Destination clubs - an equalisation loophole?

[Ant85]

Hawthorn swooping on Jake Carlisle today and potentially snatching him from a lower Victorian club speaks volumes of the impact "destination clubs" are having on the evenness of the competition.

This trade week has followed similar patterns.

Geelong and Collingwood have also lured stars to fast-track their rebuilds to prevent a dive to the bottom four ala St.Kilda, Melbourne, WB, and other clubs that don't have the luxury to lure talented, high profile players.

Not that I'm complaining as a Collingwood supporter, but I'm also not blind to the indirect consequence of free agency, which was a fear touted at its inception: that it would benefit the rich and powerful, and render other equalisation policies slightly ineffectual.

That players can nominate their clubs for a trade means that, more often than not, big name players will go to rich clubs, and rich clubs will almost always get the players they want.

Compare Collingwood to North Melbourne. North put bids for Treloar and Howe, and were rejected. Players will 9/10 choose a Collingwood/Hawthorn/Geelong over a North/St.Kilda/Melbourne.

The class system among AFL clubs is even more profound, with the destination clubs the top of the rank (can throw in Sydney, maybe Adelaide/WA clubs as well).

Destination clubs have an advantage of not bottoming out, thus ensuring more regular success than smaller clubs. Is it fair?

 

[Quivorir]

North have had a pretty good run in terms of players wanting to come to us or us getting the people we want. Can't complain really.

 

[manboob]

I'd like to thing Geelong are becoming a destination club but I know Henderson, Selwood and Dangerfield are coming partly for family reasons, I mean if we were on the bottom the ladder they wouldn't move across - so we are partway there.

I don't understand how Richmond keep missing out - maybe the coach doesn't present well or something? Or they are in that win spot of trying to offer Cats/Hawks type wages but without the history of success to justify it.

 

[Wooljay]

You can't equalise everything, it isn't and never will be a flat competition.

Roos have come a long way in making themselves attractive, other clubs will have to do the same thing or fall behind.

 

[Hawkk]

The football world would melt if we pick up Carlisle

It wont happen

 

[BobbyMorri]

likewise, until the trade ban. grrrr........

this is why teams get some form of compo though; to offset this.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Bullshit OP. Carlisle didn't come out and say "Get me to Hawthorn".

The Saints are in a bind as pick 5 is overs and their next pick is unders. Hawthorn haven't abused being a 'destination' club, they've just been more creative. Not to mention we'd be nowhere near this if Jed didn't want out.

Put the outrage away.

 

[master bate]

I'd like to thing Geelong are becoming a destination club but I know Henderson, Selwood and Dangerfield are coming partly for family reasons, I mean if we were on the bottom the ladder they wouldn't move across - so we are partway there.

I don't understand how Richmond keep missing out - maybe the coach doesn't present well or something? Or they are in that win spot of trying to offer Cats/Hawks type wages but without the history of success to justify it.

The Tigers have crap depth and everyone knows it. It comes from them rebuilding during the expansion years.

One of the reasons they can't bring anyone in is they can't get big offers together by trading guys out.

Collingwood don't have the spread of top liners that Richmond does but (besides the recent flag) they have depth on the list. As part of getting Aish, Howe and Treloar in they can lose Seedsman, Kennedy and Freeman.

There's also the issue of players not wanting to go there knowing a few key injuries could derail the whole thing and have the tigers 3-8 or 2-4 or whatever they've been the last two years.

 

[manboob]

Hawthorn haven't abused being a 'destination' club, they've just been more creative.

Same with the Cats. We might have been able to get these trade deals done cheaper but we wanted them done now and with certainty to so we did it thusly.

 

[Jaeger]

Aren't Collingwood getting Treloar, Aish and Howe?

 

[Mick39]

Why criticise Hawthorn. They are ruthless, they are well run and they get things done.

Unlike the majority of AFL clubs, they don't survive by asking for handouts.

 

[kaiserchief13]

Can't be truely equal until there are the same amount of clubs in each city and there is a cap on amount of premierships won.

"Sorry you have to retire now because you have reached the max of 2 flags per career"

 

[master bate]

GWS and Gold Coast have expanded Hawthorn's period at the top. With no serious dominant teams emerging over the last few years or at least since Sydney (with respect to Port, Freo and WC) the hawks core talent still remain by far the best in the bunch.

No other team has Hodge, Mitchell, Lewis, Burgoyne, Rioli, Roughy, Birchall. Very few teams every will get close to getting a group that good in a similar age range and keeping them for 5 years.

Port have something a little similar and hence they've got Ryder and will get Dixon.

Gold Coast's young core has been broken up and GWS' has a few cracks in it and they haven't got the depth players yet to get over the hump.

The salary cap will kick in eventually for most clubs and the Hawks have had to lose some to replace some. But the main issue is a lack of a challenger ready to draw away from them.

