Media Swans Talk in the Media 2024

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[hairy biker]

Performance psychologist weighs in on Sydney's capitulation in the AFL Grand Final

Performance psychologist, Dr Phil Jauncey, has weighed in on the Sydney Swans’ capitulation in the AFL Grand Final last Saturday. Dr Jauncey worked with the Brisbane Lions during their three-peat from 2001 to 2003, and offered insight into how the Lions were able to be successful back then, and...

www.3aw.com.au

Thanks, I found that interesting.

The speaker differentiates between the role of a sports psychologist (who seeks to get your mind right) and himself as a performance psychologist who aims to get your performance right.

Also talks about the mindset (active/passive) and don't prepare differently and let the game lift you, don't waste energy and invite negative thoughts. In our case, he felt it may have been a case of 'here we go again' ( passive) when we fell behind whereas the Lions concentrated, when the game was level, on tackling harder, running faster etc (active) (in my words the 'controllables').

We seem to have learned nothing from the 22 GF.
Hope we do this time or if we get back there again hard to see how things will be different.
Messages such as 'it wasn't our day' or 'it won't define us' don't offer much hope (although I recognise these were in the immediate aftermath).

I'll repeat what I said earlier in the week;
Accept responsibility, accept the failure, seek to understand the issues, address those issues, implement change

 

[RedBloodBlackSwan]

Thanks, I found that interesting.

The speaker differentiates between the role of a sports psychologist (who seeks to get your mind right) and himself as a performance psychologist who aims to get your performance right.

Also talks about the mindset (active/passive) and don't prepare differently and let the game lift you, don't waste energy and invite negative thoughts. In our case, he felt it may have been a case of 'here we go again' ( passive) when we fell behind whereas the Lions concentrated, when the game was level, on tackling harder, running faster etc (active) (in my words the 'controllables').

We seem to have learned nothing from the 22 GF.
Hope we do this time or if we get back there again hard to see how things will be different.
Messages such as 'it wasn't our day' or 'it won't define us' don't offer much hope (although I recognise these were in the immediate aftermath).

I'll repeat what I said earlier in the week;
Accept responsibility, accept the failure, seek to understand the issues, address those issues, implement change

Yeah agree.

The passive vs active dichotomy is a good way to think about it. I almost wrote the other day that it seemed like the Swans simply forgot they had to turn up.

When asked after the game, they kept saying things like the preparation was perfect, it just wasn’t our day, and references to the universe.

And during the game, they kept letting Lions players run past them for easy possessions or to get out the back / on the outside. They just watched themselves get outworked.

It’s like they forgot that they actually had an active role to play on the day - they the day doesn’t take care of itself.

Maybe the team can bring Mike Pike in for some sessions. There was a great article on his relationship with his grandad I think it was, who would always tell him “make it a good a day” instead of “have a good day” - and Mike applied that right through his career.

He was also a true blood, who worked and worked and worked to get every bit of ability out of himself, as a late stage rugby convert. Maybe some of that can rub off.

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Article in SMH opining we’ve become too nice - Peter Fitzsimons

Hallmark not Hellfire: Too many Mr Nice Guys at the Swans

When things started going south in the AFL grand final, there was no battle-scared old bastard to hold the others to account.

www.smh.com.au

Might be paywalled but saying no one stood up as our house was burning down around us. Too many nice guys, no d*ckheads policy gone too far, didn’t make em earn it etc.

Confesses he knows little about AFL.

Then gives Robbo a plug about standing up for Goodesy.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Article in SMH opining we’ve become too nice - Peter Fitzsimons

Hallmark not Hellfire: Too many Mr Nice Guys at the Swans

When things started going south in the AFL grand final, there was no battle-scared old bastard to hold the others to account.

www.smh.com.au

I’m surprised Fairfax allowed Fitzsimmons to write anything about the Swans - normally only Andrew Wu is allowed to mention them, in some tiny piece buried behind pages of NRL ramble.

Even though I despise most of Fitzsimmons’ holier-than-thou articles, this one may have some merit.

 

[bedford]

I’m surprised Fairfax allowed Fitzsimmons to write anything about the Swans - normally only Andrew Wu is allowed to mention them, in some tiny piece buried behind pages of NRL ramble.

