Game Day Marsh Series - Carlton v Fremantle Saturday 29 Feb 7.10pm (EST) @ David Grays Arena

[JustaBattler]

I saw a couple directly in front of me on Saturday, Setterfield was one who stopped a step short of the contest at least on one occasion. I also don't want to besmirch the man, but i'm pretty sure I saw Walsh do it too. Pretty sure I saw Kennedy have a couple of undesired contests too.

Definitely didn't see Martin take a short step, which makes the "soft" critiques often labeled at him completely hilarious.

Hopefully you just want to put it down to not wanting to get hurt in a Pre-Season game.

Can't say I saw Walsh do anything like short step - most players will do this at times- sometimes because they are trying to think things through, sometimes when they genuinely think that there are better ways to halve or win a contest....- but when I see the same player(s) do it over and over again - I kinda put a red line through their name and once it is there it never gets changed.

I wont name the player(s) who are definitely not in the trench buddies AFAIC - but the important thing to note is that such behaviour is contagious - bad team culture.

The other thing to note in association with all this is that the core on ball brigade was absent and maybe there was more confusion about who is supposed to be doing what and when around contested situations - which isn't a good sign either tbh.

Teague and his team will be all over this stuff I'm sure.

 

[Own The Future]

The other thing to note in association with all this is that the core on ball brigade was absent and maybe there was more confusion about who is supposed to be doing what and when around contested situations - which isn't a good sign either tbh.

This is a fantastic point, and one I hadn’t considered.
I wonder if we assume sometimes that players can just be put into an unfamiliar role and perform as well as those who do it all the time.
In modern footy there is so much (too much?) structure and strategy. Stoppage coaches, boundary throw in placement/blocking/outlet handballs etc. So much happens that most observers - myself included - don’t realise is actually happening. We see the resulting kick into the 50 and the mark - we may not see the shepherd put on at the clearance and the double or triple block put on to free up the leading forward.
I’m probably staying the obvious here, but the point remains - so many guys were performing in roles relatively foreign to them, and it would stand to reason that some second-guessing would have occurred. Even against an equally undermanned Freo, a split second delay or misunderstanding between teammates can (and apparently did) lead to shoddy and uninspiring play.
As so many others have said, it will be a extremely interesting to see how we perform with more of our first picked in the side.

 

[GoGeta]

What role does Zac Fisher play for you guys, outside mid/wing or fwd/mid type role? From the bits and pieces I have seen over the last two years he always seems to be on the outside of a pack or running by one getting the handball, Is he much of a contested player or more the receive, run and carry uncontested type? Liked what I have seen in snippets but not knowing much about him thought I would come ask the experts... Cheers.

 

[Macca43]

What role does Zac Fisher play for you guys, outside mid/wing or fwd/mid type role? From the bits and pieces I have seen over the last two years he always seems to be on the outside of a pack or running by one getting the handball, Is he much of a contested player or more the receive, run and carry uncontested type? Liked what I have seen in snippets but not knowing much about him thought I would come ask the experts... Cheers.

Second possession player for me, Cripps wins the ball Fisher gets the handball receive, bursts and kicks inside 50.

Can win the ball in traffic but better used outside.

 

[Robertio]

What role does Zac Fisher play for you guys, outside mid/wing or fwd/mid type role? From the bits and pieces I have seen over the last two years he always seems to be on the outside of a pack or running by one getting the handball, Is he much of a contested player or more the receive, run and carry uncontested type? Liked what I have seen in snippets but not knowing much about him thought I would come ask the experts... Cheers.

Wrong board mate, all the experts are on the Richmond board.

 

[murphster]

I am far from a Lang fan and wish he was off our list but Thomas and him weren't vying for the same spot. Thomas would have been queuing up behind Newman, SImpson, Docherty, Marchbank, SPS and Williamson down back.

Also we can afford to play Lang in the 2's all year, I wouldn't want to have done that to Daisy.

As I said we could have moved Daisy back into the forward role he originally played for us rather than Lang so based on that they would be playing same position and Daisy would have offered much more in that role including leadership.

 

[murphster]

Tipping the contract situation may have been part of it too.

If we'd kept Daisy and ditched Lang, we'd probably still be paying both of them. Given our off-season targets in Cogs, Papley, Martin, Betts - cap space would have been a significant factor.

Don’t think we’d be paying Lang a kings ransom and I’m pretty sure Daisy would have played for peanuts to have an extra year and our cap has a fairly healthy margin to play with.

