List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part IV

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 4

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
​

 

[L_W_P]

Where are all the trades? I was promised trades.

You new?

Maybe 1 decent named player will be traded this week. The Flanders deal getting done tomorrow looks likely.

The rest will all wait until the last 2 days to ensure there's plenty of talkback content and engagement over the next week or so.

 

[Mat Mann]

wtf!

fever pitch, hahaha Edumd suggested it this morning on SEN as a "who else could St Kilda get" and I thought is was nuffy 'no rigour' reporter stuff, why would we want a 29yo injury prone bloke we'd have to pay handsomly to get, doesn't make sense, esp when we have Wilson Hall Pou and Henry who can all play in that role

 

[Diehard Saint]

Haha no-one's getting Daicos, Twomey just raised it to sound important and drive clicks from Pies fans

Three years ago no one thought we would have got a pissed off SOS AND his son.

Wasn’t Daicos senior so pissed off at the Pies B&F over something he stormed out….

Just saying.

 

[Off Stump 89]

fever pitch, hahaha Edumd suggested it this morning on SEN as a "who else could St Kilda get" and I thought is was nuffy 'no rigour' reporter stuff, why would we want a 29yo injury prone bloke we'd have to pay handsomly to get, doesn't make sense, esp when we have Wilson Hall Pou and Henry who can all play in that role

This is it for mine. I'm all for bringing in players but as long as its filling gaps amd bolstering weaknesses. Not stifling development of our young guns

 

[sauce_head]

Three years ago no one thought we would have got a pissed off SOS AND his son.

Wasn’t Daicos senior so pissed off at the Pies B&F over something he stormed out….

Just saying.

Not the 17 possession call by McRae?!

 

[Saintos The ITK]

So the mystery is De Goey?????
Hahahahahahahhahhh

 

[Saints2001]

What Ralph says makes no sense. Rumours to St Kilda at fever pitch, but clubs haven't approached his camp? Does that mean he has approached us?

Haha I know right - I read that a few times to make sure I hadn't missed anything but that post made absolutely no sense.

 

[dudeintheswamp]

If they give us a draft pick I'm willing to give it a goey

 

[SainterinSydney]

You just know we were one of the clubs who reached out to Daicos' camp.

 

[Armoooo]

A lot of people acting like oppo supports are crazy or jealous for questioning our strategies, but come on guys, be serious for one minute. If the dogs or demons were making these moves, we would be saying the exact same things.

There are a few things to consider though. The first being that player salaries aren't straight forward. There is usually a base package, match fees and then bonuses for things like meeting certain thresholds for matches played, best and fairest performance results, All-Australian selections. So at the time a contract is signed there is actually no way to predict exactly what they will actually be paid. A multi-year deal is unlikely to be at a flat rate either, they are still likely to be front ended. What this all means is that a player like DeKoening could have an average base of $1.1m (starting at $1.5m in 2026 and working down $750k in the final year of his deal). He could also have $10k match fees, a $50k bonus for a top 5 B&F and a $50k bonus for an All Australian selection.

That would mean that if he plays every game next year, makes AA and wins the B&F, that he would be paid $1.8m next year. So the reports go out that DeKoening signs a 7 year deal at $1.8m per year and everyone runs with it uncritically. It might not technically be inaccurate next year, but it doesn't paint the whole picture. We simply can't expect opposition supporters to look at our finances with this level of nuance.

I think what we are doing is the smartest thing we can do in our position. I would have loved it if some of the players were a bit more exciting than Ryan and Silvagni, but that is not on the cards for us. The best way to get better players to want to join us is by moving up the ladder and these moves help us do that. Sure we may lose a couple of players we don't want to down the line when other clubs come chasing our players with blank cheques, but we can convert them into draft capital and the total value of our list should remain the same (assuming we trade and draft competently.).

Simply drafting and overpaying youngsters and being a perennial mid table team is not a better strategy.

Regardless of how this plays out, I will always defend this play. It is smart and most importantly, pragmatic. We are playing the cards we have been dealt in a way that gives us the most chance of success. Once you achieve success the rules of the game change. If we can snag a flag, we are no longer a small club and we don't have to overpay and we will start getting players wanting to play for us for unders.

We have some smart guys running the club, just remain quietly confident. We lose nothing by having oppo supporters laugh at us now, nor would we gain anything by them celebrating every move we make.

Just sit back and trust the process.

 

[hayes]

Slow news day? Asking if someone is available is news now? That’s a new low for journalism, surely there’s more to things than just asking.

 

[Moquo]

So the mystery is De Goey?????
Hahahahahahahhahhh

Old mystery guts De Gooey!

 

[Tommy Wigs]

fever pitch, hahaha Edumd suggested it this morning on SEN as a "who else could St Kilda get" and I thought is was nuffy 'no rigour' reporter stuff, why would we want a 29yo injury prone bloke we'd have to pay handsomly to get, doesn't make sense, esp when we have Wilson Hall Pou and Henry who can all play in that role

Yep, Ralph not getting any hits. So he writes that no one has approached anyone and he’s not going anywhere. What a nimrod

 

[Tommy Wigs]

You just know we were one of the clubs who reached out to Daicos' camp.

