Where do we go from here?

[Art Corvelay]

I must admit, I was a little excited when we beat West Coast, Geelong etc. In fact I penciled in a lot of wins for the last few rounds. Wouldn't make the finals, but would salvage the season into something somewhat respectable, to gain momentum for next year

But oh no. God doesn't like Collingwood supporters. He teases us, dangles the carrot in front of us, but we never get close to it

Where does Collingwood go from here? We can win when we are strong, play with immense pressue. Sure we aren't that skilled, but when we knuckle down we can bring teams down to our level. But when that doesn't happen, we get flogged!

I feel it is time (like everyone else I guess) for Mick to bite the bullet. Grab the ********ing red maker, cut the ******** players and above all, acknowledge you ********ed the list and it needs to be rebuilt. Don't dance around it, you won't garner support.

If you come out and say it's a bad list, but I will try to fix it, you will keep my support. Dance around the issue, then dance to Centrelink. Get someone with some cahoons to do the necessary chop!

 

[scottydeewah]

Will you cut up your membership if he doesnt go...hey do you even have a membership?

 

[Art Corvelay]

Will you cut up your membership if he doesnt go...hey do you even have a membership?

lol good call. I support the club, I'm just a tight ass. Next year

 

[FIGJAM]

It's not possible to simply cut the guts out of your list. At the absolute maximum, we should be cutting five. Otherwise you merely replace a dud, with an unknown quantity late pick who other clubs have most certainly overlooked for a reason (ie. another dud).

If we can find a trade for those who would benefit from a change (ie. attract some interest from other clubs) then we should do it.

Serial duds have to be first to go. Williams, Lokan and King spring to mind. Walker's clearly got nothing going for him and Billy sadly seems like another write off. Move those guys on and replace them with guys who can run faster than a speeding snail, kick straight and over 20m and can find the fricken thing.

 

[sealer]

if we lose our games we get priority pick - bring on marc murphy

 

[Art Corvelay]

It's not possible to simply cut the guts out of your list. At the absolute maximum, we should be cutting five. Otherwise you merely replace a dud, with an unknown quantity late pick who other clubs have most certainly overlooked for a reason (ie. another dud).

If we can find a trade for those who would benefit from a change (ie. attract some interest from other clubs) then we should do it.

Serial duds have to be first to go. Williams, Lokan and King spring to mind. Walker's clearly got nothing going for him and Billy sadly seems like another write off. Move those guys on and replace them with guys who can run faster than a speeding snail, kick straight and over 20m and can find the fricken thing.

Understand that. But just looking at out list and you can just see the words hacks appear.

BTW, I'm not an advocate for tanking for picks, but I reckon we're ordinary enough to get them!

It's only going to get worse really. Bucks/Presti/Clement/Rocca etc are all getting on. And they are our best/most reliable players. What's coming through to make up the difference? I'd say we might be in tough spot the next few years.

 

[MarkT]

It's not possible to simply cut the guts out of your list. At the absolute maximum, we should be cutting five. Otherwise you merely replace a dud, with an unknown quantity late pick who other clubs have most certainly overlooked for a reason (ie. another dud).

History is lettered with these duds that make it. Players promoted from the rookie list, players drafted a year or more after they turn 18, Josh Mahoney’s. 5 just isn’t nearly enough. I see no point carrying a dud no matter what the alternative is. In a dud v unknown quantity choice give me the unknown for the known. As for how deep we should go, a lot depends on who we can trade. Williams, Lokan, King and B. Morrison have to be delisted ad there is no prospect of a trade. That’s 4 before you even get to player who might at least have some redeeming feature or unknown upside. Players like Davis, O’Bree, Lockyer, C. Morrison, Woewodin, Walker, Cole, J. Cloke, Hall, maybe Lonie (I’d keep him), and others have to be up for grabs. We have to consider whether we should carry injury prone on performers like Richards and Davidson.

If you take it from the reverse end, we will have 5 rounds in the draft that we should use with the 5th being around pick 69 if we win 1 more game and one early pre season pick. We may even have a PP yet which all up makes 6 or 7 even if we don’t trade into a better position. Add to that we have to promote Fanning or cut him loose. Zane has also served his 2 rookie years but I wouldn’t image he’d get a promotion.

All of that is just the starting point. It still leaves us with a slow, poorly skilled, soft list that lacks any depth or any semblance of ruck competency unless we trade to rectify these specific things.

