WA Trading hours regulations: Absolute Joke.

[GeorgeGrljusich]

Entering the 21st Century.

You can thank people like me who work in the Resource industry for helping you to get the stuff out of the ground that provides you with the lifestyle you have.

This may come as a shock to you but the days of workers being employed Monday to friday 9-5 are gone. I lost count of the times of would go away offshore to work, get back late after being away for 1-2 months and finding everything shut-not a supermarket to be seen that was open to actually get something to eat, or to re-stock my fridge. Hell ordering some furniture requires you to Wait Awhile whilst it was delievered from interstate-or the dreaded Basil Zemphilus(sp) football show WTF!!

The Basil Zemphilus barb is indefensible. I simply have no rebuttal.
As for the rest...the market will force the change eventually. However, I am not up in arms about a referendum apparently making us look backward. Frankly, I couldn't care less.
And is the need to stock up your fridge on the very night of your return so vital? Surely that is what that culinary delight in MacDonalds was created for.
Big Mac, chips and a coke.
Sleep and shop the following day.

 

[WCEforeverman]

Why are anti extended trading hours fans still hiding behind the referendum?

The questions were flawed.

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

Why are anti extended trading hours fans still hiding behind the referendum?

The questions were flawed.

How so?

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Why are anti extended trading hours fans still hiding behind the referendum?

The questions were flawed.

Referendums other such trivial issues are a sign of weak governance. I'd be extremely annoyed if my government held referendum's like the ones the WA government's have.

Hell i wouldn't put it past a lot of people to have just voted no because they thought the politicians were wasting their time.

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

Here are the questions. Seem pretty clear to me.

Question 1 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade until 9 pm Monday to Friday?

Question 2 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade for 6 hours on Sunday?

http://www.waec.wa.gov.au/elections...details/2005_Retail_Trading_Hours_Referendum/

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Here are the questions. Seem pretty clear to me.

Question 1 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade until 9 pm Monday to Friday?

Question 2 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade for 6 hours on Sunday?

http://www.waec.wa.gov.au/elections...details/2005_Retail_Trading_Hours_Referendum/

Both questions should have included "If they want to" so as not to give an impression it would be mandatory. And just cause someone don't think they would benefit doesn't mean that they are actually against it. They are pretty poor questions.

Something simpler like "Should shops be able to open until 9pm Monday to Friday if they want to?" would have been better, the people aren't qualified to know whether or not it will benefit the community.

Also both questions should never have been asked they are not the sort of thing that Referendums should be called on in the first place.

 

[Scotland]

And is the need to stock up your fridge on the very night of your return so vital? Surely that is what that culinary delight in MacDonalds was created for.
Big Mac, chips and a coke.
Sleep and shop the following day.

Ever worked in the NW of WA then flown back to Perth?

1jasonoz has a point. If I did a 'standard' 6-6 day on site then flew home, after airport buggering around, waiting for one of the city's 3 taxis then a 20 minute ride home I'd be lucky to make it home by 8pm, which is the closing time of my local IGA. Hardly unreasonable that I might want to pick up a few groceries at that time, and it's common to get back later than that. If trading restrictions weren't in place I reckon there would be a
market for a 24 hour supermarket around the airport area e.g. Redcliffe.

I'm still waiting for a 'no' campaigner to explain to me the benefits of the existing preferential legislation. Bunnings can open, Coles can't. Why?

 

[WCEforeverman]

Here are the questions. Seem pretty clear to me.

Question 1 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade until 9 pm Monday to Friday?

Question 2 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade for 6 hours on Sunday?

http://www.waec.wa.gov.au/elections...details/2005_Retail_Trading_Hours_Referendum/

Clear as mud.

 

[WCEforeverman]

Does everyone remember that right after the referendum, all the independant grocery stores (dewsons ect.) banded together to become IGA branded?

 

[Ice-Wolf]

Ever worked in the NW of WA then flown back to Perth?

1jasonoz has a point. If I did a 'standard' 6-6 day on site then flew home, after airport buggering around, waiting for one of the city's 3 taxis then a 20 minute ride home I'd be lucky to make it home by 8pm, which is the closing time of my local IGA. Hardly unreasonable that I might want to pick up a few groceries at that time, and it's common to get back later than that. If trading restrictions weren't in place I reckon there would be a
market for a 24 hour supermarket around the airport area e.g. Redcliffe.

