Bluemour Discussion Thread IV

[Cutz]

Look SOS, is clearly better than what we had.

But let's not confuse SOS (full back of the century) with SOS (List Manager).

The same as we've confuse Stephen Kernahan (great CHF) with Stephen Kernahan (Carlton President).

We are certainly in a better position now with SOS list manager - but there are very questionable deals which haven't worked out for us - and to just hero worship SOS is just foolish

Like ?

 

[agro]

Like ?

Trading for GWS contracted rubbish players Lamb, Summer, Phillips and not securing our target player Tomlinson,

 

[Unknown Origin]

Trading for GWS contracted rubbish players Lamb, Summer, Phillips and not securing our target player Tomlinson,

Our real target for the scenario you have mentioned was Plowman. Last I recall, he now plays for us.

Sumner, phillips and Lamb were salary dumps here, letting us secure plowman for pick 28.

Get your facts right champ!

 

[Cutz]

Trading for GWS contracted rubbish players Lamb, Summer, Phillips and not securing our target player Tomlinson,

agro..must admit..your a hard task master....!

See this is when it gets a tad complex..cause I rate Philips and Lamb..Not so much Sumner .... Philips has a stress fracture in his foot...and Lamb appears to of stepped up abit in recent times.. Sumner may be carrying an injury I dont know..But he doesn't look like he'll cut it..

Need to remember though that SOS brought these guys at a time when our list was in a dire state...Picking Sumner (who was a fairly high draft pick) along with Philips is astute recruiting as far as Im concerned.

Philips should go round again next year...and so should Lamb..

 

[Jimmae]

Lamb was the salary cap dump, while Sumner and Phillips were development opportunities.

GWS couldn't afford to keep Phillips, Sumner and Plowman on their list given how many games they'd produced to that point.

 

[HBF]

I think you are missing the point. We didn't need Tuohy. SOS low balled him so he would take the Cats offer. We've got countless others that can play half back.

Palmer being on the list is not taking the place of a future Chris Judd, its more likely preventing DVR or Tutt from an extra year.

GWS needed a first Rd pick to accommodate Richmond in the Deledio trade and salary cap room to fit him in, and we provided both by giving them Geelong's 2018 first and taking Palmers salary off their books.

You claimed SOS is naive in trading.

He is in no way naive, and is perhaps the most cunning negotiator of all the list managers. He has realised that picks and players aren't the only currency available in trading. List spots and salary cap room are the 2 commodities that we currently have in abundance and he is using them to our advantage to secure high end young talent.

You need to look at the big picture.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Can you post here more often.
That is one bloody brilliant post.

 

[agro]

Our real target for the scenario you have mentioned was Plowman. Last I recall, he now plays for us.

Sumner, phillips and Lamb were salary dumps here, letting us secure plowman for pick 28.

Get your facts right champ!

Our target was not Plowman - it WAS Tomlinson.


You may want to go back and check your facts challenger.

 

[JustaBattler]

Fact - Jones is the best tall defender at Carlton right now....
Fact - A fit Alex Sylvagni is probably #2 best defender right now
Fact - A fit Rowe despite his age is a better defender than Marchbank / Macreadie and Williamson right now.

Inconvenient fact#1 - Simpson has been playing CRAPOLA for many weeks now
Inconvenient fact #2 - Docherty is a very unreliable kick.

Obvious to anyone - Carlton lacks run and A grade kicking capability from HBF - net result is turnover after turnover and easy opposition entries week in week out. This on top of the weakest, shallowest and least developed midfield capability in AFL.

No coach can put together a game plan based on losing every one on one and butchering pretty much every exit from defense.

Sorry Tuohy to Geelong was a STOOPID anyway objective observation can look at it.

 

[HBF]

Expecting him to be starting on the field round 1 of 2018.

He'd be deadly off half-back with his speed and nice kicking.

So am I.
Running off HB or playing on the wing should be his target for next year.

 

[Unknown Origin]

Lamb was the salary cap dump, while Sumner and Phillips were development opportunities.

GWS couldn't afford to keep Phillips, Sumner and Plowman on their list given how many games they'd produced to that point.

As it turns out,

Our target was not Plowman - it WAS Tomlinson.


You may want to go back and check your facts challenger.

It was most definately Plowman, SOS had him earmarked out long before the trade period.

