Who took Craig McRae Job?

[NT.Thunder]

Isn't he a rally car driver?

Sure I've seen him on Xbox

 

[sirlothie]

Who are the very best we have passed by?

We could get Bucks a senior assistant that actually has senior coaching experience like most other clubs do...

 

[Quicky]

Jobs for the boys over the very best isn't good enough to be honest.

It does have the uncomfortable feel of nepotism. But it's not fair to label the club that without inside knowledge of the selection process that occurred.

 

[Soups]

Isn't he a rally car driver?

Sure I've seen him on Xbox

Colin must be his brother

 

[Soups]

I would really like to see Tapping come in as a line coach after next year. I wouldn't be against seeing Tarks and Ant moved on. How much "development" do they do in the reserves? Or is it really mainly Tapping?

 

[Hardas]

He's been around the block but he did 1 year as a backline development coach. If we going to go in-house what about Lockyer or Rocca?
Surely we have the coin to do better than this bloke...

I've never been around Grace, so I have no idea myself.
As for the other two, I've never been in a position to get a real read on Lockyer, but if he's coaching the right way for midfielders that would mean he's teaching things that he could never do himself [I just wasn't a fan of his play].
As for Ant Rocca, he underwhelmed me as a communicator with the players from the few times I've listened to him.
So, I find both of them somewhat questionable, particularly as they have both spent years and years in the same environment, although Rocca did start elsewhere.
Getting back to Grace, I believe that Simon Lloyd recommended him to us when he wanted to come back to Victoria, for what that's worth [Lloyd was definitely well-regarded by the Pies when he was here, if you don't remember him].

 

[sirlothie]

I've never been around Grace, so I have no idea myself.
As for the other two, I've never been in a position to get a real read on Lockyer, but if he's coaching the right way for midfielders that would mean he's teaching things that he could never do himself [I just wasn't a fan of his play].
As for Ant Rocca, he underwhelmed me as a communicator with the players from the few times I've listened to him.
So, I find both of them somewhat questionable, particularly as they have both spent years and years in the same environment, although Rocca did start elsewhere.
Getting back to Grace, I believe that Simon Lloyd recommended him to us when he wanted to come back to Victoria, for what that's worth [Lloyd was definitely well-regarded by the Pies when he was here, if you don't remember him].

Lockyer is an encourager, has a bit of tactical nous. Rocca has trouble being serious....

 

[Gone Critical]

Not convinced by Steve Grace as forward coach. Forward line barely functional a lot of the time this year.

Massive MASSIVE weakness since he took over.

I am going to make an assumption here that neither of you are insiders at the Collingwood FC and thus don't have access to the intimate details of our coaching group. If you are just punters watching from the sidelines like most of the rest of us you cannot have anywhere near enough knowledge to judge Steve Grace.

Unless I have missed something there have been few if any public utterances from him describing how he is handling his job. Likewise you can have no knowledge of what exactly is his role and responsibility. How much is he a conduit for Bucks forward plans, how much independent input into structures does he have, how good is he at implementing the tasks given to him, what are his communication skills like, what sort of a personality is he, is he a disciplinarian, what are his football philosophies etc etc etc etc etc.

Most assistants are anonymous to the football public. We know about Ben Hart the player but very little about his coaching. Grace is more anonymous again. Assessing him just by whether the forwards play well is a blunt instrument because you have no real knowledge of how much influence he has individually. It's just true to say we punters have no basis to judge assistant coaches because we have next to no knowledge about how they go about their jobs.

 

[noideaatall]

I am going to make an assumption here that neither of you are insiders at the Collingwood FC and thus don't have access to the intimate details of our coaching group. If you are just punters watching from the sidelines like most of the rest of us you cannot have anywhere near enough knowledge to judge Steve Grace.
....
It's just true to say we punters have no basis to judge assistant coaches because we have next to no knowledge about how they go about their jobs.

That all maybe true but it certainly won't stop TG from labelling the appointments as disasters. I assume he/she/it is not alone in this trend of seeing black where ever the pies are involved. Is there an onus on the club to provide fans with more information that will help them in constructing an informed view?

 

[Gone Critical]

That all maybe true but it certainly won't stop TG from labelling the appointments as disasters. I assume he/she/it is not alone in this trend of seeing black where ever the pies are involved. Is there an onus on the club to provide fans with more information that will help them in constructing an informed view?

I would say no. I think we just need to accept that many roles at a footy club involve mainly behind the scenes work and supporters will have no idea how. The incumbents are performing. I would put assistant coaches, fitness and conditioning staff and medicos in this group.

 

[sirlothie]

I am going to make an assumption here that neither of you are insiders at the Collingwood FC and thus don't have access to the intimate details of our coaching group. If you are just punters watching from the sidelines like most of the rest of us you cannot have anywhere near enough knowledge to judge Steve Grace.

Unless I have missed something there have been few if any public utterances from him describing how he is handling his job. Likewise you can have no knowledge of what exactly is his role and responsibility. How much is he a conduit for Bucks forward plans, how much independent input into structures does he have, how good is he at implementing the tasks given to him, what are his communication skills like, what sort of a personality is he, is he a disciplinarian, what are his football philosophies etc etc etc etc etc.

Most assistants are anonymous to the football public. We know about Ben Hart the player but very little about his coaching. Grace is more anonymous again. Assessing him just by whether the forwards play well is a blunt instrument because you have no real knowledge of how much influence he has individually. It's just true to say we punters have no basis to judge assistant coaches because we have next to no knowledge about how they go about their jobs.

