Changes v Port Power est 1997

[Tex200]

Ellis-Yolman’s not getting dropped, nor is Greenwood. As others have mentioned, I think the club will look at using M. Crouch, Greenwood and CEY to do a lot of the inside heavy lifting, whilst allowing Sloane, Gibbs +/- B. Crouch to increase their outside minutes. This essentially gives us a number of different change up for if we’re losing the inside/contested ball. Finals are all about contested footy. Hopefully the addition of CEY, Gibbs and a fit Greenwood will give us a bit more of a buffer to getting smashed in this regard like we did GF day.

Atkins isn’t getting dropped either, btw, he’s an outside midfielder who’s clearly in Pykes best 22. He’s not getting dropped for 1 off game, outside mids always have some element of inconsistency, which is why I’d prefer to limit the number in our side, instead using the likes of Gibbs, Sloane and B.Crouch to do a lot of the outside work.

Walker will come in for Fogarty.
Sloane in for Milera.
The question will then be whether they bring in Knight for Gallucci. It wouldn’t surprise if knights forced to come back through SANFL and they give Gallucci a bit more of a run.

Although they’ll probably find another injury during the week to make these discussions moot.

Agreed. There's no chance Cam is dropped.

His haters on here are clearly unable to get past the fact he has taken longer than normal to establish himself.

Not everyone has the same journey. His has been more complex than most.

Why people just can't be happy we have a 192cm beast successfully doing our inside dirty work is beyond me.

 

[earlsta]

Gotta say, it is nice though to have a tough selection call to make.

When we're all fit, we have a bloody tough side to get in to

Ideally we’d have Brad Crouch, CEY & Greenwood as our 4th, 5th, 6th midfielders in our current rotation. Pretty bada$$.

 

[Shaz2012]

Ideally we’d have Brad Crouch, CEY & Greenwood as our 4th, 5th, 6th midfielders in our current rotation. Pretty bada$$.

Problem is, there is also Douglas tearing it up. A good problem to have. Tough decisions will have to be made. If we win the flag, we will have picked the perfect combination. If we dont, then we should have done X, Y, Z.

We will learn a hell of a lot about this new group of players if the changes this week are Tex and Sloane for Fog and Milera. If it works, then the next question is, can we also squeeze in Brad without taking out one of the 6 mids that will play this week.

 

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

Ideally we’d have Brad Crouch, CEY & Greenwood as our 4th, 5th, 6th midfielders in our current rotation. Pretty bada$$.

I don't think CEY makes the team when we have all of Mrouch, Gibbs, Sloane, Brouch and Greenwood available. I'd put Douglas in the midfield rotations ahead of him as I think he offers more points of difference.

 

[Boundryump]

I don't think CEY makes the team when we have all of Mrouch, Gibbs, Sloane, Brouch and Greenwood available. I'd put Douglas in the midfield rotations ahead of him as I think he offers more points of difference.

Can CEY play back in defence?

 

[rocket18]

Agreed. There's no chance Cam is dropped.

His haters on here are clearly unable to get past the fact he has taken longer than normal to establish himself.

Not everyone has the same journey. His has been more complex than most.

Why people just can't be happy we have a 192cm beast successfully doing our inside dirty work is beyond me.

Doesn't matter what Cam does some people have made up their minds.

Just see Marty and The Rabbit for examples, just can't get past the fact they were wrong.

Cam has done very well as an inside mid, yes he is old for a 20 gamer but he is coming back from a knee - he WILL continue to improve as he gets continuity.

These blokes still heaping shit on Cam will look just as dopey as Marty and The Rabbit.

 

[NTRabbit]

You may choose to live in a rose coloured fantasy, but I don't

 

[Bazz_27]

Problem is, there is also Douglas tearing it up. A good problem to have. Tough decisions will have to be made. If we win the flag, we will have picked the perfect combination. If we dont, then we should have done X, Y, Z.

We will learn a hell of a lot about this new group of players if the changes this week are Tex and Sloane for Fog and Milera. If it works, then the next question is, can we also squeeze in Brad without taking out one of the 6 mids that will play this week.

Douglas would be a weapon as a 70% forward and 30% mid though. We can afford to play him down forward as he is so creative. Not good for Galluci / Murphy. Our best Forward Line IMO is

B Brown Talia Doedee
HB Laird Harto Smith
C Sloane Mrouch Seed
HF Douglas JJ Lynch
FF Eddie Tex McLovin
R- Sauce Gibbs Brouch
Int- Greenwood, Atkins/Mackay, Knight, Milera
E- CEY, Kelly, Otten, Mackay/ Atkins

Doubt we will ever see those 22 on the field.

