Opinion Adelaide Football Club to Crouch "leave"... gets unhappy when he leaves

[Joffaboy]

I think the events that preceded Nicks' appointment did that.

Combo. See my post on timeline of the Adelaide trainwreck above.

To think the 'defend or leave' wasn't directed at Crouch is naive in the extreme IMO.

I have no problem with the statement, happens all the time, just shows a lack of judgement in allowing it to be aired.

 

[George]

Combo. See my post on timeline of the Adelaide trainwreck above.

To think the 'defend or leave' wasn't directed at Crouch is naive in the extreme IMO.

I have no problem with the statement, happens all the time, just shows a lack of judgement in allowing it to be aired.

It is clear he isn't directing his comments towards Crouch because he addresses the entire group. They ask Crouch what happened, he responds then Nicks talks to the grouo collectively about being a better midfield. Sloane also makes comment on it. They are a team, they are giving each other strong feedback. They are professionals, this is nothing compared to some of the stuff Ross would put our boys through.

Let's not sensationalise a 30 second clip. Way too over the top for me but sadly it's not surprising.

Their preseason of 2018 is what put them in the situation they are in now. Don't think it's got anything to do with Nicks. I think people a drawing a really long bow with this video.

Perhaps in under 9's you'd walk because of a situation like that.

 

[Joffaboy]

It is clear he isn't directing his comments towards Crouch because he addresses the entire group. They ask Crouch what happened, he responds then Nicks talks to the grouo collectively about being a better midfield. Sloane also makes comment on it. They are a team, they are giving each other strong feedback. They are professionals, this is nothing compared to some of the stuff Ross would put our boys through.

Let's not sensationalise a 30 second clip. Way too over the top for me but sadly it's not surprising.

Their preseason of 2018 is what put them in the situation they are in now. Don't think it's got anything to do with Nicks. I think people a drawing a really long bow with this video.

Totally disagree. Questioning Crouch about his lack of run, then a supposed general 'defend or leave'. How else would you take it.

Not sensationalised, just a symptom of a club in decline. Nicks will make Richardson look like a genius

 

[George]

Totally disagree. Questioning Crouch about his lack of run, then a supposed general 'defend or leave'. How else would you take it.

Not sensationalised, just a symptom of a club in decline. Nicks will make Richardson look like a genius

Well it's sensationalised because the comment is taken literally when it's not supposed to be. It's a general comment with the basic understanding of "step it up, it's not good enough". How you can make a judgement call on the relationship Nicks has with his players and if they respect him enough to be okay with robust discussion by watching a small clip like that is beyond me, especially when you consider it happens at every level of football and especially in a high pressure environment like the AFL.

I would've thought this is a pretty common occurrence at every club. Brad's a big boy, I doubt whether this not only impacted his decision to leave but he even remembers it happening at all.

Nicks appointment has nothing to do with the exodus, that happened before his time. Crouch is a Victorian, from Ballarat, and has family here. Given the current climate I am sure this impacted his decision to leave more than criticism from a coach. Guy is a best and fairest winner and probably has a level of confidence in his ability as a footballer to not let this effect him.

In the highly unlikely scenario that it did effect him, we have made a horrible decision bringing him on.

 

[Joffaboy]

Well it's sensationalised because the comment is taken literally when it's not supposed to be. It's a general comment with the basic understanding of "step it up, it's not good enough". How you can make a judgement call on the relationship Nicks has with his players and if they respect him enough to be okay with robust discussion by watching a small clip like that is beyond me, especially when you consider it happens at every level of football and especially in a high pressure environment like the AFL.

How can you make the judgement he has the respect of the players to make that decision. It isn't 'robust', it's is a trite faux hard man threat made to footballers who are professional.
Would you make that threat to Brad Hill when his whole role is to be on the outside of the play? It was a dumb cliched statement

I would've thought this is a pretty common occurrence at every club. Brad's a big boy, I doubt whether this not only impacted his decision to leave but he even remembers it happening at all.

While this may be true, your wouldn't know that. This type of bullying hard man approach hasn't been reported by anyone from Brett Ratten. And where did I ever suggest Crouch left because Nicks silly cliche faux tough guy shtick routine. However I am also sure an experienced coach like Ratten wouldn't carry on like that to a senior member of the team and a B&F winner.