 

[Macca43]

As I said we could have moved Daisy back into the forward role he originally played for us rather than Lang so based on that they would be playing same position and Daisy would have offered much more in that role including leadership.

Moved him forward to play where? In front of who?

Lang isn't going to get anywhere near the senior side so Daisy would be taking Lang's spot in the VFL - not the end for him IMO.

 

[murphster]

I agree, the opponent needs to be right. McCluggage is a good example. Gaff, Scully types, he would have the edge on pure speed.

Cuners will never be a ball hunter, as much as we would like, if he is taken to the ball by the better readers of play, he could use his strengths to burst away, as well as reducing their impact on the game

Yeah I’m pretty sure we did this with Obi4 in the second half of 2018 and it certainly worked for him as he upped his possession rate and was a lot more involved in the game so no reason it couldn’t work with Cunners.

 

[Moody Blue]

I love this, a bloke who has repeatedly refused to name a best 22 demanding someone else do it.

For me my 22 (assuming Charlie is unavailable) would be;
B: Plow, Jones, Doc
HB: Willo, Weitering, Samo
C: Fisher, Cripps, Setterfield
HF: Martin, McKay, McGovern
F: Jack, Levi, Betts
Foll: Kreuzer, Walsh, Murphy

Bench: Simpson, Dow, Ed, Cunners

Beyond that you have a group of Newman, Marchbank, O'Brien, Gibbons, Stocker, Kennedy, De Koning, Pittonet and possibly Philp to make up the 3 emergencies. Who comes in is dependent on who gets injured.

After the couple of practice games Willo has come up and Kennedy has slid down in my opinion. The other contenders have all stayed the same, no one has jumped up and grabbed the spot (I already had Fisher well in the 22).

Certainly going to be conundrum at selection time. Gibbons would start before Jack. McKay & Levi to swap in the square.
A lot of caveats in this team.
McGovern owes us a lot and needs to hit the ground running. Was very ordinary last season.
Williamson & Setterfield will want to show a lot more development, and hopefully Martin will just keep playing good footy.
Plowman was terrible at times last season.
Betts is going to give us that much needed speed and tackling pressure in the forward half.

 

[Macca43]

Certainly going to be conundrum at selection time. Gibbons would start before Jack. McKay & Levi to swap in the square.
A lot of caveats in this team.
McGovern owes us a lot and needs to hit the ground running. Was very ordinary last season.
Williamson & Setterfield will want to show a lot more development, and hopefully Martin will just keep playing good footy.
Plowman was terrible at times last season.
Betts is going to give us that much needed speed and tackling pressure in the forward half.

The only caveat necessary in this team is - I am not only the selection committee nor privy to any inside news.
Gibbons and Jack aren't fighting for the same spot, Jack gives us that hard working mid-size lead up forward as well as plenty of versatility. Thought he was great on Saturday but killed by his team mates inability to kick.
McGovern plays when fit.
Plowman was 3rd in the B&F - he plays.
Martin isn't being paid big money not to play.
Williamson and Setterfield will need to show more development - I am confident they will after strong pre-seasons.

 

[FRUMPY]

Arguing about Gibbons as if he is the difference between a flag or wooden spoon.

If we go anywhere in the next few years he wont be in the 22 or 30

Sent from my CPH1879 using Tapatalk

 

[murphster]

Good to see Cripps put the heat back on the young guys on SEN by saying the guys between 21-23 don’t have the excuse of being to young anymore as this is when they should be stepping up and making a name for themselves, at least we now know the Captain won’t be excepting sub par performances based on youth.

 

[blueboy25]

Arguing about Gibbons as if he is the difference between a flag or wooden spoon.

If we go anywhere in the next few years he wont be in the 22 or 30

Sent from my CPH1879 using Tapatalk

I wouldn't rule him out, as Richmond and even the dogs before them have proven is that you need role players and you don't need 22 stars out there.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Good to see Cripps put the heat back on the young guys on SEN by saying the guys between 21-23 don’t have the excuse of being to young anymore as this is when they should be stepping up and making a name for themselves, at least we now know the Captain won’t be excepting sub par performances based on youth.

Exactly, Cripps will be 25 this year (turns 25 day before Round 1) meaning he racked up the following Brownlow Votes at the equivalent ages

(2017) 5 at Age 22
(2018) 20 at Age 23
(2019) 26 at Age 24

Would love to see a few of our 21/22 year olds like Fisher, SPS, Setters, McKay and Weitering really go to the next level this year and start being best on grounds in a few games.

 

[murphster]

I wouldn't rule him out, as Richmond and even the dogs before them have proven is that you need role players and you don't need 22 stars out there.

