The GST carve up

[Power Raid]

'But we propped you up since federation...'

How is it hard for WA to do forward estimates if they know today that we're only going to get back 55c in the dollar?

It's a joke that get such little return based on the fact we have high mining royalties when don't get the same benefits as other states (high payroll taxes in service industry states, higher tourism income, preferential govt. investment etc.) but it is what it is. I say support the RSPT/MRRT and hike state royalties to high heaven.

We should look to do what is best and not popular.

I would prefer a royalties for regions scheme over a royalties for canberra scheme any day.


Shouldn't GST and mining royalties be to build the country and country areas and not ploughed into buying votes?

On that basis, north west WA and the top end should be benefiting the most.

 

[dr strange]

Newcastle is the world's largest coal export port and has been exporting coal for 200 years and was one of the country's first exporter's and has been providing wealth for 200 years, the city is in a rundown derelict state and the local councils are bankrupt and will have to stop funding community programmes ,yet still we have news like this happening
http://www.theherald.com.au/story/1378408/cupboard-left-bare-for-hunter/?cs=305
The sad truth is that melb syd are 40 % of the population and regional area's will never get a share of the mining wealth

 

[Scotland]

We should look to do what is best and not popular.

I would prefer a royalties for regions scheme over a royalties for canberra scheme any day.


Shouldn't GST and mining royalties be to build the country and country areas and not ploughed into buying votes?

On that basis, north west WA and the top end should be benefiting the most.

You're right, if we're going to preferentially apportion income (bare in mind GST is one small part of federal revenue and a large component of state funding - corporate tax for example can be spent as Canberra see fit) then you could easily make a case WA deserves more rather than less GST per capita based on our population and geographic area or based on the fact that there are genuine investment opportunities here that will benefit the nation.

 

[Power Raid]

You're right, if we're going to preferentially apportion income (bare in mind GST is one small part of federal revenue and a large component of state funding - corporate tax for example can be spent as Canberra see fit) then you could easily make a case WA deserves more rather than less GST per capita based on our population and geographic area or based on the fact that there are genuine investment opportunities here that will benefit the nation.

I guess I would prefer we promote bigger towns and cities where the future opportunities are. ie Port Headland, Karratha, Darwin, Ord River and 20 or 30 other places scattered around Australia.

I do not want to see Sydney and Melbourne being pork barrelled for votes nor do I want to see these cities become mega cities surrounded by suburbs devoid of access to opportunities.

Having lived in all our capital cities, I do enjoy cities of 1 to 4m people and think the sweet spot is 1.5m to 2.5m.


Personally, I do not get any government hand outs, nor do I want them. I just want to see Australia develop and believe this should be done from the regions rather than the cities.

I also believe this should be done from the states and not canberra

 

[The_Reaper]

To be honest. Perth's reached the stage where I wouldn't want it to be much bigger.

 

[Power Raid]

To be honest. Perth's reached the stage where I wouldn't want it to be much bigger.

agree

I hope we start promoting Gerldton, Albany, Bunbury (if it doesn't become an outer suburb) and Karratha for families to live. Perth is struggling with the rapid growth and for FiFo families, would it make any difference if they flew out from Geraldton or Perth?

 

[The_Reaper]

agree

I hope we start promoting Gerldton, Albany, Bunbury (if it doesn't become an outer suburb) and Karratha for families to live. Perth is struggling with the rapid growth and for FiFo families, would it make any difference if they flew out from Geraldton or Perth?

Bunbury is nearly 200 kms away so shouldn't be an outer suburb anytime soon/

 

[Scotland]

To be honest. Perth's reached the stage where I wouldn't want it to be much bigger.

I think Perth passed that point about 10 years ago.

 

[Kwality]

and a few years on, nothing has changed:
During Senate estimates this week, WA senators lined up to hear the CGC explain how it comes to its conclusions, particularly why WA is doing so much of the heavy lifting.

They were grilled on why Tasmania is considered somewhat remote — the answer being that its "remoteness" is measured by its proximity to Melbourne, as it has no cities of more the 250,000 people.

Also why gambling revenue is not factored into its considerations — replying that it is, but the wide variety of gambling policies nationwide make measuring what "normal" revenue should look like quite difficult.

Asked if they considered the system "fair", they replied that they were public servants and could not really comment — but they thought their work met the principles of horizontal fiscal equalisation.

What is WA so riled up about anyway?
The gripe of Western Australia can best be summed up in one number: 34.

Thirty-four cents in every dollar of GST paid by Western Australia in 2017-18 will be returned to them.

NSW and Victoria will receive 88 cents and 93 cents respectively, while all other states and territories will receive more GST than what they pay.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-...challenges-for-the-federal-government/8586586

 

[Smeg Head]

and a few years on, nothing has changed:
During Senate estimates this week, WA senators lined up to hear the CGC explain how it comes to its conclusions, particularly why WA is doing so much of the heavy lifting.

They were grilled on why Tasmania is considered somewhat remote — the answer being that its "remoteness" is measured by its proximity to Melbourne, as it has no cities of more the 250,000 people.

Also why gambling revenue is not factored into its considerations — replying that it is, but the wide variety of gambling policies nationwide make measuring what "normal" revenue should look like quite difficult.

Asked if they considered the system "fair", they replied that they were public servants and could not really comment — but they thought their work met the principles of horizontal fiscal equalisation.

What is WA so riled up about anyway?
The gripe of Western Australia can best be summed up in one number: 34.

Thirty-four cents in every dollar of GST paid by Western Australia in 2017-18 will be returned to them.

