Past #18: Shaun Atley - delisted end '21 - 237 NM games / 44 NM goals - thanks Ats

[LuvtheKangas]

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...2=15&type=A&pid1=3463&pid2=3453&fid1=C&fid2=C

Most stats that Caddy wins are marginally higher than Shaun. Some he wins purely by playing more up forward than Shaun, like goals a game. They average the same goal assists by the way which I found interesting. It is interesting to see that Shaun smashes him in disposal efficiency though, I thought Shaun was a poor kick, hmmm.

I wouldn't take Caddy ahead of Atley.

Whatever. I'm not here to fight you in defense of the bog ordinary Caddy. You missed my point. The fact that their career stats are even comparable is an indictment on Atley's lack of development.

It also shows that stats are misleading, because there is no way on this earth that anyone could reasonably consider that 4 out of every 5 Atley disposals are effective. You do realise how this stat works, don't you? Those times when he has the ball, surges forward 10 metres, stops, panics, turns around and handballs backwards to a player in worse position - we got a lot of those special moments this year and last - well, they're counted as effective.

By the way Caddy was taken 10 picks before Atley and is at his third club.

Thanks, Captain Obvious. I don't think this is news to anyone who follows the game.

 

[kangaspurs]

He played in a premiership team. That doesn't automatically make him a great player.

Actually, most Richmond fans will actually tell you he was a very good contributor to a premiership team.

 

[Gasometer]

He played in a premiership team. That doesn't automatically make him a great player.

Well then we may as well pack up the shop...are we playing for Premierships or what exactly?

 

[Saintly_]

What's lol about it?

Caddy gets the ball 0.1 times more per game than Shaun but Shaun uses it 13% better.

It's funny bitching about the 17th pick in the draft not fulfilling potential whilst talking up the 7th pick in the same draft who hasn't had a great career by any stretch of the imagination.

I'm happy with our pick in hindsight? Didn't say otherwise.

It was a rubbish draft.

Atley is a handy/ordinary player.

I'd prefer Caddy who's slightly above ordinary, but at least not scared, deer in headlight in traffic etc.

 

[Gasometer]

I'm happy with our pick in hindsight? Didn't say otherwise.

It was a rubbish draft.

Atley is a handy/ordinary player.

I'd prefer Caddy who's slightly above ordinary, but at least not scared, deer in headlight in traffic etc.

You reckon its deer on spotlights or uncoordinated?

 

[Dan]

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...2=15&type=A&pid1=3463&pid2=3453&fid1=C&fid2=C

Most stats that Caddy wins are marginally higher than Shaun. Some he wins purely by playing more up forward than Shaun, like goals a game. They average the same goal assists by the way which I found interesting. It is interesting to see that Shaun smashes him in disposal efficiency though, I thought Shaun was a poor kick, hmmm.

I wouldn't take Caddy ahead of Atley.

By the way Caddy was taken 10 picks before Atley and is at his third club.

We gave up four 1st rounders to get Anderson....

 

[Gasometer]

We gave up four 1st rounders to get Anderson....

Who?

 

[Jack Bradley]

We gave up four 1st rounders to get Anderson....

No 7 first rounders

 

[DarwinRoo]

Whatever. I'm not here to fight you in defense of the bog ordinary Caddy. You missed my point. The fact that their career stats are even comparable is an indictment on Atley's lack of development.

It also shows that stats are misleading, because there is no way on this earth that anyone could reasonably consider that 4 out of every 5 Atley disposals are effective. You do realise how this stat works, don't you? Those times when he has the ball, surges forward 10 metres, stops, panics, turns around and handballs backwards to a player in worse position - we got a lot of those special moments this year and last - well, they're counted as effective.



Thanks, Captain Obvious. I don't think this is news to anyone who follows the game.

If most of Atley's kicks were panicky kicks to no one or handballs that sold teammates into trouble then why has he not been dropped, traded or delisted if he is that bad of a disposer of the football?

Shaun Atley must be the worst player in the league and we must have the worst football department in the league for him to keep getting games.

 

[Saintly_]

You reckon its deer on spotlights or uncoordinated?

Combination of both, not a natural footballer.

 

[shintemaster]

Finished 10th in our best and fairest which I think isn't far off his year - which was a good one in a transitioning role IMO. He certainly improved from around rd 5-6 onwards - quite noticeable for mine.

When it comes down to it your 10th best player isn't your problem. Even if he gets pushed down the list by others. I have no doubt that if Shaun played as he did this year and was rated our 22nd best player we'd be holding up a premiership cup.

 

[remfan101]

I reckon Ats will play as close to a full-time mid next year, both on the wing and hopefully transitioning into more centre-square time. I'm not sure if he attended a single bounce this year, which is a bit strange considering he showed some great signs in that role in the JLT. Remember when he won 26 possessions mostly on the inside and was bursting out of packs and attacking the ball and the man like a natural inside mid? Then he never played that role again for the rest of the year. I still reckon he could be an asset to us in that role (which he played as a junior), as we really lack someone on the inside with explosive pace.

 

[Saintly_]

Finished 10th in our best and fairest which I think isn't far off his year - which was a good one in a transitioning role IMO. He certainly improved from around rd 5-6 onwards - quite noticeable for mine.

When it comes down to it your 10th best player isn't your problem. Even if he gets pushed down the list by others. I have no doubt that if Shaun played as he did this year and was rated our 22nd best player we'd be holding up a premiership cup.

Atley is not near our 10th best player with a fit list.