I'm still waiting for a 'no' campaigner to explain to me the benefits of the existing preferential legislation. Bunnings can open, Coles can't. Why?

Wesfarmers probably wouldn't be happy about that seeing as the own Coles now.

 

[1jasonoz]

Ever worked in the NW of WA then flown back to Perth?
1jasonoz has a point. If I did a 'standard' 6-6 day on site then flew home, after airport buggering around, waiting for one of the city's 3 taxis then a 20 minute ride home I'd be lucky to make it home by 8pm, which is the closing time of my local IGA. Hardly unreasonable that I might want to pick up a few groceries at that time, and it's common to get back later than that. If trading restrictions weren't in place I reckon there would be a
market for a 24 hour supermarket around the airport area e.g. Redcliffe.

I'm still waiting for a 'no' campaigner to explain to me the benefits of the existing preferential legislation. Bunnings can open, Coles can't. Why?

Yep i used to empty my fridge of pretty much anything perishable (due to losing power in my place when i was away once) when i would fly out. I used to get home sometimes late on a saturday night, but would have to wait till monday morning (don't mention public holidays either) to actually get access to fresh food that wasn't overpriced, barely fresh, and barely edible. Lost count of the times i would go to the local IGA and find the remants of so called fresh fruit and veggies sitting in almost emtpy baskets and when i would ask the IGA rep when their new stores would arrive-"oh Monday Mornings as we don't get weekend delieveries" FFS!

Try telling expats working in WA having to work around their Corporate HQ's hours in say Europe (plus WA hours) that they can't go shopping for food outside of the standard 9-5 except at an IGA and they laugh their heads off!

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

Ever worked in the NW of WA then flown back to Perth?

1jasonoz has a point. If I did a 'standard' 6-6 day on site then flew home, after airport buggering around, waiting for one of the city's 3 taxis then a 20 minute ride home I'd be lucky to make it home by 8pm, which is the closing time of my local IGA. Hardly unreasonable that I might want to pick up a few groceries at that time, and it's common to get back later than that. If trading restrictions weren't in place I reckon there would be a
market for a 24 hour supermarket around the airport area e.g. Redcliffe.

I'm still waiting for a 'no' campaigner to explain to me the benefits of the existing preferential legislation. Bunnings can open, Coles can't. Why?

Yes, I have worked extensively in the NW and have never had a problem.
Maybe I am better organised and make sure that I have the toilet rolls and toothpaste in the cupboard and a couple of pre-prepard meals in the freezer BEFORE I leave. The beer fridge is always stocked. Always.
Honestly, I couldn't give two hoots if we had 24 hour trading or not. It is the perception that it makes us look backward because we didn't follow an eastern states lead that grates on me a little.

 

[1jasonoz]

Yes, I have worked extensively in the NW and have never had a problem.
Maybe I am better organised and make sure that I have the toilet rolls and toothpaste in the cupboard and a couple of pre-prepard meals in the freezer BEFORE I leave. The beer fridge is always stocked. Always.
Honestly, I couldn't give two hoots if we had 24 hour trading or not. It is the perception that it makes us look backward because we didn't follow an eastern states lead that grates on me a little.

Its not an eastern state lead, its shock horror an around the world 21st Century sort of concept-the days of 9-5 work is long gone!!

 

[Clay Davis]

If there was ever a part of Australia that truly lived up to this sentence, it's WA:

"[Western] Australia is a lucky country, run by second-rate people who share its luck."

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

Its not an eastern state lead, its shock horror an around the world 21st Century sort of concept-the days of 9-5 work is long gone!!

Accepted. But it was the eastern states who took it and ran with it and now deride us for not following them.
Daylight saving is another world phenomenon which we jacked up about, and quite rightly so.
Maybe it is the dream of secession that still runs strongly through our veins?

 

[Scotland]

Yes, I have worked extensively in the NW and have never had a problem.
Maybe I am better organised and make sure that I have the toilet rolls and toothpaste in the cupboard and a couple of pre-prepard meals in the freezer BEFORE I leave. The beer fridge is always stocked. Always.

Good for you. I'll assume you have no need for anything fresh and never lose power.

Honestly, I couldn't give two hoots if we had 24 hour trading or not. It is the perception that it makes us look backward because we didn't follow an eastern states lead that grates on me a little.

We don't look backwards because we don't have things the Eastern States have, we look backwards because the justifications as to why we don't have certain things (which the Eastern Sates have) are utterly laughable.

