Our 2007 Draft Performance...

[adagio]

Masten, Ebert, Notte, Selwood.

On face value it doesn't seem too flash. All of them have attracted criticism around here, somewhat unfairly IMO.

Now all of them have a long way to go and they themselves will be the first to admit it.

But the expectations on these guys, still so early on in their careers is unreasonable.

I can see where it comes from - these kids were all relatively high draft picks, and they were the first pool of draftees handed the responsibility of taking us back to the top, right after a golden era of success, for one of the proudest clubs with the most spoiled supporter bases in the country.

Not to mention, two of them came to the club as a result of Judd leaving, possibly the most talented player in the last decade. Supporters, unrealistically, wanted an equal return.

The reality is that 2007 was not a strong draft. Why do you think we pulled out after pick #22? A lot of the players taken in the 1st round wouldn't have been there in 2008. We did the best we could with the picks we had. If you look at Burgan's phantom draft from that year, you'll recall just how well we did on the day and how we actually haven't fared too badly since - many other high picks, for various reasons, have done virtually nothing:

http://www.afl.com.au/Season2007/Ne...gArticle/tabid/8123/Default.aspx?newsId=53419


Masten will at the least be a solid, B+, high accumulator of the footy in time. People underestimate the impact injury has had on his career to date. Ebert and Selwood have both been outstanding for 3rd year players in 2010, and will continue to improve. If the punt on Notte comes off - and we'll have to wait another 2-3 years to find this out - we've really done outstandingly well out of this draft.

 

[Scotland]

23. Pears
27. Otten
40. Mayne

Yeah, fairly slim pickings after our first 4 picks.

However, looking at the top 22 the guys we selected don't look that great.

If someone said you could have:

3. Rioli
13. Grimes
20. Pears
22. Otten

...would you say no?

Hindsight is obviously wonderful, etc.

 

[kane249]

Notte was always going to be a long-term prospect, but his progress has been frustrating.

Ebert and Masten have been the 2 disappointments/frustrations to date for mine. Masten is constantly injured and when he has been there he's been played out of position. He's shown what he's capable of with some scintillating kicks, but then a moment later he will dish out a dodgy handpass or miss a target by foot and you will get frustrated again. Ebert runs all day and accumulates a lot of the ball, but Jesus Christ his disposal and decision making are sub-standard. Both are now coming into their 4th seasons and really need to lift their consistency and tighten up their disposal a heck of a lot if they want long careers in the game.

Scott Selwood has easily been the standout thus far. Has established himself as probably our number 1 run with player and has done some good jobs for us this year. Disposal is passable, especially compared to others in the team and was one of the shining lights in what was an others dull year for the club.

 

[r dub 19]

I can honestly see scooter reaching joels level. Ebert's work rate is fantastic but his skills, speed and decision making are average- same applies to masten minus work rate.

 

[Patron]

We didnt do great in this draft but not as bad as some think. Masten could still turn out to be one of the best few pure mids in this draft.
ebert wasnt too bad a pick. if he learns how to kick it will end up a good pick. Selwood is just about the perfect pick at 22. Notte has been dissapointing that far. We will know a lot lot more by the end of next year.
Worst case scenario
Masten gets a full preseason plays the first 15 odd games on ball but plays terribly bad disposal, bad impact doesnt rack up big numbers then gets dropped or injured. proving he is an injury prone spud.
Ebert continues to kick like ass clown.
Notte gets dropped again to reserves and then delisted
Selwood only plays a tagger

Best case
Masten plays on ball and racks up frequent big numbers with high efficiency
ebert learns how to kick
Notte breaks through for a few afl games
selwood continues to play as an attacking mid and starts to consistently rack up 20/30 possie games

Next year is make or break for this draft.

 

[Reminiscence]

Masten - Shown flashes of potential, no consistency
Ebert - Butcher of the ball, fix his disposal and he'll be far far better
Notte - Slow development and hasn't shown much
Selwood - Bright shining light in this lousy ass season. Close to, if not already surpassed Adam and heading towards Joel's level.

 

[wceblog]

I'm going to give it another 2-3 seasons before I cast any judgment on the 2007 crop - by then they all should've got sufficient pre-seasons and experience.

Scooter, Notte and Ebert were all drafted as bottom age players in their pool (all were only one month off being ineligible for the 2007 draft) and Masten was drafted with O.P (Ebert might've been too?).

Ebert's kicking was fine (not elite but no concerns) when we drafted him, pace was considered average for a midfielder.

Scotland, I wouldn't particularly want Otten ahead of Scooter or Grimes above Ebert.

 

[sTeeL]

Its because people on here are too harsh on our picks. For their selected position, both Selwood and Ebert have excelled so far in their early career and if Eberts kicking was 15% higher DE, he would be considered a damn fine pickup.

