Bluemour Melting Pot XXIX

[Blue_Fusion]

Sydney's form is more about excellent drafting than Pyke. The kids they recruited came in on day 1 and made the team a whole lot better.
Kudos to Pyke he has added a more attacking element to an already rock solid game plan.
CB

Haven't most of their kids come from the academy?

 

[Wickzki]

Haven't most of their kids come from the academy?

Sydney's current list and how they were acquired

Academy
=======

Lachlan McAndrew (2021 midseason draft) -- yet to debut
Errol Gulden (2020 AFL Draft) -- 11 games
Marc Sheather (cat B rookie) -- yet to debut
Braeden Campbell (2020 AFL Draft) -- 6 games
Nick Blakey (2018 AFL Draft) -- 47 games
Sam Wicks (2018 Cat B rookie, zone selection) -- 22 games
James Bell (2017 Cat B rookie, zone selection) -- 15 games
Callum Mills (2015 AFL Draft) -- 108 games
Isaac Heeney (2014 AFL Draft) -- 122 games
Sam Naismith (2013 Rookie Draft, zone selection) -- 30 games


Non-Academy
===========

Malachy Carruthers (rookie listed)
Logan McDonald (2020 AFL Draft)
Chad Warner (2019 AFL Draft)
Will Gould (2019 AFL Draft)
Dylan Stephens (2019 AFL Draft)
James Rowbottom (2018 AFL Draft)
Justin McInerney (2018 AFL Draft)
Tom McCartin (2017 AFL Draft)
Joel Amartey (2018 Rookie Draft)
Hayden McLean (2019 pre-season selection period)
Matthew Ling (2017 AFL Draft)
Will Hayward (2016 AFL Draft)
Oliver Florent (2016 AFL Draft)
Lewis Melican (2014 AFL Draft)
Tom Papley (2016 Rookie Draft)
Barry O'Connor (2019, Cat B rookie, Ireland)
Ben Ronke (2016 AFL Draft)
Ryan Clarke (2018, traded from North Melbourne)
Jordan Dawson (2015 AFL Draft)
George Hewett (2013 AFL Draft)
Colin O'Riordan (2016 Rookie Draft, Ireland)
Lewis Taylor (2019 3-way trade from Brisbane w/ Carlton)
Kaiden Brand (2019 delisted player period)
Harry Cunningham (2012 rookie upgrade, 2011 Rookie Draft)
Jake Lloyd (2013 Rookie Draft)
Robbie Fox (2017 Rookie Draft)
Luke Parker (2010 AFL Draft)
Sam Gray (2019 DFA period, from Port Adelaide)
Sam Reid (2009 AFL Draft)
Tom Hickey (2020 trade, from West Coast)
Dane Rampe (2012 Rookie Draft)
Callum Sinclair (2015 trade from West Coast)
Josh P Kennedy (2009 trade from Hawthorn)
Lance Franklin (2013 restricted free agency from Hawthorn)

 

[Arr0w]

Sydney's current list and how they were acquired

Academy
=======

Lachlan McAndrew (2021 midseason draft) -- yet to debut
Errol Gulden (2020 AFL Draft) -- 11 games
Marc Sheather (cat B rookie) -- yet to debut
Braeden Campbell (2020 AFL Draft) -- 6 games
Nick Blakey (2018 AFL Draft) -- 47 games
Sam Wicks (2018 Cat B rookie, zone selection) -- 22 games
James Bell (2017 Cat B rookie, zone selection) -- 15 games
Callum Mills (2015 AFL Draft) -- 108 games
Isaac Heeney (2014 AFL Draft) -- 122 games
Sam Naismith (2013 Rookie Draft, zone selection) -- 30 games