 

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

Can CEY play back in defence?

I don't think he'd get a spot in defence ahead of Kelly, Doedee, Brown or Laird. Similarly, I think there are a lot of better pure forward options.

So I think he's midfield or bust and with a full squad to choose from, there are too many midfielders ahead of him in the queue.

 

[Shaz2012]

I don't think CEY makes the team when we have all of Mrouch, Gibbs, Sloane, Brouch and Greenwood available. I'd put Douglas in the midfield rotations ahead of him as I think he offers more points of difference.

Douglas still worries me to be honest. I know he is the talk of the town this week and questioning him will be highly unpopular. But I still feel he is very hot and cold. Came in off a full preseason, so he should have been good to go. Looking at his form this year:

Opponent D AF SC
CAR 28 115 132
GCS 21 113 124
SYD 17 71 63
COL 14 76 74
STK 22 93 114
ESS 13 38 50

Just going on AFL Fantasy or Supercoach here because it gives a single score, it suggests that he has only played well against the poor teams so far this year. His performances against Essendon, Sydney and Collingwood were average. The gap between his good games and bad games is significant. Would be interested to drag feenix67 into this because on the Crow Cast he has similar questions on Atkins on big vs small games. I am not hanging Douglas here, and I didnt feel feenix had hung Atkins yet either, but just noting that I still have my concerns. Douglas is a senior player so he doesnt have the luxury of seeing the upside in him.

Douglas has earnt the benefit of the doubt and the right to be a preferred player in the 22. But I still question which two players from Douglas, CEY and Greenwood should be in our best 22 come finals. If we are looking for a point of difference to the team we sent into the GF against the tigers last year. Well this could be one that might be looked at.

 

[Bazz_27]

Douglas still worries me to be honest. I know he is the talk of the town this week and questioning him will be highly unpopular. But I still feel he is very hot and cold. Came in off a full preseason, so he should have been good to go. Looking at his form this year:

Opponent D AF SC
CAR 28 115 132
GCS 21 113 124
SYD 17 71 63
COL 14 76 74
STK 22 93 114
ESS 13 38 50

Just going on AFL Fantasy or Supercoach here because it gives a single score, it suggests that he has only played well against the poor teams so far this year. His performances against Essendon, Sydney and Collingwood were average. The gap between his good games and bad games is significant. Would be interested to drag feenix67 into this because on the Crow Cast he has similar questions on Atkins on big vs small games. I am not hanging Douglas here, and I didnt feel feenix had hung Atkins yet either, but just noting that I still have my concerns. Douglas is a senior player so he doesnt have the luxury of seeing the upside in him.

Douglas has earnt the benefit of the doubt and the right to be a preferred player in the 22. But I still question which two players from Douglas, CEY and Greenwood should be in our best 22 come finals. If we are looking for a point of difference to the team we sent into the GF against the tigers last year. Well this could be one that might be looked at.

You are comparing two in and under contested mids to a goal kicking mid. very different. Check douglas stats for this year:

 

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

Douglas still worries me to be honest. I know he is the talk of the town this week and questioning him will be highly unpopular. But I still feel he is very hot and cold. Came in off a full preseason, so he should have been good to go. Looking at his form this year:

Opponent D AF SC
CAR 28 115 132
GCS 21 113 124
SYD 17 71 63
COL 14 76 74
STK 22 93 114
ESS 13 38 50

Just going on AFL Fantasy or Supercoach here because it gives a single score, it suggests that he has only played well against the poor teams so far this year. His performances against Essendon, Sydney and Collingwood were average. The gap between his good games and bad games is significant. Would be interested to drag feenix67 into this because on the Crow Cast he has similar questions on Atkins on big vs small games. I am not hanging Douglas here, and I didnt feel feenix had hung Atkins yet either, but just noting that I still have my concerns. Douglas is a senior player so he doesnt have the luxury of seeing the upside in him.

Douglas has earnt the benefit of the doubt and the right to be a preferred player in the 22. But I still question which two players from Douglas, CEY and Greenwood should be in our best 22 come finals. If we are looking for a point of difference to the team we sent into the GF against the tigers last year. Well this could be one that might be looked at.

Fantasy scores don't give you points for shutting down an opposition player. If we selected a team based on fantasy scores, Talia would never make the team.

Douglas looks like he had a poor game against Sydney whereas, in reality, he had a big role in keeping Kennedy out of the game. I think he's often being given roles that require him to sacrifice his personal stats for the betterment of the team.

