Analysis 2016 List Management Discussion

[LanceRomance]

All right, I am going to wade in on Yarran for this one post.

I find the whole discussion about dodging issues with Yarran to be distasteful. He is a human being, in a bad place right now. He hasn't done anything wrong, or at least not criminal, but people are treating his serious struggle with personal issue like some sort of personal failing.

**** that.

Chris played some scintillating football for Carlton, but people are happy to kick him now he's gone. Take a long hard look at yourselves talking about how glad you are he is gone and think about him as a ******* human being.

Good luck with all your endeavours Chris, I hope you get better and I hope the Carlton Football Club reaches out for you if you need us.

As far as I am concerned you'll always be the smiling kid in Navy.

also, his retaliatory hit on Chapman will be remembered for years to come

 

[HARKER]

I can imagine a starting 22 something like this next year, should things go to plan.......excluding any new draftees or recruits.

Backs:
Simpson Weitering Tuohy
Byrne Plowman Docherty
No Jamison or Rowe for starters at least and a little short overall, but enough smarts to make things work.

Mids:
Kreuzer Gibbs Murphy
Boekhorst Cripps Cuningham
Some terrific outside speed here but it may be a little too early. Maybe.
Cuningham may seem to be early given relative, average VFL form, but there seems to be a lot of faith in him.

Forwards:
Thomas Jaksch CCurnow
Sumner Casboult Silvagni
Confident CCurnow will be a starter in 8 months time. Stretching it a little with Silvagni this early, but it wouldn't surprise either.
Jaksch is the one that has to step up and if not here, then in the back-line. Another year and we may get a little more size on him.
We know CCurnow and Silvagni are capable of kicking goals and may we worth persisting with.

Interchange: Kerridge Phillips ECurnow Sheehan
Nowhere near enough mids yet, for now but still wouldn't mind us getting games in some of the younger guys to foster the 66 game re-build.
McKay will need to nurse his body for a little while and start to make claims some time mid next year.

I just don't think we're going to be particularly keen on doubling up on players to be drafted/recruited and which is why I see forwards (goal-kickers) and mids being the priority for us. Nothing new I know but the point is that SOS and Bolton are going to have to massage this re-build very well and that will take having strong belief in who they've brought in and who they will bering in. Going to be interesting. Can't wait.

 

[DangerousD]

Pick 12ish works.

Good good, id offer 1400 points for pick 12, but doing this though we go from having 5 or 6 live picks in the draft to 3, if we go down this road i don't see how we can cut 10 players from the list.

 

[DangerousD]

Assuming we finish 6th, well have picks 24, 42 and 50 odd this year (as our 2nd and 3rd round picks) adds up to around 1400 points. Around the same value as pick 10.

If GWS score pick 10-12 (and they will have one in that range) we should swap them for it.

We should also swap next years 2nd round pick for one of Marchbank or Thommo.

I like the idea, but by doing this means we only get three selections in the draft, which is fine, but we can delist 10 and only have 3 draft picks.

 

[cfc4life]

Since we're naming names already here's my "pull your finger out or you're done" list:

Gorringe
Foster
Viojo-Rainbow
Buckley
Tutt
Walker
Jamison
Dick
Smith
Whiley
Armfield
Gowers (r)
Wood (r)
Gallucci (r)
Sheenan (r)

Bold is delist
Italics retire
The rest we should keep.

 

[DangerousD]

Whilst I liked what I saw from Gallucci during the preseason trials, what does he offer that we don't already have covered with Wright, Lamb and Sumner?

Sumner could turn in to a midfielder, Lamb might not make it and Wright isn't young. Galluci has lost this season due to injury and was tracking well before he went down.

 

[LordLucifer]

Forwards:
Thomas Jaksch CCurnow
Sumner Casboult Silvagni
Confident CCurnow will be a starter in 8 months time. Stretching it a little with Silvagni this early, but it wouldn't surprise either.
Jaksch is the one that has to step up and if not here, then in the back-line. Another year and we may get a little more size on him.
We know CCurnow and Silvagni are capable of kicking goals and may we worth persisting with.

Not the most attacking forward line I've ever seen.

I still of the opinion that Curnow will develop into a big-bodied midfielder and Silvagni a rebounding defender. As for Jaksch, I can't see him holding down CHF, if he is to make it (and I'm not convinced at all right now) then it will be as a third-marking tall.

