Local Womens International Footy

[TWLS]

Womens Footy in England and Ireland continues its growth step by step. One way to gauge that is how many Cup type comps they get involved with.
We are not sure if they have broken through into this comp previously, but they have now.
The 4th Inter-Varsity Fitzpatrick Cup for 2017 will be held on Saturday February 4th at the University College Cork in Ireland.
The Cup is named after the AFL Commission boss -Mike Fitzpatrick, who attended Oxford Uni in England in 1975/76 and played for the Oxford Uni Aussie Rules team against the Cambridge Uni Aussie Rules team in their Annual matches, which go back many decades, and were likely the only semi-regular Aussie Rules matches around over there until the 1990`s.
Currently 11 teams are confirmed for this Uni Tournament, which is good growth from recent low/nil bases, and the expansion has really flown under the radar Internationally.
There will be 3 Womens Teams from UCC, Oxford and Maynooth Universities, and 8 Mens teams.
Remember this is in the full Northern Winter, so how spoiled are we in this country for weather and playing conditions.

 

[BringBackTorps]

Thats interesting, i personally think that footy tourism is a huge untapped market both into Australia and Australians heading O/S.

10 years ago many people would have scoffed at something like this.

I think something like rugby do in Hong Kong with the 7's will be the way of the future, the new 7 a side game or 10 a side ( whatever format the AFL decide to go with)

I personally don't really think 18 a side football is realistically any great sort of a chance to be successful O/S, but i can see 7 aside or 10 a side football played on smaller grounds having successful tournaments around the world.

Don't be too concerned about there being insufficient large enough ovals overseas for AF, played 18 a side.

There are often adjoining soccer and/or rugby grounds side by side (not goal to goal) in large parkland areas -these could be used; some parklands have moveable soccer posts; a few countries have cricket grounds. Also, 15 a side is still a good alternative, if the ground is still slightly to small.

Not sure how easy it would be to arrange insurance for Australians going overseas to play AF -but two years ago VWFL St Albans Spurs (now Vic. Uni Spurs) played against USAFL women's teams in Boston & NY.

Many football teams go on end of season holiday trips. If they played football overseas on their holiday, it would be a big boost for AF overseas.

Might have to split the Australians up with the o/s local teams, to make it more competitive?

Probably, the Australian players might have to come from several Australian clubs -it could be very difficult/almost impossible to get 22 players from the same team able & willing to go o/s at the same time to play football.

The game might have to be played at the end of the Australians' holiday. This minimises the fear and the risk for the Australians that, after paying big dollars for airfares etc, they have an early game, get injured, then can't properly enjoy the rest of their holiday -which could be a 14 days, or more, planned holiday (probably more if going to Europe). Or play non-contact AFL 9's style football.

This concept may be attractive for Aust. over 35's or over 45's teams, possibly a bit more disposable income - many would be willing to take on an O/S open age team. I play over 45's, many like to go on team trips.

The Victorian Amateurs play Ireland every few years in Ireland, in IR. There is a lot of enthusiasm for the trip.

The AFL should heavily promote this concept throughout Australia (and, also, O/S teams coming to Australia to train & play against a "similar"standard local team).

Is anyone aware if the AFL is being proactive in this regard.

 

[TWLS]

Don't be too concerned about there being insufficient large enough ovals overseas for AF, played 18 a side.

There are often adjoining soccer and/or rugby grounds side by side (not goal to goal) in large parkland areas -these could be used; some parklands have moveable soccer posts; a few countries have cricket grounds. Also, 15 a side is still a good alternative, if the ground is still slightly to small.

Not sure how easy it would be to arrange insurance for Australians going overseas to play AF -but two years ago VWFL St Albans Spurs (now Vic. Uni Spurs) played against USAFL women's teams in Boston & NY.

Many football teams go on end of season holiday trips. If they played football overseas on their holiday, it would be a big boost for AF overseas.

Might have to split the Australians up with the o/s local teams, to make it more competitive?

Probably, the Australian players might have to come from several Australian clubs -it could be very difficult/almost impossible to get 22 players from the same team able & willing to go o/s at the same time to play football.

The game might have to be played at the end of the Australians' holiday. This minimises the fear and the risk for the Australians that, after paying big dollars for airfares etc, they have an early game, get injured, then can't properly enjoy the rest of their holiday -which could be a 14 days, or more, planned holiday (probably more if going to Europe). Or play non-contact AFL 9's style football.

