Will Mathew Nicks get fired before he coaches a win?

[FR0GGY]

Last three seasons there was quite an abundance of calls for all the youngsters to play and that they were loaded with talent being held back by playing vets.

Turns out some of them can’t kick from 15 meters away.

Kinda speaks for itself

I think Marty was being sarcastic

 

[AmericanCrow]

I think Marty was being sarcastic

I bit

 

[Barneythecrab]

Smashed? Jeez your definition of smashed is pretty loose. Equal scoring shots, more clearances, more possessions, more contested possessions

Adelaide were 2 posters and 2 badly missed set shots from winning. Yes, the crows absolutely sucked today, but 320 minutes of football does not make a coach. Im happy for Nicks to coach out the season, give him a chance to draft, delist and trade, and see where the club is at mid next season.

Clarkson finished 5 wins 17 losses in his first season and had Crawford, Mitchell, Everitt, Hodge, Joel Smith plus Mark Williams kicking 60+.

Murphy 37 games
Keays 34 games
Crocker 30 games
Doedee 25 games
OBrien 25 games
Jones 13 games
Poholke 13 games
Frampton 6 games
McHenry 4 games
Hamill 3 games
McAdam 2 games

Looks pretty raw to me.

I actually cannot believe that people are calling for Nicks already.
Rebuild
Young and inexperienced players
COVID-19
New game plan
No home games where players get to go home
Cooked senior group
Worst assistant coaches in the league

What the * did you expect people? WE DO NOT NEEDA SANDO BOUNCE!

 

[FR0GGY]

I actually cannot believe that people are calling for Nicks already.
Rebuild
Young and inexperienced players
COVID-19
New game plan
No home games where players get to go home
Cooked senior group
Worst assistant coaches in the league

What the fu** did you expect people? WE DO NOT NEEDA SANDO BOUNCE!

I don’t think it’s the results people are complaining about.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Young players are not nearly good enough and overvalued by way to many on this board.

This is a similar narrative to what I saw play out in the NFL since ‘99, with a team that shall go unnamed.

Getting high picks is going to mean absolutely zero if unable to properly evaluate talent.

As for this particular head coach...clueless and in over his head are two of my initial reactions.

Way to much standing around and half hearted jogging.

You do not need to be talented to put in honest effort. This club routinely puts in about 10-15 minutes of honest effort a game so far.

Our failings are largely driven by our seniors though.

 

[DJ75]

Bottom line is I listen to Nicks and I like him. He seems genuine and I think he has a pretty clear plan what we wants to do.

Unfortunately, like most at the club, he seems to still believe that Matt and Brad are the answers rather than the issues in our midfield. Over the past few weeks, we have seen some glimpses of what Chayce and Myles can do in the midfield when given time. Against Gold Coast our most centre bounce attended list went as follows; ROB, M Crouch, B Crouch, B Keays, Seedsman.
So we dropped Matt Crouch and tried something a little different (but still went for 'experienced' guys like Smith or Seedsman in the middle).

Then we bring Matt back in and go straight back to the same midfield set up that GC destroyed.

Anyone want to guess what this weeks CBA looked like?

Nicks simply has to bite the bullet and accept that playing Matt and Brad together is actually detrimental to our chances. Take Matt out, make him play the role that Poholke played this week. Give Poholke a run of 5 weeks playing the M Crouch midfield minutes. Let's actually see what he can do. Flick Keays, play Jones extended minutes in the middle.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result....

 

[Southerntakeover]

I don’t think it’s the results people are complaining about.

It's not, but it's easier to frame it that way.

No one is making a case that there has been even adequate coaching, other than that one guy who thinks 5 minutes of play demonstrates a successful game plan.

 

[footy4ever]

There's no obvious brand yet. What's the base that he's building this team on? The first building block to put in place?

It's what I've banged on about after the two pre-season games and round one. There is no fundamental game plan, or as you say, base building block.

 

[DJ75]

Did we get any information on the reserves match??

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Most coaches start with the backlines because it's the easiest.

Young or old, get a stable group of 7 going through there. Working together, gelling, improving.

That has also been in a state of flux (including off field).

 

[Murray2503]

Bottom line is I listen to Nicks and I like him. He seems genuine and I think he has a pretty clear plan what we wants to do.