Non-Academy
===========

Malachy Carruthers (rookie listed)
Logan McDonald (2020 AFL Draft)
Chad Warner (2019 AFL Draft)
Will Gould (2019 AFL Draft)
Dylan Stephens (2019 AFL Draft)
James Rowbottom (2018 AFL Draft)
Justin McInerney (2018 AFL Draft)
Tom McCartin (2017 AFL Draft)
Joel Amartey (2018 Rookie Draft)
Hayden McLean (2019 pre-season selection period)
Matthew Ling (2017 AFL Draft)
Will Hayward (2016 AFL Draft)
Oliver Florent (2016 AFL Draft)
Lewis Melican (2014 AFL Draft)
Tom Papley (2016 Rookie Draft)
Barry O'Connor (2019, Cat B rookie, Ireland)
Ben Ronke (2016 AFL Draft)
Ryan Clarke (2018, traded from North Melbourne)
Jordan Dawson (2015 AFL Draft)
George Hewett (2013 AFL Draft)
Colin O'Riordan (2016 Rookie Draft, Ireland)
Lewis Taylor (2019 3-way trade from Brisbane w/ Carlton)
Kaiden Brand (2019 delisted player period)
Harry Cunningham (2012 rookie upgrade, 2011 Rookie Draft)
Jake Lloyd (2013 Rookie Draft)
Robbie Fox (2017 Rookie Draft)
Luke Parker (2010 AFL Draft)
Sam Gray (2019 DFA period, from Port Adelaide)
Sam Reid (2009 AFL Draft)
Tom Hickey (2020 trade, from West Coast)
Dane Rampe (2012 Rookie Draft)
Callum Sinclair (2015 trade from West Coast)
Josh P Kennedy (2009 trade from Hawthorn)
Lance Franklin (2013 restricted free agency from Hawthorn)

They draft and trade well at every level.

But, when you know you have acadamy talent for the taking, it does make it easier to plan trade needs and draft types

 

[myblueroan]

Time to ‘reveal’?

Is that "why can't we have both"?????

 

[Gavstar]

They draft and trade well at every level.

But, when you know you have acadamy talent for the taking, it does make it easier to plan trade needs and draft types

Agresta Recruiting Manager of Swans 2010-2017 , hasn't had much time yet at Carlton.

 

[myblueroan]

He left at the end of a review exactly like one we are conducting now, the findings of which are confidential.

Sounds like another of Lloyd and Liddle's genius thought bubbles.

Absolutely. This is the guy who ran that camp isn't it? I mean..let those idiots run it.

 

[mjonc43]

Media had Pyke and Pies linked today.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[skadoosh]

They draft and trade well at every level.

But, when you know you have acadamy talent for the taking, it does make it easier to plan trade needs and draft types

Hmm, rather than looking at it as though we're not getting access to good kids, could it be a development and culture issue?
ie. unless you're driven like a Walsh or Weitering, anyone would find it hard to thrive playing at Carlton vs throwing an average-skilled kid into Sydney's club - what type of player do you end up with?

 

[BlueLocke]

The Crows current woes can absolutely be linked back to the review that ousted Pyke - but Brett Burton

Brett Burton

Age

47

Ht

185cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.2

3star

K

10.4

4star

HB

2.8

2star

M

6.0

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

2.2

5star

No current season stats available

D

14.4

4star

K

12.0

5star

HB

2.4

3star

M

8.4

5star

T

1.0

3star

G

2.8

5star

was the one who seemed to run the club into the ground - some of his press conferences post-camp would put Baghdad Bob to shame.

The exodus of Aboriginal players from the Crows is what really raised eyebrows to the complete and utter debacle under Burton - speaking to a friend of a former Crow there is no doubt there’s some bad blood over what went down.

Don’t know how much of this reflects back on Pyke; I’m not sure he’s the fit for us in any capacity but hey! The review knows more than I.

In conclusion, Adelaide is a club of contrasts.

 

[agro]

Don’t be deceived Sydney’s rebuild has taken much longer than you think it has.

