Player Watch Welcome to Hawthorn pick 13: Will Day 2023 PCM!

[kazzooka]

Justin Westoff looked like a strong tackle could break him in half for his first 6 years but no one ever did.

Zach Guthrie was as young and underdeveloped as they come and played 9 games in his debut year including 2 finals.

Day is not as light or weak as people are suggesting.

Also in my opinion no matter whether you are gold coast, Richmond or anyone in between you pick the player that will have the best career not the best first few years. Even if you have plenty of players in that position you pjck the best player available leave positional selections for later in the draft.

Even beasts like Worpel needed body conditioning before he could play afl. Heck marc Pittonet weighed more than McEvoy when he was drafted spent 5 years developing.

 

[cryptor]

Inside the draft's first round: Twists, turns, bluffs, big calls

Draft guru Callum Twomey takes you inside the first round of the draft

www.afl.com.au

"The Giants' need for a gun ruck made Jackson a priority, but with him gone, the club focused on speed. It's what led them to pick the dashing half-back Lachie Ash at No.4. Young was a consideration, but he didn't have the dazzle they were searching for.

They visited Gippsland pair Caleb Serong and Flanders three days before the draft but neither was really in their plans at No.4 given Jackson or Ash was set to be available. Half-back Will Day was also high on their thoughts near this range."


So does this mean Day was as high as Pick 4 in the Giant’s rankings?

Don't see how he could have been as high as pick 4 otherwise they would've picked him instead given he was still available. At best they might have had him ranked very highly for some particular attributes but overall unlikely to have been that high.

 

[KermitJagger]

Inside the draft's first round: Twists, turns, bluffs, big calls

Draft guru Callum Twomey takes you inside the first round of the draft

www.afl.com.au

"The Giants' need for a gun ruck made Jackson a priority, but with him gone, the club focused on speed. It's what led them to pick the dashing half-back Lachie Ash at No.4. Young was a consideration, but he didn't have the dazzle they were searching for.

They visited Gippsland pair Caleb Serong and Flanders three days before the draft but neither was really in their plans at No.4 given Jackson or Ash was set to be available. Half-back Will Day was also high on their thoughts near this range."


So does this mean Day was as high as Pick 4 in the Giant’s rankings?

It seems like they've ordered their list weighted towards quick players with good ball use off half back. Some clubs have different priorities, and GWS in particular are looking to prepare for a world post-Shaw.

For mine I'm not sure who was the better choice between Young and Ash. There's not much difference between them in speed, but there are big differences elsewhere. Ash is dual sided but a straight line player and runner, and not nearly as agile. Young has a lot better lateral movement, cuts his angles better with his kicks but is very left dominant.

I'd argue that the player with better lateral movement is the better option because AFL is a 3 dimensional game, but being dual sided does make the agility slightly less important.

 

[TylerDurden]

It seems like they've ordered their list weighted towards quick players with good ball use off half back. Some clubs have different priorities, and GWS in particular are looking to prepare for a world post-Shaw.

For mine I'm not sure who was the better choice between Young and Ash. There's not much difference between them in speed, but there are big differences elsewhere. Ash is dual sided but a straight line player and runner, and not nearly as agile. Young has a lot better lateral movement, cuts his angles better with his kicks but is very left dominant.

I'd argue that the player with better lateral movement is the better option because AFL is a 3 dimensional game, but being dual sided does make the agility slightly less important.

Give me Young. Elite user and decision maker.

 

[KermitJagger]

Give me Young. Elite user and decision maker.

I'd take Young too. Ash is just going to replace Shaw and his "kick it long and out of bounds on the full" mentality.

 

[Bugs1977]

Justin Westoff looked like a strong tackle could break him in half for his first 6 years but no one ever did.

Zach Guthrie was as young and underdeveloped as they come and played 9 games in his debut year including 2 finals.

Day is not as light or weak as people are suggesting.

Also in my opinion no matter whether you are gold coast, Richmond or anyone in between you pick the player that will have the best career not the best first few years. Even if you have plenty of players in that position you pjck the best player available leave positional selections for later in the draft.