Masten has had standout games which people blatantly forget, and just a couple of injuries have made him appear worse than he is. I believe also, that due to his injuries, he was being played out of the HFF/FP rather than the middle which contributed to poor stats.

Notte is still a fair way off but was drafted as a long term prospect and will hit his 4th AFL preseason this coming year so still has a year or two left to show some worth.

Out of that list, I would probably only take Grimes, and Rioli had enough trouble moving to Melbourne, you really wouldnt want to put him through that stress again of moving to WA. Don't think he would have ever been in contention for our pick.

 

[lewigie]

Judd won a brownlow in his 4th year, so THEY BETTER BLOODY STEP UP NEXT YEAR!

 

[WCE_phil]

Judd won a brownlow in his 4th year, so THEY BETTER BLOODY STEP UP NEXT YEAR!

Yeah and he was likened to jesus for doing so. He ended up turning into judas though didnt he.

 

[Prem87]

Its because people on here are too harsh on our picks. For their selected position, both Selwood and Ebert have excelled so far in their early career and if Eberts kicking was 15% higher DE, he would be considered a damn fine pickup.

Masten has had standout games which people blatantly forget, and just a couple of injuries have made him appear worse than he is. I believe also, that due to his injuries, he was being played out of the HFF/FP rather than the middle which contributed to poor stats.

Notte is still a fair way off but was drafted as a long term prospect and will hit his 4th AFL preseason this coming year so still has a year or two left to show some worth.

Out of that list, I would probably only take Grimes, and Rioli had enough trouble moving to Melbourne, you really wouldnt want to put him through that stress again of moving to WA. Don't think he would have ever been in contention for our pick.

He would, but he hasn't improved at all since being drafted..he seems to have become worse. He needs a big preseason of skills and decision making.

I'm still a big fan of Masten, at worst I think he will end up the KCornes type player accumulator who will be a bit more damaging/influential by foot. Injuries have just stopped him from playing consistent footy.

 

[basalt]

Expectations have cruelled them

 

[Marlin01]

He would, but he hasn't improved at all since being drafted..he seems to have become worse. He needs a big preseason of skills and decision making.

Ebert has had a few games, this season, in which his disposal has been good. These games seem to be the games where he gets 15 or so possessions, rather than the 20+ possession games.

There's two possible explanations for this IMO. Firstly, when you use the ball well, you tend not to get a "second-go" possession, as per the hot potato handballs we've seen.

Alternatively, it could be when he's playing a less central role and he doesn't have to run so much, he's not as exhausted when he goes to use the ball, so he uses it well.

I'm not sure which it is.

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

2007 was a horrible draft and I think we did the best of a bad situation. Masten and Ebert were both very highly rated at the time (both state captains if I remember correctly), Selwood ... is a Selwood and Notte was always going to take years to develop. And was also rated very highly.

 

[swannies]

For those ready to slit their wrists at our 207 draft just remember that the Eagles have a long way to go to outdo a single blunder of my Redskins, in the NFL.

We've paid $32M out so far for Fatty Haynesworth, who is a fair player, it's got to be said. But after a year he wanted out and now it looks like we may trade him back to his original team, for a downgrade in original draft picks given up for him. The dockers, in their heyday couldn't have botched a trade/draft like this! Just as well Snyder has bucket loads of money but we're baulking at the second draft pick at present. FFS, just wear the egg on face and get it over and done with!

 

[75Cardies]

As much as scott has improved to say he is reaching joel levels is a bit far fetched. Until he starts to get a tag rather than tagging and starts to damage teams rather than limit the damage of other teams, he cannot be considered in same class as joel. however game is about opinions, mine is just that. and we can only hope.

Maybe he just keeps working to overtake adam

Ebert like selwood has grit for a fight and will work all day for you, something that cannot be coached. This is invaluable.

Masten has a lot of question marks still, but until he is played in the position in which he was drafted we cannot judge on whether he is sussessful or not. players mature at different stages.

stats % only tell a samall part of the story. Some guys have it some guys don't.

Don't forget that alot of WCE disposals in last 3 years have been in struggling teams against bigger bodies. We can only improve...and if not just start again.

As for Notte he was always considered long term and too early to judge but he'd want to start showing more signs as the game will pass him quicker than gaspar and macdougal.

 

[Be Aggressive]

I don't think there was any real problem with the picks. They were all highly rated juniors. All three of Ebert, Masten and Selwood have shown the ability to dominate a game early in their career, but have never been able to display this form consistently.

