Coaching Staff Brendon Bolton - Senior Coach - Locked in until end of 2020 (23/5/18)

[gab213]

What we really need is a couple of wins, that will calm things down at least for a little while.

 

[thylacine60]

rubbish - I hate you!

 

[95bluemember]

I am not sure what the problem is if people come onto a forum and have a whinge or a vent ? Why do some find it so offensive?

Posters are entitled to their opinion and there is no site rule that says only positive and glowing endorsements of the club are allowed.

Your opinion is more than valid given the circumstances.
I would love to know if you think Bolts would survive a loss to the Lions if we go into that game 0 and 11?
I hope we don't end up there, but if that eventuates I think Bolts would get the lemonade and sars.....

 

[Metalcrusher]

I've had this little argument twice over the last two weeks with TheHeatleyStand.

People are absolutely entitled to their opinion. The issue is, if my opinion about your stated opinion is that yours is wrong/full of effluence, should I then refrain from saying so?

Freedom of opinion is not freedom from criticism. If you are unwilling or unable to argue your point, then you are either wrong or unable to adequately express your argument (for whatever reason; you could be unwilling to put in the time to do so. If that's the case for the collective, PLEASE try to do so!) and the criticism your opinion receives is warranted, provided it doesn't attack the poster, merely the argument.

It is important for ideas to be challenged, to ensure they hold up under pressure. In a way, this public pressure against Bolton is a good thing, as it will prove whether or not we've really changed, or if it's cosmetic. If I refuse to argue something I feel or think is correct, and a dominant ideology rises in my absence - 'We're Carlton, **** the rest' - then it is my fault if that ideology fails.

Argue every point, articulate why you're right or another is wrong. Strive to be respectful. But accept a challenge with rigor, energy, and most importantly with more than just your opinion.

LOTS OF PEEPS ON THIS FORUM ENDORSE THIS POST.

 

[Neese]

Your opinion is more than valid given the circumstances.
I would love to know if you think Bolts would survive a loss to the Lions if we go into that game 0 and 11?
I hope we don't end up there, but if that eventuates I think Bolts would get the lemonade and sars.....

Why do you keep pushing this 0 and 11 agenda?

 

[thylacine60]

extreme negativity is extreme

 

[GoBlues!]

I've had this little argument twice over the last two weeks with TheHeatleyStand.

People are absolutely entitled to their opinion. The issue is, if my opinion about your stated opinion is that yours is wrong/full of effluence, should I then refrain from saying so?

Freedom of opinion is not freedom from criticism. If you are unwilling or unable to argue your point, then you are either wrong or unable to adequately express your argument (for whatever reason; you could be unwilling to put in the time to do so. If that's the case for the collective, PLEASE try to do so!) and the criticism your opinion receives is warranted, provided it doesn't attack the poster, merely the argument.

It is important for ideas to be challenged, to ensure they hold up under pressure. In a way, this public pressure against Bolton is a good thing, as it will prove whether or not we've really changed, or if it's cosmetic. If I refuse to argue something I feel or think is correct, and a dominant ideology rises in my absence - 'We're Carlton, **** the rest' - then it is my fault if that ideology fails.

Argue every point, articulate why you're right or another is wrong. Strive to be respectful. But accept a challenge with rigor, energy, and most importantly with more than just your opinion.

 

[95bluemember]

Why do you keep pushing this 0 and 11 agenda?

because that's the reality we are faced with, you think I have some kind of vodoo doll with Bolts head on it?
How many losses would it take for you to be no longer convinced it's working?
For me that is a loss to the Lions if we are zip and 11.

 

[thylacine60]

then what, 95? what's your plan or what do you think the club should do?

 

[AceAndy]

I would love to know if you think Bolts would survive a loss to the Lions if we go into that game 0 and 11? I hope we don't end up there, but if that eventuates I think Bolts would get the lemonade and sars.....

I hope we dont go into the Brisbane game 0 and 11 but seeing the next five matches it seems quite likely. If we do lose to Brisbane i dont think Bolton will be shown the door.