We don't have the population.
We don't have the same shopping culture.
Extended trading is bad for small business.
Extended trading is bad for families.
Extended trading is bad for competition.

What grates the mildly progressive in WA is the narrow-minded section of society who oppose things the Eastern States have because the Eastern States have them.

If Melbourne and Sydney had trading restricted to 9-5 Monday to Friday and Colin Barnett introduced extended trading to Perth as a 'new and exciting innovation' would you still oppose it?

Here's a Qld article from 2008 about Coles & Woollies applying for 6am-12am trading in a tourist precint of the Gold Coast.

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,24241608-952,00.html

Deregulated trading, allowing retailers to remain open until 9pm and on Sundays, was introduced in Queensland in 1994.

Mr Black said the current trading regime, which allows supermarkets to trade from 8am until 9pm Monday to Friday, 8.30am to 5.30pm on Saturdays and 9am to 6pm on Sundays, forced tourists to use convenience stores with smaller ranges and higher prices.

So, what we call extended trading they've had for 15 years and "small business" continues to thrive. The sky didn't fall in after all.

Replace 'tourists' with 'everyone' and delete 20 hours a week of available shopping hours and you're describing Perth.

Surfers Paradise IGA supermarket owner Rick Joubran said that extended trading hours would be a disaster for his and other small businesses.

His store is only about 100m from Woolworths Surfers Paradise and opens from 6am to midnight to cash in on after-hours trade.

"This will kill us and many of the other convenience stores if it gets up because Coles and Woolies are just too big for us - we only survive now on their crumbs," he said.

There's a common drum beating down at IGA HQ.

If you 'won't survive' in the face of competition who sell the same stuff bought from the same suppliers in similar volumes then the problem lies with your business model.

Again I ask, where is the benefit in preferential legislation which benefits a conglomerate who 'can't' afford to compete with the expensive and profitable Coles and Woolworths?

There is a shopping centre I know of in the South East of Perth which has a Coles and an IGA. The centre is open standard Perth shopping hours and due to the building layout extended trading for IGA is not possible, yet this IGA store thrives. Why? Because they tailor their range of and appropriately price their products to suit their customer base.

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

Good for you. I'll assume you have no need for anything fresh and never lose power.

I do indeed love my fresh food. I can, however, survive one night without it.

We don't look backwards because we don't have things the Eastern States have, we look backwards because the justifications as to why we don't have certain things (which the Eastern Sates have) are utterly laughable.

Fair point.
However the people did speak on this subject and there is very little that you and I can do about it.
As I have stated before, the market will drive the change, not whining people. It is already happening...

If Melbourne and Sydney had trading restricted to 9-5 Monday to Friday and Colin Barnett introduced extended trading to Perth as a 'new and exciting innovation' would you still oppose it?

I don't oppose it. Never said I did. I am just not that overly concerned with it.
The market is making the changes covertly by pressuring the government into declaring "tourist precincts. Joondalup a tourist precinct? Oh please.

 

[jerry springer]

Dont come back, we dont want extra trading hours , we dont need them, and some shops/most markets are open on sundays anyway.

I am no christian but who wants to work on a sunday, it should be a day to relax, spend with family etc.

.

did you even read my post?or were you to busy standing on your soapbox being a flog dictating to other people how to live their life?

I like working a extra day a week(sat i play footy)so I can play my morgage off quicker,seems an entirely sensible thing I choose to do.In the past ive delivered pizzas on weeknights,but If I work at coles/woollies/K-mart on a sunday stacking shelves I can get penalty rates and do a good 8-10 hour shift and get a extra $200 bucks in the pocket

 

[Scotland]

I do indeed love my fresh food. I can, however, survive one night without it.

And if you arrive at 5.05pm on a Saturday? Happy to track down a 'little guy' or wait until Monday for some milk?

Fair point.
However the people did speak on this subject and there is very little that you and I can do about it.
As I have stated before, the market will drive the change, not whining people. It is already happening...

The people are idiots, and when presented with more than a handful of syllables idiots will always vote to maintain the status quo.

You could have asked 'Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were restricted to allow a conglomerate to monopolise weeknight and weekend trading?' and you would have got a resounding no, yet that that is what the no camp voted to retain...

The 'market' is not driving anything. Change is being driven by political forces. Barney no doubt has advisors telling him his stance represents public opinion and is being lobbied by business groups, while Labor oppose his position for the sake of opposition and Gryllth... well if you can work out his motives for opposing something which does not affect rural areas well good luck to you.