Especially ones that can run and run hard all day and Gibbo has this in spades, still has growth to come in his game as well so I wouldn’t be writing him off.

 

[murphster]

Off topic but did anyone see the game between St Mary’s and Nightcliffe on NITV last night, was a semi final I think but Maurice Rioli Jnr played and kicked 4 goals for St Mary’s who won in the end, was a good game to watch with a few good young players in both sides, I liked the look of Nick Yarran Jr who is 23 I think, although he’s very small and slight, only 171cm, he doesn’t mind the hard stuff and has some good skills, one piece of play where he ran to about 55 out and kicked it across his body to spot up the forward about 40 out, reminded me of that SPS kick against Collingwood in his first year. Old school footy with lots of shirt fronts and great bumps as well as some great skills well worth a watch if you get a chance.

 

[__Bobcat__]

Bring on round 1 already...

all this "bitching", over a bloody practice match Farcanal.

Wanting Setters and Cunningham to go in hard in Feb. WTF.

understand the passion but bugger me.

 

[GudOnya]

What role does Zac Fisher play for you guys, outside mid/wing or fwd/mid type role? From the bits and pieces I have seen over the last two years he always seems to be on the outside of a pack or running by one getting the handball, Is he much of a contested player or more the receive, run and carry uncontested type? Liked what I have seen in snippets but not knowing much about him thought I would come ask the experts... Cheers.

Fish is a bit of a weird mix to be honest, he often plays as an inside mid but doesn't have the body for it so doesn't play as a traditional big-bodied inside mid. He really excels when he is in congestion but can find himself a bit of space to use his speed and creativity to get through it. He seems to play as maybe a 3rd inside mid, not a prime ball winner but not outside away from the contest either.

Best way to sum it up is probably two of my favourite gifs from the last few years.

 

[DirkDiggler]

From what most people say on here Cuningham is a fairly simple guy, so while getting him to run with a quality player might seem like it will drag him to the ball and keep him engaged the issue for me comes when they get to the ball, we want Cuningham at that contest being aggressive, winning the ball and bursting away that is hard to do if he is also tasked with being accountable for a player and would leave him doing 2 things badly. A good opponent would simply take him to contest and lose him in the traffic as his attention gets divided.

Keep it simple, see ball, get ball, run.

Don't get how Cuningham's opponent will lose him in the traffic given his speed and strong tackling. You are making assumptions here. Would be great to trial it now because I would prefer Cuners in that role to E Curnow who regularly burns us with his disposal.

 

[NewDarkNavyBlues]

Fish is a bit of a weird mix to be honest, he often plays as an inside mid but doesn't have the body for it so doesn't play as a traditional big-bodied inside mid. He really excels when he is in congestion but can find himself a bit of space to use his speed and creativity to get through it. He seems to play as maybe a 3rd inside mid, not a prime ball winner but not outside away from the contest either.

Best way to sum it up is probably two of my favourite gifs from the last few years.

Not easy to make MacRae and Fyfe look silly.

 

[Accidental genius]

Good to see Cripps put the heat back on the young guys on SEN by saying the guys between 21-23 don’t have the excuse of being to young anymore as this is when they should be stepping up and making a name for themselves, at least we now know the Captain won’t be excepting sub par performances based on youth.

Best captain in the league. Loved by all.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Don't get how Cuningham's opponent will lose him in the traffic given his speed and strong tackling. You are making assumptions here. Would be great to trial it now because I would prefer Cuners in that role to E Curnow who regularly burns us with his disposal.

It happens very easily. You can’t make up much room over 2-3m no matter how fast you are. If we are talking about him playing on the more outside players I’m not sure he has the elite endurance most of those guys have.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Hey Mods - any chance we can set up a separate thread called "The Cage", so if posters (myself included) feel the need to engage in a 6-page debate they can be banished and segregated from everyone who has no desire to watch the old irresistible force/immovable object conundrum in digital form...?

We can look at separating out certain topics on occasion.

As a stick to my guns debater back in the early days of BF, I don't have an issue with well articulated arguments that don't get personal.

The point of forums is to inspire discussion, accommodate debates and allow conflicting opinions.

I find it pretty easy to filter out stuff I'm not interested in. I hope we haven't been spoiling everyone by shutting down debate for too long. You folk need a good Windhover debate to break your spirits.

I note that Arr0w suggested to Harker that they agree to disagree on something and Harker took him up on it.

You're all intelligent adults, you can find your way out of any hedge maze you find your way into.

 

[norway blue]

That’s beautiful writing . Agree .


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