawson is free, err no. Um ok I’ll kick it blindly then.”

Our coaching changes from 2015 to 2016

Coaching team: 2015 - 2016
Senior coach: Ross Lyon - Ross Lyon
Midfield coach: Brett Kirk - Simon Eastaughand Marc Webb
Defensive coach: Michael Prior - Michael Prior and Brent Guerra
Forwards coach: Peter Sumich - Mark Stone
Senior development coach/assistant coach: Simon Lloyd - Peter Sumich
Development/specialist coach: Simon Eastaugh - David Hale
Development coach: Roger Hayden - Roger Hayden,
Development coach: Webb - Anthony Rock

 

[electricfeel]

I noticed that as well with the centre square yesterday. There weren't enough players and Dan Hannebery was left unmanned and consistently waltzed out of the centre square.

 

[Freo Dr]

was thinking this today at the game, how it was good to see Yarran because he just looks like a footballer, the way he took a good strong contested mark and then just eased it through from 45m out. And I laughed because I realised I'm used to the likes of Mayne or Taberner who either can't take a contested mark or make the distance from 45m. Supposedly professional footballers who aren't really footballers.

Even his mark on the northern wing and when all other players were just kicking it long down the line he weighted it perfectly to drop into a hole for Mayne to mark on his chest. He would get out on leads and we would kick it to his opponent. Yarran would fit perfectly into a Hawthorn game plan but we have only a few with skills and decision making like his. Pity he is 27 not 22.

 

[malpaso]

We knew for years Pav, Mcpharlin would be retiring and did nothing about it. Should have picked up at least one KPP per year to see which one would come on but expected to just buy a ready made one.

Now Sandilands will retire next year and Clarke never worked out

I'm probably alone in this but I think Clarke lone rucking is much better than Griffin. The problem is that we have expected him to have a presence up forward as well.

 

[malpaso]

tl;dr thread but IMO it’s coaching. The major shakeup of our 2015 coaches have FAILED. Of the players that were out there 16 of the 22 players are good enough to play finals/grand finals. And of the 6 other players who haven’t had finals experience I rate quite highly (Yarran, Weller, Langdon, Collins etc..). When coached well, our group of players have shown they are good enough.

Midfield Coaches HAVE DRASTICALLY FAILED. Webb and Eastaugh can move on. We miss Kirk badly! Even when we had Fyfe, Sandi, Mundy, Barlow at the start of the season, the Bulldogs, Gold Coast and West Coast just ‘walked’ it out of the centre and got smashed in the midfield all over, it used to be our strongest asset. Now, it’s pathetic. Our stoppages are ok but the opposition get it out of the centre way too easily. On the weekend against the Swans, there were several times that we didn’t even have enough players in the centre square just before the bounce, with Mundy and Clarke screaming to De Boer or D Pearce to run in! How can we have a professional centre set up if there aren’t even enough players! That’s Under 12s Footy. Obviously something isn’t sinking into the players tiny little skulls and it boils down to POOR COACHING. How many times this year has our defence tried to clear the ball from our D50 only to kick it to a bunch of walking mids with their hands in the air. WTF! Very little run from any midfielder.

It really looks like the players are not confident at the role their playing. We look slow because we don’t know whether to go backwards or up the line. There is no instinct because the players don’t know where we will be. Last year we seemed to ‘know’ that there will be a player running past or up the line and could deliver the ball even if we didn’t look. That is what the best teams do. That is what we used to do! This year we are going “Do I go here, no, wait, what was it again, go backwards, no, oh dawson is free, err no. Um ok I’ll kick it blindly then.”

Our coaching changes from 2015 to 2016

Coaching team: 2015 - 2016
Senior coach: Ross Lyon - Ross Lyon
Midfield coach: Brett Kirk - Simon Eastaughand Marc Webb
Defensive coach: Michael Prior - Michael Prior and Brent Guerra
Forwards coach: Peter Sumich - Mark Stone
Senior development coach/assistant coach: Simon Lloyd - Peter Sumich
Development/specialist coach: Simon Eastaugh - David Hale
Development coach: Roger Hayden - Roger Hayden,
Development coach: Webb - Anthony Rock

Valid points but I believe the fall is due to the skill requirement brought in by the changing coaching roles. Take Kirk for instance, he suited the pressure type of midfield which we played at the time however we don't want that anymore.
The coaching staff is asking our players to play more 'footy' and a lot of them are found lacking.
Our defensive position players are the biggest weakness in the team, they are a) Not good at stopping anyone and b) they have no skill in directing the ball into the forward half of the field. I would expect a major overhaul in this area in the off-season. Spurr is a shank kick, Sutcliffe should be on a wing, Sheridan is pea-heart, Collins first year player, Dawson is Dawson, Ibbo is waiting for a pizza delivery. The 2 players I rate are not on the park (Johnson and A.Pearce)

 

[salim malik]

Most on here I would guess have never pulled on a pair of footy boots and experienced the physical and mental pressure applied in the major leagues AFL,WAFL etc. so the term pea heart used by some is a tiny bit disingenuous. All the boys who play have courage some just have more ability.

