Whats our weakest Line?

[footyfan1978]

Polson for the small defender? owies for the small forward. Remains to be seen if they have what it takes

Which is why want list stronger. If those guys were secondary or third options it would be much stronger in those list areas. Fact is when we won three premierships in four years when I was a kid the small goal kicking forward had 3 or 4 stand out options of Vin Catoggio, Ken Sheldon, Alex Marcou, Rod Ashman or Jimmy Buckley and also had back ups like Rod Waddell or Leneghan. I want abundant options for all areas. Not just one or two which is all we can name for those roles at present and we not even sure if either will make it at this point. Like Sumner, LeBois and Pickett maybe in two years time Owies if off list. Need more options to have no weakness on our list. Papley would have been a stand out option. So close, yet so far.

 

[Arr0w]

Which is why want list stronger. If those guys were secondary or third options it would be much stronger in those list areas. Fact is when we won three premierships in four years when I was a kid the small goal kicking forward had 3 or 4 stand out options of Vin Catoggio, Ken Sheldon, Alex Marcou, Rod Ashman or Jimmy Buckley and also had back ups like Rod Waddell or Leneghan. I want abundant options for all areas. Not just one or two which is all we can name for those roles at present and we not even sure if either will make it at this point. Like Sumner, LeBois and Pickett maybe in two years time Owies if off list. Need more options to have not weakness on our list. Papley would have been a stand out option. So close, yet so far.

Strangely enough most were midfielders

 

[footyfan1978]

Strangely enough most were midfielders

Exactly, they were both small forwards and rover options. If only we had such certainty now. Ken Sheldon could be a 50 goal a season small forward or classy rover. When we get such abundance of options that overlap, then we have type of list where we know we are clear best in league. We are not there yet. SOS was not allowed to keeping doing this to such a level. I hope we are not complacent and think our list is finished....

 

[Arr0w]

The best/flag winning teams generally have depth of midfielders playing on the flanks

Been that way for more than 3 decades

 

[JustaBattler]

Yes but if you take 2 players as good as Harry and Charlie out of any forward line, that club will not play finals either. And no club can afford to have "spare" high quality players to come in and replace them. We have Levi - which based on 2019 form is the next best thing. Most other clubs will have a young forward in the wings developing and they may or may not make and impact- we have TDK. It would seem that Harry will be playing round 1 based on various reports, so we are really talking about Charlie IMO. Hopefully Charlie doesnt "slip up" again.

I agree the young mids need to really breakout this year to add to our Locks: Cripps, Walsh, Ed, Murph. There are real promising signs by all reports coming from Setterfield and if that does eventuate this year, then that takes the pressure off short term- until Murph retires- say in 2 years. It looks like DT wants SPS to play back this year so maybe he is off the table as a fulltime mid. That leaves Dow, Fisher , LOB, Cuningham, gibbons Kennedy of the second tier. Then we have the new recruits including Stocker , Honey, Philps, Kemp , Ramsay. For once it looks as though we have enough development coming through.

I'm not disagreeing with your take on things - when I say 'middling' it is where we are right now given all the givens - but there is nothing wrong with being middling and competitive - with serious potential growth to come in a much deeper list. I read earlier that Harry McKay is apparently fit and looking liek a beast - so that is a match winner back in calculations.

Anything can happen - we've seen it in other Clubs - I reckon an A grade monster mid and a Papley finishes the rebuild off nicely.

 

[ShanDog]

The line in the sand for mine.

Need to show more mongrel.

 

[footyfan1978]

The best/flag winning teams generally have depth of midfielders playing on the flanks

Wrong.
Best premiership winning teams generally have depth of goal kicking midfielders that just as good as forwards as they are midfielders.
A midfielder playing on flanks is not the same as a goal kicking midfielder playing on flanks. The later is really good to have, the other is trying to see if it works as you not found half forward specialists that help you kick a winning score regularly.

 

[JustaBattler]

The line in the sand for mine.

Need to show more mongrel.

Random comment thought bubble- but I like the word mongrel.

 

[Arr0w]

Wrong.
Best premiership winning teams generally have depth of goal kicking midfielders that just as good as forwards as they are midfielders.
A midfielder playing on flanks is not the same as a goal kicking midfielder playing on flanks. The later is really good to have, the other is trying to see if it works as you not found half forward specialists that help you kick a winning score regularly.

Course that is ideal/bonus, but doesn't always eventuate.

Go back, even the last 10 flags, two things stick out.

1. No elite ruckman, but both are a threat forward.

2. Midfielders occupying some of the flanks

 

[footyfan1978]

Course that is ideal/bonus, but doesn't always eventuate.

I want the bonus/ideal.
Until we are there , in midst of multiple premierships there is a weakness...
Hope club never gets so complacent again. We are not there. Aim for abundance, that is where we need our list.
OP only able to name one or two names is not an abundance.

 

[JustaBattler]

Course that is ideal/bonus, but doesn't always eventuate.

Go back, even the last 10 flags, two things stick out.

1. No elite ruckman, but both are a threat forward.

2. Midfielders occupying some of the flanks

OK I've had enough reading this word 'midfielder'.

I've suggested that anyone who plays between the arcs is a midfielder ie there are six midfielders in CSBU ( see look I just made uo an acronym for center square ball ups) there are three shorter midfielders positioned to receive a tap from a taller midfielder all around a square which is called the square and two midfielders positioned further out from the square, called flankers because they are closer to the boundary than the center of the square...before the ball is bounced or tossed up - after which they try and guess where to be depending on wether they have a team mate in possession or are looking to cover for aan opponent in case they are on the receiving end of a disposal from one of the 4 midfielders in the square when the ball was bounced up.

