Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 8 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[_Mike_]

Opposition supporters coming to troll , you have been warned

 

[who_let_the_dogs_out]

Can they cancel the Oscar Allen trade?

 

[BLACAE]

Can they cancel the Oscar Allen trade?

That'd be awesome, not that he won't get somewhere. It was a Dog act on his part the way it went down.

 

[Munnez]

We may already have the solutions on our list.

Weightman
A Jones
Hynes
Dolan

Possibly but I think Weightman is a big unknown and we need some more quality in that area

 

[Munnez]

Probably need pressure just as much as goals. Pointless scoring 3-4 goals now and then, if you barely touch the ball, stick a tackle, or have a poor pressure rating.

Forward pressure
Defensive Structure across the whole ground/midfield
Defensive personnel

I think those are the three key areas we need to improve on in the offseason.

I am curious to the CAREER pressure rating of all of Weightman, West, Jones, Dolan, and whoever else. And how they rank vs the best few players in the league, and the league average. I know someone else made a post highlighting the Cats forwards pressure ratings in the Preliminary Final compared to how our players average.

Haven't seen much of Dovaston but in the VFL match Dogs V Hawks his defensive intensity seemed pretty good

 

[Snarls Barkley]

Correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t West average the highest pressure rating of the small forwards this year?

Not sure about pressure rating, not sure how that stat is worked out. He was 25th amongst 85 general forwards (more than 10 games) for pressure acts. 3rd out of 85 for inside 50 tackles

He was number 1 in the league for forward 50 ground ball gets

 

[RWnBluey]

Not sure about pressure rating, not sure how that stat is worked out. He was 25th amongst 85 general forwards (more than 10 games) for pressure acts. 3rd out of 85 for inside 50 tackles

He was number 1 in the league for forward 50 ground ball gets

Yes that’s the one. I knew he was leading something. 3rd got tackles i50 also impressive

 

[Snarls Barkley]

Probably need pressure just as much as goals. Pointless scoring 3-4 goals now and then, if you barely touch the ball, stick a tackle, or have a poor pressure rating.

Forward pressure
Defensive Structure across the whole ground/midfield
Defensive personnel

I think those are the three key areas we need to improve on in the offseason.

I am curious to the CAREER pressure rating of all of Weightman, West, Jones, Dolan, and whoever else. And how they rank vs the best few players in the league, and the league average. I know someone else made a post highlighting the Cats forwards pressure ratings in the Preliminary Final compared to how our players average.

That was probably my post. I’ve been obsessing over it for a long time and have had many posts so apologies if people are getting sick of it

One of the things with pressure acts is that it has a lot to do with the position you play. Inside mids get the most (Rowell, Liberatore, Atkins) regularly at 30 a game. Half forwards get a lot but wings and defenders have very little. So with career averages it probably throws things out a little, Vandermeer had that season he played half back for example. There was one year than Petracca was high for pressure acts for general forwards but it’s obviously just because he had a lot of midfield time. Also how the team plays probably has a factor, the Richmond dynasty all had very high pressure acts with their style, Brisbane (I don’t think we can say dynasty yet) with their chip kick/mark style tend to have lower pressure acts

In saying all that, I do think we are so far behind the game in this area. I think we have a great advantage in Darcy and particularly Naughton who are good pressure players for their position as well, not like we have a Mason Cox or something that means you’re essentially one down when the ball hits the deck.

The sort of elite pressure forwards are getting 18+ a game, sometimes up above 22. Switkowski, Schultz, McCreery, Butler, Brent Daniels, Miers, Neal-Bullen are putting these numbers up pretty consistently year on year. The only one we’ve had in that range was Arty Jones in 2023 with 19.7

The career numbers of our main guys and each season since the COVID year

Weightman - Career: 14.4, 2025: n/a (DNP), 2024: 15.1, 2023: 15.2, 2022: 14.0, 2021: 14.4
West - Career: 13.4, 2025: 13.7, 2024: 14.8, 2023: 15.0, 2022: 12.7, 2021: n/a (limited games)
Vandermeer - Career: 11.1, 2025: 9.0, 2024: 10.9, 2023: 10.6 (half back), 2022: 14.4, 2021: 13.8
McNeil - Career: 11.6, 2025: 9.5, 2024: 14.7, 2023: 10.8 (TOG 41%), 2022: 13.5, 2021: 10.4

 

[Bald Headed Flog]

Interesting. Now show the $$ spent on academy and father son players. I’d be willing to bet it absolutely dwarfs what any of Geelong, Pies, Sydney, etc have ever had on their list at any one time.