 

[Belnakor]

I'm probably alone in this but I think Clarke lone rucking is much better than Griffin. The problem is that we have expected him to have a presence up forward as well.

we were competitive in the ruck with Clarke. Griffin is a liability.

 

[Belnakor]

Our defensive position players are the biggest weakness in the team, they are a) Not good at stopping anyone and b) they have no skill in directing the ball into the forward half of the field. I would expect a major overhaul in this area in the off-season. Spurr is a shank kick, Sutcliffe should be on a wing, Sheridan is pea-heart, Collins first year player, Dawson is Dawson, Ibbo is waiting for a pizza delivery. The 2 players I rate are not on the park (Johnson and A.Pearce)

the way the ball has been coming into the forward line any defense would have issues. Our defense has been servicable. our defensive mids are the ones who have really dropped off.

 

[E Shed]

Even his mark on the northern wing and when all other players were just kicking it long down the line he weighted it perfectly to drop into a hole for Mayne to mark on his chest. He would get out on leads and we would kick it to his opponent. Yarran would fit perfectly into a Hawthorn game plan but we have only a few with skills and decision making like his. Pity he is 27 not 22.

That was a beautiful kick. Everything that is wrong with our side summed up right here; Yarran at 27 in his 2nd AFL game makes most of our players look unimaginative and unskilled. No wonder half our team is exhausted the amount of energy it must have taken to get to a grand final playing brute force weight of numbers football.

 

[malpaso]

the way the ball has been coming into the forward line any defense would have issues. Our defense has been servicable. our defensive mids are the ones who have really dropped off.

Yes no doubt however our defense does themselves no favours in their ability to move it out of the back line.

 

[Sweetback]

From Ross's presser it sounds like the end of the year can't come quickly enough, which must be conflicting for much of the list because it will mean the end of their careers, or for a small handful, they will move on to other clubs. I can't imagine that would be an inspiring environment to work in.

 

[freo1997]

Even his mark on the northern wing and when all other players were just kicking it long down the line he weighted it perfectly to drop into a hole for Mayne to mark on his chest. He would get out on leads and we would kick it to his opponent. Yarran would fit perfectly into a Hawthorn game plan but we have only a few with skills and decision making like his. Pity he is 27 not 22.

Yarran to me would of been one of those kids who would of used the edge of the fence and the lightpost as his goals and drill them from anywhere in the street!!

Its second nature for players like yarran, pav or a walters. We just dont have enough players with that football instinct. Im glad we got yarran and he looks confident out there which is fantastic.

 

[rodney hoo]

I'm probably alone in this but I think Clarke lone rucking is much better than Griffin. The problem is that we have expected him to have a presence up forward as well.

I'm with you and when you are one of the few going from afl to wafl and back, confidence gets eroded. I beleive the coaching staff ?? Ruck coach has tried to change him from a leaping type ruck to the stay on the ground smash your way through ruck which has not worked. I wouldn't rate Hawks Cegular the most athletic ruck but they get full value out of him and IMO he'd be 95kg wringing wet. Hickey st kilda, Stanley cat, Lobb giants all similar type players.
Clubs don't always get an aron Sandilands, coaches got make most of the talent the player has got.

 

[youmewe]

we were competitive in the ruck with Clarke. Griffin is a liability.

Great to see Moller is putting his three years at Freo to good use.

Having a so-so season with the Ballarat Miners in the SEABL (that's the South East Australian Basketball League).
http://www.sportingpulse.com/team_info.cgi?pID=201777496

 

[kingswood71]

Bascially, as I see it, we have a lot of players who are very good at defensive football. We have proven this over the last few years. Now when asked to be more attacking, we dont have the necessary skilled players to do it.
You watch teams like the Bulldogs, Adelaide, WC and even Port, and there seems to be a wave of players running forward when they have the ball....we dont even seem to have a ripple It all looks very stagnant.

 

[Lach72]

Bascially, as I see it, we have a lot of players who are very good at defensive football. We have proven this over the last few years. Now when asked to be more attacking, we dont have the necessary skilled players to do it.
You watch teams like the Bulldogs, Adelaide, WC and even Port, and there seems to be a wave of players running forward when they have the ball....we dont even seem to have a ripple It all looks very stagnant.

When you start so deep, what happens when the players start moving forward? They cross over the defensive lines of the opposing team that are already set up. The way we play depends on winning 50% + of center clearances, hitting the odd target, forward defensive pressure to hold the ball in, and a strong marking target (Sandi/Fyfe) coming out of defence.

What we need to accept that the doesn't work anymore, and the players we draft/trade for need to reflect that and the game plan adjusted.

 

[malpaso]

From Ross's presser it sounds like the end of the year can't come quickly enough, which must be conflicting for much of the list because it will mean the end of their careers, or for a small handful, they will move on to other clubs. I can't imagine that would be an inspiring environment to work in.

Yeah that's a good point, there's plenty of players who know their time is up.

