2015 Fixture Leaks

[Demonic Ascent]

yes, but they also get a massive amount of cash in return for that inferior draw

if that money was taken away, and a "fair" draw given, do you think the Dees would be getting sold out houses?

The issue is they have few supporters, and their recent crap performances has made them unwatchable. when was the last time you were motivated to watch the dees on TV or god forbid live?

The compensation is inadequate for the long term impact it has on clubs abilities to consolidate and expand on memberships, supporters, sponsors etc. Some clubs have been on the wrong side of the fixturing for two decades, give us two decades of fair fixturing and things will even out.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

so you think the demons are a massive drawcard people would go to see if only you had a great draw?

The point was we play those teams anyway and will get the same crowds whether we are the home team or the away team. We're already playing Essendon but why does it have to be their home game every single year? Making it our home game isn't going to all of a sudden mean crowds will drop.

 

[Spook]

Btw I do find it funny how after a year of non Vic fans telling us all how awesome ETihad is, and how weak Vic fans are for bitching about it, this thread is dominated by non Vic fans bitching about playing at Etihad

But it's a great venue, it's close to the city, and it has a roof. What more do you want?

It's an awsum venue. Bloody awsum. Best viewing stadium in Australia. OK not that G for big games but great to watch a game at.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

The compensation is inadequate for the long term impact it has on clubs abilities to consolidate and expand on memberships, supporters, sponsors etc. Some clubs have been on the wrong side of the fixturing for two decades, give us two decades of fair fixturing and things will even out.

How is it inadequate? You have been receiving millions for years now

Your issue is you have pissed the money up the wall, and not invested it in actually growing your club

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Tell your own supporters, you know the ones who didn't rock up to games against Freo, GWS and Port just this year.

Our supporters are not the ones asking for handouts from the afl

Big difference to buying a membership and not turning up, and doing SFA and expecting others to always save your club

 

[Demonic Ascent]

How is it inadequate? You have been receiving millions for years now

Your issue is you have pissed the money up the wall, and not invested it in actually growing your club

Our supporters are not the ones asking for handouts from the afl

Big difference to buying a membership and not turning up, and doing SFA and expecting others to always save your club

You do realise Richmond get roughly the same from the AFL out if the disequalisation fund as Melbourne do yeah?

The compensation is inadequate because it only takes into account the short term loss of revenue without accounting for the long term inability to consolidate our supporter base and grow our support/membership base as well as sponsorship and all the other stuff that goes along with that. The AFL's policies regarding the fixture and equalisation are designed to ensure that a number of clubs are reliant on them so that they maintain virtual control of the club.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

You do realise Richmond get roughly the same from the AFL out if the disequalisation fund as Melbourne do yeah?

The compensation is inadequate because it only takes into account the short term loss of revenue without accounting for the long term inability to consolidate our supporter base and grow our support/membership base as well as sponsorship and all the other stuff that goes along with that. The AFL's policies regarding the fixture and equalisation are designed to ensure that a number of clubs are reliant on them so that they maintain virtual control of the club.

and you do realize you have a significantly better stadium deal than us dont you?

my issue with the compo demands is you have no end game. ive repeatedly asked dees fans, what do you need to never receive compo again, and the answer is always silence. even if you get the draw of your dreams, you will still have your hand out. if you're asking for charity constantly you may as well pay a price for it

 

[ManWithNoName]

and you do realize you have a significantly better stadium deal than us dont you?

my issue with the compo demands is you have no end game. ive repeatedly asked dees fans, what do you need to never receive compo again, and the answer is always silence. even if you get the draw of your dreams, you will still have your hand out. if you're asking for charity constantly you may as well pay a price for it

You mean Daniel Demon-Fan on the street isn't sure of the clubs finances and what kind of sustainable revenue they need to obtain?

I'm shocked. Clearly if Daniel Demon-Fan doesn't know then the club doesn't know. I remember asking Richard Richmond-Fan in the mid 2000's and he had a full ledger showing me what needed to be done.

 

[Sprout]

rfctiger74 - you've become little more than a troll of ManofClay proportions. You don't actually listen to the answers given to you, you just crap on with your theories that somehow place all blame on the supporters.