At the end of the season if we havent won a game (I think we will probably win a couple at least in the second half of the year) I think he maybe in trouble.

 

[95bluemember]

then what, 95? what's your plan or what do you think the club should do?

I don't have one, I just don't see him surviving such a scenario. If that was to happen obviously Barker would take over.
SOS and McKay would also be pushed out I would imagine?

 

[thylacine60]

I hope we dont go into the Brisbane game 0 and 11 but seeing the next five matches it seems quite likely. If we do lose to Brisbane i dont think Bolton will be shown the door.

At the end of the season if we havent won a game (I think we will probably win a couple at least in the second half of the year) I think he maybe in trouble.

I think your comment is based on sound logic, Mr Andy, and thank you for posting in such a clear, respectful manner. Well done to you & your family.

 

[thylacine60]

I don't have one, I just don't see him surviving such a scenario. If that was to happen obviously Barker would take over.
SOS and McKay would also be pushed out I would imagine?

See that's where you have the tough job and I the easy one. I'm ok with where we are ultimately headed. If you want to criticize the club and demand change, you pretty much need to come up with some solutions. Otherwise you might sound like a bitter, cranky fan - and you don't want that - do ya?

 

[Neese]

because that's the reality we are faced with, you think I have some kind of vodoo doll with Bolts head on it?
How many losses would it take for you to be no longer convinced it's working?
For me that is a loss to the Lions if we are zip and 11.

How about we wait until the end of the season and evaluate? This is what the club is doing with the 66 game rebuild. We'll be getting back better players throughout the rest of the season.
You seriously think we will lose 11 games in a row?
I am not focused on the number of wins. It's not that black and white. To concentrate on just games won is narrow minded in my opinion.

 

[95bluemember]

See that's where you have the tough job and I the easy one. I'm ok with where we are ultimately headed. If you want to criticize the club and demand change, you pretty much need to come up with some solutions. Otherwise you might sound like a bitter, cranky fan - and you don't want that - do ya?

I'm fine with the rebuild, although it is frustrating. If the season heads further south and gets really ugly then history tells us there will be people held accountable.

 

[Neese]

History never repeats I tell myself before I go to sleep...and there's a light shining in the dark, leading me on towards a change of heart

 

[95bluemember]

How about we wait until the end of the season and evaluate? This is what the club is doing with the 66 game rebuild. We'll be getting back better players throughout the rest of the season.
You seriously think we will lose 11 games in a row?
I am not focused on the number of wins. It's not that black and white. To concentrate on just games won is narrow minded in my opinion.

Given our form and injuries we must brace for that scenario, it's a results based business.

 

[Neese]

I'm not sure you are understanding the concept of a 66 game rebuild.

 

[gab213]

At the end of last year, I was looking forward to an increase in the number of wins this season.

My expectations were lowered a bit once Docherty went down with his injury, then the spate of injuries we have suffered since the beginning of the season meant they have lowered again.

I'd probably be happy if we managed 2 or 3 wins from here.

If the club is true to its word and is fully committed to this rebuild then there is no way Bolton should be removed from his position under any circumstance this year, in fact, I think he needs at least another two years from now.

If the club isn't true to its word then I'm done with it.

 

[Gethelred]

At the end of last year, I was looking forward to an increase in the number of wins this season.

My expectations were lowered a bit once Docherty went down with his injury, then the spate of injuries we have suffered since the beginning of the season meant they have lowered again.

I'd probably be happy if we managed 2 or 3 wins from here.

If the club is true to its word and is fully committed to this rebuild then there is no way Bolton should be removed from his position under any circumstance this year, in fact, I think he needs at least another two years from now.

If the club isn't true to its word then I'm done with it.

This.

Next year is when the rebuild has been done; from this point, we have the list in a position in which we should be able to add/delist as we see fit, instead of trading away talent for draft picks in order to get the list into an average state. From there, we should see the talent becoming more consistent and their increased inputs driving us towards greater onfield success.