Nicks appointment has nothing to do with the exodus, that happened before his time. Crouch is a Victorian, from Ballarat, and has family here. Given the current climate I am sure this impacted his decision to leave more than criticism from a coach. Guy is a best and fairest winner and probably has a level of confidence in his ability as a footballer to not let this effect him.

Nothing to do with Croucg, everything to do with the culture of AFC in the hole they have created for themselves since the full time siren of the 2017 GF.

In the highly unlikely scenario that it did effect him, we have made a horrible decision bringing him on.

Why? Could have been the final straw, reported the club mishandled his injury in 18 and 19, and a number of other things may have occurred. The insult by Nick to him may have just been the final nail in the coffin of an ongoing toxic relationship, who knows? To say we have made a terrible mistake because this may have contributed is a silly thing to conclude. You don't know the full story, only Crouch does.

i don't know what him being Victorian has to do with him leaving. Walker is from Broken Hill and has been at the Crows his whole career, Hayes from NSW, Riewoldt from QLD, all lifer Saints players.

My guess, and it is only a guess, Crouch thought his chance at a flag at the Crows was done, and he got offered 5 x 600k at 26 by a finals team. However I reckon you don't pointedly question a B&F winning senior player about his defence and then make a big song and dance about ' defend or leave'. Shows a poor culture and a poor inexperienced coach who thinks he is Rodney Eade.

 

[Hubnester]

Totally disagree. Questioning Crouch about his lack of run, then a supposed general 'defend or leave'. How else would you take it.

Not sensationalised, just a symptom of a club in decline. Nicks will make Richardson look like a genius

It's mostly the editing.
There's a cut away between the different coaches talking. First one is conversing with Brad. Second one is sitting behind him and is directing his speech to the group.
In reality these two moments could have happened an hour apart and been in totally different contexts.

 

[Joffaboy]

It's mostly the editing.
There's a cut away between the different coaches talking. First one is conversing with Brad. Second one is sitting behind him and is directing his speech to the group.
In reality these two moments could have happened an hour apart and been in totally different contexts.

Just rewatched it, and I stand by what I wrote. They hang Crouch out to dry. He says so himself. Sloane having a go at him, wont even look at him, then Nicks plays the tough guy issuing threats from behind him.

You can tell it is moments later, Crouch is sitting the exact same way. Maybe Sloane and the others should take some accountability for their dreadful season as well, seemed only too happy to pile in on Crouch.

Yep reinforces my beliefs that the AFC is a divided rabble and Crouch made a great decision to get the hell out of there.

 

[George]

How can you make the judgement he has the respect of the players to make that decision. It isn't 'robust', it's is a trite faux hard man threat made to footballers who are professional.
Would you make that threat to Brad Hill when his whole role is to be on the outside of the play? It was a dumb cliched statement

So you agree you don't know what his relationship with the players is like. It's not a hard man threat haha, it's pretty obvious to understand what he is getting at. Why did you take his comment literally?

While this may be true, your wouldn't know that. This type of bullying hard man approach hasn't been reported by anyone from Brett Ratten. And where did I ever suggest Crouch left because Nicks silly cliche faux tough guy shtick routine. However I am also sure an experienced coach like Ratten wouldn't carry on like that to a senior member of the team and a B&F winner.

This is what I mean by sensationalism. Bullying, really?

Mate these things happen at every single club if you played football for any level for long enough you would've experienced It. A coach telling his players what is required of them. And comments like if you don't want to work hard you can leave or words to that effect isn't meant to be taken literally.

Nothing to do with Croucg, everything to do with the culture of AFC in the hole they have created for themselves since the full time siren of the 2017 GF.

You can make assumptions about the culture of a football club by watching a clip of a coach demanding a better effort from his players? (Because he was talking to the group). Nicks has absolutely nothing to do with the 2017 GF and the preseason camp that came after it, which many players have publicly said was the major reason they left.

Why? Could have been the final straw, reported the club mishandled his injury in 18 and 19, and a number of other things may have occurred. The insult by Nick to him may have just been the final nail in the coffin of an ongoing toxic relationship, who knows? To say we have made a terrible mistake because this may have contributed is a silly thing to conclude. You don't know the full story, only Crouch does.

