Opinion Chris Scott's coaching - Part 1 [closed, see Part II]

[Daitro]

2/3 this year, which is all that really counts, the rest is just a mildly amusing byway of history.

Beat Hawthorn (who are being revealed to be fairly average), tick I guess. Scraped past Essendon late and comprehensive loss to Collingwood. Amusing.

 

[FredLeDeux]

yeah that's a bit worrying.

said a couple of times in the autopsy thread, Collingwood regularly burned us by using the width of the ground; when they switched play they kicked it looong to the opposite flank/wing; we were caught napping time and again and they quickly orchestrated a free man or two after switching.

That was largely a consequence, however, of the failure of our F50 defence which has been such a key plank in our success this season.

 

[romeohwho]

Beat Hawthorn (who are being revealed to be fairly average), tick I guess. Scraped past Essendon late and comprehensive loss to Collingwood. Amusing.

the 14 out of 26.
Am guessing, from memory, happy to be corrected.
Hawks x 5 (won all those flags-and go check every other team's record against them at the G in last few years.)
Pies x 5 (go figure, have flogged us even when we were very good)
Freo x 1 (had our number everywhere for a couple of years there-who after all, could forget the final at K. Park)
North x 1 (beat us by a goal, made the prelim)
Just not that bad for mine and different team now.

 

[Cursed Cat]

That was largely a consequence, however, of the failure of our F50 defence which has been such a key plank in our success this season.

some truth to that for sure.
but once it became a trend, it would have been nice to see the coaching staff or the onfield leaders pick up on it and tighten things up.

 

[RegHickeyStand]

I noticed this from an article on afl.com.au earlier this week :

Geelong has won 14 of 25 games at the MCG since it won the 2011 premiership in Chris Scott's first year as coach. It has won just one final in five attempts at the venue since that flag.

Make that 14 of 26 now. Not a great record for a team that has won as many games as we have. Our system that works so well in Geelong doesn't seem to translate so well to the ground where we'll most need it to win a premiership.

14 out of 26? Probably tracks our away game losing average fairly closely.

But there's hope!! Two out of three this season means our averages are way up! Also, we played shite yesterday, and it would not have mattered where we played.

 

[RegHickeyStand]

Beat Hawthorn (who are being revealed to be fairly average), tick I guess. Scraped past Essendon late and comprehensive loss to Collingwood. Amusing.

Over the past years at the 'G we would have played Carlton, Richmond, Melbourne. Or Hawthorn, Collingwood (when they were good). So I figures could have been skewered by whoever we played.

 

[ATSAM]

Buckley outcoached Scott yesterday, again. One of our problems is the lack of on field leaders. Sure Joel leads by example but there is no-one barking out orders as he and Dangerfield, perhaps he is not an on-field leader either, are too busy shaking tackles to get a grip on the whole game. Funnily enough S Johnson was very good at this, even acknowledged by the wonder Coach Thompson, but now ,well.....
Perhaps the Captain should not be the best player, as for example Ling and Harley who could then look around at what is happening. But then Scott and the many coaches in the box can see that and they do??????

 

[romeohwho]

Buckley outcoached Scott yesterday, again. One of our problems is the lack of on field leaders. Sure Joel leads by example but there is no-one barking out orders as he and Dangerfield, perhaps he is not an on-field leader either, are too busy shaking tackles to get a grip on the whole game. Funnily enough S Johnson was very good at this, even acknowledged by the wonder Coach Thompson, but now ,well.....
Perhaps the Captain should not be the best player, as for example Ling and Harley who could then look around at what is happening. But then Scott and the many coaches in the box can see that and they do??????

Think we have plenty of on field leaders- go to a game and see how many people are instructing and organizing. Selwood, Dangerfield, Duncan, Caddy, Taylor, Hawkins, Guthrie....
Yesterday we just didn't play well-that's all.

 

[hbk_aus]

Think we have plenty of on field leaders- go to a game and see how many people are instructing and organizing. Selwood, Dangerfield, Duncan, Caddy, Taylor, Hawkins, Guthrie....
Yesterday we just didn't play well-that's all.

Agree with that. Whilst there are concerns about how easily we were opened up yesterday, I think there are a few clichés which are too easily brought out after a loss:

"Someone shouldve given Joel a chop out with his tagger." - There is only so much you can do in today's game. A bit of blocking and pushing around and that's about it. Joel is a superstar, superstars should know how to beat a tag.

"No leaders out there" - we have plenty but they didn't play well yesterday. You could still see the verbal instruction and I didn't notice the likes of Selwood and Dangerfield going in less harder than usual.

"We were outcoached" - In what way? Move Selwood away from the position where he has made himself a superstar? Our midfield got smashed as it was - who else could we have run through there apart from the usual 10 or so who usually rotate through there? I see this outcoached thing after every loss but I very rarely see the opposite viewpoint after a win.

"Hawkins should kick more goals" - based on that ball movement and delivery? Every time we get it to him in a one-on-one contest he looks like marking it, as the final quarter showed. The trick is to work out how to do that more often which is my one main ongoing concern with our coaching staff. But then again, spreading it around is aiding the development of Kersten and co.