I've a post in the expectations for 2018 thread, in which I stated that I expected 8 wins for the year as a minimum, on the basis we would be able to moneyball Gibbs and Doc's inputs over the course of the year via improved input from the young midfielders and the forwards, and a settled back six growing in maturity. My caveat was, provided injuries don't cripple our midfield, the way they absolutely have; the weakness of our midfield has increased how poor we are immeasurably, unable to defend due to the quality of entries and unable to attack because we don't have the ball enough and when we do we cannot dispose of it well enough.

That said, I still expect us to get on something of a roll in the second half of the year, as we get players back. There's a reason Sydney lost their first six last year, and they are the most consistent side of the modern era.

 

[norway blue]

As a ten year everyday reader and now tentative poster I have thoroughly enjoyed every post ever written regarding the Fortunes of the navy blues. People’s passion and differing opinion does not affect my love for the Carlton jumper. We have to stay the course , we have no choice . 19 onwards the full team + new additions will continue to gel , build , train , practice and implement the game plan,s and grow into a tough skilled unit . Then start to challenge and rise up.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[teagueyubeauty]

I don't have one, I just don't see him surviving such a scenario. If that was to happen obviously Barker would take over.
SOS and McKay would also be pushed out I would imagine?

Ill give you a tip, I’ll be out to and I’d dare say a fair few others.

Why? Because the club has been open and honest, did what the majority of supporters have wanted for eons and then when it gets tough go back to exactly what the majority of the members hate about the club.

It would be a wrong decision of monumental proportions as I truly believe the vast majority of supporters are very aware of where we are at, why and where we are going. The club has been unbelievably open, historically a closed shop, about the plan and for them to turn around and do a knee jerk reaction because a minority of the supporters have zero patience or vision because they want it now would shock me to the core.

I’d b done, local footy only for eternity.

 

[BlueVision]

At the end of last year, I was looking forward to an increase in the number of wins this season.

My expectations were lowered a bit once Docherty went down with his injury, then the spate of injuries we have suffered since the beginning of the season meant they have lowered again.

I'd probably be happy if we managed 2 or 3 wins from here.

If the club is true to its word and is fully committed to this rebuild then there is no way Bolton should be removed from his position under any circumstance this year, in fact, I think he needs at least another two years from now.

If the club isn't true to its word then I'm done with it.

Well said, couldn't agree more

 

[ODNBlue]

I am not sure what the problem is if people come onto a forum and have a whinge or a vent ? Why do some find it so offensive?

Posters are entitled to their opinion and there is no site rule that says only positive and glowing endorsements of the club are allowed.

IMO there is no problem with people coming on to whinge or vent. The passions associated with following sport often necessitate it. The problem arises when said venter finds dissenting views AND then claims that their not allowed to hold their opinion. The fact is, everyone has the right to make whatever statement about their subjective view of the world. What they do not have is the right to expect that their statement will exist in a vacuum of non-response. Furthermore, they do not get to claim that it is simply groupthink that leads to opposition to their position. Groupthink certainly exists, but it is not the only reason why people hold the opinions they do. To suggest otherwise is simply dismissive.

Discussions on the relative merits of the direction being taken by a football club, especially after our start to this season, are bound to find passionate, and opposing, viewpoints. People need to recognise that there is a difference between responses that say, "no, I disagree," and those that say, "no, I disagree and you're a moron for holding your view." Unfortunately, people hold their opinions so personally that it appears that when faced with the former, they respond as if it were the latter.

To put it out there, my belief is that the process the Carlton Football Club is undertaking is the best one to undertake in order to achieve sustained success. There is a part of me that needs to believe this because believing otherwise would be, for me, unpalatable. Knowing this, i recognise that my own biases will have me view this through Navy Blue coloured glasses. Recognising this, I attempt to account for these biases and I still come to the opinion that we're on the right track. However, I don't expect that everyone feels the same way I do. I know that their are some who hold radically different opinions. That's okay. Just don't expect me to agree.

 

[ShanDog]

I think some of the general dislike for negativity from "regular" posters comes from a perception that a loss or hard times results in "new" or less frequently seen posters coming in out of nowhere to vent and then disappearing again. I'm not saying that's what happens, but it's the perception, and it means some hostility appears pretty quickly.