These young guys have also had to battle it out in a team with very few older leaders in top form. That makes it very hard to step in and perform. I know they aren't from the same draft, but I don't think someone like Mitch Duncan or Steele Sidebottom would have looked as good playing for us. And can you imagine the outrage if we took Jetta and he kicked 19 consecutive behinds for us!? They would have had brilliant moments but with so much workload put on their shoulders, they too would have struggled to be consistent. Our young blokes are doing it tough at the moment, but they are far from busts.

Things can turn around very quickly - but it needs the right environment. You need your best and/or most experienced players playing at their peak, with the young guys providing the icing on the cake. Look at these teams who all out performed pre-season predictions and look at the performances of their established players:

Team : Players in AA Squad of 40.
Fremantle: Sandilands, Mundy, Pavlich.
Sydney: Goodes, Malceski, Mumford.
Melbourne: Green, Jamar, Frawley.
North Melbourne: Harvey, Swallow, Rawlings.

These players make it so much easier for kids like Jack, Hannebery, Hill, Fyfe, Bastinac, Scully, Grimes, Trengove etc to look good. The kids aren't the ones having to do all the work.

Now look at the output of our best (previous AA players):

Kerr: 4 games.
Glass: 8 games - never looked right in most of those either.
Cox: 22 games - Underdone for half the year. Overall output was OK, nowhere near best (not in top 5 ruckmen this year).

Le Cras was our only AA nomination. He was the shining light but it's hard to lead from the front in the forward pocket.

If these olders guys put it together next year (along with Embley, Priddis, Waters, Selwood etc) it will make it so much easier for the kids to stand up around them and play exceptional footy. I don't expect a return to AA for Glass, Cox and Embley at this stage, but if they at least have good years by their standards then the likes of Kerr, LeCras, Hurn, Kennedy and Waters should be able to contend for AA selection. Meanwhile, the likes of Masten, Swift, Ebert and Shuey are left to step their game up with a more realistic workload. tl;dr

 

[BOND 007]

Dangerfield went #10 & IMO if you fast forward 4 years - he will be the standout of the draft.

Realistically Masten has shown nothing to suggest he is ever going to be anything more than a B grade player. Clubs cannot afford to finish where they do to "earn" that high a pick and only get from it a B grade player.
Ebert looks like he will be a solid reliable player and Selwood's performances late this year has changed my mind about him as I originally thought he was another honest trier with very few tricks. Notte was no where and has seemed to go backwards if thats possible.

Teams expect a return on their 3yr investments especially high 1st round picks and when you look at the poorly performing teams, invariably its these players that arent performing as expected. i.e. Masten @ WC and Myers @ Ess

Right now - WC's 2007 picks have underperformed and I would think 2011 would be a watershed for a couple.

 

[Wirra for PM]

I don't know that we drafted poorly, but it sure sucks for us that a key draft in terms of our side's future prospects was fairly weak. Masten etc may prove to be solid players - personally I think Masten will become very good - but IMO none of them is going to be top notch, and it's that class that wins you premierships.

We need a couple of players of the Martin, Scully, Hill ilk. We didn't get one in 2007 - jury is still out on our 08/09 draftees, but there are some prospects there - and with the drafts depleted over the next couple of years we may struggle to get one then as well.

 

[adagio]

I don't know that we drafted poorly, but it sure sucks for us that a key draft in terms of our side's future prospects was fairly week. Masten etc may prove to be solid players - personally I think Masten will become very good - but IMO none of them is going to be top notch, and it's that class that wins you premierships.

We need a couple of players of the Martin, Scully, Hill ilk. We didn't get one in 2007 - jury is still out on our 08/09 draftees, but there are some prospects there - and with the drafts depleted over the next couple of years we may struggle to get one then as well.

Yep. Unfortunately Judd left in the year of a weak draft pool. If he'd gone in 2006 we might have got Joel Selwood out of it.

 

[Santa Claus]

Unfortunately Scott Selwood isn't even qualified to lace up his brother Joels boots, but he is a 5 out of 10 'solid' player, perhaps in the last 6 picked each week, but he will continue to be solid for us. I still think we need to throw Cox or Kerr out there, Kerr has given us nothing at all for 3 years, lets go fishing with him, maybe Collingwood would give us something?

 

[Bestbird]

Dangerfield went #10 & IMO if you fast forward 4 years - he will be the standout of the draft.

Realistically Masten has shown nothing to suggest he is ever going to be anything more than a B grade player. Clubs cannot afford to finish where they do to "earn" that high a pick and only get from it a B grade player.
Ebert looks like he will be a solid reliable player and Selwood's performances late this year has changed my mind about him as I originally thought he was another honest trier with very few tricks. Notte was no where and has seemed to go backwards if thats possible.

Teams expect a return on their 3yr investments especially high 1st round picks and when you look at the poorly performing teams, invariably its these players that arent performing as expected. i.e. Masten @ WC and Myers @ Ess

Right now - WC's 2007 picks have underperformed and I would think 2011 would be a watershed for a couple.