Even though I despise most of Fitzsimmons’ holier-than-thou articles, this one may have some merit.

He is an absolute half back flanker

 

[SM]

Article in SMH opining we’ve become too nice - Peter Fitzsimons

Hallmark not Hellfire: Too many Mr Nice Guys at the Swans

When things started going south in the AFL grand final, there was no battle-scared old bastard to hold the others to account.

www.smh.com.au

Might be paywalled but saying no one stood up as our house was burning down around us. Too many nice guys, no d*ckheads policy gone too far, didn’t make em earn it etc.

Confesses he knows little about AFL.

Then gives Robbo a plug about standing up for Goodesy.

I thought Campbell tried to throw his weight around from memory.

 

[Bloods86]

I thought Campbell tried to throw his weight around from memory.

Rowy, Parker, Fox, Campbell when he came on.

 

[Bandicoot]

Not sure whether this should be in here or its own thread but ties into the Robbie Fox interview and a few of the players interviews before and after the game. Long post.

The 'one game won't define us' chat is either being misrepresented by the players or they're missing a key component of it (whether through delivery from the players to the media, or the coaches to them).

The same messaging I and schools/intervention programs etc have used both with at risk teenagers speaking about traumatic experiences, mistakes in judgement or with high achieving students when focussing on ATAR results/End of Schooling Exams.

"‘One game won’t define us.’ This was four weeks ago, and we just had this mentality."

This is a great way to cope with failure and setbacks- it is a great way to prepare people for results going against them/outside their control. ATAR results won't define you- error in judgement/mistake/one action won't define you. This is a great way of making people be able to cope with failure- however, it doesn't prevent failure/take a proactive mindset to success either.

“We would like to win a grand final, but it won’t define us. You always have to take those learnings, and hopefully, everyone believes that good things are coming. It wasn’t this year, but hopefully, it’s in the years to come."

This is completely off. The athletes are looking at a grand final and performance as something outside of their control on the day. They are looking at it as they have done all the work and then what happens on the day happens- this is not right at all. It isn't 'Hopefully' good things are coming- good things ARE coming because the work has been done, because on the day the athletes are the best prepared, they can be and now it is the time to put everything into practice. They should be excited on the day to perform, to work hard to implement their work because they've done the work. They aren't hopeful things will work out- things WILL work out because of the things they can and have controlled (if they fail you then talk about losses not defining you.)

E.G Students complete all the study/work, teenager goes through all the mindfulness/rehabilitation and a big event comes up- you believe that you're capable of delivering on the day/achieving because of the work you have done- but you still do the work. You still dissect the question, highlight key cognitive verbs, plan out answers with the same structure etc. You don't just turn up and whatever happens- happens.

"We had such a good year to put ourselves in this position, and then it’s just that cherry on top. "

Concerning from an AFL perspective. The Grand Final is not the cherry on top- the Grand Final is the prize and the result. The study/training/other games aren't the cake- THIS is the cake. (Brownlow, All Australian, Norm Smith is the Cherry for players).

Same as 'appreciating the enormity of the week' was good and not burning energy- but it'd be good to hear the players talk about the 'enormity of the game'. The Grand Final parade isn't the thing to burn energy on or the enormous event- the game is the enormous part of the week.

I think the work they have done with open discussions/communications/check ins with each other during the game is great- shows players are able to express themselves on the field and the team remains connected. What is concerning is that it certainly looks like the players aren't communicating with each other the importance of the grand final to them. OR the importance of the grand final from the staff/club/fans etc. The players aren't going to be desperate on Grand Final Day if they believe that it is the cherry on top, it is not a season defining day and that it is something that they simply 'hope' comes together on the day. I get they're doing this to alleviate the sting of failure and to help players cope with 2022 (and now 2024) but all they're doing is undermining competitive fire of some of the players.

The team needs to be confident they've done the work to get here, know they've got a team of players they can be open with, that the players and coaches have all been honest about how much this game means to them and then go out and show how much the game means. It is healthy to be nervous, it is healthy to care, and it is healthy to understand that it is not just another game. It is healthy to be upset/angry/disappointed when you lose. It is healthy to be happy when you win- you're defined by the many actions you make, the biggest defining action for an AFL team is performing when it matters. THIS matters to them.