Haha I am sure Brad has had many instances of being told to give more effort. In this case however the comment was directed to the team, not to Crouch. What insult by the way? I didn't see him insult Brad at all. We have made a terrible mistake bringing him on if he is really that soft that he can't take questions on his performance.

i don't know what him being Victorian has to do with him leaving. Walker is from Broken Hill and has been at the Crows his whole career, Hayes from NSW, Riewoldt from QLD, all lifer Saints players.

Uhh, COVID mate. Might’ve played a part. Year away from family, lockdowns, restrictions, perhaps entered his mind about what is important to him. Moreso than questions from his coach anyway.

My guess, and it is only a guess, Crouch thought his chance at a flag at the Crows was done, and he got offered 5 x 600k at 26 by a finals team. However I reckon you don't pointedly question a B&F winning senior player about his defence and then make a big song and dance about ' defend or leave'. Shows a poor culture and a poor inexperienced coach who thinks he is Rodney Eade.

Why is any player exempt from being questioned on his performance?

Shows nothing other than a normal interaction that most players at all clubs will go through at some point.

You don't reckon a coach like Clarkson would do something as meek as this?? He has one of the biggest tempers in the league. Yet nobody left and they won 4 flags. It's silly to suggest what happened in this video is the reason or should be part of reasons for a player leaving a football club.

Can hate the Crows if you want but come on man be objective about it. Discussions like these take place at all clubs. I really worry for Brad if he took issue with this but in all honesty I reckon he probably doesn't even remember it happening it's that insignificant.

 

[Jay Beast]

It was clumsy but it was a general comment to the group. Would be staggered if this exact situation has not happened a million times in clubs over the journey. I just don't think it is a big deal.
Crouch leaving AFC was by mutual agreement.

 

[George]

I don't think they have any players left that we can vulture our way into anyway

Rest of the clubs have picked at their carcass for a few years now, they along with North are in for a pretty painful few years.

 

[Mowman]

I don't think they have any players left that we can vulture our way into anyway

Rest of the clubs have picked at their carcass for a few years now, they along with North are in for a pretty painful few years.

Throw Hawthorn in there as well

 

[StCicatriz]

Totally disagree. Questioning Crouch about his lack of run, then a supposed general 'defend or leave'. How else would you take it.

Not sensationalised, just a symptom of a club in decline. Nicks will make Richardson look like a genius

i've never heard a first-year coach tell a group of players to "do this or leave"... actually i lie, i have... mark neeld. he never recovered from it and was gone < 24 months later.

its very strange, even stranger the defence of it.

i mean imagine being the senior group of players here. you've given your all to the club and taken them to a grand final, as per the cyclical nature of football you then fall back down the ladder and are in rebuild mode. you've just come out of a training program that involved mentally torturing your players using techniques from training commandos, that saw your last coach sacked. you then get a green first year coach, you need to help upskill whilst also reducing the losses and train up the younger players.

only for the ****wit to turn around, before the season is even out, and tell you to "do this or leave". let alone whilst it's filmed to show others.

you know what i would think if i was an out of contract sought after player: "this guy has got a screw loose, fine, catch ya. i'm not going to take all these hits to develop the younger players for this guy to throw me under the bus"

i've seen some very strong coaches, who did not tolerate fools and demanded a high standard. they would not mince their words and could deliver an almighty spray. none of them would tell a group "do this or leave" after being in their first job for literally months, tasked with rebuilding an ageing list and developing a bunch of younger players. especially with the turn over the crows have had in past seasons and what they were then exposed too.

it's utter madness.

you need to appreciate what the senior players have to do, so early on in a rebuild and need them to come with you on the journey, knowing they may not be there to reap the reward. throwing them under the bus like that so publicly, will not go down well.

 

[Sheepey]

I don't mind Nicks' comments. I interpreted it as being directed towards the entire group, not just B Crouch. They just lost a showdown by the largest margin ever (75 points). A strong response was absolutely necessary. Every coach has to have a hard edge. They should keep their powder dry and not bring it out often, but it gets the playing group to notice when it manifests.

Honestly I had more of an issue with Sloane's message and delivery to Crouch. He came across as dismissive and petulant, and he wouldn't even look at him when he was providing feedback.