They may not have star KPFs, but they’ve been able to trade for gun players at every part of the ground while still bringing in top end talent thanks to a laughably unfair academy system that is far easier to qualify for than an NGA, while also enjoying the benefits of father son.

There’s debate over whether Port should be allowed Cochrane given he’s not been in their academy long enough, but Brisbane doesn’t have the same tenure requirements. Ty Gallop joined their academy the year before he was drafted..

 

[weltschmerz]

Interesting. Now show the $$ spent on academy and father son players. I’d be willing to bet it absolutely dwarfs what any of Geelong, Pies, Sydney, etc have ever had on their list at any one time.

They may not have star KPFs, but they’ve been able to trade for gun players at every part of the ground while still bringing in top end talent thanks to a laughably unfair academy system that is far easier to qualify for than an NGA, while also enjoying the benefits of father son.

There’s debate over whether Port should be allowed Cochrane given he’s not been in their academy long enough, but Brisbane doesn’t have the same tenure requirements. Ty Gallop joined their academy the year before he was drafted..

Northern academies have more lenient requirements than next generation academies. Which makes sense, because Brisbane is clearly so very disadvantaged by being based out of a non-footy state.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

Interesting. Now show the $$ spent on academy and father son players. I’d be willing to bet it absolutely dwarfs what any of Geelong, Pies, Sydney, etc have ever had on their list at any one time.

They may not have star KPFs, but they’ve been able to trade for gun players at every part of the ground while still bringing in top end talent thanks to a laughably unfair academy system that is far easier to qualify for than an NGA, while also enjoying the benefits of father son.

There’s debate over whether Port should be allowed Cochrane given he’s not been in their academy long enough, but Brisbane doesn’t have the same tenure requirements. Ty Gallop joined their academy the year before he was drafted..

I like the appeal of father/son. Is it unfair? Yes. Have we benefitted more than most? Definitely. But I love the romanticism of it. It's weird how many dominant players are father/son's, feel like this doesn't happen in other sports. If you could pick any under 23 player in the league, the top three would nearly be Darcy, Daicos and Ashcroft

Academies are an absolute rort. Always have been, always will be. It didn't pay off but us getting Jamarra at pick 1 was just laughable. The Northern academies are even worse. The lie that was sold that they need the academies to grow their own talent because traditional states would steal them was dumb. Sydney have never had issues recruiting players. People were leaving because they sucked and were poorly run. Gold Coast and Brisbane aren't having trouble recruiting players now that they aren't laughing stocks

Creating these pathways in the northern states and the areas the NGA covers is important but the AFL could easily run it themselves and it would benefit the entire comp. But they don't want to spend a cent more than they can, so would rather palm it off to the clubs to do the work and they get insanely ridiculous rewards

 

[Zgope1]

If you guys and gals are mad about the academies wait til you hear what a little birdie told me the other day.

My best mate was talking to a bloke who’s son, born and raised in glen Waverley, Melbourne, is a talented young footballer. The kid is 13 years old or so and footy mad.

Lions offered to pay for him to relocate so he can be in their academy.

 

[Dav1d]

I don’t mind the teams getting an academy player early but when it’s multiple it becomes a bit much, no reason to even want to tune in for the first night of the draft

 

[perro_loco]

Probably need pressure just as much as goals. Pointless scoring 3-4 goals now and then, if you barely touch the ball, stick a tackle, or have a poor pressure rating.

Forward pressure
Defensive Structure across the whole ground/midfield
Defensive personnel

I think those are the three key areas we need to improve on in the offseason.

I am curious to the CAREER pressure rating of all of Weightman, West, Jones, Dolan, and whoever else. And how they rank vs the best few players in the league, and the league average. I know someone else made a post highlighting the Cats forwards pressure ratings in the Preliminary Final compared to how our players average.