 

[romeohwho]

Agree with that. Whilst there are concerns about how easily we were opened up yesterday, I think there are a few clichés which are too easily brought out after a loss:

"Someone shouldve given Joel a chop out with his tagger." - There is only so much you can do in today's game. A bit of blocking and pushing around and that's about it. Joel is a superstar, superstars should know how to beat a tag.

"No leaders out there" - we have plenty but they didn't play well yesterday. You could still see the verbal instruction and I didn't notice the likes of Selwood and Dangerfield going in less harder than usual.

"We were outcoached" - In what way? Move Selwood away from the position where he has made himself a superstar? Our midfield got smashed as it was - who else could we have run through there apart from the usual 10 or so who usually rotate through there? I see this outcoached thing after every loss but I very rarely see the opposite viewpoint after a win.

"Hawkins should kick more goals" - based on that ball movement and delivery? Every time we get it to him in a one-on-one contest he looks like marking it, as the final quarter showed. The trick is to work out how to do that more often which is my one main ongoing concern with our coaching staff. But then again, spreading it around is aiding the development of Kersten and co.

Haha Yep agree with the above, and of course we need to address some things, but really, everyone lifts their game by 10% and we win yesterday-and Pies were good. Clean and hard and so few mistakes. Unusual. We were the opposite and that is unusual for us this year- we have played some beaut, precise and sure footy.
Will be interested to see how we go next week, and how the Pies form holds up.

 

[hbk_aus]

The funny thing is, as badly as we played and as little as we deserved to win, we still could have with some straighter kicking throughout the game.

 

[Bobby_]

the 14 out of 26.
Am guessing, from memory, happy to be corrected.
Hawks x 5 (won all those flags-and go check every other team's record against them at the G in last few years.)
Pies x 5 (go figure, have flogged us even when we were very good)
Freo x 1 (had our number everywhere for a couple of years there-who after all, could forget the final at K. Park)
North x 1 (beat us by a goal, made the prelim)
Just not that bad for mine and different team now.

We only lost 3 games in 2014 and got completely smashed by North Melbourne in the semi final. A team who lost 8 games that year and were very, very fortunate to get by Essendon the week prior. The posters who continually look at the end result (it was only a goal) are the same posters who think the 2012 elimination final was a fairly even duel.

Teams like GWS, Hawthorn, North Melbourne or Collingwood would be dying to face us in a final if they get there. They know who to target and who to put the most work into.
Fremantle is another one that always has our measure. Even this preseason, no different.

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

Then there are plenty of posters who aren't true fans.

Disagree , they exist but fortunately they represent a small percentage

 

[Cronin]

The funny thing is, as badly as we played and as little as we deserved to win, we still could have with some straighter kicking throughout the game.

Also, when we were 8pts down with all the momentum, they had a kick in from our goals and went straight down the corridor where we had more players but somehow they got it through and went coast-to-coast.
It is a funny game, but just not ha ha funny

 

[catempire]

Also, when we were 8pts down with all the momentum, they had a kick in from our goals and went straight down the corridor where we had more players but somehow they got it through and went coast-to-coast.
It is a funny game, but just not ha ha funny

This one: http://www.afl.com.au/video/smart-r...05&eventType=Goal&seek=5830&videoQuality=high

1. Howe shanked the kick and it luckily landed in an opponent's arms
2. Stanley ball watching rather than running to the contest (he does this too often)
3. We somehow let Grundy get goal side of the last line of defence (infuriating)

 

[DanA]

We only lost 3 games in 2014 and got completely smashed by North Melbourne in the semi final. A team who lost 8 games that year and were very, very fortunate to get by Essendon the week prior. The posters who continually look at the end result (it was only a goal) are the same posters who think the 2012 elimination final was a fairly even duel.

Teams like GWS, Hawthorn, North Melbourne or Collingwood would be dying to face us in a final if they get there. They know who to target and who to put the most work into.
Fremantle is another one that always has our measure. Even this preseason, no different.

- Teams like GWS, Hawthorn, North, Collingwood and Freo would be dying to face us in the finals
- They know who to target and who to put most work into

These are opinions you are presenting as facts. And quite frankly opinions that appear to be based on some cherry picking. How many times have GWS beat us prior to the last game? Didn't we beat Hawthorn? Preseason as an indicator? I'm struggling to see how you've formed this opinion that you are presenting as fact with any sort of logical consistency.

And you can say people continually look at the end result but it's funny how you ignore the bit where they say it's a very different team. I think most would concede the contested ball, hitouts and clearances were a real concern in 2014 and a big part of the finals result. You'd be hard pressed to make that case in 2016 though because they've actually been strengths.

 

[Cronin]

This one: http://www.afl.com.au/video/smart-r...05&eventType=Goal&seek=5830&videoQuality=high

1. Howe shanked the kick and it luckily landed in an opponent's arms
2. Stanley ball watching rather than running to the contest (he does this too often)
3. We somehow let Grundy get goal side of the last line of defence (infuriating)

Yeah that one, good times good times

 

[Micksy]

3. We somehow let Grundy get goal side of the last line of defence (infuriating)

I miss Scarlett.