 

[malpaso]

I'm with you and when you are one of the few going from afl to wafl and back, confidence gets eroded. I beleive the coaching staff ?? Ruck coach has tried to change him from a leaping type ruck to the stay on the ground smash your way through ruck which has not worked. I wouldn't rate Hawks Cegular the most athletic ruck but they get full value out of him and IMO he'd be 95kg wringing wet. Hickey st kilda, Stanley cat, Lobb giants all similar type players.
Clubs don't always get an aron Sandilands, coaches got make most of the talent the player has got.

Yep, Clarke has always had his best games when he's allowed to 'roam' the paddock on top of having the #1 ruck role. I hope Lyon plays Clarke the last 4 games as the lone ruck and it goes a long way to upping his value.

 

[malpaso]

Yarran to me would of been one of those kids who would of used the edge of the fence and the lightpost as his goals and drill them from anywhere in the street!!

Its second nature for players like yarran, pav or a walters. We just dont have enough players with that football instinct. Im glad we got yarran and he looks confident out there which is fantastic.

Which is why B.Hill would be valuable to us and better than more than a few in our 22.

 

[BStaff17]

First post so i am entering the lions den so to speak.

But having watched their fall from grace over the past 12 months is quite extraordinary. I must admit like a lot of other freo supporters i didnt see it coming. Especially a ross lyon coached side. Who thought his defensive structures would keep us competitive at least.

The confidence of the 2nd tier players in the side the likes of sutcliffe, sheridan, Ibbotson and mayne has just been eroded. They are solid afl players but it has been frustrating seeing them just make basic errors.

One thing i notice with Zac Clarke at the centre bounces is as they are about to collide instead of watching the ball his eyes turn to his opponent instead of tapping the ball. Giving the opponent the hit out the majority of times.

Now i was never a ruckman so i dont know weather or not he is coached like that or is it just a confidence issue. Or do all ruckman do that. Just find it strange to not be looking at the ball just as its about to land.

 

[Big Animal]

Michael Apeness (Collarbone) Test
Ryan Nyhuis (Knee) 1 week
Hayden Ballantyne (Facial fracture) 2 weeks
Tanner Smith (Hamstring) 3-5 weeks
Nat Fyfe (Leg) Season
Harley Bennell (Calf) Season
Alex Pearce (Leg) Season
Brady Grey (Ankle) Season
Matthew Uebergang (Hamstring) Season
Michael Barlow (Shoulder) Season
Michael Johnson (Knee/hamstring) TBA
Aaron Sandilands (Ribs) TBA
Harley Balic (Wrist) TBA
Sean Hurley (Hip) TBA

If we are playing this badly when all of these guys (bold) are back on the park, then I will also get churlish towards the coaches. But until then, in my opinion, we are just seeing what happens when you lose your best ruck/mids combo and best KP backmen, and the holes are too big to fill, leading to the subsequent collapse of the whole pack of cards. I mean look at Geelong, they were average last year at best and on the way down. Add in one star mid, KPB, and a decent ruck and they rocket back into contention. Sandi is better than Zac Smith, Fyfe slightly better than Dangerfield (plus add in a Bennell), and Johnson + A Pearce > Henderson. Assuming these injuries don't affect future performance, watch what happens next year. Yes, present year will continue to suck and will not improve. Look at the positives, you have a free September to get out and play Pokemon Go uninterrupted. It's the first in a while and I predict won't happen again for a while again* (*assuming we don't maintain the present injury curse).

 

[Proud SJW]

First post so i am entering the lions den so to speak.

Meh, you'll get used to it. Welcome aboard!

The confidence of the 2nd tier players in the side the likes of sutcliffe, sheridan, Ibbotson and mayne has just been eroded. They are solid afl players but it has been frustrating seeing them just make basic errors.

One thing i notice with Zac Clarke at the centre bounces is as they are about to collide instead of watching the ball his eyes turn to his opponent instead of tapping the ball. Giving the opponent the hit out the majority of times

Yep, and yep.
Mayne is (apparently) attracting a lot of interest from other clubs so it's fairly obvious they don't believe he's crap. If true, of course.

 

[Ragtooth]

If we are playing this badly when all of these guys (bold) are back on the park, then I will also get churlish towards the coaches. But until then, in my opinion, we are just seeing what happens when you lose your best ruck/mids combo and best KP backmen, and the holes are too big to fill, leading to the subsequent collapse of the whole pack of cards. I mean look at Geelong, they were average last year at best and on the way down. Add in one star mid, KPB, and a decent ruck and they rocket back into contention. Sandi is better than Zac Smith, Fyfe slightly better than Dangerfield (plus add in a Bennell), and Johnson + A Pearce > Henderson. Assuming these injuries don't affect future performance, watch what happens next year. Yes, present year will continue to suck and will not improve. Look at the positives, you have a free September to get out and play Pokemon Go uninterrupted. It's the first in a while and I predict won't happen again for a while again* (*assuming we don't maintain the present injury curse).

Agree in part to what you are saying, however Geelong finished 10th, only 1 game out of the 8… They still played respectable football and won a pile of games, almost making the finals….We are so much further away from the ‘Geelong fall’. I wish that was as bad as our season got, winning 11 games. Also remember we almost had a full squad against Gold Coast, Bulldogs and Wet Taost….and got smashed to bits…