Operation Cameron Ling : assistant coach

[knobby]

Nathan Buckley might be available at the end of the year !

 

[Rear Admiral]

I'd prefer we pinch some underutilised, but experienced talent, from other clubs.

My thoughts exactly.
But the problem is, at least in my opinion, is that the Crows (i.e. Steven Trigg) won't even contemplate hiring anyone....for any role....if he even considers that they might rock the boat. Which is precisely what the Crows need. We need to poach someone with serious experience....that has absolutely no ties whatsoever to anyone at the Crows. And preferably someone from interstate with mates in high places.

 

[tiggsy]

this seems to point to one of two things....

1. The Crows Hierarchy aren't at all concerned/considering an experienced assistant to replace Bailey.
2. The Club IS considering/trying to look for a replacement for Bailey, but nobody (or very few) want to work with Sando and/or Trigg in an Assistant Coach role. At least nobody of any quality.

This could obviously be a bit premature, but this does give me cause for concern. But in regards to planning for 2015, the club surely must be making moves now?

So the only two explanations you can think of are that they plan to do nothing or nobody wants to work at the Crows? I would have thought another plausible explanation is that they don't want to say what they are doing. I agree that it's poor not to respond to an enquiry, but I don't agree with your conclusions based on your experience.

 

[MRB37]

Hoping you could explain that a little more clearly?
What we go for....in an assistant? Or once an assistant has been appointed?

What we go for in anyone, as in they don't like people to speak their minds and have strong opinions that differ from what Trigg and Co. want. It's a "If you support me and the club then you'll do as your told" type mentality to running things.

If Bassett came in and said "this is wrong, this sucks, this needs fixing" then he'd be taking aside and "advised" to stop it, or given the old "re-education" course. There were always whispers that half the reason Sando got the coaching gig was he told them that in terms of list management we were fine and finals bound, whereas someone like Neeld was more critical and said there was more work needed. Translated it basically means one said we'd go hammer and tongs for the finals regardless, while one wanted to bottom out, which is a big no no at the AFC.

 

[MRB37]

Sando is appearing at the Willunga footy club with Mark Harvey tonight. Maybe they'll hit it off?

 

[mistylake]

I'd take Ling over any of our assistants. Every day of the week. Just because he hasn't had any coaching experience doesn't make him a fail. This guy strikes me as a very good leader and someone that could relate to our players & fit into our group very easily.

I liked how he dressed Mick Malthouse down the other day. Although I could see why Mick was a bit cranky.

 

[mistylake]

I'd love to see them hire Tredrea as a forward line coach.

That would put the cat amongst the pigeons, or is that Magpies?

 

[mistylake]

Fair comment.

But all that aside, what doesn't get nearly enough recognition or emphasis is (in my opinion) the absolute rock solid, undisputed fact that the vast majority of potential candidates for positions at the Crows simply do not want to live in Adelaide.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threa...-assistant-coach.1070201/page-3#post-34092046

Coaches, players, administrators, even strappers....that vast majority of people simply do not want to live here. Of all the comments I've made, along with the various comments I've read (many of which I agree with), there is nothing I am more certain about than this issue. Couldn't lure Pavlich back, TidBit and Cunston bailed, just to name a few.

For the most part, most people outside of Adelaide consider us to be a huge backwater town (not a city) that they avoid like the plague. I'm not saying those people are right or wrong in their judgements, but that is how Adelaide is viewed by the vast majority of our fellow Aussies. More the point, this seriously affects how we compete at the top level. The Crows are fighting in a cut-throat, competitive market....not an isolated bubble....and we need to start bl00dy waking up and smelling the coffee.