 

[ManWithNoName]

rfctiger74 - you've become little more than a troll of ManofClay proportions. You don't actually listen to the answers given to you, you just crap on with your theories that somehow place all blame on the supporters.

To be fair we really should finish that accounting course and read all those financial reports from the club and work out exactly how much the club needs. I mean it's amateur on our behalf.

 

[LeverPuller]

I need to do a full breakdown of every Victorian club's year-by-year home game fixture. I know Melbourne gets stooged, as does Hawthorn (although the latter is partially due to the Tassie deal).

 

[Ned_Flanders]

You mean Daniel Demon-Fan on the street isn't sure of the clubs finances and what kind of sustainable revenue they need to obtain?

I'm shocked. Clearly if Daniel Demon-Fan doesn't know then the club doesn't know. I remember asking Richard Richmond-Fan in the mid 2000's and he had a full ledger showing me what needed to be done.

not talking about the fans, but the club

FWIW I've actually been on record as saying our current off field rebuild is our last roll of the dice. Most fans (like me) had been to hell and back, and if the club financially went under again, I honestly didn't know if the supporter base would have it in them to do a scorched earth rebuild again (including me).

I know no one owes my club an ongoing existence, and if we fall again it will be more than just Carlton and North wanting us to die. If I feel this way about my own club, are you surprised I have similar feelings about the rest?

 

[Ned_Flanders]

rfctiger74 - you've become little more than a troll of ManofClay proportions. You don't actually listen to the answers given to you, you just crap on with your theories that somehow place all blame on the supporters.

get over yourself. no one owes any club a living, but dees fans expect to be gifted a good draw, financial compo, draft picks, and all the help the AFL can dole out.

you want a better fixture, how about produce a product people actually want to watch?

 

[Crankyhawk]

even for that, its about maximizing crowds. reality is Richmond vs Carlton (for instance) will always draw much more than Melbourne vs Carlton, but counter to that, Richmond vs GWS is not hugely higher than Melbourne vs GWS. Reality is your own fans are not eager to watch your side, and opposition fans are even less so.

As the trade off, you get hundreds of thousands in compo.

His question is why isn't it Melb vs Essendon instead of Ess vs Melb - same crowd draw. There should be alternation between home and away. This would also help hawk supporters in Brisbane.

 

[sverik25]

yes, but they also get a massive amount of cash in return for that inferior draw

if that money was taken away, and a "fair" draw given, do you think the Dees would be getting sold out houses?

The issue is they have few supporters, and their recent crap performances has made them unwatchable. when was the last time you were motivated to watch the dees on TV or god forbid live?

I understand that in the financial interests of the AFL, they cannot simply give every team a perfectly fair draw. However, if they gave Melbourne and other smaller teams the opportunity to make some money themselves by fixturing them against larger drawing teams, they would solve some of their own problems and Melbourne and others would be less dependent on the AFL for handouts.

As I said earlier, this argument isn't about how good they are to watch, and they can be fixtured at home against bigger drawing sides without being on FTA TV.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Oh, and another thing:

Melbourne v GWS. Round 21, 2014, on the back of a massive losing streak for the Dees.
Attendance: 17,218
Hawthorn v GWS. Round 11, 2014, in the middle of a premiership season.
Attendance: 17,904

Despite the massive gap in 'size', that says a lot about how 'willing' Melbourne supporters are to turn up to s**t football games.

I missed the GWS game - Sunday twiligh and expected easy win = couldn't be stuffed going. Would not surprise if many other Hawks felt the same, also I think there had been some players out for GWS. And the last time we played was a 25 goal thumping.
The reality was different and the crowd next time we play them here will probably be better.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Wow Hawks are finalists and then premiers yet get GC and GWS both at home the following year... Two years in a row.... But they get a hard draw they say

Getting them at home means you play a good club away. You want to play strong clubs at home to maximise advantage and s**t clubs away as you will win anyway.

 

[Hawkk]

Wow Hawks are finalists and then premiers yet get GC and GWS both at home the following year... Two years in a row.... But they get a hard draw they say

I mean that GWS trip has been a daunting experience this last 3 seasons

 

[carnthedons]

His question is why isn't it Melb vs Essendon instead of Ess vs Melb - same crowd draw. There should be alternation between home and away. This would also help hawk supporters in Brisbane.

