Traded Chris Yarran [to Richmond for Pick 19]

[dlanod]

It's true that we rarely see an open market.

That doesn't alter the principle that trade value is determined by the market.

If that's your argument then you need to add a disclaimer after your every use of "market value".

A normal person (or economist) with an understanding of the term "market value" is fundamentally different to that. The element of a competitive market is fundamental to the concept. Just because you're using a well-understood term and trying to apply your own definition doesn't validate that claim.

Here's some definitions of market value from a variety of sources:

The highest estimated price that a buyer would pay and a seller would accept for an item in an open and competitive market.

Market value or OMV (Open Market Valuation) is the price at which an asset would trade in a competitive auction setting.

The price which a seller of property would receive in an open market by negotiation, as distinguished from a "distress" price on a forced or foreclosure sale, or from an auction.

If Yarran is traded to Richmond because it is the only club he will allow a trade to, then the value will not be set by the market. Carlton may end up getting close to market value depending on what Richmond hands over, but the market is not involved in setting that value - it is purely between Richmond and Carlton. If other clubs could reasonably bid for Yarran and he goes to the highest bidder, then that would involve market value.

 

[Tiger71]

Trade Radio host Cam Luke suggesting richmond will offer Ben Lennon and a third round pick for Yarran!! Ill take that.

Well Con from Craigieburn Mentioned the Blues will offer Yarran and also pay out the last year of his contract for the Tigers 3rd round pick. I'll take that!

 

[Beer n Skittles]

Well Con from Craigieburn Mentioned the Blues will offer Yarran and also pay out the last year of his contract for the Tigers 3rd round pick. I'll take that!

Could you throw in an underperforming senior player?

 

[Tig22]

Very simple have preached it many times, if proposed offers are ridiculous, then sit him in development team for 2016.
If he sulks and has poor professionalism and demeanor for an A grader and refuses to play out the year then he costs nothing CFC zero, as he's in breach of contract.
At very worst case scenario we'll be granted a 2nd rounder as Compo next year, stronger draft.
CFC would have set a rigid criteria and get a better deal in the end.
With the coin we save we can sniff around a few other disgruntled and yet to be contracted players.
It's a double edged sword we're all playing, what goes around comes around.
SOS has to have balls and take this on front no more excuses due diligence please.
Let the games begin, this will be juicy.
Ciao

Ah, I love this attitude. A player has publicly stated he'll never wear the carlton jumper again, and rather than get the negative and not committed player out there, you'd rather him play in your VFL.

The same VFL team as you'll develop your future players, you want them to be going 100% trying to prove they deserve a place in the AFL alongside Yarran who doesn't want to be there. If I was on that team I wouldn't put my head over the ball if all I had for support was a player that didn't care.

He's consuming cap space you could be using to attract and retain players that want to be there!
It establishes carlton as the complete opposite of a destination club, with no morale and the place to go to kill your career.

How many years of that do you think it will take to drive out Menzel and Cripps?

Thank the good lord that people like you do not run clubs. Yarran will be moved on next year, even if its for Hawthorn's third round pick. He simply will not be at carlton.

Ciao xx

 

[Sweet Jesus]

If that's your argument then you need to add a disclaimer after your every use of "market value".

A normal person (or economist) with an understanding of the term "market value" is fundamentally different to that. The element of a competitive market is fundamental to the concept. Just because you're using a well-understood term and trying to apply your own definition doesn't validate that claim.

I think it goes without saying that we rarely or never have a truly open market when it comes to player trading. But I take your point.

If Yarran is traded to Richmond because it is the only club he will allow a trade to, then the value will not be set by the market.

Agreed. Yarran will narrow the field to one club so those dealings are unlikely to be a reflection of market value.

Carlton may end up getting close to market value depending on what Richmond hands over, but the market is not involved in setting that value - it is purely between Richmond and Carlton.

Agreed. I never said Carlton would get market value for Yarran in a trade.

My argument throughout has been that when people say 'Yarran is worth a first-rounder' in a trade, a club needs to be willing to give up a first-rounder for that to be the case. Carlton might ask for a first-rounder but that's not what determines his trade value. If no club is willing to give up a first-rounder, then he's not worth a first-rounder. None of that presupposes that it's an open market where Carlton can simply trade him to the highest bidder.

 

[Gosha]

Trade Radio host Cam Luke suggesting richmond will offer Ben Lennon and a third round pick for Yarran!! Ill take that.

Hahahahahahahahahahahaha don't get your hopes up

 

[cdcanman]

Trade Radio host Cam Luke suggesting richmond will offer Ben Lennon and a third round pick for Yarran!! Ill take that.

That would be a great deal for Carlton. Of course, it would be contingent on Lennon actually wanting to play there. We have heard nothing of the sort to this point

 

[Blue87]

Im not suggesting that will be the trade, im simply just writing it on here as i see it.
Personally, i think thats too much. It would have to be a third round upgrade for richmond.

 

[telsor]

A suggestion that came up on the Richmond board from a Brisbane supporter in relation to their interest in Astbury.

Brisbane trades pick 20 to Richmond for pick 30 & Astbury.

Brisbane then on-trades 30 for Bell.

Richmond on-trades 20 for Yarran.


Might require a few steak knives, but I think it's workable.

 

[Stylo]

A suggestion that came up on the Richmond board from a Brisbane supporter in relation to their interest in Astbury.

Brisbane trades pick 20 to Richmond for pick 30 & Astbury.

Brisbane then on-trades 30 for Bell.