This concept may be attractive for Aust. over 35's or over 45's teams, possibly a bit more disposable income - many would be willing to take on an O/S open age team. I play over 45's, many like to go on team trips.

The Victorian Amateurs play Ireland every few years in Ireland, in IR. There is a lot of enthusiasm for the trip.

The AFL should heavily promote this concept throughout Australia (and, also, O/S teams coming to Australia to train & play against a "similar"standard local team).

Is anyone aware if the AFL is being proactive in this regard.

Don't be too concerned about there being insufficient large enough ovals overseas for AF, played 18 a side.

There are often adjoining soccer and/or rugby grounds side by side (not goal to goal) in large parkland areas -these could be used; some parklands have moveable soccer posts; a few countries have cricket grounds. Also, 15 a side is still a good alternative, if the ground is still slightly to small.

Not sure how easy it would be to arrange insurance for Australians going overseas to play AF -but two years ago VWFL St Albans Spurs (now Vic. Uni Spurs) played against USAFL women's teams in Boston & NY.

Many football teams go on end of season holiday trips. If they played football overseas on their holiday, it would be a big boost for AF overseas.

Might have to split the Australians up with the o/s local teams, to make it more competitive?

Probably, the Australian players might have to come from several Australian clubs -it could be very difficult/almost impossible to get 22 players from the same team able & willing to go o/s at the same time to play football.

The game might have to be played at the end of the Australians' holiday. This minimises the fear and the risk for the Australians that, after paying big dollars for airfares etc, they have an early game, get injured, then can't properly enjoy the rest of their holiday -which could be a 14 days, or more, planned holiday (probably more if going to Europe). Or play non-contact AFL 9's style football.

This concept may be attractive for Aust. over 35's or over 45's teams, possibly a bit more disposable income - many would be willing to take on an O/S open age team. I play over 45's, many like to go on team trips.

The Victorian Amateurs play Ireland every few years in Ireland, in IR. There is a lot of enthusiasm for the trip.

The AFL should heavily promote this concept throughout Australia (and, also, O/S teams coming to Australia to train & play against a "similar"standard local team).

Is anyone aware if the AFL is being proactive in this regard.

The official AFL House policy to International Footy is below bar a few exceptions like the 3 yearly International Cup and modest funding to other stuff -AFL Europe etc etc.
'We think the International Game should grow organically". In other words from within in each country, and about 6 years ago said to the clubs we want you do talent development work overseas, which led to Hawthorn.St Kilda going to NZ, and recently Port Power to China, and it looks like Essendon to India.
Others -(The majority) however think they are doing the right thing because the "Policy" is the realistic option and the game should remain only in Australia.

 

[TWLS]

Update on Under Age Girls footy across PNG.
AFL PNG has selected their two Development Squads - U17 and U14 from the following Centres
Mt Hagen - West Highlands Province
Lae - Morobe Province
Kimbe - West New Britain Province
Kavieng - New Ireland Province
Kerema - Gulf Province
Port Moresby - National Capital District

For info purposes only- PNG has 22 Provinces, so we have a presence in 6 of them, which may indicate further expansion in the future funds permitting.

From the 2 squads, the 2017 Kurakums (U/14 & U/17 Girls) travelling teams will be selected to represent PNG at the relevant 2017 AFL QLD State Development Championships.
A final group of 47 U17 Girls from across PNG were available to be in final selection to travel to QLD.
A final group of 39 U14 Girls ditto
We think this is an expansion of this program as societal attitudes change up there.
If they all feed over time into eventually the Senior programs it will be a big plus for PNG Womens footy.
Lets hope the Senior PNG Womens team finds a sponsor to get to Melbourne in August for IC17, because in 2014 for IC14 their sponsor dropped out at last moment.

 

[jatz14]

Update on Under Age Girls footy across PNG.
AFL PNG has selected their two Development Squads - U17 and U14 from the following Centres
Mt Hagen - West Highlands Province
Lae - Morobe Province
Kimbe - West New Britain Province
Kavieng - New Ireland Province
Kerema - Gulf Province
Port Moresby - National Capital District

For info purposes only- PNG has 22 Provinces, so we have a presence in 6 of them, which may indicate further expansion in the future funds permitting.