If they lose and they gave everything- they aren't defined as losers, and it doesn't define them. If they go out there- are defeatist and believe things are out of their control, then it absolutely defines them and is completely damning.

"The funny thing is, we actually started well for once. I don't think we could have prepped any better, mentally we went into the game great, physically as well…the footy gods had something else to say," Warner said.

Maybe a lot of it just comes down to players emotional/not articulating themselves and the messaging properly in the media- but there's quite a few quotes from players which just seem to be a serious disconnect. The way I've worked with young adults and adolescents in approaching failure, key tests and pressure situations seems to have far higher expectation on internal locus of control, understanding why they want something and expectation of performance than in a professional sporting team.


Edit: Just to clarify from what I've seen of Emma Murray she seems great (imperfects podcast, other athlete testimonials). I just wonder have we put enough time into this for it to be effective (as it has for other athletes/sporting clubs). Have we done enough focus on big games/important moments? You'd think this would be big priority next year if the club continues to go down this route.

As much as we reflect on the debacle that was Saturday, many here are looking at the prospect of what would/could happen next time we are in a GF.
My problem with that is that I believe it will be many years before we are again in a GF.
It seems that the list management team are going to go down the same path as they did after the 2022 GF believing that the internal progression from the existing squad would/will be enough. No need for new additions to the squad other than the draft. 2023 proved how wrong that was.
Hawthorn will be a significantly better team next year as will Brisbane. Collingwood, Geelong and Fremantle will have improved their best 22 but it seems we're happy to stay with what we've got.
Some may argue that we can't bring in additional players due to salary cap restrictions but that problem doesn't seem to affect the forementioned clubs, particularly Geelong who seem to be able to bring in whoever they like, no matter the cost.

 

[Registered User]

This was just played on SEN: Mitch Morton

Mitch Morton

Age

38

Ht

185cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.9

3star

K

7.7

3star

HB

5.2

4star

M

4.2

4star

T

2.5

4star

G

1.4

5star

No current season stats available

D

8.6

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

3.8

4star

T

0.6

3star

G

1.0

4star

was gassin' on with Paul Kelly at the past players' function during the Grand Final. After a while, when Mitch thought they'd been enjoying some mutual respect and bonding, Paul said to him, "hey buddy, so how did you get into the players' function?"
See below in my next post to hear the crappy audio

 

[bedford]

This was just on SEN: Mitch Morton was gassin' on with Paul Kelly at the passed players' function during the Grand Final. Mitch thought they were enjoying mutual respect and bonding, but, after a while, Paul said to Mitch, "hey buddy, how did you get into the players' function?"

Yep the past players function

 

[zyzzbruh]

As much as we reflect on the debacle that was Saturday, many here are looking at the prospect of what would/could happen next time we are in a GF.
My problem with that is that I believe it will be many years before we are again in a GF.
It seems that the list management team are going to go down the same path as they did after the 2022 GF believing that the internal progression from the existing squad would/will be enough. No need for new additions to the squad other than the draft. 2023 proved how wrong that was.
Hawthorn will be a significantly better team next year as will Brisbane. Collingwood, Geelong and Fremantle will have improved their best 22 but it seems we're happy to stay with what we've got.
Some may argue that we can't bring in additional players due to salary cap restrictions but that problem doesn't seem to affect the forementioned clubs, particularly Geelong who seem to be able to bring in whoever they like, no matter the cost.

Unpopular opinion, but i think the Hawks bubble will burst next year - Majority of teams are going to come out and try to play their fast paced 'chaos' game more than ever, and it's going to end up a sporadic, inefficient style of play imo. If we thought this years results were all over the place, wait till next year. I rekn team to team inconsistency will be off the charts and look absolutely ridiculous at times.

I actually think the more stable, contest based teams will succeed ahead of the latter next year. What that says about us, I actually don't know.

 

[bedford]

Unpopular opinion, but i think the Hawks bubble will burst next year - Majority of teams are going to come out and try to play their fast paced 'chaos' game more than ever, and it's going to end up a sporadic, inefficient style of play imo. If we thought this years results were all over the place, wait till next year. I rekn team to team inconsistency will be off the charts and look absolutely ridiculous at times.