Obviously as assistant forward line coach Steve Grace's KPI would be the functioning of the forward line and it's perfectly reasonable for supporters to have an opinion on how effective he has been.

You don't need to know the recipe to tell if the cake is no good...

 

[Gone Critical]

Obviously as assistant forward line coach Steve Grace's KPI would be the functioning of the forward line and it's perfectly reasonable for supporters to have an opinion on how effective he has been.

You don't need to know the recipe to tell if the cake is no good...

I disagree. There are many many factors besides Steve Graces role as assistant coach that influence outcomes for our forward line. Unless you have an inside knowledge you just don't have any ability to seperate out these individual influences and ascribe a value to each one.

 

[sirlothie]

I disagree. There are many many factors besides Steve Graces role as assistant coach that influence outcomes for our forward line. Unless you have an inside knowledge you just don't have any ability to seperate out these individual influences and ascribe a value to each one.

Well if that's the case noone could rate Nathan Buckley's performance either...

 

[Bard]

Steve Grace's work looked very good early with the clearly improved crumbing work of a number of our small forwards. As we as a team deteriorated so did his work. At the halfway point of the season we had the highest goal-kicking accuracy of any side, and like our win rate that tanked with it. I think it's fair to say that without having a wholly bad season or a wholly good season we can't really assess him because 2015 was very much played in two halves from all sections of the field - one spectacularly good and another entirely dreadful.

 

[Kappa]

Well if that's the case noone could rate Nathan Buckley's performance either...

We also can't rate our players performances because we don't know their KPI's or what role the coach gave them.

Nor can we rate other teams performances, nor can we rate commentators because we don't know what the producers have told them.

In fact we can't really have an opinion on anything

 

[mike123]

We also can't rate our players performances because we don't know their KPI's or what role the coach gave them.

Nor can we rate other teams performances, nor can we rate commentators because we don't know what the producers have told them.

In fact we can't really have an opinion on anything

We may as well shut down bigfooty.

 

[Gone Critical]

Well if that's the case noone could rate Nathan Buckley's performance either...

It's not a bad idea to remember that as supporters our access to assessing the main coach is limited. Good to have that rider on your mind when expressing an opinion I reckon. Still we have far more evidence to go on when assessing Buckleys role compared to Grace. For one we can have an educated guess and for the other we have NFI.

 

[Gone Critical]

We also can't rate our players performances because we don't know their KPI's or what role the coach gave them.

Nor can we rate other teams performances, nor can we rate commentators because we don't know what the producers have told them.

In fact we can't really have an opinion on anything

We are limited compared to the match committee yes. Still the players are the ones at a club we have the most knowledge about and get to see perform their main duties. They are the most obvious members of the club we can have an informed opinion about. The main coach less so because we see so little of what they really do. After that it really falls away.

Opinions are like the proverbial. Everyone has got one. It's not a bad idea to have an idea about how informed any opinion you have is. For me I have no real idea about how good Grace is because I feel too uninformed. Still this is just my opinion and part of what makes BF fun.

 

[Big Bryza]

Not convinced by Steve Grace as forward coach. Forward line barely functional a lot of the time this year.

It was a million times better than 2014.

 

[AmellyPies]

We could get Bucks a senior assistant that actually has senior coaching experience like most other clubs do...

Scott Burns and Robert Harvey are highly rated in the AFL, Don't know what you're on.

 

[left at home]

as an out sider, I would not be able to judge any of our assistants properly except on the performance of
our senior teams, I would be guessing and that I don't do that very well. the forward line to me looked better this year
except for the number of behinds we kick, and that was mainly in the 3rd quarter

 

[Jelly Bean]

Obviously as assistant forward line coach Steve Grace's KPI would be the functioning of the forward line and it's perfectly reasonable for supporters to have an opinion on how effective he has been.

You don't need to know the recipe to tell if the cake is no good...

Steve Grace's KPIs would be about how effectively the forward line is executing on Nathan's plan for the forward line.

People think that the forward coaches (or backline coaches) determine the game plan / game style / output of their area - in reality all they are is the extra eyes to execute the coach's game plan. The funniest thing I ever heard was when someone said that Buckley was responsible for the GF win in 2010 because the forward press was what won it for us, and he was the forward coach ). the forward press (e.g. game plan) was MM.

 

[Tarkyn_24]

I've never been around Grace, so I have no idea myself.
As for the other two, I've never been in a position to get a real read on Lockyer, but if he's coaching the right way for midfielders that would mean he's teaching things that he could never do himself [I just wasn't a fan of his play].
As for Ant Rocca, he underwhelmed me as a communicator with the players from the few times I've listened to him.
So, I find both of them somewhat questionable, particularly as they have both spent years and years in the same environment, although Rocca did start elsewhere.
Getting back to Grace, I believe that Simon Lloyd recommended him to us when he wanted to come back to Victoria, for what that's worth [Lloyd was definitely well-regarded by the Pies when he was here, if you don't remember him].

To be honest I don't understand why Tarks isn't our forwards coach. His greatest asset during his playing days was his ability to read the play and be in the right spot - he should either be coaching primarily on leading patterns or assisting with developing the players' skills.

 

[Harry O]

Our coaching panel is third rate. Team won't improve until Balme and Eddie make the hard calls.

 

[legendstatus]

Wonder if Grace has a say in recruiting forwards seeing he is the forward coach? Reckon if that's your job then you need to own it from start to end.


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