Good. Offer him up Zak Jones’ money

 

[StFly]

Someone the calibre of Ro can afford to hire a driver to get him back and forth. No need for him to feel stressed sitting in traffic.

Avalons close enough, private heli pad, no traffic to speak of.

 

[St Neil]

You just know we were one of the clubs who reached out to Daicos' camp.

Unquestionably. Saints are being a serial pest at the moment.

If you don’t ask you can’t get.

I’d love Daicos to nominate Saints just for the melts.

 

[MightySaintas]

Nobody would want Dogoey

 

[projectv]

wtf!

Has Jon Ralph just woken up from a 3 year coma?

 

[Armoooo]

Unquestionably. Saints are being a serial pest at the moment.

If you don’t ask you can’t get.

I’d love Daicos to nominate Saints just for the melts.

I suppose we need somebody to carry Nas' bags around, may as well be Nick.

 

[saintmike65]

Twomey really pushing that Essendon landing spot today.

As much as i like Cal Twomey's work, he is an Essendon fanboy..

 

[jumperfan]

Unquestionably. Saints are being a serial pest at the moment.

If you don’t ask you can’t get.

I’d love Daicos to nominate Saints just for the melts.

Imagine St Kilda winning a premiership with a Daicos and a Silvagni in the team...

 

[TheJackal]

Starcevich is a ticking time bomb with his concussion issues.

You'd have to see what else is happening with the trade but Brisbane getting pick 16 for their free agent whilst bringing in 2 free agents of their own is daylight robbery. Thats on top of getting Annable and Ashcrofts/Marshall for bugger all.

Worst club in the comp making the best club stronger when the PSD was sitting there free to be used.

Roma's price better go through the roof with ridiculous trades like this setting a precedent.

 

[bird_man]

My theory is that we are playing silly buggers and pretending we have a heap of cash to splash on DeGoey and the likes in the hope we bluff the cats

 

[Falchoon]

A lot of people acting like oppo supports are crazy or jealous for questioning our strategies, but come on guys, be serious for one minute. If the dogs or demons were making these moves, we would be saying the exact same things.

There are a few things to consider though. The first being that player salaries aren't straight forward. There is usually a base package, match fees and then bonuses for things like meeting certain thresholds for matches played, best and fairest performance results, All-Australian selections. So at the time a contract is signed there is actually no way to predict exactly what they will actually be paid. A multi-year deal is unlikely to be at a flat rate either, they are still likely to be front ended. What this all means is that a player like DeKoening could have an average base of $1.1m (starting at $1.5m in 2026 and working down $750k in the final year of his deal). He could also have $10k match fees, a $50k bonus for a top 5 B&F and a $50k bonus for an All Australian selection.

That would mean that if he plays every game next year, makes AA and wins the B&F, that he would be paid $1.8m next year. So the reports go out that DeKoening signs a 7 year deal at $1.8m per year and everyone runs with it uncritically. It might not technically be inaccurate next year, but it doesn't paint the whole picture. We simply can't expect opposition supporters to look at our finances with this level of nuance.

I think what we are doing is the smartest thing we can do in our position. I would have loved it if some of the players were a bit more exciting than Ryan and Silvagni, but that is not on the cards for us. The best way to get better players to want to join us is by moving up the ladder and these moves help us do that. Sure we may lose a couple of players we don't want to down the line when other clubs come chasing our players with blank cheques, but we can convert them into draft capital and the total value of our list should remain the same (assuming we trade and draft competently.).

Simply drafting and overpaying youngsters and being a perennial mid table team is not a better strategy.

Regardless of how this plays out, I will always defend this play. It is smart and most importantly, pragmatic. We are playing the cards we have been dealt in a way that gives us the most chance of success. Once you achieve success the rules of the game change. If we can snag a flag, we are no longer a small club and we don't have to overpay and we will start getting players wanting to play for us for unders.

We have some smart guys running the club, just remain quietly confident. We lose nothing by having oppo supporters laugh at us now, nor would we gain anything by them celebrating every move we make.

Just sit back and trust the process.

It's also been under the radar, this is at least 4 years in the planning (NWM may have brought it forward a year).

There's a shock factor to this in that it hasn't been done before and no "reporter" saw it coming.

The lack of financial acumen from the football media at this time of year is astounding, but they can get away with almost anything because of the hidden nature of football contracts. Most 'reporting' is parroting sources, no investigative journalism is occurring.

It may or may not turn out, but it's a bold strategy and needs to be admired (once understood).

 

[austinnn]

Can't really imagine Jack Steele with a glass of wine. Maybe he likes churches?

I can definitely imagine him as a international spy, sipping a glass of Pic St Loup in a hotel lounge with a young lady on the other side of the table who has another country's secrets somwhere on her person. That Mona Lisa smile of Jack's, he'll never give the game away.

Whoops, bit of a daft segue but Jack Steele has always looked to me more of a James Bond than a William Wallace