List Mgmt. Cook Re-Signs

[The rabbi]

Do you really think that all the premierships that Hawthorn won in the 70's, 80's and in 91 have any correlation at all with their 4 recent premierships ?

I cant see the connection at all , in fact they had a really lean period in between the 91 and 2008 premierships.

Hawthorn have been the most successful club over the past 50 years without a doubt , but lets not pretend that they have something special about them that enables them to win premierships .

Hawthorn last 4 premierships come down to 3 simple reason.

1.Talented players
2.Great coach
3.Being a rich club

I have yet to see a team win a premiership with crap players, crap coach and a financially strapped club.
And I don't think that Hawthorn's relatively lean period is all that lean comparatively.

Given that they have been in the competition for 91 years and have a premiership frequency of 1 every 7 years on average. They also had not won a flag in their first 37 years in the competition until they broke through in 1961.

Collingwood took 20 years to win one in 2010 and their previous flag broke a drought of 32 years,
North has not won one since 1999 (16 years) and it took them over 50 years to get their first flag.
Carlton '' '' '' 1995 (20 years)
Richmond 1980 (35)
Essendon 2001 (14)
Swans had a drought of 72 years,
Bulldogs current drought is 61 years
Fitzroy had a drought of 52 years before Fitzroy died.
Melbourne has not won a flag for over 50 years
St.Kilda has not won one in 49 years
And Geelong took 44 years to break their premiership drought in 2007.

Hawthorn have been the most successful club over the past 50 years without a doubt , but lets not pretend that they have something special about them that enables them to win premierships .

Are you seriously going to suggest that Hawthorn do not have something special about them that has contributed to their success as a club in the past 50 years?

They have talented players because they wisely choose talented players who are good at the basics of football. I.E. they select players who can kick for a start.
Surely the selection of great and intelligent coaches that they have had in their past is due to the diligence that they put into what they want in a coach.

And the wealth of the club again must have something to do with the blokes that they have in the front office. Collingwood is also a very rich club but that has not helped them much as they have only managed 2 premierships in the last 50+ years.

The Hawks are a club that appear to have a history of having the right people at the club in their respective roles. Be they coaches, Administration or players.
And yes, I think that their is something special about the Hawthorn football club. As much as I wish that it were not true.

 

[CharacterFirst]

And yes, I think that their is something special about the Hawthorn football club. As much as I wish that it were not true.

They don't have "something special" in the common use of the term - which is to suggest attributes that are hidden; unique; and particular to them to the exclusion of others.

They have just recently done things well, and circumstances have conspired to favour them.

They are not "special" in anyway that would exclude other clubs (on parity) from matching their achievements.

 

[The rabbi]

They don't have "something special" in the common use of the term - which is to suggest attributes that are hidden; unique; and particular to them to the exclusion of others.

They have just recently done things well, and circumstances have conspired to favour them.

They are not "special" in anyway that would exclude other clubs (on parity) from matching their achievements.

They have something special in choice of personnel that they bring into the club in all areas.
There is nothing magical about it but it is due to good decisions.

They are not "special" in anyway that would exclude other clubs (on parity) from matching their achievements.

Bullshit. No clubs have matched what the Hawks have done in the last half century let alone in recent times since the introduction of the AFL.

 

[Partridge]

They have something special in choice of personnel that they bring into the club in all areas.
There is nothing magical about it but it is due to good decisions.

Exactly. Personally I think the best thing to do is learn from them and seek to emulate them. Rather than flippantly dismissing their record as some sort of fluke.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

True, but we also must remember that the current AFL system makes it more difficult to win a premiership in a competition that has 50% more teams in it than it did in the old VFL of 1980.

Although Hawthorn have still managed to win 5 premierships since the transition to the AFL in 1990.

I don't want to read that rabs

 

[The rabbi]

Exactly. Personally I think the best thing to do is learn from them and seek to emulate them. Rather than flippantly dismissing their record as some sort of fluke.

I dislike the Hawks as much as any Cats supporter on this board. Believe me Partridge!
But I just refuse to let my personal bias towards Geelong blind me to the achievements of the HFC.

Personally I think the best thing to do is learn from them and seek to emulate them.

Yes and No. That is if you use "emulate" in the sense of matching their style.
I felt that Geelong tried to emulate the style of the Swans after they won their first premiership in '05. It was a style that just did not suit the Cats and the free running attacking style of '07 worked a charm.
I think that to beat Hawthorn you have to come up with strategies that effectively shut their game down.

But who could deny that the Hawks disposal by hand and their precision field and goal kicking should not be emulated. I am of the opinion that the disposal skills (foot and hand) of the Geelong team at the moment are well down on what the Hawks have, and I doubt that we could emulate their accurate kicking game in 2016. But it is certainly something the aspire to.

The Hawks also spread very well when they have the ball. In contrast Geelong often look lazy and refuse to make space. I have heard Hawkins being accused of playing lazy but he is far from alone.
They pressure us when we have the ball and we cannot find space but they seem to have no great difficulties in that area.

 

[The rabbi]

I don't want to read that rabs

Just put your hands over your ears and you won't have to NSFB.

 

[Pivo]

Just put your hands over your ears and you won't have to NSFB.

Is he blind?

 

[The rabbi]

Anyway this thread is about this recruit.

 

[Boxhead_31]

I wonder who the club was that made a Godfather offer that Cookie turned down last year given that it is stated it was North?

ABOUT a year ago, Cook was again headhunted to join a rival AFL club with another lucrative offer.

Not from North Melbourne this time but another club, one Cook is reluctant to name, nor wanting to overplay the approach.