McKay is the missing name in that lot, we are pinning a lot of hope on that young lad. He has a lot of development to make up which will take some time.

 

[HARKER]

Not the most attacking forward line I've ever seen.

I still of the opinion that Curnow will develop into a big-bodied midfielder and Silvagni a rebounding defender. As for Jaksch, I can't see him holding down CHF, if he is to make it (and I'm not convinced at all right now) then it will be as a third-marking tall.

McKay is the missing name in that lot, we are pinning a lot of hope on that young lad. He has a lot of development to make up which will take some time.

CCurnow is an attacking player as is Silvagni.

Point is that we really don't have the ready-made cattle, so what to do?
Develop your own, in CCurnow, Silvagni, McKay or shell out some stupid numbers for a Jenkins....can't believe he's being offered 750K+

Too early to predict who may be on offer but surely a KPF will be on the shopping list in a year or two.......and you're right about CCurnow.

 

[LordLucifer]

Point is that we really don't have the ready-made cattle, so what to do?
Develop your own, in CCurnow, Silvagni, McKay or shell out some stupid numbers for a Jenkins....can't believe he's being offered 750K+

Too early to predict who may be on offer but surely a KPF will be on the shopping list in a year or two.......and you're right about CCurnow.

No arguments there from me .......... its the only way to go if we are serious about achieving sustained success.

 

[Soapy V]

I can imagine a starting 22 something like this next year, should things go to plan.......excluding any new draftees or recruits.

Backs:
Simpson Weitering Tuohy
Byrne Plowman Docherty
No Jamison or Rowe for starters at least and a little short overall, but enough smarts to make things work.

Mids:
Kreuzer Gibbs Murphy
Boekhorst Cripps Cuningham
Some terrific outside speed here but it may be a little too early. Maybe.
Cuningham may seem to be early given relative, average VFL form, but there seems to be a lot of faith in him.

Forwards:
Thomas Jaksch CCurnow
Sumner Casboult Silvagni
Confident CCurnow will be a starter in 8 months time. Stretching it a little with Silvagni this early, but it wouldn't surprise either.
Jaksch is the one that has to step up and if not here, then in the back-line. Another year and we may get a little more size on him.
We know CCurnow and Silvagni are capable of kicking goals and may we worth persisting with.

Interchange: Kerridge Phillips ECurnow Sheehan
Nowhere near enough mids yet, for now but still wouldn't mind us getting games in some of the younger guys to foster the 66 game re-build.
McKay will need to nurse his body for a little while and start to make claims some time mid next year.

I just don't think we're going to be particularly keen on doubling up on players to be drafted/recruited and which is why I see forwards (goal-kickers) and mids being the priority for us. Nothing new I know but the point is that SOS and Bolton are going to have to massage this re-build very well and that will take having strong belief in who they've brought in and who they will bering in. Going to be interesting. Can't wait.

like it and gives us something to really look forward to. maybe add pick 5 marchbank steele pretia tomlinson omeara to that side and we look okay

 

[LordLucifer]

Apart from quality key position players (ie. tall), we also need to build a deep pool of gutsy mids.

Right now, all we have is Gibbs, Murphy & Cripps who pass muster IMO and then there are heap of others who may or may not make the grade and some others who are short-term options.

Compare that to the Swans midfield group of McVeigh, Heeney, Jack, Hanneberry, Kennedy & Parker who are all gilt-edged plus Lloyd & Mitchell as second-stringers.

 

[Blue87]

Tomlinson named for GWS, whats the better option:
1: He plays poorly and gets dropped back to the NEAFL, therefore he maybe cheaper come trade period or,
2: plays great, stays in the team, gets AFL games experience however his currency goes up come trade time?

 

[LordLucifer]

Tomlinson named for GWS, whats the better option:
1: He plays poorly and gets dropped back to the NEAFL, therefore he maybe cheaper come trade period or,
2: plays great, stays in the team, gets AFL games experience however his currency goes up come trade time?

If he plays poorly, then why would we want him anyway ???

 

[Chookie]

Apart from quality key position players (ie. tall), we also need to build a deep pool of gutsy mids.

Right now, all we have is Gibbs, Murphy & Cripps who pass muster IMO and then there are heap of others who may or may not make the grade and some others who are short-term options.