Richmond on-trades 20 for Yarran.


Might require a few steak knives, but I think it's workable.

That's the most equitable solution I think

 

[HBF]

Trade Radio host Cam Luke suggesting richmond will offer Ben Lennon and a third round pick for Yarran!! Ill take that.

Happy with that as well.

 

[Monkey King]

Our 2nd rounder is higher than Sydney's 2nd rounder.

Edit: Its also higher than both WA clubs 2nd rounders

If Sydney decide they want Yaz, they'll get the deal the done I reckon. None of this amateur hour - second rounder or nothing - stuff. Whether that be passing on something they get for Jetta with a later pick swap, or lining up a player or some such.

I wonder how we'd go trying to get Tom Mitchell wrapped up in the deal somewhere. Given they've got young enough guys like Hannebery and Parker, with Heeney and now Mills through the academy and Mitchell rumoured to have at least considered us before deciding to sign on with the Swans last year.

 

[two hearts]

I think it goes without saying that we rarely or never have a truly open market when it comes to player trading. But I take your point.

Agreed. Yarran will narrow the field to one club so those dealings are unlikely to be a reflection of market value.

Agreed. I never said Carlton would get market value for Yarran in a trade.

My argument throughout has been that when people say 'Yarran is worth a first-rounder' in a trade, a club needs to be willing to give up a first-rounder for that to be the case. Carlton might ask for a first-rounder but that's not what determines his trade value. If no club is willing to give up a first-rounder, then he's not worth a first-rounder. None of that presupposes that it's an open market where Carlton can simply trade him to the highest bidder.

HAHAHAHA!!

the argument against you in this whole shambles of a thread is that you keep using the term MARKET VALUE where its not warranted and here yet again you are confusing it with 'trade value' which is only the final sale price. You don't know what it means and are wasting everyone's time

 

[Sweet Jesus]

the argument against you in this whole shambles of a thread is that you keep using the term MARKET VALUE where its not warranted and here yet again you are confusing it with 'trade value' which is only the final sale price. You don't know what it means and are wasting everyone's time

Actually, the argument being made is that Carlton can determine Yarran's trade value simply by saying he's worth x amount. That's not the case if no club is willing to give that up in exchange.

 

[Blue87]

SEN now reporting a likely straight swap between Carlton and Richmond, Yarran for Lennon. It's got to the media now, probably reading big footy hahaha

 

[tonywilson43]

Then we'll shop Yarran around somewhere else.

No one else wants him and no one will give up first round pick for him? any suggestions to who you think would

 

[Beer n Skittles]

Oh yeah, I forgot Carlton have such excellent list management. Kennedy, Garlett, Jacobs, Waite, Betts, Robinson, Grigg and now Yarran, Henderson, Kreuzer, Menzel and Bell. What will you have to show for all those players next season while the majority of them will be playing finals at other clubs? Carlton is just an irrelevant feeder club these days.

Well I suppose Carlton have that finals win from 9th to show for them, it never would've been possible if they hadn't traded Kennedy.

I note you left off Hampson. Carlton have Docherty to show for Hampson. But you make a good point, Carlton shouldn't sell players cheap

 

[andrew_]

From winning finals to winning spoons

It seems memory fades quickly, shall I refresh yours?

 

[tonywilson43]

If Sydney decide they want Yaz, they'll get the deal the done I reckon. None of this amateur hour - second rounder or nothing - stuff. Whether that be passing on something they get for Jetta with a later pick swap, or lining up a player or some such.

I wonder how we'd go trying to get Tom Mitchell wrapped up in the deal somewhere. Given they've got young enough guys like Hannebery and Parker, with Heeney and now Mills through the academy and Mitchell rumoured to have at least considered us before deciding to sign on with the Swans last year.

Sydney simply will not give up first round pick there reserved ofr academy player simple as that

 

[HBF]

No one else wants him and no one will give up first round pick for him? any suggestions to who you think would

I don't just want a first rounder. I'd be happy to do a player swap, but not for someone who has been playing state league footy for most of the year.

 

[tonywilson43]

I don't just want a first rounder. I'd be happy to do a player swap, but not for someone who has been playing state league footy for most of the year.

Lennon is a first round pick number 12 who is just 20 years old, its only his second year, he has done nothing to decrease his value and has been coming along nicely this year, Richmond have already said we dont want to trade a first rounder, so in what way would they trade lennon for yarran considering its pretty much trading a first rounder for yarran?

 

[tonywilson43]

SEN now reporting a likely straight swap between Carlton and Richmond, Yarran for Lennon. It's got to the media now, probably reading big footy hahaha

Sen talk more shit then anybody during trade period its rather crazy

 

[Sweet Jesus]

Sen talk more shit then anybody during trade period its rather crazy

People who subsequently report speculation or hypotheticals aired on SEN as fact are even worse.

 

[HBF]

Lennon is a first round pick number 12 who is just 20 years old, its only his second year, he has done nothing to decrease his value and has been coming along nicely this year, Richmond have already said we dont want to trade a first rounder, so in what way would they trade lennon for yarran considering its pretty much trading a first rounder for yarran?

Well Carlton aren't going to give Yarran away for nothing, particularly given he still has a year to run on his contract.

 

[Capitano_Cotch]

Can't see us giving up Lennon (a former pick 12) for Yarran.
If it was the case, why wouldn't we just give up our pick 12 this year for him?
Makes absolutely no sense.
The only way this is possible is if Lennon requests a trade to Carlton, which may happen, who knows.