Syria 2014 - The Year Assad "Wins"?

[MaddAdam]

its a disguised redline backtrack innit

I reckon that's the one genuine farfackle up of the Obama presidency. The red line. And he still got out of it. FFS, Clinton would have had Tomahawks raining down on Jabhat Al Isis Ibn Al Someone Al Other by now.

The Chicago man can play politics.

Who knows what's going doing on the ground now though. Saw Tweets from "respected" sources there saying that Jabhat had "liberated" Christian churches from ISIS near Aleppo and were going to turn them back over to the monks/priests.

HA!

Jabhat is the OFFICIAL Zawahiri endorsed Qaeda outfit in Syria. And they are respecting kufr sites? LOL.

Baghdadi and the ISIS crew have really screwed up.

Or more likely Jabhat learned the Anbar lesson of 06 and are taking Yank sawha cash to "fight" ISIS and then just absorb them under yet another banner and continue the fight.

Afghanistan 86/87/88 again.

s**t, now I'm posting like you.

 

[blackcat]

I reckon that's the one genuine farfackle up of the Obama presidency. The red line. And he still got out of it. FFS, Clinton would have had Tomahawks raining down on Jabhat Al Isis Ibn Al Someone Al Other by now.

The Chicago man can play politics.

or has less Kenneth Starrs on his back. Barry only has Grover Novquist (just an excuse to use best name in the US), the Koch brothers and other tea partiers agitating over Obame/nee Romney- care

 

[MaddAdam]

or has less Kenneth Starrs on his back. Barry only has Grover Novquist (just an excuse to use best name in the US), the Koch brothers and other tea partiers agitating over Obame/nee Romney- care

Nah, Obama just learned the lessons.

Clinton got caught bad in that he was the consumate old style poltimatrician who came up against a nascent talk show/cable/Internet (FreeRepublic/Drudge etc) MEDIASCAPE when his people and he weren't ready for it.

 

[vapid1]

War in 2014, on YouTube in HD.

 

[little graham]

Australains go to Syria to fight Russian tanks with American arms, supplied from Turkey by Saudi Arabia using British communications and the intel supplied by Isrealis.

War in 2014...

 

[Slax]

I think Assad has enough on his plate as it is, and the Kurds are also very anti the jihadi/takfiris.

Provided the Kurds continue there compaign against the fundamentalists and promise not to cause trouble they will get whatever they want (exluding independence).

I am still amazed at why the USA wants to get rid of Assad. We know that he is not a friend of Israel, but if they had thought about the alternative then it is by far and away better to deal with the devil you know. Syria is way to close to Europe to want to have extremists running free, but unfrotunately the USA and some of her allies fail to see the bigger picture.

Russia will ensure that Assad wins this and Turkey has realised that this is no longer a popular uprising, but one that has been taken over by the extreme Islamic fundamentalist movement. If they allowed Assad to lose they could find another Libya on their hands and I doubt anyone wants that level of unpredictability in Syria.

 

[Taylor]

Perhaps the end game is that a rabid Syria allows Israel to bolster border protection and self preservation policy. The world is drifting pro Palestinian, making the neighborhood marginally less safe but reporting that the neighborhood is far more dangerous would go a fair way towards it.

 

[Chameleon75]

Provided the Kurds continue there compaign against the fundamentalists and promise not to cause trouble they will get whatever they want (exluding independence).

I am still amazed at why the USA wants to get rid of Assad. We know that he is not a friend of Israel, but if they had thought about the alternative then it is by far and away better to deal with the devil you know. Syria is way to close to Europe to want to have extremists running free, but unfrotunately the USA and some of her allies fail to see the bigger picture.

Russia will ensure that Assad wins this and Turkey has realised that this is no longer a popular uprising, but one that has been taken over by the extreme Islamic fundamentalist movement. If they allowed Assad to lose they could find another Libya on their hands and I doubt anyone wants that level of unpredictability in Syria.

Pax Americana.

Syria is too close to Russia and not within their sphere of influence.

 

[Slax]

Pax Americana.

Syria is too close to Russia and not within their sphere of influence.

I hope that they realise that continuing to push their cause in Syria is widening the cracks in the relationship with Turkey.

 

[Chameleon75]

I hope that they realise that continuing to push their cause in Syria is widening the cracks in the relationship with Turkey.

turkey is another satellite, they might make a bit of noise for their domestic audience but ultimately the generals are pro American and the politicians know that.

 

[Slax]

turkey is another satellite, they might make a bit of noise for their domestic audience but ultimately the generals are pro American and the politicians know that.

That was not in question a decade ago, but there has been a slow shift away from the pro-American stance that existed and more towards the Generals thinking about what is actually in Turkey's best interests. The pro-American stance existed because of the Cold War when Turkey was a potential target.
Realistically would of thought an alliance with Russia would be more in Turkey's interests these days considering what is happening on their door step (plus the Russians actaully have money unlike the Americans)

 

[blackcat]

I am still amazed at why the USA wants to get rid of Assad.

the path to Iran will go thru
Iraq
Syria
Lebanon


think, shiaa to persian crescent.

Reasd some of Brookings, WINEP, PNAC papers over the past two decades. All about redefining the ME.