NSW and Victoria will receive 88 cents and 93 cents respectively, while all other states and territories will receive more GST than what they pay.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-...challenges-for-the-federal-government/8586586

Lets face it, if people keep voting in either the coalition on the left, or the coalition on the right to the senate in particular we won't ever get change because they care about their parties first and foremost. If we had a few independents solely there to benefit WA, change or concessions would happen quickly, lest they scupper all other senate business.

 

[Power Raid]

WA should simply aim to bankrupt the state. by doing so, will force the hand of the commonwealth.

spend........and spend big recklessly, until parties come to the table. It has worked in SA.

 

[Kwality]

WA should simply aim to bankrupt the state. by doing so, will force the hand of the commonwealth.

spend........and spend big recklessly, until parties come to the table. It has worked in SA.

Silly enough to appeal, self interest will always rate over the national interest to a State government.

 

[Power Raid]

Silly enough to appeal, self interest will always rate over the national interest to a State government.

and so it should.

under WA's constitution, thus by law, they should look after the interests of the state first and foremost. In this case, fixing GST properly, would be in the interest of the state and the nation.

 

[The_Reaper]

WA should simply aim to bankrupt the state. by doing so, will force the hand of the commonwealth.

spend........and spend big recklessly, until parties come to the table. It has worked in SA.

Sink the ship with no survivors.

 

[Kwality]

I see Taswegians don't pay for an ambulance - does WA sponsor that directly or goes the GST just pay for it.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-...ance-to-avoid-tasmanian-hospital-wait/8594914
The resident of Glenorchy, in Hobart's north, said if he had driven himself to Royal Hobart Hospital, in the city centre, "I know for a fact I would have been sitting holding my hand for hours and hours on end".

If Mr Marks lived in any other state or territory in Australia he would have been billed a non-urgent callout fee worth hundreds of dollars.

But Tasmania does not apply such a fee and neither major party is inclined to introduce one.

 

[The_Reaper]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-07/former-perth-lord-mayor-plans-new-political-party/8598398

About time.

 

[Power Raid]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-07/former-perth-lord-mayor-plans-new-political-party/8598398

About time.

should be the "West" Australian party rather than Western Australia

 

[The_Reaper]

should be the "West" Australian party rather than Western Australia

I disagree. Its pedantry but imo calling it West Australia rather than Western Australia gives it some secessionist vibe that isn't really needed.

 

[masai]

I disagree. Its pedantry but imo calling it West Australia rather than Western Australia gives it some secessionist vibe that isn't really needed.

Westralia Party

 

[Kwality]

I disagree. Its pedantry but imo calling it West Australia rather than Western Australia gives it some secessionist vibe that isn't really needed.

IF the GST carve up is to be fixed there will be losers who get less than they do today & have budgeted to get into the future, and n this world where you are entitled to what you currently have, there can be no losers.

Arguably, ALL of the major parties have more to lose by fixing the inequity, they've both admitted it exists but refuse to even try & fix it. Don't hold your breath for the Right or Left of Fed politics showing any leadership ......

Love Charlie Hopkins idea but 2 x dedicated Senators will not do the job IMHO.

 

[Ripper]

Arguably, ALL of the major parties have more to lose by fixing the inequity, they've both admitted it exists but refuse to even try & fix it. Don't hold your breath for the Right or Left of Fed politics showing any leadership ......

Yep , anyone in WA who votes for either major party in the senate deserves what they (don't get) . Vote Brendan Grylss and a couple of offsiders in and it will be fixed.

He has form in getting money back to where it came from.

 

[Kwality]

Premier Mark McGowan, in Tasmania for his first Council of Australian Governments meeting today, welcomed BHP’s intervention. He said he would use COAG to argue the national importance of making the GST carve-up fairer.

“The entirety of our iron royalties have been redistributed to other States and Territories, which means there’s just no incentive for us to develop more iron ore mines,” he said.

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/bhps-gst-push-ng-b88501461z

Yet earlier this week we see the Qld senator offering this tripe:
Referring to suggestions the Federal Government could provide a $1 billion loan to help get the Adani coal project in Queensland off the ground, Mr Johnston also questioned why the Government would need to support a supposedly economically viable project.

“Again, Matt (Canavan) is missing the point,” he said.

“If the Government is tipping taxpayers money into viable resources projects, WA should get in the queue.”

Mr Johnston’s comments follow claims by Mr Canavan at yesterday’s annual AMEC conference in Perth that it was inconsistent for the WA Government to argue for a greater share of GST revenue while maintaining a Statewide ban on uranium mining and introducing a fracking ban across the South West.

The State Government has argued that the existing so-called horizontal fiscal equalisation system for the GST carve-up encouraged some States not to exploit their natural resources.

 

[Power Raid]

I disagree. Its pedantry but imo calling it West Australia rather than Western Australia gives it some secessionist vibe that isn't really needed.

I'd vote to secede

There are better ways to move forward than nations. Imagine if the largest nation was only 10-20m in size.....no war!

 

[Kwality]

With WA contributing 35% of exports & only 13% of imports, it is THE cash cow.

http://dfat.gov.au/about-us/publica...lias-trade-by-state-and-territory-2015-16.pdf

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

Yep , anyone in WA who votes for either major party in the senate deserves what they (don't get) . Vote Brendan Grylss and a couple of offsiders in and it will be fixed.

He has form in getting money back to where it came from.

He proposed a $5 per tonne levy / tax on iron ore.

The voters and other political parties collectively s**t themselves. The voters of WA had a chance and blew it. As if BHP, RIO, FMG etc would just walk away from the billions that they've invested and the billions upon billions still left in the ground.

Last month, 80,000,000 tonnes of iron ore were exported from WA. At $5 per tonne, that's $400,000,000 for the month that's potentially gone begging.