I don't oppose it. Never said I did. I am just not that overly concerned with it.
The market is making the changes covertly by pressuring the government into declaring "tourist precincts. Joondalup a tourist precinct? Oh please.

If you are not overly concerned with it, why go on an internet forum to discuss it?

Tourist precincts are a shemozzle. Scarborough? Cottesloe? Don't tourists go there?

 

[Dont be a lemon]

Gryllth... well if you can work out his motives for opposing something which does not affect rural areas well good luck to you.

Probably IGA party donations.

 

[Play by Numbers]

Here are the questions. Seem pretty clear to me.

Question 1 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade until 9 pm Monday to Friday?

Question 2 Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were extended to allow general retail shops to trade for 6 hours on Sunday?

http://www.waec.wa.gov.au/elections...details/2005_Retail_Trading_Hours_Referendum/

The questions are worded in a similar fashion as well.

Most countries who hold referendums now avoid dual or multi question ballots. This due to the separability problem, where people were unable or would not separate the two issues.

If voting no to daylight savings it is likely that many will also vote no to extended trading simply because they now associate the two.

 

[Scotland]

Probably IGA party donations.

But... but IGA stores are small businesses?

Surely they couldn't be the party's 4th biggest donor? That's some mob called Metcash.....

 

[GeorgeGrljusich]

And if you arrive at 5.05pm on a Saturday? Happy to track down a 'little guy' or wait until Monday for some milk?

Probably just get it at my local 24hr Service station after I fill the Subaru up with diesel.
Lucky that we got rid of that roster system, or I would be screwed.
And is tracking down a "little guy" such a chore? Or don't you know your local area very well?

The people are idiots, and when presented with more than a handful of syllables idiots will always vote to maintain the status quo.

You could have asked 'Do you believe that the Western Australian community would benefit if trading hours in the Perth Metropolitan Area were restricted to allow a conglomerate to monopolise weeknight and weekend trading?' and you would have got a resounding no, yet that that is what the no camp voted to retain...

The 'market' is not driving anything. Change is being driven by political forces. Barney no doubt has advisors telling him his stance represents public opinion and is being lobbied by business groups, while Labor oppose his position for the sake of opposition and Gryllth... well if you can work out his motives for opposing something which does not affect rural areas well good luck to you.

You underestimate the political clout that business lobbyists have on policy direction.
They are driving this and Barnett is the sock puppet desperately trying to look in touch with public opinion. And good luck to them.
Agree on Brendan.

If you are not overly concerned with it, why go on an internet forum to discuss it?

Tourist precincts are a shemozzle. Scarborough? Cottesloe? Don't tourists go there?

Initially, (I think but couldn't be bothered looking back), because this whole wait a while thing is pretty stale and irrelevant in the bigger picture.
But, to be honest, I have never had a problem sourcing things on a weekend. ( I will grant you that after 9pm is a different story). I just don't get the vitriol and exhaustive argument over shopping schedules.
Organise your self a bit better, think ahead and stop bloody moaning about such a trivial matter.


Re shopping precincts..what's next? Koondoola?

 

[fabulousphil]

did you even read my post?or were you to busy standing on your soapbox being a flog dictating to other people how to live their life?

I like working a extra day a week(sat i play footy)so I can play my morgage off quicker,seems an entirely sensible thing I choose to do.In the past ive delivered pizzas on weeknights,but If I work at coles/woollies/K-mart on a sunday stacking shelves I can get penalty rates and do a good 8-10 hour shift and get a extra $200 bucks in the pocket

Plenty of work here on sunday, plenty of shops open as well, we dont need any more shops open.

Thank you.

 

[Rob]

Plenty of work here on sunday, plenty of shops open as well, we dont need any more shops open.

Thank you.

Over Christmas, I had a conversation with one of my family members who was just like you. She was of the opinion that 'we' didn't need extended trading and how terrible it's going to be.

I asked her if she would prefer to go back to rostered petrol stations, noon closures on Saturday and compulsory closures of all shops at 5pm.
Funnily enough, she wasn't opposed to *those* changes. Just this one.

Eventually the market will be deregulated and people like you will look back in a couple of years and wonder why you gave a shit. What stands WA people apart from a lot of the rest of the western world is their stern resistance to any change - it doesn't matter what it is. Eventually, after an overly extended delay, WA catches up with the rest of the country and the population moves on to the next potential change to whinge about.