Tomilson was completely different. We were prepared to offer up Pick 11 from memory for him but GWS baulked at the last minute.

 

[LanceRomance]

Our target was not Plowman - it WAS Tomlinson.


You may want to go back and check your facts challenger.

Tomlinson was contracted... Was almost ours and then freo went all nuff nuff over mccarthy.. Also contracted.... GWS refused to let either go.


Carlton were ready to pull the trigger on an announcement for Tomlinson too. Set up their media and everything in the last 30 mins of 2015 trade week.

 

[Unknown Origin]

As it turns out,


It was most definately Plowman, SOS had him earmarked out long before the trade period.

Tomilson was completely different. We were prepared to offer up Pick 11 from memory for him but GWS baulked at the last minute.

Also note, If GWS had of accepted our offer of pick 11 for Tomilson, we would not have Curnow. You'd be ok with that???

 

[LanceRomance]

Also note, If GWS had of accepted our offer of pick 11 for Tomilson, we would not have Curnow. You'd be ok with that???

I actually think it was pick 19 or whatever it was we used for Cuningham

 

[NumberEight]

Inconvenient fact #2 - Docherty is a very unreliable kick..

Umm..wot?

 

[Cutz]

Our target was not Plowman - it WAS Tomlinson.


You may want to go back and check your facts challenger.

So he missed out on Tomlinson. Thats not a fail. Thats just a miss.

Particularly in the back drop of still getting Plowman.

 

[JustaBattler]

Umm..wot?

Watch the game just played.

 

[ShanDog]

Do we still get Cerra and Coffield at picks 8 and 9?

Pffft what do I look like, someone who has a clue?

I don't bother watching potential draftees. I recognise I far too removed from the process of recruitment to have any real idea about 17 year old footballers from all over the country. I leave it to the people paid for it.

 

[NumberEight]

Watch the game just played.

So one poor game and hes an unreliable kick?

Hes the best kick on the bloody list!

 

[crazybear]

Our target was not Plowman - it WAS Tomlinson.


You may want to go back and check your facts challenger.

Had we secured Tomlinson it would have cost us Charlie Curnow. I say thank God we didn't get Tomlinson.

 

[JustaBattler]

So one poor game and hes an unreliable kick?

Hes the best kick on the bloody list!

Reliable kicks have the occassional duffer - unreliable kicks get down to 50% on a 'bad day'or worse.

Best accurate kick in defense right now under pressure or not is Jones - by a long way ....and btw - my post was about why I hated losing Tuohy and laugh at the irrational rationalising about it that goes on in here.

 

[Smalls0304]

Had we secured Tomlinson it would have cost us Charlie Curnow. I say thank God we didn't get Tomlinson.

I think it would have cost us McKay. We only selected him first because Adelaide wanted him and knew C.Curnow would be there by the next pick. Id take either of them before Tomlinson though

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Trading for GWS contracted rubbish players Lamb, Summer, Phillips and not securing our target player Tomlinson,

Thank God the Tomlinson deal didn't go through. We got Charlie with that pick.

 

[BigFrizz36]

Our target was not Plowman - it WAS Tomlinson.


You may want to go back and check your facts challenger.

my memory was that they were 2 completely deals. the crows gave us kerridge and pick 28 for menzel. 28 was the on traded to gws for plowman, phillips, lamb and sumner.
on the last day of the trade period sos tried to trade in tomlinson for the pick that we eventually used on charlie. if it had happened we would have either moved up for charlie and missed harry or missed charlie. by accident it looks like a great outcome for us.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

We could have had the superstar Jordan Murdoch....

 

[ShanDog]

Look SOS, is clearly better than what we had.

But let's not confuse SOS (full back of the century) with SOS (List Manager).

The same as we've confuse Stephen Kernahan (great CHF) with Stephen Kernahan (Carlton President).

We are certainly in a better position now with SOS list manager - but there are very questionable deals which haven't worked out for us - and to just hero worship SOS is just foolish

I'd say a good list manager is someone who can get the best out of each situation they are presented with. To expect 'wins' from every trade is not only counterintuitive (it's called a trade, not a "**** the other person over") but is not possible in reality. From what we've seen so far, I think SOS has done an excellent job in playing the cards he's been dealt and we are no doubt better overall than under previous management.