Melbourne fans want it that way. Essendon fans want it that way. Gill/Simon make a fixture for the fans which has it the other way. Strong logic AFL.

 

[Billy ray]

how come Saturday night games move to a 'family friendlier' start time of 7:20pm, but friday's remain at 7:50 ?
they should both be 7:10!

 

[sverik25]

how come Saturday night games move to a 'family friendlier' start time of 7:20pm, but friday's remain at 7:50 ?
they should both be 7:10!

To accommodate Channel 7 and allow people more time to get home and ready for the footy after work.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

and you do realize you have a significantly better stadium deal than us dont you?

my issue with the compo demands is you have no end game. ive repeatedly asked dees fans, what do you need to never receive compo again, and the answer is always silence. even if you get the draw of your dreams, you will still have your hand out. if you're asking for charity constantly you may as well pay a price for it

We do not have a significantly better stadium deal, our stadium deal is comparable to the one Richmond has. Have a look at the presentation on the AFL's Disequalisation Funding for the 2012-2016 period.

If the AFL wants to get rid of compo they need to;
- Create fair stadium deals
- Create a fair fixture/schedule
- Have these policies in place for a period of time (preferably 15-20 years) to enable some equilibrium following the unfair policies of the last 20 years or so but also going back to the days of zoning etc which favoured certain clubs over others
- Ideally clubs should dictate where their home games are played - so for instance if Dogs or North want to play a few home games in Geelong or even sell one to Perth as North wanted to a few years ago they should be able to do so - if that impacts on the AFL's contracts then bad luck they should wear it or compensate those clubs for the lost revenue (this is more applicable to those two clubs than MFC)

Those are the main things there are other areas of equalisation policies which need to be addressed but they are more competitive than financial issues (such as FA etc)

Just FYI we received about $300k more than Richmond per season over the last 3 years.

 

[Billy ray]

To accommodate Channel 7 and allow people more time to get home and ready for the footy after work.

and how does that work for perth games which start at 610pm local time?
and Adelaide with 720pm local time?
do people not have to get home from work there?

 

[sverik25]

and how does that work for perth games which start at 610pm local time?
and Adelaide with 720pm local time?
do people not have to get home from work there?

They do, but those times are put on earlier locally for TV purposes in the rest of the country. I'm not saying that that is the way it should be, it's just the way it is at the moment.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

We do not have a significantly better stadium deal, our stadium deal is comparable to the one Richmond has. Have a look at the presentation on the AFL's Disequalisation Funding for the 2012-2016 period.

If the AFL wants to get rid of compo they need to;
- Create fair stadium deals
- Create a fair fixture/schedule
- Have these policies in place for a period of time (preferably 15-20 years) to enable some equilibrium following the unfair policies of the last 20 years or so but also going back to the days of zoning etc which favoured certain clubs over others
- Ideally clubs should dictate where their home games are played - so for instance if Dogs or North want to play a few home games in Geelong or even sell one to Perth as North wanted to a few years ago they should be able to do so - if that impacts on the AFL's contracts then bad luck they should wear it or compensate those clubs for the lost revenue (this is more applicable to those two clubs than MFC)

Those are the main things there are other areas of equalisation policies which need to be addressed but they are more competitive than financial issues (such as FA etc)

Just FYI we received about $300k more than Richmond per season over the last 3 years.

it actually is significantly better.

when you made peace with the MCC and renegotiated your deal, you went from having the worst one at the G to a very good one. Pies of course have the best of us all, and Hawks received a very favourable deal because the G wanted them to move there after Waverley was done. Unfortunately our lack of leverage (we fans would burn Punt Road down if we moved to Etihad) means the MCC have been pretty tough in the negotiations with us. We have even struggled to get similar members reserve allocations to other clubs until recently, because the MCC didn't want to hand over ticketed reserve areas it would sell at the gate.

JFYI we are up for negotiation again next year I think, so it will be interesting to see how discussions go this time around (esp with Carlton moving here and others wanting a bigger presence)