At all other times these midfielders are variously positioned at or near or thereabouts any ball up between the arcs ready to do same as above - but in no particular field placement because the square is no longer central to anything except the overall field.


- do you have a better definition that we can all agree on ?

 

[WFGodot]

Weakest line: Forward.
I see a solid backline with ready cover if we have injuries. Lots of midfield talent and competition for spots but forward Im not yet confident week to week who we can rely on to kick a winning score - without significant contributions from the mids.

 

[Jabba73]

Random comment thought bubble- but I like the word mongrel.

Can confirm

 

[Sector 7G]

Which is why want list stronger. If those guys were secondary or third options it would be much stronger in those list areas. Fact is when we won three premierships in four years when I was a kid the small goal kicking forward had 3 or 4 stand out options of Vin Catoggio, Ken Sheldon, Alex Marcou, Rod Ashman or Jimmy Buckley and also had back ups like Rod Waddell or Leneghan. I want abundant options for all areas. Not just one or two which is all we can name for those roles at present and we not even sure if either will make it at this point. Like Sumner, LeBois and Pickett maybe in two years time Owies if off list. Need more options to have no weakness on our list. Papley would have been a stand out option. So close, yet so far.

Left out the best of all - Johno

 

[Sweet Seventeen]

I'm not disagreeing with your take on things - when I say 'middling' it is where we are right now given all the givens - but there is nothing wrong with being middling and competitive - with serious potential growth to come in a much deeper list. I read earlier that Harry McKay is apparently fit and looking liek a beast - so that is a match winner back in calculations.

Anything can happen - we've seen it in other Clubs - I reckon an A grade monster mid and a Papley finishes the rebuild off nicely.

We already have the monster mid, Kemp.

 

[therubbernub]

Wrong.
Best premiership winning teams generally have depth of goal kicking midfielders that just as good as forwards as they are midfielders.
A midfielder playing on flanks is not the same as a goal kicking midfielder playing on flanks. The later is really good to have, the other is trying to see if it works as you not found half forward specialists that help you kick a winning score regularly.

Well spread of goal kickers is the key - the hawks often had 12 different goal kickers during their threepeat. Its absolutely necessary to provide options to disrupt the opposition zones

 

[therubbernub]

I want the bonus/ideal.
Until we are there , in midst of multiple premierships there is a weakness...
Hope club never gets so complacent again. We are not there. Aim for abundance, that is where we need our list.
OP only able to name one or two names is not an abundance.

well that was not the point of my OP. So i didnt name alternatives but they are there IMO- certainly in defence. The midfield is more hope and potential than reality atm. 2020 will tell us a lot about our midfield depth or not.
Forward line is short of depth. But Levi or TDK can come in for harry or charlie. Not sure if he is suited but Marchbank might also be considered if he cant find a place down back and there are forward injuries.
Small forwards are down to cuningham, fisher, martin, eddie,

 

[Sweet Seventeen]

The consensus seems to be that most think that the forward line is the most vulnerable. I just have a gut-feel that we will be pleasantly surprised by our forward line this season. Cunners is ready to explode and Jack Martin has been going well up until his niggle a couple of weeks ago. Both should be cherry ripe for Tiges. Harry looks likely to play now as well, boy oh boy Astbury sure will have his hands full.

 

[JustaBattler]

We already have the monster mid, Kemp.

Kemp and Stocker are both not in the mix this year though - time will tell but I would love to get someone like Ollie Wines into the Club - although I note that many believe that Setterfield is ready to asume on ball responsibilities. Anyway we look at things- our midfield thanks to SOS is in a much better state than it was only 3 years ago. Theoretically if the list management regime is just half decent - we should be able to maintain and improve depth across the lines from here on in.

But right now - I'd rate our midfield below that of Richmond/WC/GWS and Collingwood. This could change in 2020 or 2021.

 

[Metalcrusher]

● Ranked 3rd in Clangers Per Game
● Ranked 12th in Tackles Per Game

● Ranked 15th in Handballs Per Game

● Ranked 16th in Disposals Per Game

● Ranked 15th in Points Per Game

We are not yet hard enough at the ball. When we have it we butcher it or cough it up. We do not have enough accumulators to give us the opportunity in the midfield to get consistent forward fifty entries.

 

[therubbernub]

We are not yet hard enough at the ball. When we have it we butcher it or cough it up. We do not have enough accumulators to give us the opportunity in the midfield to get consistent forward fifty entries.

Do we have the same stats since DT was in charge? Might tell a very different story.

 

[Salt Lake Cities]

Midfield for mine, suspect it’ll end up our strongest line in 3 or so years though...

 

[Metalcrusher]

Do we have the same stats since DT was in charge? Might tell a very different story.

Nope they were 2019 stats total.

 

[footyfan1978]

Well spread of goal kickers is the key - the hawks often had 12 different goal kickers during their threepeat. Its absolutely necessary to provide options to disrupt the opposition zones

Yes, goal kicking midfielders, goal kicking ruckmen, goal kicking wingers, goal kicking forwards. It is how we have the best premiership winning sides that do it more than one year have gone. Until our list has all these things, this notion some people post about of list is done or finished is complacent at best and would scare me if inside club they thinking the same. I really hope what SOS was building towards is continued and not thinking the work is done....

 

[footyfan1978]

Left out the best of all - Johno

My favourite player ever. Testing everyone for if they really get it....