The offer was as tempting as it was humbling, further proof of the lengths clubs go in an attempt to lure the legendary football administrator out of Simonds Stadium.

“Sometimes there are things called ‘offers too good to refuse’ — and this was probably one of them,” Cook says, smiling.

He would have left Geelong immediately but, like many times before, respectfully declined the offer.

“It blew me out of the water, really,” he said.

“A couple of reasons I didn’t take it was I wasn’t worth the money they offered, I just didn’t feel comfortable and I wanted to stay at Geelong.”

http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au...s/news-story/a685431e0fb7662ed578a35c88fe8c69

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Give that man a bronze statue. Tremendous character.

 

[JUBJUB]

I wonder who the club was that made a Godfather offer that Cookie turned down last year given that it is stated it was North?

http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au...s/news-story/a685431e0fb7662ed578a35c88fe8c69

Who needed a CEO ?
StKilda ?

 

[dazbroncos]

Who needed a CEO ?
StKilda ?

Cook said it was mega bucks. Who has cash and needs one that would pay above the scale to get Cook.

I knew we had a pay structure on the field but off it was well?

Onya Cookie.

Go Catters

 

[Willo_]

Anyway this thread is about this recruit.

Forgive me for questioning your accuracy mate.... but I can't help by think you have photoshopped that picture

 

[The rabbi]

Forgive me for questioning your accuracy mate.... but I can't help by think you have photoshopped that picture

I can say with all honesty that I have not.

 

[jim boy]

Cook said it was mega bucks. Who has cash and needs one that would pay above the scale to get Cook.

90% certain it would have been Carlton, they did appoint Trigg only a year ago and it is (or was) very much the way they went about things. Bruce Mathieson would have bank-rolled the offer as well.

 

[Willo_]

90% certain it would have been Carlton, they did appoint Trigg only a year ago and it is (or was) very much the way they went about things. Bruce Mathieson would have bank-rolled the offer as well.

Yeah that was my thinking as well.... it fits their MO of trying to buy their way out of trouble as well

 

[CharacterFirst]

Bullshit. No clubs have matched what the Hawks have done in the last half century let alone in recent times since the introduction of the AFL.

Straw man Rabbi. This was not the point made.

The Hawks are not special. They may have chosen better (or had available to them) better people, but there is nothing inherently special about the Hawks.

They have no special advantage that would have excluded other clubs doing what they have done.

In fact in the last 30 years we have basically matched them, but for some unfair advantages they had (and are probably still reaping the rewards of), such as zoning.

 

[Partridge]

In fact in the last 30 years we have basically matched them, but for some unfair advantages they had (and are probably still reaping the rewards of), such as zoning.

In the last 30 years they have won 8 premierships to our 3. Tell me how exactly have we matched them?

 

[James1970]

Anyway this thread is about this recruit.

Pretty sure I caught this guy fronting The Fall a couple of weeks ago.

 

[The rabbi]

Straw man Rabbi. This was not the point made.

The Hawks are not special. They may have chosen better (or had available to them) better people, but there is nothing inherently special about the Hawks.

And that is my point. They have recruited skilled people and players to the club. Or to use your words "they may have chosen better". And they have chosen better. I am not suggesting that there is anything mystical about their history in the last 50 years. They have just done due diligence and reaped the rewards for it.

And Geelong's history changed after more than 4 decades in the premiership wilderness because one Frank Aloysius Costa decided that for the club to go anywhere it had to have the right people in place. He got those people and changed the Geelong Football club from a broke club that was something of a laughing stock into a powerhouse of the competition.

 

[CharacterFirst]

In the last 30 years they have won 8 premierships to our 3. Tell me how exactly have we matched them?

No disrespect, but you need to follow the discussion more closely and think harder about what is being said, P.

GFC are not really on parity as a club. They are a bigger Melbourne club, we are what we are.

Considering that, and the fact that we would have probably won 3 more flags had we not had to meet the WCE state side, and a cashed up cheating Carlton in 1995, we have generally matched them.

We have played in lots of finals, won as many games, won flags, played in roughly as many GFs, are the most respected club in the country, have developed our own stadium, etc.

We did not have the massive zoning advantage the Hawks had that led to their many 70s, 80s and '91 flags.

With that advantage, we would have surpassed them.

 

[CharacterFirst]

And that is my point. They have recruited skilled people and players to the club. Or to use your words "they may have chosen better". And they have chosen better. I am not suggesting that there is anything mystical about their history in the last 50 years. They have just done due diligence and reaped the rewards for it.

That's right.

The Hawks do not have something "special" about them that is unavailable to any other club on parity.

That is what I took exception to. The idea you were implying (perhaps unintentionally), that they had something "special" about them. They don't, except they had a massive zoning advantage in the 70/80/90s, which would have made anyone a powerhouse.

 

[The rabbi]

That's right.

The Hawks do not have something "special" about them that is unavailable to any other club on parity.

That is what I took exception to. The idea you were implying (perhaps unintentionally), that they had something "special" about them. They don't, except they had a massive zoning advantage in the 70/80/90s, which would have made anyone a powerhouse.

They don't have that zoning advantage today but that has not stopped them winning 4 of the last 8 premierships. I think that is pretty special.

 

[CharacterFirst]

They don't have that zoning advantage today but that has not stopped them winning 4 of the last 8 premierships. I think that is pretty special.

I think they are probably still reaping that zoning advantage actually.

Culture, personal, support, etc.

But they have done very well besides that advantage.

Of course we have won 3 of the last 9 as well.

So......we are special to.