I actually think the more stable, contest based teams will succeed ahead of the latter next year. What that says about us, I actually don't know.

Where am i ?

 

[Registered User]

Yep the past players function

Mitch Morton with Paul Kelly

 

[KingV23]

poor Morton. We wouldn't have won without him. Put some respect on his name, Kells haha

 

[The King!]

Unpopular opinion, but i think the Hawks bubble will burst next year - Majority of teams are going to come out and try to play their fast paced 'chaos' game more than ever, and it's going to end up a sporadic, inefficient style of play imo. If we thought this years results were all over the place, wait till next year. I rekn team to team inconsistency will be off the charts and look absolutely ridiculous at times.

I actually think the more stable, contest based teams will succeed ahead of the latter next year. What that says about us, I actually don't know.

100% willing to bet they miss the 8

 

[bloodsbigot]

Unpopular opinion, but i think the Hawks bubble will burst next year - Majority of teams are going to come out and try to play their fast paced 'chaos' game more than ever, and it's going to end up a sporadic, inefficient style of play imo. If we thought this years results were all over the place, wait till next year. I rekn team to team inconsistency will be off the charts and look absolutely ridiculous at times.

I actually think the more stable, contest based teams will succeed ahead of the latter next year. What that says about us, I actually don't know.

Agree. The hawks are severely overrated.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Agree. The hawks are severely overrated.

Not so sure their style will hold up in finals once they get more experience they were the best team along with Brisbane after starting 0-5 in the W/L column.

Mitchell is also a very good and clever coach, they are probably closer to their next flag than we are :/

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Can the wounded Swans recover? Four experts give their thoughts

After so much hope, the Swans’ season ended in bitter disappointment with a resounding grand final defeat against Brisbane.

www.smh.com.au

 

[Kiama Chris]

Can the wounded Swans recover? Four experts give their thoughts

After so much hope, the Swans’ season ended in bitter disappointment with a resounding grand final defeat against Brisbane.

www.smh.com.au

Gotta love Ruck Jesus.
Interesting that both Jude and the psych said pretty much the same thing.

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

Gotta love Ruck Jesus.
Interesting that both Jude and the psych said pretty much the same thing.

Seems like a few of us have written in to the club….

 

[caesar88]

Can the wounded Swans recover? Four experts give their thoughts

After so much hope, the Swans’ season ended in bitter disappointment with a resounding grand final defeat against Brisbane.

www.smh.com.au

This was a really interesting quote from Hickey:

"After ’22 everyone had a plan that all the talk in the media and stuff was that Swans are too small, and they need to put on weight, and I think there was a big focus on a lot of guys putting on weight, and then through that, there was a lot of injuries that preseason."

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

This was a really interesting quote from Hickey:

"After ’22 everyone had a plan that all the talk in the media and stuff was that Swans are too small, and they need to put on weight, and I think there was a big focus on a lot of guys putting on weight, and then through that, there was a lot of injuries that preseason."

Now that is really interesting you would only hear stuff like this from ex players.

More weight = more stress on ligaments/muscles

 

[caesar88]

Now that is really interesting you would only hear stuff like this from ex players.

More weight = more stress on ligaments/muscles

Sounds reasonable to me, though I know next to nothing on the subject.

And yet... we needed to put weight on. Arguably still do. Some of our players seem immune to gaining size. It's frustrating.

 

[sataris]

Sounds reasonable to me, though I know next to nothing on the subject.

And yet... we needed to put weight on. Arguably still do. Some of our players seem immune to gaining size. It's frustrating.

I don't have the statistics for this, but I'd wager that we rely a lot on moving the ball by hand. and thus we need a lot of 2 way running.

This requires a lot of endurance. Can't be running up and down all day with handball chains and be strong as an ox.

 

[caesar88]

I don't have the statistics for this, but I'd wager that we rely a lot on moving the ball by hand. and thus we need a lot of 2 way running.

This requires a lot of endurance. Can't be running up and down all day with handball chains and be strong as an ox.

I'd agree with that. Problem is in these grand finals we don't even get to put that endurance to the test because we just get killed in the contest. It's like our preferred game plan doesn't even get off the ground.