 

[Curnivore]

Hmm, rather than looking at it as though we're not getting access to good kids, could it be a development and culture issue?
ie. unless you're driven like a Walsh or Weitering, anyone would find it hard to thrive playing at Carlton vs throwing an average-skilled kid into Sydney's club - what type of player do you end up with?

Makes me think of Troy Menzel. Loved him in our forward line, then heard whispers of a few attitude problems.
SOS sends him to the Crows, a team building towards a premiership and he is barely heard from again.

maybe our culture isn’t as rich as other club.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

I am sorry Don Pyke and his involvement with that toxic and insidious camp (even though it does appear Brett Burton

Brett Burton

Age

47

Ht

185cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.2

3star

K

10.4

4star

HB

2.8

2star

M

6.0

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

2.2

5star

No current season stats available

D

14.4

4star

K

12.0

5star

HB

2.4

3star

M

8.4

5star

T

1.0

3star

G

2.8

5star

was mostly responsible for it it seems in hindsight) leaves me cold having him at the club.

I still firmly believe we shouldn't go down the recycled coach path if we decide to part ways with Teagje.

 

[Wickzki]

Makes me think of Troy Menzel. Loved him in our forward line, then heard whispers of a few attitude problems.
SOS sends him to the Crows, a team building towards a premiership and he is barely heard from again.

maybe our culture isn’t as rich as other club.

Menzel - you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink

 

[swuzzlebubble]

I still firmly believe we shouldn't go down the recycled coach path if we decide to part ways with Teagje.

So someone with less experience than DT?

 

[BlueBlood15]

Hmm, rather than looking at it as though we're not getting access to good kids, could it be a development and culture issue?
ie. unless you're driven like a Walsh or Weitering, anyone would find it hard to thrive playing at Carlton vs throwing an average-skilled kid into Sydney's club - what type of player do you end up with?

Sydney draft well (with a slight leg up from their academy) but most importantly they are elite at developing players.
They have a strong coaching group who make clear the standards to play for the club from day one and set clearly defined roles for young players in a well oiled system.
They have a strong senior core of players who set the standards and push their teammates hard.
A number of their success stories are kids not rated particularly highly as juniors - Papley, McInerney, Dawson, Lloyd etc. They identify players with AFL attributes and then they slowly mould them into strong AFL players through a first class development program.
We’re still behind the 8 ball in the player development stakes.

 

[BringFevBack2021]

Is there a possibility that Pyke is purely being interviewed to meet criteria for the selection process?

 

[Membling]

Agresta Recruiting Manager of Swans 2010-2017 , hasn't had much time yet at Carlton.

From those drafts:

2010: Lamb, Parker, Johnson, Spangher
2011: Mitchell, Lockyer, Brown
2012: Towers, Marsh, Membrey, Dick
2013: Jones, Hewett, Nankervis, Aliir Aliir
2014: Heeney, Rose, Hiscox, Davis
2015: Mills, Leonardis, Dawson
2016: Florent, Hayward, Maibaum, Cameron,
2017: Ling, McCartin, Stoddart

Notably rookie selections: Rampe, Lloyd, Melican, Newmam, Papley, Ronke, Fox, Amartey

Moral of the story, good second and third round picks. Also can strike gold in rookie.

 

[BigFrizz36]

Is there a possibility that Pyke is purely being interviewed to meet criteria for the selection process?

Yep. It's also quite possible that we haven't even spoken to him.

 

[Arr0w]

Hmm, rather than looking at it as though we're not getting access to good kids, could it be a development and culture issue?
ie. unless you're driven like a Walsh or Weitering, anyone would find it hard to thrive playing at Carlton vs throwing an average-skilled kid into Sydney's club - what type of player do you end up with?

Number of items here.

Sure you know my thoughts about culture, I prefer to drill down further, rather than clickbait

So...