In terms of attracting players, we're hamstrung by the Salary Cap. But in terms of attracting coaching and off-field talent, we can seriously offset Adelaide's unpopularity by offering much, much, much better salaries than what people can get offered elsewhere. If we want the remotest chance of success in Finals, we need to attract the best talent in the land, and make no mistake - people know their worth. And this means we need to open up the coffers bigtime. We need to more than double what people can get elsewhere. Unfortunately, under Trigg, this just isn't happening - not by a million miles. I doubt we're even matching the offers made by other Clubs, let alone beating them. The fact that we couldn't outbid Port in snaring Darren Burgess has me seething with rage. He preferred Port to the Crows? Fine....add another $50k to his offer. He's still not sure? Add another $50k. He still prefers Port? No probs, add another $50k. Like it or not, everyone has a price. If we're offering coaches and other major staff salaries of around $1-3k....the top-shelf coaches and administrators would laugh at us. Look at Sando's assistants in the Coaches' Box - The Three Stooges! Bicks as a Forward Line Coach?!? Christ Almighty, the rest of the AFL must be pissing their pants laughing at us.

If we want to be serious Finals contenders, we need to get people of the calibre of Roos/Malthouse/Worsfold/Clarkson on board, and why on God's green earth would they uproot and move their families for the same sort of salaries (or less) than what they're on already? Added to that, it would often mean their spouses giving up their jobs, so there's an additional chunk of total family income they're losing. Not to mention they'd be moving away from their extended family and friends. That's why Victorian-based clubs generally have the greatest pool of talent - they don't have to relocate interstate; they just drive to a different office in another suburb. And then there's the issue of all our incompetent buffoonery (thanks Trigg) - all the lunacy that Trigg has presided over hasn't been concealed from the media, not at all. All our dirty laundry has been out in the open for all of the AFL to see. Anyone that's looking for a successful career change is hardly going to move to a semi-incestuous, incompetent, Old-Boys-Club who's only interest is lining their own pockets while the Club is on it's knees. Any club can attract candidates for roles, but if you're looking at luring the very best talent, they're not going to get involved with a basket case Hierarchy like ours.

Now that the Crows have moved to Adelaide Oval - even though we're mostly playing like a bunch of derelicts every other week, we're still pulling huge crowds. There's no reason why we can't open up the warchest and seriously start poaching the best talent in the land, midseason. And if it puts a few noses out of joint, either here or elsewhere - even better. This club needs a serious shake up. I'd even go as far as saying if you're from SA, or you personally know anyone at the Club, don't even bother applying. And I hope you're reading this Trigg.

I thought we were getting screwed over at AA and there is no Warchest.

 

[craig crowing]

Giving Clarke another go because we have a AA ruck man is ludicrous especially when look at the key area he works on is clearances and our worst performing areas getting clear centre clearances and stopping oppositions.
Must be 3 new coaches at least with Clarke first out the door . We want new ideas not Sandos friends like Clarke and Milburn yes men.

 

[mistylake]

I'm pretty sure that 99% of readers agree that since the loss of Dean Bailey (my deepest sympathy to his family and loved ones), Sando has seriously struggled in the Coaches' Box during games. In fact of all the issues the Crows have to contend with, this is the one issue that would get the greatest consensus among supporters.

Anyway, not all that long ago I contacted the Crows asking if they were at least considering finding an experienced assistant to replace Dean Bailey. I didn't ask for any in-depth specifics, names, other clubs, anything like that. I just made a broad, general inquiry. I wasn't expecting to get an in-depth thesis on their coaching plans moving forward, but I at least expected to get some sort of response. Perhaps even some comments that Dean's loss was a terrible tragedy. Something, anything.

Nothing. Nil. Nada. Zilch. Zero. Not so much as a gnat's fart.

Obviously they don't want to expose their cards too early on, but surely they must have something to say. I know for sure I'm gonna earn a heap of criticism here, but this seems to point to one of two things....

1. The Crows Hierarchy aren't at all concerned/considering an experienced assistant to replace Bailey.
2. The Club IS considering/trying to look for a replacement for Bailey, but nobody (or very few) want to work with Sando and/or Trigg in an Assistant Coach role. At least nobody of any quality.

This could obviously be a bit premature, but this does give me cause for concern. But in regards to planning for 2015, the club surely must be making moves now?

Or they are playing there cards close to there chests.
For god sake don't let Sando in on it. or the whole world will know before I finish this sentence.