Bottom clubs need longer draftee deals to give them protection to allow them to secure their own talent so they can build something that attracts players.

 

[Hawkas1988]

Stupid post. Saints won't get Carlisle because they didn't come to the party with a decent offer. It's their own fault.

Hawthorn are smart and pounced with a much fairer offer and Essendon rightfully want to accept that one.

Carlisle never chose Hawthorn, it's St. Kilda's own fault for it coming to this

 

[J_Moore]

Aren't Collingwood getting Treloar, Aish and Howe?

What is the relevance of this?

 

[Jatz]

Why criticise Hawthorn. They are ruthless, they are well run and they get things done.

Unlike the majority of AFL clubs, they don't survive by asking for handouts.

Absolutely this.

He fits under their cap and they've offered the best trade.

We want them to stop being so good as a football club? Come on...

 

[manboob]

Again I think this is more to do with strategy that destination club-ness. Hawks, Pies and Cats have hung on a topped up Saints etc choose to drop back down. They let Goddard and Dal Santo go when they were still playing good footy and had some value.

 

[Ant85]

Bullshit OP. Carlisle didn't come out and say "Get me to Hawthorn".

The Saints are in a bind as pick 5 is overs and their next pick is unders. Hawthorn haven't abused being a 'destination' club, they've just been more creative. Not to mention we'd be nowhere near this if Jed didn't want out.

Put the outrage away.

Aren't Collingwood getting Treloar, Aish and Howe?

Why criticise Hawthorn. They are ruthless, they are well run and they get things done.

Unlike the majority of AFL clubs, they don't survive by asking for handouts.

I'm not criticising Hawthorn or anyone, did you three read the whole post or just the first line?

 

[Mick39]

This crap about equalisation just lets club like Brisbane & St. Kilda deflect their ineptness by hiding behind their situation. The good and great clubs go about their business and no surprise, they are successful onfield.

Having more money doesn't make you more successful. Having more money is a result of being better run than those clubs who can't get deals done. Throwing money at the inept clubs won't change why they are unsuccessful.

 

[JohnnyFontane90]

in this situation it seems like hawthorn offered a more favorable deal than st kilda. nothing more to it than that. that's how trade works...

 

[Walter H White]

In recent years, Hawthorn and Geelong have become the Woolworths-Coles duopoly of the AFL, Sydney is ALDI and Saints are the local store being pushed out of competition.

 

[threesixpio]

Hawthorn swooping on Jake Carlisle today and potentially snatching him from a lower Victorian club speaks volumes of the impact "destination clubs" are having on the evenness of the competition.

This trade week has followed similar patterns.

Geelong and Collingwood have also lured stars to fast-track their rebuilds to prevent a dive to the bottom four ala St.Kilda, Melbourne, WB, and other clubs that don't have the luxury to lure talented, high profile players.

Not that I'm complaining as a Collingwood supporter, but I'm also not blind to the indirect consequence of free agency, which was a fear touted at its inception: that it would benefit the rich and powerful, and render other equalisation policies slightly ineffectual.

That players can nominate their clubs for a trade means that, more often than not, big name players will go to rich clubs, and rich clubs will almost always get the players they want.

Compare Collingwood to North Melbourne. North put bids for Treloar and Howe, and were rejected. Players will 9/10 choose a Collingwood/Hawthorn/Geelong over a North/St.Kilda/Melbourne.

The class system among AFL clubs is even more profound, with the destination clubs the top of the rank (can throw in Sydney, maybe Adelaide/WA clubs as well).

Destination clubs have an advantage of not bottoming out, thus ensuring more regular success than smaller clubs. Is it fair?

Kudos for posting as a Maggie and acknowledging your club's part in this. More than I can say for some (powerful) posters who start threads.

I do wonder whether this will seem exactly the same in 5 years or so. WB or the Saints might be super teams who attract players because of team success in years to come. Already Suckling left for the WB likely thinking there was long term success over there. So did Boyd. I think this issue is exaggerated and blown out of proportion tbh.

If Hawthorn swoop on a whole lot of free agents next year then I could understand people being annoyed but so far we got Frawlwy and lost Buddy and traded everyone else in. Carlisle is just shrewd trading

 

[Blue Heart]

The AFL is getting more and more like the EPL every year !!!

How long before the gap between the top and bottom teams with the help of new and ever evolving scenario of destination clubs and supported by FA, becomes almost permanent.

 

[threesixpio]

Again I think this is more to do with strategy that destination club-ness. Hawks, Pies and Cats have hung on a topped up Saints etc choose to drop back down. They let Goddard and Dal Santo go when they were still playing good footy and had some value.

and don't forget the mentoring by those wiser heads.

 

[threesixpio]

The AFL is getting more and more like the EPL every year !!!

How long before the gap between the top and bottom teams with the help of FA becomes almost permanent.

and how is this to do with FA exactly?