WC had a culture of drugs and party boys, a section at least, but they won a flag in that period. Tigers had a perception of poor culture, that changed after their flags, do they have a poor culture now, 5hat they are losing

Hawks strong culture while winning their 3-peat, has it changed given they sit 17th? I don't think so

As for the Swans, SkyhorseTamer would be better placed, to comment regarding their strengths and weaknesses, but their development is not only better than our club, it's better than most clubs

From what I know, they have have had strong support, $$$, from the AFL, but close to 2 decades, they developed a "no dickheads" policy, as well as strict non negotiables. This was largely driven by the players and is ingrained at their club. They too have misses, but they are rare.

Ultimately, people perceive strong culture around winning, which is flawed, as success is predominantly built on talent

So, while many of our players may seem to have stagnated, that perception changes quickly when winning

 

[Juddernaut08]

Number of items here.

Sure you know my thoughts about culture, I prefer to drill down further, rather than clickbait

So...

WC had a culture of drugs and party boys, a section at least, but they won a flag in that period. Tigers had a perception of poor culture, that changed after their flags, do they have a poor culture now, 5hat they are losing

Hawks strong culture while winning their 3-peat, has it changed given they sit 17th? I don't think so

As for the Swans, SkyhorseTamer would be better placed, to comment regarding their strengths and weaknesses, but their development is not only better than our club, it's better than most clubs

From what I know, they have have had strong support, $$$, from the AFL, but close to 2 decades, they developed a "no dickheads" policy, as well as strict non negotiables. This was largely driven by the players and is ingrained at their club. They too have misses, but they are rare.

Ultimately, people perceive strong culture around winning, which is flawed, as success is predominantly built on talent

So, while many of our players may seem to have stagnated, that perception changes quickly when winning

Sydney and Adelaide (as much as I hate them) do have great development.

Sydney also has a huge advantage due to academy though.

 

[BringFevBack2021]

Yep. It's also quite possible that we haven't even spoken to him.

I tend to trust RB to be honest, but I get your skepticism. It does tie in to something I mentioned a few pages back, that Teague has lost the players etc

Who knows though, unless you’re in the inner circle - rather than someone who hears something then you can never be sure. All speculation.

Do love it tho

 

[mochacinolatte]

They draft and trade well at every level.

But, when you know you have acadamy talent for the taking, it does make it easier to plan trade needs and draft types

I well run organisation to be honest at all fronts. From Coaching to Recruiting to Development.

 

[Jeremias]

Pyke would be a good addition as a senior assistant.

Not keen on him replacing Teague though.

 

[CoachB]

Good discussion. It's hard to know how much credit to give Pyke when there are so many other positive factors affecting the performance of the Swans.

I'm not convinced he us the guy for us.

Nevertheless, looking at the Swans resurgence shows you need to get many things right simultaneously.

The board, Harley very focused on the football side of things (should be favourite for Hocking's job) without ignoring sponsors etc. drafting, academy, development, culture, head coach, assistants, fitness medicos etc.

Just changing the head coach isn't going to be enough...

CB

 

[skadoosh]

Number of items here.

Sure you know my thoughts about culture, I prefer to drill down further, rather than clickbait

So...

WC had a culture of drugs and party boys, a section at least, but they won a flag in that period. Tigers had a perception of poor culture, that changed after their flags, do they have a poor culture now, 5hat they are losing

Hawks strong culture while winning their 3-peat, has it changed given they sit 17th? I don't think so

As for the Swans, SkyhorseTamer would be better placed, to comment regarding their strengths and weaknesses, but their development is not only better than our club, it's better than most clubs

From what I know, they have have had strong support, $$$, from the AFL, but close to 2 decades, they developed a "no dickheads" policy, as well as strict non negotiables. This was largely driven by the players and is ingrained at their club. They too have misses, but they are rare.

Ultimately, people perceive strong culture around winning, which is flawed, as success is predominantly built on talent

So, while many of our players may seem to have stagnated, that perception changes quickly when winning

Very true.

Can we drill it down to assistant and head coaches who are well-drilled, hold high standards, strong game plan/nous and able to effectively communicate down to players.