 

[Vader]

That would put the cat amongst the pigeons, or is that Magpies?

No different to them hiring Tyson Edwards as an assistant coach.

 

[little graham]

How much change do we want? Ling could very well be better than camporeale as a mid coach, but what we need is football manger.

Gary Ayers
Malcolm blight
dare I say Mark Thompson.

Those types.

 

[MRB37]

I heard that one of the other candidates for the top job....can't remember his name - he was of the opinion that we needed to bottom out, major overhaul, everything turned upside down. All the sorta thing. Scotty Burns I think?

I'm not sure if it was Neeld or Burns who had that opinion, although I had thought that the offical call on Burns was that they thought he wasn't "ready" to be a head coach, though the way they came to this conclusion i'm not sure.

 

[Team DJ]

Whats Gary ODonnell doing these days?
Always seemed to be the "Man in Waiting" through the early 2000s, but never got his crack.
Learnt of some of the best the game has to offer (And different from those we already have). Would be a great asset to our box.

 

[Bacon8]

Whats Gary ODonnell doing these days?
Always seemed to be the "Man in Waiting" through the early 2000s, but never got his crack.
Learnt of some of the best the game has to offer (And different from those we already have). Would be a great asset to our box.

Development Coach at Brisbane

 

[Bicks]

Development Coach at Brisbane

LOL

The youngsters don't stick around long enough to develop there!!

Polec says hi!

 

[Deaneus!]

Step 1. Kick 77.90 as a half back flanker.
Step 2. ?
Step 3. Become Adelaide Crows forward-line coach.

 

[Deaneus!]

Bickley?

Yup. Should have put his name in there somewhere too.

 

[Mattrox]

the absolute rock solid, undisputed fact that the vast majority of potential candidates for positions at the Crows simply do not want to live in Adelaide.

Really? That's a big call. Bailey, all the coaching applicants that we passed over, Sando, Milburn. I'd suggest you are wrong. We wouldn't have a football club if you were remotely correct.

coaches, players, administrators, even strappers....that vast majority of people simply do not want to live here. Of all the comments I've made, along with the various comments I've read (many of which I agree with), there is nothing I am more certain about than this issue. Couldn't lure Pavlich back, TidBit and Cunston bailed, just to name a few.

False assumption. While some people have floggish and backward views, this just isn't true. People move all over Australia for work all the time.

Pav reportedly was open to returning but the Club stuffed it up. Bad example. And other that the huge cash offers by GC and GWS, Tippett and Gunston seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Tex, Danger, Sloane, Talia, Jenkins, etc etc are completely at odds with your claim.

For the most part, most people outside of Adelaide consider us to be a huge backwater town (not a city) that they avoid like the plague. I'm not saying those people are right or wrong in their judgements, but that is how Adelaide is viewed by the vast majority of our fellow Aussies.

Repeating your argument from above does not make it true. You are making an emotive play to score Internetz Points.

More the point, this seriously affects how we compete at the top level. The Crows are fighting in a cut-throat, competitive market....not an isolated bubble....and we need to start bl00dy waking up and smelling the coffee.

I'm pretty sure the club fully understands this. To claim otherwise is shifting the burden of proof. You really need to back up a claim like this for it to have any substance.

In terms of attracting players, we're hamstrung by the Salary Cap.

Hamstrung? We signed up players for this season didn't we?

But in terms of attracting coaching and off-field talent, we can seriously offset Adelaide's unpopularity by offering much, much, much better salaries than what people can get offered elsewhere.

If people don't want to live in Adelaide and won't enjoy themselves why pay much, much more. I'd rather pay a slight premium to people who WANT to work at the AFC as they are more likely to do a good job over someone who is virtually bribed to "live in a backwater".

If we want the remotest chance of success in Finals, we need to attract the best talent in the land,

Thank you Captain Obvious

and make no mistake - people know their worth. And this means we need to open up the coffers bigtime. We need to more than double what people can get elsewhere.

Completely not possible. More than double? Just go ask your boss to double your pay because you know you are worth it and Adelaide is a hole......