He couldn't give a stuff how much ball forwards got up the ground.

He was always waiting for them when they headed back to goal.

 

[Bobby_]

How many times have GWS beat us prior to the last game?

Not many and do you know why?
They were far too inexperienced but even still, look at the games:
59 point loss
7 point loss
27 point loss
13 point win

You can clearly see how even our games have been against them in recent seasons. They now know they can get us and I think they may even beat us again in round 11.

Didn't we beat Hawthorn? Preseason as an indicator? I'm struggling to see how you've formed this opinion that you are presenting as fact with any sort of logical consistency.

Yes we did beat Hawthorn in round one when they had no Ceglar, Hill or Roughead but Hawthorn have got us when it mattered most come September. There is no hiding away from this. Continue to put your head in the sand if you like.
We are a better team this year while Hawthorn are a weaker team but I'll happily give the edge to Alaister Clarkson if we have to meet them again in a final this season as he has the runs on the board.

And you can say people continually look at the end result but it's funny how you ignore the bit where they say it's a very different team. I think most would concede the contested ball, hitouts and clearances were a real concern in 2014 and a big part of the finals result. You'd be hard pressed to make that case in 2016 though because they've actually been strengths.

It's a different team, that is for sure but certainly not a very different team.
Lonergan, Enright, Mackie, Taylor are still our main back line. The same blokes who have been found wanting in those big games after 2011. You want to know why they have been found wanting?
They are no longer in their prime and they are asked to play on guys 22-27. In fact, go on to YouTube mate, type in Geelong 2009 highlights or 2010 highlights and you will see just how fresh and lively those same four guys looked and compare them to the highlights you watch today.
Henderson has been a great get, he's definitely going to be holding his own but I have no confidence in the rest once our midfield tires and drops away and our backs are getting pummeled with relentless inside 50's.
Hawthorn's back line in recent grand finals has been so good because they are still youthful and smack bang in their prime. Last year, the oldest defender was Lake at 33.
Stratton 26, Birchall 27, Frawley 27, Suckling 27, Duryea 24.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

So sad. One loss and you're off the wagon again.

 

[Bobby_]

So sad. One loss and you're off the wagon again.

I'm not convinced and never have been that we can win the flag NSFB.
I am starting to believe top four is a slight chance, certainly after beating Adelaide but we don't have good enough midfield depth and we don't have a forward line who have been playing with one another for long enough.

This next month, I reckon we are going to struggle. Should beat Carlton but we probably won't beat North Melbourne or the Western Bulldogs and the GWS match is definitely 50/50, especially with Cameron back in their side.

 

[Vdubs]

14 out of 26? Probably tracks our away game losing average fairly closely.

But there's hope!! Two out of three this season means our averages are way up! Also, we played shite yesterday, and it would not have mattered where we played.

We won 3 quarters yesterday, thrashed in the first.
Last year we would have lost all 4 quarters.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

I'm not convinced and never have been that we can win the flag NSFB.
I am starting to believe top four is a slight chance, certainly after beating Adelaide but we don't have good enough midfield depth and we don't have a forward line who have been playing with one another for long enough.

This next month, I reckon we are going to struggle. Should beat Carlton but we probably won't beat North Melbourne or the Western Bulldogs and the GWS match is definitely 50/50, especially with Cameron back in their side.

GWS at home I haven't given up on, we're a pressing side so far this year and the narrow ground and tricky wind can be not easy to navigate for sides not used to it. Dogs concerns me more than the Roos. They have genuine pace and spread something we struggle with and will on their fast track. Smith/Stanley will need to beat Campbell.

 

[Vdubs]

I'm not convinced and never have been that we can win the flag NSFB.
I am starting to believe top four is a slight chance, certainly after beating Adelaide but we don't have good enough midfield depth and we don't have a forward line who have been playing with one another for long enough.

This next month, I reckon we are going to struggle. Should beat Carlton but we probably won't beat North Melbourne or the Western Bulldogs and the GWS match is definitely 50/50, especially with Cameron back in their side.

I never try and prognosticate, but...I think we will win 1/3, and end up about 14-8.
That is better than last year. GWS are the real deal with speed strength and depth everywhere, and if we win that, it will be a bonus imo. NM have had our measure for 2-3 years and are the team to beat, by definition at present. Not impossible for us, but still o be done.
I see a Haw NM GF, with the 2 Sydney teams losing prelims.
We are not yet top 4, but if all goes well, we could squeeze out a team.
But I am basing that on my preseason predictions, so am being a bit stubborn.

 

[romeohwho]

We wil beat GWS and Doggies. They both started to look a bit tired today. Am wondering if injuries will take a little toll on Doggies, and if GWS, who play a pretty demanding style of footy, might just need one more year for their bodies to be mature enough to keep it up.( well hopefully that will be the case by the finals!)
North, they would be favorite to win that against us-tough to win.