 

[Vader]

Just going on AFL Fantasy or Supercoach here because it gives a single score, it suggests that he has only played well against the poor teams so far this year. His performances against Essendon, Sydney and Collingwood were average. The gap between his good games and bad games is significant. Would be interested to drag feenix67 into this because on the Crow Cast he has similar questions on Atkins on big vs small games. I am not hanging Douglas here, and I didnt feel feenix had hung Atkins yet either, but just noting that I still have my concerns. Douglas is a senior player so he doesnt have the luxury of seeing the upside in him.

Just going off stats, or do you actually watch the game?

Douglas was extremely important in our win over Sydney. He was given the job of shutting down Josh Kennedy, and he did an almost flawless job. The only time Sydney got on a roll was when Douglas went off due to the blood rule, allowing Kennedy to get off the leash.

 

[Shaz2012]

You are comparing two in and under contested mids to a goal kicking mid. very different. Check douglas stats for this year:

View attachment 494679

True, but the point still stands that the good goal kicking mid performances came against the weaker teams. 1 goal from 13 touches in a loss against the bombers, off a full pre-season. No goals in the loss against the pies or the win against the swans. 5 goals against the Suns and the Blues. Best forward line will be Tex, JJ, Gov, Lynch, Eddie, plus one pressure forward and one rotation of the bench. To me Douglas is that logical option from the bench. Dont disagree with that. But he needs to be consistent for us in the big games moving forward. If he can't then I am not sure if he should be in the team when we have other options.

I have said that I think that only 2 of Douglas, Greenwood and Hugh can be in the 22 with everyone fit. We would only go down the path of Greenwood and CEY if we were prepared to give these two the brunt of the inside stoppage work. Then that brings Sloane, Gibbs and Brad Crouch to spend more time on ground in outside roles. I think Sloane and Gibbs in particular could give us a goal kicking mid with as much impact as Douglas if not more and they would rotate into the middle with much more impact than Douglas.

Its a good problem to have. Douglas has responded in the past and the past two games shows that he is not finished yet. I am less questioning of him now than I was a few weeks ago, but I want to see him keep going because Hugh and CEY have also been going well.

 

[Shaz2012]

Fantasy scores don't give you points for shutting down an opposition player. If we selected a team based on fantasy scores, Talia would never make the team.

Douglas looks like he had a poor game against Sydney whereas, in reality, he had a big role in keeping Kennedy out of the game. I think he's often being given roles that require him to sacrifice his personal stats for the betterment of the team.

Was it Douglas or CEY that shut down Kennedy? I think both spent time on him but I will give you that. Its true that fantasy scores are a poor guide. But this is what I have felt with my own eyes. When you make unpopular statements like this, then its better to have some kind of statistic to back it up. Douglas has been a great player, but the issue now is that we have Hugh and CEY also playing exceptional footy and these two are on the way up, while Douglas is at the age where he is past his peak. I am not sure that the trajectory lines of these players have crossed yet, but they must be getting close. If Douglas keeps playing like he did the last 2 weeks he has nothing to fear.

 

[Shaz2012]

Just going off stats, or do you actually watch the game?

Douglas was extremely important in our win over Sydney. He was given the job of shutting down Josh Kennedy, and he did an almost flawless job. The only time Sydney got on a roll was when Douglas went off due to the blood rule, allowing Kennedy to get off the leash.

No I dont watch the games. I just live stream the stats.

 

[Bazz_27]

True, but the point still stands that the good goal kicking mid performances came against the weaker teams. 1 goal from 13 touches in a loss against the bombers, off a full pre-season. No goals in the loss against the pies or the win against the swans. 5 goals against the Suns and the Blues. Best forward line will be Tex, JJ, Gov, Lynch, Eddie, plus one pressure forward and one rotation of the bench. To me Douglas is that logical option from the bench. Dont disagree with that. But he needs to be consistent for us in the big games moving forward. If he can't then I am not sure if he should be in the team when we have other options.

I have said that I think that only 2 of Douglas, Greenwood and Hugh can be in the 22 with everyone fit. We would only go down the path of Greenwood and CEY if we were prepared to give these two the brunt of the inside stoppage work. Then that brings Sloane, Gibbs and Brad Crouch to spend more time on ground in outside roles. I think Sloane and Gibbs in particular could give us a goal kicking mid with as much impact as Douglas if not more and they would rotate into the middle with much more impact than Douglas.

Its a good problem to have. Douglas has responded in the past and the past two games shows that he is not finished yet. I am less questioning of him now than I was a few weeks ago, but I want to see him keep going because Hugh and CEY have also been going well.

Averaged 7.5 tackles against the pies and swans. Bombers wasn't his best game but he seemed to worry post Zerrett hit. I just don't see a scenario where he is even consider for dropping.