 

[George]

Throw Hawthorn in there as well

Few clubs seem really dire at the moment. I can't think of a player out of the three of those clubs that we could be better with.

 

[gringo2011]

Feel like this is a bit of an overreaction. There's not much context in that snippet and there seems to be a very tenuous link being made between the comments and Crouch's departure. I don't think this reflects anywhere near as badly on Adelaide as some are making out. Seems like the comments about leaving were pretty broadly directed to the group to emphasise the importance of defence.

It's ****ing horrible optics after their camp fiasco made them look like some kind of tactless buffoons. To let the media film them doing it was a real misfire. I doubt even their fans would have got anything but anxiety from that. You only do that for two reasons, fire up the players or show the fans that you are setting standards. I'm not sure if it did either well.

 

[Jay Beast]

When you're a struggling team I imagine these reviews are brutal and having teammates go-in on each other when reviewing a bunch of individual plays seems almost antithetical to team cohesion.
May be it works and coaches talk about the need for accountability to your teammates but geeez seems totally illogical.

 

[Premium]

So you agree you don't know what his relationship with the players is like. It's not a hard man threat haha, it's pretty obvious to understand what he is getting at. Why did you take his comment literally?


This is what I mean by sensationalism. Bullying, really?

Mate these things happen at every single club if you played football for any level for long enough you would've experienced It. A coach telling his players what is required of them. And comments like if you don't want to work hard you can leave or words to that effect isn't meant to be taken literally.



You can make assumptions about the culture of a football club by watching a clip of a coach demanding a better effort from his players? (Because he was talking to the group). Nicks has absolutely nothing to do with the 2017 GF and the preseason camp that came after it, which many players have publicly said was the major reason they left.



Haha I am sure Brad has had many instances of being told to give more effort. In this case however the comment was directed to the team, not to Crouch. What insult by the way? I didn't see him insult Brad at all. We have made a terrible mistake bringing him on if he is really that soft that he can't take questions on his performance.


Uhh, COVID mate. Might’ve played a part. Year away from family, lockdowns, restrictions, perhaps entered his mind about what is important to him. Moreso than questions from his coach anyway.


Why is any player exempt from being questioned on his performance?

Shows nothing other than a normal interaction that most players at all clubs will go through at some point.

You don't reckon a coach like Clarkson would do something as meek as this?? He has one of the biggest tempers in the league. Yet nobody left and they won 4 flags. It's silly to suggest what happened in this video is the reason or should be part of reasons for a player leaving a football club.

Can hate the Crows if you want but come on man be objective about it. Discussions like these take place at all clubs. I really worry for Brad if he took issue with this but in all honesty I reckon he probably doesn't even remember it happening it's that insignificant.

Coach can say whatever he wants , but you don't show it to the world through the media - strange how they will show this but never really showed anything about the preseason drama they had the year before with collective minds fiasco.

 

[Premium]

It's ******* horrible optics after their camp fiasco made them look like some kind of tactless buffoons. To let the media film them doing it was a real misfire. I doubt even their fans would have got anything but anxiety from that. You only do that for two reasons, fire up the players or show the fans that you are setting standards. I'm not sure if it did either well.

The coach just made a big mistake - you can rip a player but don't let the public see it.

Ratten has most probably said worse to Carlisle but he does it behind closed doors.

 

[George]

Coach can say whatever he wants , but you don't show it to the world through the media - strange how they will show this but never really showed anything about the preseason drama they had the year before with collective minds fiasco.

All in all I don't think it's even an issue and definitely not as big of an issue as some are making it out to be here. It's a non event. It happens everywhere, all the time.

 

[jwikked]

Few clubs seem really dire at the moment. I can't think of a player out of the three of those clubs that we could be better with.