Still don't get the big wraps on Dangerfield, looks to be a good player but his output in games isn't much greater than any of our midfield draft picks at the moment.

He is a better half forward than Masten though

 

[Geoffe_Miles]

Not expecting these guys to be dominating at this stage but most guys who go on to be good players are showing hints/signs of their talent and what is to come by the 50 game mark, which Masten and Ebert are nearly at, and so far, with these two the signs are not good.

Selwood looks like he will be a decent player. Haven't seen much of Notte but getting dropped to te WAFL ressies as an AFL listed player and early draft pick is ominous.

I am nearly at the stage of writing off Ebert. I will give one more season but i have a feeling he will be another Farren Ray/Adam Fiora and the only question is how many games and years do we waste investing in him before cutting our losses.

Masten could become a solid B grader. Will never be an A grader with that disposal. And, frankly, he may not even get to B grade if his attitude doesn't improve. The arrogance he displays off field is also on display on the field and Worsfold, weak coach and leader that he is, has done nothing to sort him out. He should have been hauled in for a chat by now and had some of the over confidence and arrogance verbally bashed out of him by the coach. What do you think a strong leader of men like say Ian Chapell would do if Chris Masten had just broken into the Australian cricket team? Does anybody think he would be allowed to play and carry on and show the poor mind set and mental attitude that he does at our club in that environment?

We won't know for sure about these guys untill the Worsfold era is over and we get a proper development program in place and some genuine leadership within the club.

 

[paran]

For those ready to slit their wrists at our 207 draft just remember that the Eagles have a long way to go to outdo a single blunder of my Redskins, in the NFL.

We've paid $32M out so far for Fatty Haynesworth, who is a fair player, it's got to be said. But after a year he wanted out and now it looks like we may trade him back to his original team, for a downgrade in original draft picks given up for him. The dockers, in their heyday couldn't have botched a trade/draft like this! Just as well Snyder has bucket loads of money but we're baulking at the second draft pick at present. FFS, just wear the egg on face and get it over and done with!

Bl00dy hell, another 'Skins fan! Dropped my jaw there swannies - hadn't heard the latest news on the trade! Don't think we gave up any picks for AH though. This stupid pi$$ing contest with Shanahan and change in D just seems to be out of proportion. Start fining the guy for failing tests, make meetings, etc, and get him to try defend himself - make it so miserable he either sucks it up or quits.
*EDIT: looks like an almost completely fabricated piece of news from ESPN - apparently the Titans contacted the Skins and were given a ridiculous asking price and said no thanks - that's it. Story is still making the rounds though... gotta love the media and the "news".


As for our 07 draft, Masto needs a big kick up the but and more luck with injuries, Ebert needs to add more weight and sturdiness, Notte needs a LOT of bulk and games at FF/CHF/HFF where he's the first option (not happening at Swans), and Scooter is coming on perfectly. not sure what happened to Ebert, but I think there has been a major shift in our training regime, and he hasn't physically developed as needed - in fact, he seems weaker. He needs a strong preseason to raise his fitness base, another 5-10kg's of muscle (esp in the legs), and that'll hold hi in good stead for his disposal. He almost looks to drained when disposing, and loses his focus when dropping the ball.

 

[BOND 007]

I don't know that we drafted poorly, but it sure sucks for us that a key draft in terms of our side's future prospects was fairly week. Masten etc may prove to be solid players - personally I think Masten will become very good - but IMO none of them is going to be top notch, and it's that class that wins you premierships.

We need a couple of players of the Martin, Scully, Hill ilk. We didn't get one in 2007 - jury is still out on our 08/09 draftees, but there are some prospects there - and with the drafts depleted over the next couple of years we may struggle to get one then as well.

the problem was the finish to the end of 2009 - where WC finished artificially high for the quality of the squad and 2010 bought them back to the correct positioning.

For those that are interested - a couple of months ago I spent time with one of Trevor Woodhouses right hand men. I happen to know this guy pretty well as he has worked with my wife for about 7-8 years and we catch up perhaps twice a year at social events.
Because I'm the only one interested in footy at these dinners he sits next to me and talk invariably turns to WC and draft picks as I know he spends hours and hours and hours watching kids play all over Aust.

I asked him whether WC had made a strategy mid way through the year when a PP was on the offering as to whom they would have selected with picks 2 and 4. After being a little coy he admitted that such a list existed and said that Scully was always going 1, and that WC would probably have taken Martin at #2, knowing Melb would go with Trengrove leaving morabito at #4. As to pick 18 he said that it depended on who was available, but Fyfe and Bastinac headed their suggested list at that point.

Nothing against Sheppard who I think will be a very good player, but Martin, Morabito and Fyfe would be very nice indeed.