Even beasts like Worpel needed body conditioning before he could play afl. Heck marc Pittonet weighed more than McEvoy when he was drafted spent 5 years developing.

So true. One of your best posts kazzooka

 

[Brishawk]

It seems like they've ordered their list weighted towards quick players with good ball use off half back. Some clubs have different priorities, and GWS in particular are looking to prepare for a world post-Shaw.

For mine I'm not sure who was the better choice between Young and Ash. There's not much difference between them in speed, but there are big differences elsewhere. Ash is dual sided but a straight line player and runner, and not nearly as agile. Young has a lot better lateral movement, cuts his angles better with his kicks but is very left dominant.

I'd argue that the player with better lateral movement is the better option because AFL is a 3 dimensional game, but being dual sided does make the agility slightly less important.

Young >>>>> ash.

ash seemed to polarise recruiters. Either they rated him highly or didn’t like him at all.

Day seems to have been well regarded but just behind a few depending on whose list

 

[Mitchell54]

Young >>>>> ash.

ash seemed to polarise recruiters. Either they rated him highly or didn’t like him at all.

Day seems to have been well regarded but just behind a few depending on whose list

Inside the draft's first round: Twists, turns, bluffs, big calls - https://www.afl.com.au/news/267097

This article suggests that Day crossed GWS' minds at Pick 4.

Just for those saying that he was a massive reach.

Also suggests that we were looking to trade back into the First Round with our Future 1st.

 

[B&GBlood]

I really don't understand this mentality. Players don't get broken playing AFL football simply by being a bit slight. They might get bodied off the ball a bit easier, but it's not like they've got brittle bones and tendons if they don't put 10kg on.

The 'Hawthorn Apprenticeship' doesn't exist, despite how much its talked about. Every club has players that sit in their seconds, we just develop them better so they eventually become good AFL footballers at a higher percentage than other clubs. Sounds like an apprenticeship to me! See Mitchel Lewis for an example.

Every first rounder we've picked since 2004 has played senior football in their first year on the list, save for Ellis who was completing Year 12 at the time. Even Max Bailey played some senior football in his debut year and he was a baby giraffe. What do you think the purpose of that game(s) is? Learning experience for player and coach perhaps. It is a rare player in our squad who does not spend time in the twos.

See X Ellis for breakage, Ladson was another. Slight guys do get knocked around if they are courageous, Will looks courageous in his highlights and will need to fill out or he will miss more footy than he plays, particularly if he plays at the coal-face. The game is harder than ever in collisions, players are bigger, faster and harder.

 

[matey]

Heard Punky on SEN today and he said that Day needs to work on conditioning his body for AFL, has a quick side step, some bags of tricks and a nice kick.

One thing for sure Hawks won’t throw him into the deep end unlike many other clubs would and we will play him only when he his ready. We want Will to play for 12 years!

 

[SSSSSS]

People are rating muscle mass more than core strength way too highly ITT

Give me Kade Simpson > Josh Hunt any day of the week.

 

[Yardie]

Imagine how many premierships this bloke could have won if he only put on extra weight.....

 

[Brant]

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Imagine how many premierships this bloke could have won if he only put on extra weight.....

Didn't he play 50-odd games at Box Hill (2.5 - 3 seasons) before playing for HFC?

Pretty much exactly the point that a few on here are trying to make.

 

[Bugs1977]

View attachment 790060

Imagine how many premierships this bloke could have won if he only put on extra weight.....

He was as hard as a cats head good old Tucky. All arms and legs.

 

[Yardie]

Didn't he play 50-odd games at Box Hill (2.5 - 3 seasons) before playing for HFC?

Pretty much exactly the point that a few on here are trying to make.

Clarkson likes his apprenticeships and the club has recruited with a long term view. So don't have an issue with that. Some people think he needs to add 10+ kilos to make it, that I don't necessarily agree with.

 

[threesixpio]

This is what I’m hearing time and time again

 

[WireHawk]

Didn't he play 50-odd games at Box Hill (2.5 - 3 seasons) before playing for HFC?