From the 2 squads, the 2017 Kurakums (U/14 & U/17 Girls) travelling teams will be selected to represent PNG at the relevant 2017 AFL QLD State Development Championships.
A final group of 47 U17 Girls from across PNG were available to be in final selection to travel to QLD.
A final group of 39 U14 Girls ditto
We think this is an expansion of this program as societal attitudes change up there.
If they all feed over time into eventually the Senior programs it will be a big plus for PNG Womens footy.
Lets hope the Senior PNG Womens team finds a sponsor to get to Melbourne in August for IC17, because in 2014 for IC14 their sponsor dropped out at last moment.

Footy is in the 6 provinces, but to what degree? Are we talking 6 teams, 6 comps or somewhere in the middle?

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[Gigantor]

In these sorts of situations, it probably pays to focus on key areas rather than try and cover the whole country (which would be a logistical nightmare).

 

[TWLS]

Footy is in the 6 provinces, but to what degree? Are we talking 6 teams, 6 comps or somewhere in the middle?

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Good question - Currently we know there are 4 Senior Womens teams in Moresby and we think 2 in Lae.
The other centres obviously have for sure School Comps for both groups of girls. That is all we know.
May know more when the Senior Womens team is picked for Melbourne- They usually list where they come from, but they may include some U17 girls already listed for QLD Champs.
If anybody else knows more feel free to post.

 

[Garlic muncher]

Good question - Currently we know there are 4 Senior Womens teams in Moresby and we think 2 in Lae.
The other centres obviously have for sure School Comps for both groups of girls. That is all we know.
May know more when the Senior Womens team is picked for Melbourne- They usually list where they come from, but they may include some U17 girls already listed for QLD Champs.
If anybody else knows more feel free to post.

Traditionally in PNG, West New Britain ( kimbe is the capital) has been a hotbed for football for some reason, possibly due to Australian religious connections or service men after and during WW2.

My family due to my father being in the Australian Navy was stationed on Manus Island which is N/W of West New Britian had a football comp there in the 1960's, i actually think the old Navy base is now used as a detention center for illegal refugees.

This was of course when PNG was under Australian control before independence.

Probably similar to Brother Pye up in the tiwi islands who took football there.

 

[The_Wookie]

 

[CrowdedHouse]

In our (GPF) podcast this week, we interviewed the new AFL Europe Head of Women's Development, Lisa Wilson, and the European Crusaders, Berengere Portal.

These interviews begin at around the 20 minute mark.

 

[TWLS]

In our (GPF) podcast this week, we interviewed the new AFL Europe Head of Women's Development, Lisa Wilson, and the European Crusaders, Berengere Portal.

These interviews begin at around the 20 minute mark.

Good stuff - Finally the realisation that footy exists outside of the big bubble called Australia - There will be true International matches against Australia quicker than the men.
We have a suggestion -Why not play the Womens World team picked at IC17 against a suitable Aussie team. Have to start somewhere.

 

[NoobPie]

Good stuff - Finally the realisation that footy exists outside of the big bubble called Australia - There will be true International matches against Australia quicker than the men.
We have a suggestion -Why not play the Womens World team picked at IC17 against a suitable Aussie team. Have to start somewhere.

I don't think there ever will be. The cream of this AFL W would beat any of the 8 teams by an enormous margin and there were only 2 non Australian's in the over 200 selected to pay.

Representative football may work with some of the better countries being able to beat, say, Tasmania or the NT at some point. You could even, in the first instance, pick a world team to compete in a state of origin comp

The most significant representative football each year by some margin - arguably outside of a world cup soccer year - is the RL state of origin. The Kangaroos are relatively a non event.

 

[Garlic muncher]

I don't think there ever will be. The cream of this AFL W would beat any of the 8 teams by an enormous margin and there were only 2 non Australian's in the over 200 selected to pay.

Representative football may work with some of the better countries being able to beat, say, Tasmania or the NT at some point. You could even, in the first instance, pick a world team to compete in a state of origin comp

The most significant representative football each year by some margin - arguably outside of a world cup soccer year - is the RL state of origin. The Kangaroos are relatively a non event.

I am with TWLS on this, i reckon the standard is pretty low and i reckon O/S women's teams and players can match or catch the Australian standard.

There is far more chance IMO of women playing competitive matches against other countries than men.

 

[The_Wookie]

I am with TWLS on this, i reckon the standard is pretty low and i reckon O/S women's teams and players can match or catch the Australian standard.