 

[GreatBradScott]

154 games. Jesus time flies.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

If most of Atley's kicks were panicky kicks to no one or handballs that sold teammates into trouble then why has he not been dropped, traded or delisted if he is that bad of a disposer of the football?

Shaun Atley must be the worst player in the league and we must have the worst football department in the league for him to keep getting games.

Hmmm, are your comprehension skills so lacking that you think that was what I was saying about Atley? I assume not, it's just a case of

 

[shintemaster]

Atley is not near our 10th best player with a fit list.

Time will tell.

I also rate players that can get on the park pretty much every week for a decade.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Time will tell.

I also rate players that can get on the park pretty much every week for a decade.

It seems that umpires don't, as evidenced by a grand total of 2 Brownlow votes for someone on the park pretty much every week for a decade.

It was in one game: round 5, 2012. (Fun fact: Liam Anthony got 2 votes in round 17 of the same year).

The Brownlow is not the be all and end all, of course, but it's interesting that he only caught the umpires' attention once in 154 goes. Indeed, it sort of tallies with my observations and is the source of my disappointment - he has never once torn open a game. Well, maybe once, almost.

 

[shintemaster]

It seems that umpires don't, as evidenced by a grand total of 2 Brownlow votes for someone on the park pretty much every week for a decade.

It was in one game: round 5, 2012. (Fun fact: Liam Anthony got 2 votes in round 17 of the same year).

The Brownlow is not the be all and end all, of course, but it's interesting that he only caught the umpires' attention once in 154 goes. Indeed, it sort of tallies with my observations and is the source of my disappointment - he has never once torn open a game. Well, maybe once, almost.

I know you're playing Devil's Advocate - but I couldn't give two sh*ts what umpires vote for. I rate what I see and what I see is a player that does his job and is still improving. He's not the best player in the league, nor the best player in our team, but when he's the worst guy in our team we'll be smashing the sh*t out of everyone. I don't want to ignore what players can do to improve but I just think he's so far from a problem for us at the moment that it's not worth spending time on it for the most part.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

I know you're playing Devil's Advocate - but I couldn't give two sh*ts what umpires vote for. I rate what I see and what I see is a player that does his job and is still improving. He's not the best player in the league, nor the best player in our team, but when he's the worst guy in our team we'll be smashing the sh*t out of everyone. I don't want to ignore what players can do to improve but I just think he's so far from a problem for us at the moment that it's not worth spending time on it for the most part.

Yeah, fair enough. I'm banging on about it to a greater degree than necessary. He's not really on my radar as part of the upcoming NMFC resurgence, simply because he hasn't improved in all that time, so he's unlikely to get any better from here.

This is a revised opinion, by the way, as I was more bullish on him mid-season. Then he disappointed in the back end. Again.

 

[shintemaster]

Yeah, fair enough. I'm banging on about it to a greater degree than necessary. He's not really on my radar as part of the upcoming NMFC resurgence, simply because he hasn't improved in all that time, so he's unlikely to get any better from here.

This is a revised opinion, by the way, as I was more bullish on him mid-season. Then he disappointed in the back end. Again.

Away from the heat of battle so to speak I'm happy to be a bit philosophical about it.

Not every player is the game changer, but a lot of players are better in the right team with the right balance. Based on this year I'm firmly of the opinion that Shaun Atley is a much better than average player if we can put the right guys around him. I think he won't ever be what some hoped but you can't build a team by throwing out everyone that isn't what you think they could be. His average games are still better than plenty of guys best games.

 

[Gasometer]

If most of Atley's kicks were panicky kicks to no one or handballs that sold teammates into trouble then why has he not been dropped, traded or delisted if he is that bad of a disposer of the football?

Shaun Atley must be the worst player in the league and we must have the worst football department in the league for him to keep getting games.

You could argue the same point for half the list the past 3 years.

Picked regardless of form...bar one or two.

 

[Gasometer]

It seems that umpires don't, as evidenced by a grand total of 2 Brownlow votes for someone on the park pretty much every week for a decade.

It was in one game: round 5, 2012. (Fun fact: Liam Anthony got 2 votes in round 17 of the same year).

The Brownlow is not the be all and end all, of course, but it's interesting that he only caught the umpires' attention once in 154 goes. Indeed, it sort of tallies with my observations and is the source of my disappointment - he has never once torn open a game. Well, maybe once, almost.

Shannon Watt would have killed for 1 vote iirc.

 

[Saintly_]

Time will tell.

I also rate players that can get on the park pretty much every week for a decade.

Very low standards then.

Just because a guy turns up every week for his (massive) pay cheque doesn't impress, idiotic not to.

I don't rate Atley at all as a "quality" player.

 

[Snake_Baker]

I can't ever understand the knocks on Ats.

He's not perfect, but people are completely ******* kidding themselves if they don't rate him in our best 22.

I just can't take them seriously.

 

[Yoko and me]

Me and a mate to our best brownlow performer for next year after brownlow night. We both picked Atley. But both agreed that he'd needs to die his hair blonde. He is at the age and hopefully had the trust of the coaches to read the play on offence and do it off his own bat. He should be the one bursting off the centre square from the wing position. No thought of defending until if/ when it becomes apparent that he should. Tell turner to always block for him. He has seen mullet and Gibson go. There is no way he is not planning on stepping it up. Simple instructions should be to read ball getters in the centre then run. If you don't see a target handball and run past again. I think his stagnation is purely mental. Back the boy in. He has grown a beard and that means that this shut is serious.

Who seriously thinks we can tank enough to be bottom four without injuries. Forget 2018 draft picks. We want to win.