 

[Chameleon75]

That was not in question a decade ago, but there has been a slow shift away from the pro-American stance that existed and more towards the Generals thinking about what is actually in Turkey's best interests. The pro-American stance existed because of the Cold War when Turkey was a potential target.
Realistically would of thought an alliance with Russia would be more in Turkey's interests these days considering what is happening on their door step (plus the Russians actaully have money unlike the Americans)

There is tension in russo-turkish relations though. Turkey has been trying to deal themselves into the caspian oil reserves by bringing the former soviet states in the caucuses into their sphere of influence, they were supporters of Georgia during their conflict with russia for that reason, in turn russia support armenia.

In the past turkey has grounded russian cargo planes of armourments to syria as their official policy supports the rebels.

I think there's far to much distrust and hystorical baggage at the moment, but who knows, that might change if the US support the kurds, but I don't think thats likely.

 

[Chameleon75]

[quote="blackcat, post: 31436052, member: ]the path to Iran will go thru
Iraq
Syria
Lebanon


think, shiaa to persian crescent.

Reasd some of Brookings, WINEP, PNAC papers over the past two decades. All about redefining the ME.[/quote]

All about caspian oil and gas.

 

[little graham]

I am still amazed at why the USA wants to get rid of Assad. .

To add more to BC's post

Assad is essentially a socialist and will support nations bastardized by American money. Assad couldn't be bastardized himself, his gov have morals. An insurgency was easier than going after the main target Assad supports, Iran. Simple weakening of the rebel alliance. They knew that Iran would also be compelled to support Syria. Thus a drain there as well.

 

[blackcat]

[quote="blackcat, post: 31436052, member: ]the path to Iran will go thru
Iraq
Syria
Lebanon


think, shiaa to persian crescent.

Reasd some of Brookings, WINEP, PNAC papers over the past two decades. All about redefining the ME.

All about caspian oil and gas.[/quote]

and Persian oil, and ringfencing the sinos out of ME supply lines if conflict combusts

and these two factors you raise, and the thinkwanks and State dept in DC, their roundabout, incoherent strategy that some idiot like Pearl or Wurmser created in come neo-con acid fest trip in DC, have the stupid treasure map that says, mayfair = iraq, then syria equals other bluchip, then lebanon. just tear up sykes picot will you already

 

[blackcat]

To add more to BC's post

Assad is essentially a socialist and will support nations bastardized by American money. Assad couldn't be bastardized himself, his gov have morals. An insurgency was easier than going after the main target Assad supports, Iran. Simple weakening of the rebel alliance. They knew that Iran would also be compelled to support Syria. Thus a drain there as well.

they dont really like russias port in the mediterranean neither

that s**t does not work for dc

 

[Chameleon75]

All about caspian oil and gas.

and Persian oil, and ringfencing the sinos out of ME supply lines if conflict combusts

and these two factors you raise, and the thinkwanks and State dept in DC, their roundabout, incoherent strategy that some idiot like Pearl or Wurmser created in come neo-con acid fest trip in DC, have the stupid treasure map that says, mayfair = iraq, then syria equals other bluchip, then lebanon. just tear up sykes picot will you already[/quote]

Who coined the phrase "the great game"?

This is the sequel.

 

[blackcat]

and Persian oil, and ringfencing the sinos out of ME supply lines if conflict combusts

and these two factors you raise, and the thinkwanks and State dept in DC, their roundabout, incoherent strategy that some idiot like Pearl or Wurmser created in come neo-con acid fest trip in DC, have the stupid treasure map that says, mayfair = iraq, then syria equals other bluchip, then lebanon. just tear up sykes picot will you already

Who coined the phrase "the great game"?

This is the sequel.[/quote]


was it zbigniew brzezinksi?

i think it mighta been uncle ziggy. in his chessboard tome or before it when he was in academia

 

[Chameleon75]

Who coined the phrase "the great game"?

This is the sequel.


was it zbigniew brzezinksi?

i think it mighta been uncle ziggy. in his chessboard tome or before it when he was in academia

not sure who it was.

love the sig by the way.

 

[blackcat]

love the sig by the way.

yep, im pretty happy with that too

me and skilts mom

 

[medusala]

Obama learned lessons? Huge egg on face. Putin rang rings around him. Amateur hour. As was administration approach to Arab spring (may have been Clintons fault - who knows)

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/01/world/middleeast/syria.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

In one of the riskiest gambles of his presidency, Mr. Obama effectively dared lawmakers to either stand by him or, as he put it, allow President Bashar al-Assad of Syria to get away with murdering children with unconventional weapons

 

[blackcat]

allow President Bashar al-Assad of Syria to get away with murdering children with unconventional weapons

so congress and senate put a sanction on boeing and northropp grunman to stop selling drones to Assad yep that works fine hehehhe

 

[MaddAdam]

Obama learned lessons? Huge egg on face. Putin rang rings around him.

Putin has read his Sun Tzu = build your enemy a golden bridge away from the fight.

Obama is sane knows that getting involved in Syria at any level is suicidal.

He's doing the only thing you can do now in his position - don't back any side hard enough to win completely, especially the oppsoition.

 

[medusala]

Obama was keen to get in. Led from the front, looked around and saw no one behind him.

He and Cameron both managed to look useless on the issue.