Pretty much exactly the point that a few on here are trying to make.

I used to go to Glenferrie Oval and watch a fair bit of the reserves before the seniors
started. The bloke playing full forward one week was a very young Michael Tuck. The
guy playing full forward in the seniors was Peter Hudson.

Hard to replace Huddo in the seniors! Tucky found his place though. Boy, did he ever!

 

[Alite]

I found this an interesting exercise:

Who will be first, between Brodie Kemp and Will Day, to play a significant role for their AFL team?

• Kemp will not likely play AFL next year due to his ACL injury and him not having an AFL fitness base.
• Day will need to put on some muscle to be able to absorb the impact of being tackled, and eventually shake off the tackle. His first year will likely be in the VFL.

• If all goes well, Kemp will have his first preseason in 2020/21.
• 2020/21 will be Day’s second preseason

• Kemp will likely play in positions that require him to make a contest. He will need time to get the strength and endurance to match it with hardened AFL footballers.
• Day could easily play an outside role where his lack of muscle will be of less importance.

Possible Comparisons (as made by others)
Brodie Kemp = Ryan Burton.
1st year … a write off
2nd year … finding his feat
3rd year … could make an impact

Will Day = Bradley Hill.
1st year … 5 games… at best
2nd year … 24 games… a bit ambitious
3rd year … Premiership player… why the hell not!

 

[Milkshaker]

He was as hard as a cats head good old Tucky. All arms and legs.

Played contact sport against a heap of these type guys . Every time you made contact with them a bone got you where it hurts and made you think twice. Tough wiry bastards. Played against a few skinny ones who you hit and never saw again as well.

 

[Tomohawks]

Yes he's skinny at the moment as most 18 yo's are , but gee what he can become is a tantalising proposition. A real natural, aggressive and competitive footballer with skills and athleticism to boot. I happen to think that he'll fill out okay yet won't be obviously massive, but I'm not concerned at all by that as you don't need to be if you have everything else.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I found this an interesting exercise:

Glad someone did.

 

[PenAndPaper]

Give me Kade Simpson > Josh Hunt any day of the week.

There's also a thing called footballing ability that comes into play there haha

 

[PhatHQ]

If he is good enough he will play.
Just because he is light doesn’t mean he can’t be an outside player in year 1-2. The kid has skills & smarts with a debut next season very likely.
I was actually quite taken with his level of “footballer” rather than an outside runner as an assumption.
His confidence in himself to speak the way he does has me believing that this kid will play a small part next year & a very large role in the future.
76-86-96.... if you can football you will make guys miss & know how to preserve yourself. Very happy with this selection in the end.

 

[toomanysquibs]

I mean correct me if I'm wrong but four seasons would be four years which would count as it took him years.

Guys around 16-22 can put on a fair bit of muscle quickly if they've stopped growing.

The requirements of playinf footy do limit that a bit though.

Four years is definitely a hell of a long time in the sporting life of a professional football player. Take a look at NFL players at the time they're drafted, after a similar length of time in the College system. They're often already monsters.

It really comes down to how someone's physiology is, and how well they're trained. If your body's nervous system allows you to lift heavy weights, while recruiting all of the available muscle groups, a year or two is plenty of time to put a lot of size on and gain strength.

Size wise, Will Day could end up anywhere. But I don't really think he needs a heap of it to be effective in the AFL.

Jordan Lewis was a burly monster. He got ironed out going back under a highball by a relative midget. No amount of size would have helped him there. Meanwhile Bradley Hill went through 3 years of successful finals campaigns, avoiding contact through the home and away, and ramping the physicality up a few notches for finals.

Not everyone needs to take the big hits, or get their knees dirty week after week, if they still play a valuable role for the team.

 

[MasterSamurai]

Didn't he play 50-odd games at Box Hill (2.5 - 3 seasons) before playing for HFC?

Pretty much exactly the point that a few on here are trying to make.

Exactly! No one’s suggesting Day won’t make it, it’s about whether if he’s a realistic chance to debut next year or not, nothing to do with his skill set or lack of courage, just that the kid is very skinny.