Couldn't agree more. Felt like for far too long we've been too reliant on Murph and Judd. i don't think it's any coincidence that Murph's best year, 2011, coincided with Judd's best year with us. The midfield load was spread more evenly. In recent years far too much has been placed on our best two or three players, without getting adequate support from the rest.

Ed Curnow has stepped up, and Kerridge is finding plenty of the footy (though didn't use it well against North), plus Cripps emerging as one of the best inside players in the competition and you can already see its started to lift the burden placed on Murphy and Gibbs. We need more of that.

If we fail to recruit well through the middle I feel in down the track we'll just end up being too reliant on Cripps.

 

[DangerousD]

If he plays poorly, then why would we want him anyway ???

A bad game this week shouldn't change the mind of anyone. It would be hard knowing you are on the fringe and one foot wrong and you're gone. Some players need faith and confidence shown in them to thrive and develop. He would know he is still just making up the numbers and if he is unhappy it will come through in his form.

 

[passmark]

Given the massive reservoir of talent GWS has, the rest of the comp are relying on them having off years or not playing the MCG that well.

It reminds me of the WCE from 90-96. They won two but (IMO) had a team that was superior to everyone else by some margin.

If anything GWS may even be stronger.

We need to a list that gets us around the top 4 and then need a bit of luck.

 

[Mezzoculo]

If he plays poorly, then why would we want him anyway ???

Because he is being played OUT OF POSITION in the seniors. As I said to you previously.

 

[LordLucifer]

Because he is being played OUT OF POSITION in the seniors. As I said to you previously.

If he is good enough and wants it hard enough he will overcome that issue (well apart from being thrown into the ruck).

 

[Mezzoculo]

If he is good enough and wants it hard enough he will overcome that issue (well apart from being thrown into the ruck).

That's very simplistic.

 

[DaVillaBlues]

Starting to think the MC and Bolton have put a line through Nick Graham, if he keeps getting close to BOG every week in the VFL and not getting a call up to the seniors, that's pretty much alarm bell ringing time. Think he's contracted for another season, but it's hard to see him not being traded or delisted after then, and it's a shame because he's worked pretty hard and seems like a nice lad, but unfortunately, he isn't the line breaking, gut running midfield option that we need.

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

Starting to think the MC and Bolton have put a line through Nick Graham, if he keeps getting close to BOG every week in the VFL and not getting a call up to the seniors, that's pretty much alarm bell ringing time. Think he's contracted for another season, but it's hard to see him not being traded or delisted after then, and it's a shame because he's worked pretty hard and seems like a nice lad, but unfortunately, he isn't the line breaking, gut running midfield option that we need.

...OR... he is playing great but still working on things that Bolts has identified.
...OR... he is playing great but there's no immediate spot for him to take in the side.

It doesn't have to be 'he plays seniors or he's gone at the end of the year'.

 

[gandaal]

Bold is delist
Italics retire
The rest we should keep.

Even Gorringe himself would put his name in bold at this point.

 

[HARKER]

Starting to think the MC and Bolton have put a line through Nick Graham, if he keeps getting close to BOG every week in the VFL and not getting a call up to the seniors, that's pretty much alarm bell ringing time. Think he's contracted for another season, but it's hard to see him not being traded or delisted after then, and it's a shame because he's worked pretty hard and seems like a nice lad, but unfortunately, he isn't the line breaking, gut running midfield option that we need.

Still feel he'll be at Geelong next year.
Can't see any immediate need but if they were keen earlier before, they may still be now....like us with Jaksch and Tomlinson.
Sometimes you fall in love and just can't fall back out

 

[passmark]

Still feel he'll be at Geelong next year.
Can't see any immediate need but if they were keen earlier before, they may still be now....like us with Jaksch and Tomlinson.
Sometimes you fall in love and just can't fall back out

.and vikky verka.

 

[Soapy V]

Still feel he'll be at Geelong next year.
Can't see any immediate need but if they were keen earlier before, they may still be now....like us with Jaksch and Tomlinson.

i am hoping that the discussion has been you need to work on one or two key things over the next month, get them right and then youll be back in. a lot of coaches work in blocks of 4 plus weeks rather than 1 or 2. my feel is that jaksch was the same. he needed to work on some key areas and they may have felt that full games at VFL level were more beneficial for his development. graham may well be better getting a full run on the ball at vfl as opposed to playing high hf in the seniors. get form, a few things right, learn and improve and then come back in. bolton being a teaching coach may well look at the longer term than just week to week. everyone is different