Sicily would be great for us

 

[Joffaboy]

i've never heard a first-year coach tell a group of players to "do this or leave"... actually i lie, i have... mark neeld. he never recovered from it and was gone < 24 months later.

its very strange, even stranger the defence of it.

i mean imagine being the senior group of players here. you've given your all to the club and taken them to a grand final, as per the cyclical nature of football you then fall back down the ladder and are in rebuild mode. you've just come out of a training program that involved mentally torturing your players using techniques from training commandos, that saw your last coach sacked. you then get a green first year coach, you need to help upskill whilst also reducing the losses and train up the younger players.

only for the ******* to turn around, before the season is even out, and tell you to "do this or leave". let alone whilst it's filmed to show others.

you know what i would think if i was an out of contract sought after player: "this guy has got a screw loose, fine, catch ya. i'm not going to take all these hits to develop the younger players for this guy to throw me under the bus"

i've seen some very strong coaches, who did not tolerate fools and demanded a high standard. they would not mince their words and could deliver an almighty spray. none of them would tell a group "do this or leave" after being in their first job for literally months, tasked with rebuilding an ageing list and developing a bunch of younger players. especially with the turn over the crows have had in past seasons and what they were then exposed too.

it's utter madness.

you need to appreciate what the senior players have to do, so early on in a rebuild and need them to come with you on the journey, knowing they may not be there to reap the reward. throwing them under the bus like that so publicly, will not go down well.

Nailed it.

 

[Joffaboy]

So you agree you don't know what his relationship with the players is like. It's not a hard man threat haha, it's pretty obvious to understand what he is getting at. Why did you take his comment literally?


This is what I mean by sensationalism. Bullying, really?

Mate these things happen at every single club if you played football for any level for long enough you would've experienced It. A coach telling his players what is required of them. And comments like if you don't want to work hard you can leave or words to that effect isn't meant to be taken literally.



You can make assumptions about the culture of a football club by watching a clip of a coach demanding a better effort from his players? (Because he was talking to the group). Nicks has absolutely nothing to do with the 2017 GF and the preseason camp that came after it, which many players have publicly said was the major reason they left.



Haha I am sure Brad has had many instances of being told to give more effort. In this case however the comment was directed to the team, not to Crouch. What insult by the way? I didn't see him insult Brad at all. We have made a terrible mistake bringing him on if he is really that soft that he can't take questions on his performance.


Uhh, COVID mate. Might’ve played a part. Year away from family, lockdowns, restrictions, perhaps entered his mind about what is important to him. Moreso than questions from his coach anyway.


Why is any player exempt from being questioned on his performance?

Shows nothing other than a normal interaction that most players at all clubs will go through at some point.

You don't reckon a coach like Clarkson would do something as meek as this?? He has one of the biggest tempers in the league. Yet nobody left and they won 4 flags. It's silly to suggest what happened in this video is the reason or should be part of reasons for a player leaving a football club.

Can hate the Crows if you want but come on man be objective about it. Discussions like these take place at all clubs. I really worry for Brad if he took issue with this but in all honesty I reckon he probably doesn't even remember it happening it's that insignificant.

Try actually reading what I posted before responding with incoherent straw man arguments.
As for lecturing me on being objective, don't think I'll take to much advice from a gen y with minimal life experience who seems to have difficulty understanding a relatively linear alternative pov. Hey but appreciate the effort mate.

 

[Joffaboy]

Anyway arguing over the Crows, not our best use of our time.

I'm out [emoji3][emoji3][emoji3]

 

[George]

Try actually reading what I posted before responding with incoherent straw man arguments.
As for lecturing me on being objective, don't think I'll take to much advice from a gen y with minimal life experience who seems to have difficulty understanding a relatively linear alternative pov. Hey but appreciate the effort mate.

Lmao, what a weird response.

Sorry I don't want to join in on the sensationalist pile on of another club. The discussion Nicks had with his players was pretty straight forward. You'd have to be a pretty weak individual to get offended by something like that or even think it was offensive. To not think these kinds of discussions happen at all clubs is naive.

Some do love blowing things out of proportion.

 

[Ducky Tie]

It's ******* horrible optics after their camp fiasco made them look like some kind of tactless buffoons. To let the media film them doing it was a real misfire. I doubt even their fans would have got anything but anxiety from that. You only do that for two reasons, fire up the players or show the fans that you are setting standards. I'm not sure if it did either well.

I’ll wait and see the full clip before passing such a strong judgement. I get what you mean, but I really don’t see this in the same way. Seems like an overreaction to a contextless snippet. I’d be surprised if neutral fans saw this as such a big issue as we seem to.