 

[relapse]

Douglas still worries me to be honest. I know he is the talk of the town this week and questioning him will be highly unpopular. But I still feel he is very hot and cold. Came in off a full preseason, so he should have been good to go. Looking at his form this year:

Opponent D AF SC
CAR 28 115 132
GCS 21 113 124
SYD 17 71 63
COL 14 76 74
STK 22 93 114
ESS 13 38 50

Just going on AFL Fantasy or Supercoach here because it gives a single score, it suggests that he has only played well against the poor teams so far this year. His performances against Essendon, Sydney and Collingwood were average. The gap between his good games and bad games is significant. Would be interested to drag feenix67 into this because on the Crow Cast he has similar questions on Atkins on big vs small games. I am not hanging Douglas here, and I didnt feel feenix had hung Atkins yet either, but just noting that I still have my concerns. Douglas is a senior player so he doesnt have the luxury of seeing the upside in him.

Douglas has earnt the benefit of the doubt and the right to be a preferred player in the 22. But I still question which two players from Douglas, CEY and Greenwood should be in our best 22 come finals. If we are looking for a point of difference to the team we sent into the GF against the tigers last year. Well this could be one that might be looked at.

I have often been a harsh critic of Douglas in the past, but I actually think he's had a pretty good year so far. No way would he even be close to being in the gun for me.

 

[Elite Crow]

You may choose to live in a rose coloured fantasy, but I don't

You live in a rabbit hole though.

 

[GreyCrow]

Any whispers about a surprise selection?

Tex and Sloane in is my pick , but is there a smoky?

 

[Shaz2012]

I have often been a harsh critic of Douglas in the past, but I actually think he's had a pretty good year so far. No way would he even be close to being in the gun for me.

He is not really in my firing line either. For me its more about CEY and Greenwood. I am really intrigued and quite surprised at the seasons they have put together. We should have lost that Richmond game after we lost Crouch and then Mackay and also with Sloane's foot. But we ended up smashing them in contested footy by 50. I really felt that these two guys were the catalyst for that win. Even after that game, I thought that it was just one of those fluke games by CEY. I didnt expect him to back it up, but he has. And now he is working beautifully with Greenwood. You would think they are too similar, but it just works.

So now we are in a position where both CEY and Greenwood are giving us a real point of difference to what we had last year. Add in Gibbs and it would be quite a different side that we could bring to the table for a GF rematch against the Tigers. Both CEY and Greenwood are improving every game and they will pretty much double their AFL games experience by the end of this year if they keep getting games.

So really, Douglas isn't in my firing line so much as I am looking at these two and thinking how good will they be in 15 games time and how can we possibly look that gift horse in the mouth. And IF, we decide to keep both players, then Douglas for me is competing with Gibbs, Sloane and Brad Crouch, which is why he has ended up in my firing line.

 

[Thetrader15]

Just to be 'that guy', I'll let ya both know this

2011 after Round 7 - Carlton 5-1-1
2012 after Round 7 - Carlton 5-2

but slim pickings otherwise

So you are suggesting they start the season well

 

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot]

No I dont watch the games. I just live stream the stats.

Please tell me you're joking.

 

[Bazz_27]

He is not really in my firing line either. For me its more about CEY and Greenwood. I am really intrigued and quite surprised at the seasons they have put together. We should have lost that Richmond game after we lost Crouch and then Mackay and also with Sloane's foot. But we ended up smashing them in contested footy by 50. I really felt that these two guys were the catalyst for that win. Even after that game, I thought that it was just one of those fluke games by CEY. I didnt expect him to back it up, but he has. And now he is working beautifully with Greenwood. You would think they are too similar, but it just works.

So now we are in a position where both CEY and Greenwood are giving us a real point of difference to what we had last year. Add in Gibbs and it would be quite a different side that we could bring to the table for a GF rematch against the Tigers. Both CEY and Greenwood are improving every game and they will pretty much double their AFL games experience by the end of this year if they keep getting games.

So really, Douglas isn't in my firing line so much as I am looking at these two and thinking how good will they be in 15 games time and how can we possibly look that gift horse in the mouth. And IF, we decide to keep both players, then Douglas for me is competing with Gibbs, Sloane and Brad Crouch, which is why he has ended up in my firing line.

IF the club wants to play CEY & Greenwood then they can do it without Douglas. If they push Sloane or Gibbs to a wing then we could drop a winger like Mackay, Atkins or Milera. I did my best 22 above and that is with Smith & Brouch who are both speculative at the moment.

 

[Shaz2012]

Please tell me you're joking.

Seriously, you have to ask