There is far more chance IMO of women playing competitive matches against other countries than men.

that'll be the case now - I reckon a World XVI would give any one team a run for its money - i think they'd struggle against an all-Australian womens side though - hell I think Darebin would possibly win out at the moment over some of the AFL Womens sides - but by seasons end I think the training and skills will be vastly improved.

 

[NoobPie]

I am with TWLS on this, i reckon the standard is pretty low and i reckon O/S women's teams and players can match or catch the Australian standard.

There is far more chance IMO of women playing competitive matches against other countries than men.

I certainly agree with that

 

[Gigantor]

It's true that the women from places like the US, Canada and Ireland are closer to Australian women than any non-Australian would be to Australian men's teams.

But...we all saw the intensity of the first round of games, first ever game, the girls had absolutely zero time on the ball - you can't ever convince me that even right now, women from the US and Canada would be used to getting clobbered within a split second of getting hands to ball and would have the wherewithal to get a meaningful possession.

I might be wrong, but I think the momentum of the past year has meant that the top 200 Australian women have put more of a gap between them and the best women overseas.

Having said that, I'd like to see some baby steps taken, perhaps the US or Canadian teams playing an ACT or Tassie rep side - at least to guage where things stand, and doing it regularly so we can guage any progression.

But now that we are setting up academies all over the country, and with real pathways to the AFL Women's, I have trouble seeing any other country ever getting close again.

 

[Bostonian]

Turn the international series into a mens and womens series.

Irish women are more than capable of beating the Aussies.

 

[NoobPie]

Turn the international series into a mens and womens series.

Irish women are more than capable of beating the Aussies.

The Irish would probably beat us at Gaelic with tackling and marking, sure. We are talking about football though

 

[Bostonian]

The Irish would probably beat us at Gaelic with tackling and marking, sure. We are talking about football though

I said International rules. So they wouldn't be playing Gaelic.

 

[jatz14]

The closest international players will be to a national Australian women's team was about 6 months ago. The gap is now widening, and will keep widening.

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[threenewpadlocks]

I reckon there's a real market for ex-US female college athletes who want to be part of a team sport environment.

Unlike mens' basketball, soccer etc. there's a massive hole in what professional opportunities exist for these players.

The ex-college basketballers (not talking about the Cox and Holmes types who found a little bit of success) who did the athletic testing, the 30 or so every year for the last 5 years, are the dregs of the college programme - those who are at the end of the bench of the lower-level Division 1 programmes etc.

Consider the fact that there are similar sized talent pools for women's soccer, volleyball and so on in the US, but less professional opportunities for these players. There's no semi-pro or volleyball league in any English speaking country in the world, for example - that could be enough to convince a very talented player to come out to Australia and play in the AFLW.

 

[NoobPie]

I said International rules. So they wouldn't be playing Gaelic.

Well they're not playing football...and international rules is basically Gaelic with tackling

 

[Bostonian]

Well they're not playing football...and international rules is basically Gaelic with tackling

No basically it's not.

More money and exposure will come into the AFLW if they play an international rules series than if they play Canada or PNG in AFL.

 

[NoobPie]

No basically it's not.

More money and exposure will come into the AFLW if they play an international rules series than if they play Canada or PNG in AFL.

What other key differences are there? If I'm missing something, point it out, otherwise, I think we can conclude that these are the only significant differences. The absolute fundamentals - the ball and the pitch - are effectively exactly the same

I don't think the international rules does anything significant in terms of money and exposure. As much as anything I think it has a diplomatic function to salve the irish for stealing their talented youth

 

[jatz14]

I reckon there's a real market for ex-US female college athletes who want to be part of a team sport environment.

Unlike mens' basketball, soccer etc. there's a massive hole in what professional opportunities exist for these players.

The ex-college basketballers (not talking about the Cox and Holmes types who found a little bit of success) who did the athletic testing, the 30 or so every year for the last 5 years, are the dregs of the college programme - those who are at the end of the bench of the lower-level Division 1 programmes etc.

Consider the fact that there are similar sized talent pools for women's soccer, volleyball and so on in the US, but less professional opportunities for these players. There's no semi-pro or volleyball league in any English speaking country in the world, for example - that could be enough to convince a very talented player to come out to Australia and play in the AFLW.

Actually, it isn't the dregs of college basketball looking to get into AFL. These players are given offers to attend based on criteria that the AFl is looking at, which are different to the criteria the NBA is looking at.

The recruiters have said the criteria they are after are more often found in bit part and bench players than star starters, so for the NBA they are the dregs, but for the AFL they are the cream.

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