Unfortunately, like most at the club, he seems to still believe that Matt and Brad are the answers rather than the issues in our midfield. Over the past few weeks, we have seen some glimpses of what Chayce and Myles can do in the midfield when given time. Against Gold Coast our most centre bounce attended list went as follows; ROB, M Crouch, B Crouch, B Keays, Seedsman.
So we dropped Matt Crouch and tried something a little different (but still went for 'experienced' guys like Smith or Seedsman in the middle).

Then we bring Matt back in and go straight back to the same midfield set up that GC destroyed.

Anyone want to guess what this weeks CBA looked like?

Nicks simply has to bite the bullet and accept that playing Matt and Brad together is actually detrimental to our chances. Take Matt out, make him play the role that Poholke played this week. Give Poholke a run of 5 weeks playing the M Crouch midfield minutes. Let's actually see what he can do. Flick Keays, play Jones extended minutes in the middle.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result....

I agree the Crouches are the problem along with the clubs insistence of playing Sloane along with them. This insanity has gone on for 2 years now. What we are basically seeing is a club that could not make hard list management decisions trying to justify the contracts they gave out by continually playing players in the wrong position. We all know who is in charge of list management and needs to depart along with Chapman immediately. I feel Jones will be a good mid in time. Will take 50 games but he will turn into a very good mid. Needs to improve his disposal and composure. For mine I don't see it in Myles. Will be adequate but we need more than adequate. We must trade or draft another couple of elite mids with speed to complement Jones and Schoenberg. Mchenry is not a mid imo and we got that pick very wrong sadly. The club also needs to start to only draft players that are ready to go straight away. Getting tricky at the draft has generally been a failure.

 

[Barneythecrab]

I don’t think it’s the results people are complaining about.

I know, I’m also talking about game plan. All the above things that I’ve said would be playing a huge role in whether his game plan is going to be learnt/work. The key one being senior players not stepping up and being leaders.

 

[Anzacpaul]

I would think having produced possibly the worst football team in the history of professional football would be distressing.

Must have a short memory if you genuinely believe this.

 

[Kezza86]

He also got the very most out of those sides really but just fell short.

Again, for mine it would be to help assist/guide our coaches which we're really lacking with our lack of coaching experience.

The closest I have him to the crows is a strategic coach and that’s it!

 

[1970crow]

Exactly. We’re paying out a bunch of ex coaches, gone to the $2 bin for their replacements, and even had to let one go. Chuck in the pandemic.

They aren’t in a position to splash out on trivial stuff like coaches.

The pandemic hasn't seen other clubs coaching groups looking like ours. And ours was s**t well before the pandemic adjustments. Apparently admin is making cash hand over fist and esports and baseball putt8ng even more into the coffers. Fagan said we'd go over the spending cap if need be when implementing the review recommendations. And yet here we are and we've been here since well before covid came to town.

 

[1970crow]

Young players are not nearly good enough and overvalued by way to many on this board.

This is a similar narrative to what I saw play out in the NFL since ‘99, with a team that shall go unnamed.

Getting high picks is going to mean absolutely zero if unable to properly evaluate talent.

As for this particular head coach...clueless and in over his head are two of my initial reactions.

Way to much standing around and half hearted jogging.

You do not need to be talented to put in honest effort. This club routinely puts in about 10-15 minutes of honest effort a game so far.

And this is a direct result of fostering a culture that valued intangibles ahead of game day performance. Senior players not held to account at selection, they get lazy and comfortable while the kids that get denied earned opportunities get leaving. This is a club management philosophy on football returning the inevitable dividends that it deserved.

And Nicks is still doing that bidding.

Sloane useless while playing injured. He's not 26 and at the top of his game anymore, slow him down 20% and he's no longer AFL quality.
Hartigan returns ahead of Butts or keeping McAsey. Seriously, nobody expected him to be meaningfully better and Fish needing a rest after 3 games, that is a straight out lie.
Mids showing promise when in the middle being denied the opportunity until late in games.
Matt Crouch out and straight back in for no change at all.
Continuing with the same god awfully slow back half despite it being clear to all that the speed and quality of ball movement from their area is one of the reasons they see so much ball in the first place.
Very little 22 game day moves/flexibility
Playing seniors into the 2s without trying anything to get more value from them in the 1s
Carrying the above for far too long when delivering nothing in the 1s

The name has changed, some players might be happier, certainly satisfied that they forced change, but nothing has because the crew that set the football strategy are still there and they recruit only those minds that align.

 

[AmericanCrow]

Our failings are largely driven by our seniors though.

