Opinion Hill will not be best 22 in 2013.

[Dark Sharks]

Yeah i agree. We will have better options for mind. If they decide to play nicoski and Lecra in the forward line too that is.

But to soften the blow, heres a list of players i would pick AFTER hill....

Swift, Ginnity, Rowan Jones, Mitch Brown.... thats all i can think of right now

Edit.... Sheppard

 

[WCEbrody]

Kennedy
Darling
Lynch
Cox

Lecras
Nicoski
Embley

Would play all those players before Hill in our forward line. Could include Masten but he'll get more midfield time next year.
Problem is we dont really have any crumbers apart from Hams

 

[Macca81]

kind of agree with the OP.

Hill cost us the game against the Lions up in Brisbane earlier this year. Watch the passage of play where Darling soccers the ball off the ground towards goal. Hill was actually about to run past the Brisbane defender and he could have sheparded Darling through so the ball wasnt touched on the goal line. Instead he just casually jogged off to the side of the contest as if the game wasnt on the line or meant nothing. That one passage of play says everything about his as a footballer. Pretty lazy, and isnt prepared to work hard for the team.

Ill give him his kudos, he can take the occasional great overheard mark and has the x-factor about him. But make no mistake he cost us that game against Brisbane with his lackadaisical attitude.

 

[Wunjarrah]

It's easy to judge one element of a team over one act - but the importance to a team isn't one act it the sum of all the actions. Of course this is all pie in the sky and maybe a Newman will train the house down over the preseason; but my feeling is that that the X-factor of Hill that you refer to, in a far more balanced team is going to look pretty darn good. Much like the first half to his season.
It's also understandable with our dysfunctional forward and midfield that he nowlooks terrible. That might make him a flat track bully, but it is often the Xfactors, the Buddy's and Stevie-J's who turn a contest; and a game can be won on that.
If a player like Newman dislodges him from the team, well well-done on him; BUT Hill in a forward line made up of JK, Darls, LeCras, and the resting ruck is going to be pretty darn hard to stop and his overhead marking is going to be key to that. Tonight he had Scarlet on him at times FFS! Next year I'll be confident he will start as best 22, what his application is over the course of the year will determine whether he is there at the end of the year. His workrate at the end of this game wasn't bad either. His pressure in the F50 looked ok from the couch.
Now if the post was about Hams, Swift or McGinna then it would be another story! I'm off ta bed!

 

[Carbine Chaos]

He'll be bloody good depth if he drops out.

 

[bodazoka]

The problem is he's been playing so deep and relying on his marking ability too much, in 2013 are we going to be short of dangerous marks with Cox, Naitanui, Darling, Kennedy, Lynch and LeCras returning? Not to mention the looming shadow of one JEMERMY McGOVERN!

As well as other players who are more than handy as forwards for the last few years like Embley and Nicoski, we'll have a fit Dick, a Newman and Weedon, Hams.

Agreed.

The hope would be that the pressure on him with that forward line forces him to work even harder on his pressure acts and work up the ground. His form earlier in the season would put him ahead of all but Darling, LeCras, Kennedy and the resting rucks.

Best thing about him is that he can also crumb goals.

 

[ziad]

Structure will be musch better next year to support his role. We hada few forwards whe weer down - but soem Geelong defenders didnt attack as I would have expected - can not see our role in that on TV.

To comment on a few above - with JK and LeCras back in and possably Nicko there will be some interesting outs and changes in roles.

I dont see swift being part of it though. Hill I can see as being dangerous.

What we need is a big bodied mid (Stevens steps up or trade), more pace (Newman??) and a fast crumber (Dick??)

interesting stuff.

 

[Toshowyouwhy]

Hams has been far worse.

 

[PRANKSTER666]

Mmmm.

Is opinion immune from criticism? Is that a magic rule that I missed?

Because Robert Walls offers his opinion every week and it doesn't stop us from shitting on it.

Do you understand that not all opinions are equally convincing? Or equally worthy?

Or do you think that any halfwit can spunk out their half-formed nonsense, call it "an opinion" and demand that no one challenge it? Is that how it works? Because that's a concession to idiocy that I'm unwilling to make.

In the US, some people are of "the opinion" that the President wasn't born in the US. In the spirit of Voltaire, should we honour that? Or should we identify it as bullshit?

It's my opinion that my anus is made out of chocolate. Do you dare disagree? What happens then? Would the magic decree that protects all opinions from any interrogation be violated?

I'm sorry, but labelling something as opinion doesn't protect it from dissent or disagreement. If anything, it invites it. Go read a book.

Shut up.

 

[Butler]

Hams has been far worse.

100% agree. I would take Lecras, Hill, Dick, Nicoski and Newman before Hams.

Anyways, imo Hill will be best 22. Anyone actually remember his preseason? He played a lot up on the wing and looked really good. Unfortunately due to injuries to our forwards he has had to stay deep most of the time. Next year with Lecras back he should be able to go for a run on the wing when he is having a quiet one and get involved in the game.

Most small forwards go through these patches of poor form. It's not an easy role to play. The problem is because of his lazy reputation when he drops in form he gets accused of being lazy. Last night i saw him chase hard and provide pace to our forward line. Those last 15 minutes were the hardest i seen him work and he was working a lot harder than a lot of our other players.