Unfortunately, under Trigg, this just isn't happening - not by a million miles. I doubt we're even matching the offers made by other Clubs, let alone beating them.

Paying more than double market value won't happen under any CEO. You don't know what or how much we are offering. So your doubts are simply unverified opinion with zero weight.

The fact that we couldn't outbid Port in snaring Darren Burgess has me seething with rage. He preferred Port to the Crows? Fine....add another $50k to his offer. He's still not sure? Add another $50k. He still prefers Port? No probs, add another $50k. Like it or not, everyone has a price.

2 problems. We had no money after lawyers fees. And isn't is reported that the AFL helped Burgess get to Port....

There are 4 teams above Port without Burgess and us who beat them. Burgess is good, but he's not some fitness messiah.

If we're offering coaches and other major staff salaries of around $1-3k....the top-shelf coaches and administrators would laugh at us. Look at Sando's assistants in the Coaches' Box - The Three Stooges! Bicks as a Forward Line Coach?!? Christ Almighty, the rest of the AFL must be pissing their pants laughing at us.

You have no idea what any coaches or staff at any club are on so to base an argument on an "if" statement is clearly flawed. Not to mention that the point of your argument was to appeal to emotions rather than make a claim of fact.

The rest of your post rambles on repeating the above themes. You posted absolutely nothing of substance. Everything was based on suppositions you have no knowledge about and was cheap emotive internet point scoring.

 

[Bacon8]

Yup. Should have put his name in there somewhere too.

Can you please provide the goalkicking stats for the following Forwards coaches in the AFL?

Brisbane - Simon Black
Essendon - Matthew Egan
Gold Coast - Dean Solomon
Geelong - Blake Caracella
Hawthorn - Brendan Bolton
Melbourne - Daniel McPherson
Port Ade - Tyson Edwards
Richmond - Brendon Lade
Sydney - Henry Playfair

FYI - the others were forwards
Carlton - Brad Green
Collingwood - Matthew Lappin
Freo - Peter Sumich
GWS - Chad Cornes
Kangas - Brett Allison​

St Kilda - Aaron Hamill
Bulldogs - Shannon Grant​

Eages - Justin Longmuir​

 

[Deaneus!]

1826 Hawthorn - Brendan Bolton
1687 Port Ade - Tyson Edwards
1547 Sydney - Henry Playfair
1500 Adelaide - Mark Bickley
1486 Freo - Peter Sumich
1451 Geelong - Blake Caracella
1451 Gold Coast - Dean Solomon
1404 Carlton - Brad Green
1400 Kangas - Brett Allison
1399 Richmond - Brendon Lade
1397 Eagles - Justin Longmuir
1355 Collingwood - Matthew Lappin
1318 Essendon - Matthew Egan
1300 GWS - Chad Cornes
1286 Bulldogs - Shannon Grant
1033 Brisbane - Simon Black
1009 St Kilda - Aaron Hamill
971 Melbourne - Daniel McPherson

In order of points scored. But is he #4 because we have the best functioning forward line in the comp?

 

[Bacon8]

I actually meant their career stats, as you posted that Bickley was a HBF.

Did score more than Tyson, for example?

 

[fabs33]

False assumption. While some people have floggish and backward views, this just isn't true. People move all over Australia for work all the time.

Pav reportedly was open to returning but the Club stuffed it up. Bad example. And other that the huge cash offers by GC and GWS, Tippett and Gunston seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Tex, Danger, Sloane, Talia, Jenkins, etc etc are completely at odds with your claim.

Lynch was a Vic Metro kid and he chose the AFC.

 

[Mattrox]

I'm just pointing out that you are using broad brush strokes and suppositions to try and make a point that is so full of hyperbole that it is wide of the mark.

Pay staff more than double the going market rate? Any CEO that signs off on that is more incompetent than Trigg.

 

[fabs33]

As far as luring players here goes the biggest concern I have is that we don't have the same business and/or media opportunities outside of football that other states enjoy, which is potentially a key factor for players weighing up their options, especially high profile players.