What really hurts is that we can actually field a competitive best 22 with everyone fit and firing but as soon as a decent player gets injured the replacement options are dud or not yet ready/maybe a player if he develops in 2 years time. Given no injuries this year we would be in the 8. Buckely and Rocca alone would have changed a number of close games. The problem is we won’t have our best 22 available.

 

[sealer]

would anyone consider recrruiting a hard player not the most skilled player to put on back flank - TY ZANTUCK - for a 4th round pick - instead of picking up another kid. He can go forward as well - kicked 5 for tiges once

 

[Murray]

Clubs just don't turn over huge numbers anymore.
Carlton were an aboration.

There just aren't enough players to put onto a list if more than 8 or so are delisted.

Where do they come from?
The draft will only get you 5
Trades will only get you 1 or 2
Rookie list will get you another 1.

That's about it.
It will take 2 years to turn over all the duds
Sorry but it is a fact of life.

 

[sealer]

Why cant you delist all you want....? It would not matter if we cut 10 players. davis, woey, lonie, c morrison, b morrison, cole, walker, williams, king, j cloke should all be offered for trades/delistings - there are no reasons to keep these players....Cole is our main trade bait - we can not stuff up with trying to trade him -

Can you honestly tell me that the 10 mentioned players could all play in the one collingwood team together - what a nightmare...

We MUST keep FANNING - under no circumstances get rid of him. Davidson is another one who a hard decision must me made on.....

 

[Murray]

Why cant you delist all you want....? It would not matter if we cut 10 players. davis, woey, lonie, c morrison, b morrison, cole, walker, williams, king, j cloke should all be offered for trades/delistings - there are no reasons to keep these players....Cole is our main trade bait - we can not stuff up with trying to trade him -

Can you honestly tell me that the 10 mentioned players could all play in the one collingwood team together - what a nightmare...

Where do you get the (quality) player to fill up all the holes from those players that been delisted.

They don't grow on trees, you actually have to have someone better than those that have been delisted otherwise the exercise is useless.

E.g. We delist Walker and pick up Rowan Jones.
Nothing is gained and we have arguably lost (height) in the process.
So why do it.

The draft is only 5 rounds deep at best.

Get it now?

 

[grayza]

where do we go from here?

the pub, i reckon

 

[grayza]

im with Figjam, you dont want to change the list too much

King, Williams and Lokan are definitely gone IMO

Billy, Lonie, Cole and perhaps Jason Cloke are skating on thin ice, either via delisting, trade, or just wanting out

i wouldnt want many more changes than that

 

[bradrowe#32]

would anyone consider recrruiting a hard player not the most skilled player to put on back flank - TY ZANTUCK - for a 4th round pick - instead of picking up another kid. He can go forward as well - kicked 5 for tiges once

No freakin' way.

 

[twaters]

If we have 5 new picks (could be 4), 1 trade?, 1 PSD?, and 1 or 2 rookie promotions (Fanning and as a longshot one of the others), looks like around 8 players on the main list would need to be moved on (last year it was six senior lists and 2 rookies).

Do we have 8 likelies?
Williams, King, Hall, BMorrison, Lokan?

possible trades (not sure I want any of these to go, but someone has to make room:
Cole? (?Essendon, Richmond need a back pocket with attitude)
Lonie? (?Geelong need someone who can kick goals from 50 if allowed to play up forward consistently)
Obree? (?) and Woey (??????) - both are reportedly out of contract at end of year and are coming to their slowed up ends - we may be able to offer one of them a one year contract, but to carry both would be an injustice to our youngsters who need experience in the middle
JCloke (?? - not sure if Richmond finish in the 8 that they'll want to fuss about with their back structure beyond a small back pocket?)

Richards/Walker are probably on last dibs the year after - unless 2006 seems them fit on the park all year. As probably are Burns /Wakelin for retirements. Davidson could be anything from a 150 game player to gone next year - not sure if he's spiritually more at home down at Cat land with his football manager Dad - a Lonie and Davo combo trade for what from the Cats (Bartels? and ...?) ????

Dreaming.

With a Fanning rookie promotion and a reluctant Leonard rookie delisting after his second rookie year, we could afford two rookie picks so far. And given how good they were last year, they're not to be sneezed at. There's this tall chap Meyer and a son of Billy Picken at Willi for example that may be worth a look before venturing too far elsewhere? But no doubt this new Hines supremo has dug deeper than that with new surprises.