Do you include tackling when you talk about defensive pressure, bc that is something that needs huge improvement?

 

[_Cerberus_]

Do you include tackling when you talk about defensive pressure, bc that is something that needs huge improvement?

Yeah the whole package, pressure, tackles, forcing turnovers. The Cats tried to get it out of defence a few times, only for it to go straight back into a Lions players hands, and straight back inside 50. Hard to defend repeat entries.

 

[ossie_21]

Yeah the whole package, pressure, tackles, forcing turnovers. The Cats tried to get it out of defence a few times, only for it to go straight back into a Lions players hands, and straight back inside 50. Hard to defend repeat entries.

A big part of our game style in the mid 2010’s was dominating the ball & repeat entries, but our conversion rate sucked balls. I’d love to be able to see that game plan with the current teams firepower, but the game has changed since then.

Man, the amount of games we lost with more possessions and a truck load more inside 50’s back then….

 

[MaxiBont]

McVee requested a trade to Freo.

That's a really good get for Freo if they get it done

 

[Bulldogs85]

McVee requested a trade to Freo.

That's a really good get for Freo if they get it done

He is out of contract so that kind of helps

 

[JohnnySteel]

So when Wilkie officially states his staying & we shift that money / focus to Butters. What’s the likelihood of him requesting a trade this season & that actually getting done?

 

[Doggies7]

So where do with think Treloar's best role next season is going to be? I think others will be first in line for CBAs, not to mention if we somehow land Butters. Can he shift to a full time wing role? Would he work at half forward or like a twilight Matty Boyd off half back?

 

[adogsfan5]

So where do with think Treloar's best role next season is going to be? I think others will be first in line for CBAs, not to mention if we somehow land Butters. Can he shift to a full time wing role? Would he work at half forward or like a twilight Matty Boyd off half back?

Wing for me

 

[Mojorisin]

So where do with think Treloar's best role next season is going to be? I think others will be first in line for CBAs, not to mention if we somehow land Butters. Can he shift to a full time wing role? Would he work at half forward or like a twilight Matty Boyd off half back?

Inside mid unless we bring in Butters, half back may suit him best if we cant address that need through trade or draft.

 

[adogsfan5]

So when Wilkie officially states his staying & we shift that money / focus to Butters. What’s the likelihood of him requesting a trade this season & that actually getting done?

Not sure it’s done yet. Nothing was ever gonna be done before their bnf night.

 

[Munnez]

Not sure it’s done yet. Nothing was ever gonna be done before their bnf night.

Reckon there would be some awfully nervous Saints officials. Day before their BnF and no announcement shutting it down. I would still have the odds at 80% staying.

100% There is major Sphincter puckering having said that. If there is no announcement at the BnF then it could well be game on.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

So where do with think Treloar's best role next season is going to be? I think others will be first in line for CBAs, not to mention if we somehow land Butters. Can he shift to a full time wing role? Would he work at half forward or like a twilight Matty Boyd off half back?

Don't like him on the wing. Want guys with size and running power, who just go all day both ways, even if less talented

Has played a bit of half back before, would only do it if Dale was out and we were desperate for someone with composure at half back

I think he'll just play half forward rolling up into the contest. Maybe 20% CBAs. There's going to be games where he's on and you give him more, or days when the ones ahead of him are struggling and he gets more but think he'll just be a bit part player for the most part. There will be a time where we need someone to step up and he'll be ready to be that guy

 

[Mojorisin]

Don't like him on the wing. Want guys with size and running power, who just go all day both ways, even if less talented

Has played a bit of half back before, would only do it if Dale was out and we were desperate for someone with composure at half back

I think he'll just play half forward rolling up into the contest. Maybe 20% CBAs. There's going to be games where he's on and you give him more, or days when the ones ahead of him are struggling and he gets more but think he'll just be a bit part player for the most part. There will be a time where we need someone to step up and he'll be ready to be that guy

The flank opposite Dale concerns me. It was held down by an aging JJ and hot and cold Bramble this year, who knows if JJ will be on the list next year, Bramble certainly isn't going to improve at this point. Sellwood looks more defensive and Jaques still prepubescent.