To a degree that is true. But overvalued younger players isn’t going to help

 

[AmericanCrow]

And this is a direct result of fostering a culture that valued intangibles ahead of game day performance. Senior players not held to account at selection, they get lazy and comfortable while the kids that get denied earned opportunities get leaving. This is a club management philosophy on football returning the inevitable dividends that it deserved.

And Nicks is still doing that bidding.

Sloane useless while playing injured. He's not 26 and at the top of his game anymore, slow him down 20% and he's no longer AFL quality.
Hartigan returns ahead of Butts or keeping McAsey. Seriously, nobody expected him to be meaningfully better and Fish needing a rest after 3 games, that is a straight out lie.
Mids showing promise when in the middle being denied the opportunity until late in games.
Matt Crouch out and straight back in for no change at all.
Continuing with the same god awfully slow back half despite it being clear to all that the speed and quality of ball movement from their area is one of the reasons they see so much ball in the first place.
Very little 22 game day moves/flexibility
Playing seniors into the 2s without trying anything to get more value from them in the 1s
Carrying the above for far too long when delivering nothing in the 1s

The name has changed, some players might be happier, certainly satisfied that they forced change, but nothing has because the crew that set the football strategy are still there and they recruit only those minds that align.

I am a firm believer you play to win the game you have in front of you. I have zero issues with organizational decisions to put the best 22 out there.

The poor returns for losing players the last several years, coupled with picks not performing to expected level have fundamentally contributed to speeding up our decline.

 

[1970crow]

Last three seasons there was quite an abundance of calls for all the youngsters to play and that they were loaded with talent being held back by playing vets.

Turns out some of them can’t kick from 15 meters away.

Kinda speaks for itself

You're blaming the younger players? You not watching what our senior players are delivering?

 

[marty36]

I think Marty was being sarcastic

We are dead last, I think that speaks volumes don't you?

 

[AmericanCrow]

You're blaming the younger players? You not watching what our senior players are delivering?

I am not arguing the senior players are diminished.

I am saying the other factors, including younger players who are not AFL level replacements have contributed mightily to fast tracking our descent to the pit.

If we had AFL caliber replacements we would not be headed for a Cleveland Browns 0-16 season.

 

[Pilchard_Adams]

You reckon our list of talent is pretty equivalent to Hawthorns peak era?

How can you pick that out of my entire post?

Hawthorn won only 5 games and they had Crawford, Mitchell, Everitt, Hodge, Joel Smith plus Mark Williams kicking 60+. This list is better than any 6 players on our list. My point is Hawthorn did really badly in Clarksons first year despite having quite a bit of talent in their prime, and they didnt sack him. Imagine if they did...

The level of talent on our list has nothing to do with Nicks as a coach.

 

[Vhaluus]

I think we all know that Nicks is just seen as a caretaker coach until an ex player is ready to take the reigns.

Obvious priority is Goodwin if Melbourne get sick of him but they'll have a few assistant coaches as options in a few years too.

 

[Pilchard_Adams]

The thread isnt about whether he will get sacked this week, it's whether he will get sacked before he coaches a win. How long without coaching a win is an acceptable period for you?

1.5 years?

I dont care about wins right now, this year is a compromised year and Adelaide are blooding a large amount of youth. They will see a lot of list changes in the off season, so I would make my call by round 8 next year. Right now I care about player development, not scraping together 3 or 4 wins. If they wanted to do that, they could have kept Greenwood and Co. The moves made so far indicate they are committed to a rebuild.

 

[relapse]

How can you pick that out of my entire post?

Hawthorn won only 5 games and they had Crawford, Mitchell, Everitt, Hodge, Joel Smith plus Mark Williams kicking 60+. This list is better than any 6 players on our list. My point is Hawthorn did really badly in Clarksons first year despite having quite a bit of talent in their prime, and they didnt sack him. Imagine if they did...

The level of talent on our list has nothing to do with Nicks as a coach.

I completely agree with your post.

There were lots of calls about Clarkson's ability as a coach earlier on.

He was slammed for playing Zac Dawson on Rocca, Dawson was a scrawny kid and Rocca was about 30 kilos heavier and kicked about 10 goals on him. Clarkson was slammed from pillar to post for leaving Dawson on him for the whole game and people in the media were saying that he couldn't coach.

I am not saying that Nicks is going to be a great coach, but the reality is that he's only coached a hand full of games so any calls to sack Nicks are laughable at this moment.