 

[WCErevival]

Just a bit of stats.
Goal averages
2012
Lecras - 2.1
Nicoski - 1.6

2011 before last night
Hill - 1.9
Hams - 1.6

They aren't doing that bad. Lecras was never that great defensively either so you cant single out Hill there.

 

[Eastern Rangers]

Structure will be musch better next year to support his role. We hada few forwards whe weer down - but soem Geelong defenders didnt attack as I would have expected - can not see our role in that on TV.

To comment on a few above - with JK and LeCras back in and possably Nicko there will be some interesting outs and changes in roles.

I dont see swift being part of it though. Hill I can see as being dangerous.

What we need is a big bodied mid (Stevens steps up or trade), more pace (Newman??) and a fast crumber (Dick??)

interesting stuff.

Won't we be crying out for a forward with some genuine crumming ability next year?

 

[Eastern Rangers]

100% agree. I would take Lecras, Hill, Dick, Nicoski and Newman before Hams.

Anyways, imo Hill will be best 22. Anyone actually remember his preseason? He played a lot up on the wing and looked really good. Unfortunately due to injuries to our forwards he has had to stay deep most of the time. Next year with Lecras back he should be able to go for a run on the wing when he is having a quiet one and get involved in the game.

Most small forwards go through these patches of poor form. It's not an easy role to play. The problem is because of his lazy reputation when he drops in form he gets accused of being lazy. Last night i saw him chase hard and provide pace to our forward line. Those last 15 minutes were the hardest i seen him work and he was working a lot harder than a lot of our other players.

The first part is true, but remember LeCras, Embley, Darling, Nicoski all pushed up the ground pretty well in 2011.

Perhaps he's being played too deep, or he's not working hard enough up the ground. But he's no small.

 

[Truckosaurus]

Needs a bit of Darling's attitude. Jack had a shitty first half and clearly came out of half time determined to have an influence on the game and played much better as a result. Hill had a shitty first half and came out of half time to have a shitty second half.

 

[Jackfrost]

Hill has turned as soft as dough this last month - doesn't attack the ball hard enough. I liked him early, but he needs to lift big time.

Shhhhh I got ripped to shreds when I dared mention the first signs of this after the St Kilda game. Unfortunately this sort of hot and cold come with the territory

 

[CursoryMercenary]

Offers more to the side than Hams.

 

[the harry]

He isn't a key forward. He's a good/great finishers who is oportunistic and can mark well when not on the best defender. He still chased hard from what I saw last night and it's not as if we are making a heap of forward 50 tackles anyway the last few months.

He'll be in the 22, I'm confident of that.

 

[pantskyle]

Has improved significantly from last year. Asked maybe to do more then he can at this late stage.

With another WC preseason he should be able to increase his fitness levels.

Still a pass for this season.

 

[Wettoast11]

If Kennedy comes back for finals then we might have a chance

 

[Spoon_Man]

Let's not forget he was playing for the Doggies last year. He's done well to adjust to the different game plan we have and the higher intensity we play at. I agree with pantskyle above that with another pre season under his belt his fitness levels will be where we want them..

 

[BigBirds1987]

I would play Hill over Nicoski...and Swift.....and McGinnity...and Sheppard

I Agree!! Would even play him ahead of Hams.

ISnt Hill our leading goal kicker this year??? or close to it?

 

[Carbine Chaos]

I Agree!! Would even play him ahead of Hams.

ISnt Hill our leading goal kicker this year??? or close to it?

Darling is, he's equal second with the Q.

I reckon a fit Nicoski brings a lot more to the team.

 

[greennick]

While he may not be best 22, we will rarely have our best 22 on the park. And he is certainly best 25/26.

I think LeCras will play further up the ground, so he won't be taking JK's spot.

Upon saying that, unless he finds a way to up his defensive pressure consistently and minimise his downside, he will find himself on the outer.

 

[Prem87]

Our entire team other than Kerr and Glass are in terrible form. Yes Hill had a poor game but most of our players did. Even Schofield was relatively quiet to his usual standards. It's easy to pick out the guy who's had question marks on his endeavour in the past - we should be sinking the boot into other players as well.

 

[Marlin01]

I wouldn't have small/medium forwards that can't play through the midfield. They are a drain on the rest of the team.

Kennedy - our most important forward. If he's fit he plays.
Darling - Provides tremendous versatility. Excellent mark, great speed and just as likely to crumb a goal as anyone. I wouldn't mind seeing him start in the centre square on occasion, just to mix things up, like the way NN is used as a RR.
Cox/NN - provides enormous flexibility for the team. These two currently sit 10th in the Coleman Medal. That's right, the best ruck combo in the league have also produced the 10th most goals. There's a stat that hasn't been bandied around too much. Because they both can go forward, it means other players get more rest on the bench.
Lynch - don't underestimate the importance of him as a ruck option. If we lose Cox or NN during a game, it throws out one of our team's big advantages. We beat Kangas because they had no contingency for Goldstein. If McGovern or McInnes develop well, Lynch might come under scrutiny, but that hasn't happened yet. In wet conditions, Lynch's position would be the one that might get downsized.

So that leaves two places for small/mediums:

LeCras - I know this is contraversial, but I think he must rotate through the midfield, assuming his knee is up to it.

Midfielder - Shuey/Masten/other

When you break it down, if you're not able to rotate through the midfield and you can't provide a genuine marking target, you'd want to be an All Australian quality player to justify a full-time role in the forward line.