Test The Ashes First Test November 21-25 1300hrs @ Perth Stadium

[MarcMaverick]

Yeah, Ussie's last great moment was his double ton against Sri Lanka at Galle in Feb this year.

 

[Kappa]

What a pathetic display from England

No cummins, no hazlewood, Khawaja injured, and they put up an absolute dismal whimper in 2 batting performances and the 2nd innings bowling.

 

[revo333]

NFI…

Starc is the best fast bowler this generation has ever seen. Boland responded as a champion should and Doggett a worthy fill in.

Behind Pat Cummins

 

[revo333]

I reckon Carey is a better bat than Webster. Either or though.........

Then Webster doesn't get in the team then

 

[revo333]

Look what beat them though.

It was shot selection - driving on the up. It's a really bad shot in Australia, particularly as the errors go to where the field is set.

It cost them the series win in India.

 

[revo333]

Does Renshaw come into the picture if he makes runs against the Vic's?

I'd keep Head at the top of the order for Brisbane.

Maybe, word is the selectors do love him.

 

[revo333]

In First-Class cricket overall Wasim scored 7161 runs @ 22.73, including seven 100s and twenty four 50s. Of those seven First-Class 100s, three of them were in Test matches.

Like Warne he was probably more handy with the bat than his record suggested.

 

[revo333]

Ludicrous and comes across as very arrogant.

People are saying Heads innings was Baseball but he started his innings fairly cautious and only started playing aggressive shots with what the bowling was presenting to him.

 

[Juddy88]

NFI…

Starc is the best fast bowler this generation has ever seen.

Your cricket literacy is appalling.

That statement is not only objectively false, it's so far outside cricket mainstream analysis that you can't even possibly believe yourself?

He's competing with

Steyn, Anderson, Broad, Cummins, Rabada, Boult, Bumrah, Philander, Southee.

Now he might be better or equal to a couple of them but again, you're living in a dreamworld of you think he's the best of that lot.

Some FACTS - Mediocre Test average (27–28) vs elite peers, inconsistent, poor in England, not close to a metronome like Hazlewood or Cummins, lower control and higher bowling average than every other generational great. He's not even Australia's best of the generation.

Starc isn't in the same universe as Dale Steyn, cmon. He's been the third best quick of his own test nation for most of his career. Not anywhere near as consistent away from home as Bumrah who dominates everywhere. Not close to Rabada's consistency. Philander averaged 22 with the ball. Longevity =/= the best.

And he would agree. That's not taking anything away from him, and I love him; he's arguably the best world cup bowler of all time, and one of the best ever left arm quicks when the conditions favour him. But he's only pushing top 7of the generation, not top 1.

You've officially disqualified yourself from any serious cricket discussions. I wouldn't even call it an incorrect take (one of many); I would call it a non-serious take, to the extent no one here should be surprised if you are trolling.

Logic? Nah. Common sense? Nah. Evidence? Nah. History? Nah.

You're going off "the vibe". I'll give you a shovel so you can dig up out of the hole you're in, if you like?

 

[Juddy88]

People are saying Heads innings was Baseball but he started his innings fairly cautious and only started playing aggressive shots with what the bowling was presenting to him.

It's different chasing like that. You either go defensive and are 0/30 at stumps or 5/60, or you go all out and either win the game or are 2/20.

In terms of Travis, that's how he had always played. It's not forced on him by the coaching staff; it's his natural game. We've seen how he plays when he goes in to his shell, and it's ugly. He's not a technical player he's a genuine see-ball hit-ball player, and all his best knocks have been in that vein.

After his first innings I'm sure he thought, "**** it, I'm just going to play it how I see it" and that's worked for him his entire career. It also have Wetherald confidence to ease in to his innings and play his natural game, and you could see the confidence going from Head to Wetherald once he got going.

 

[to1994]

We should be using Usman's injury as a golden opportunity to move him on without admitting to making a mistake picking him this series.

No disrespect, he's had a fantastic career, especially as an opener but we shouldn't allow these farewell summers to be the new norm.

I'd be totally fine with either Renshaw getting a go or just leaving Head to open and bringing in Webster or really anyone into the middle order.

The interesting thing about Head's innings, is he played the dream knock that everyone wanted Sam Konstas to play, and he did it opening. I've always felt he's been a little bit too inconsistent at number 5 but if he performed his feast or famine role as an opener that would be gold and would also allow Green to move in to his old spot.

That said, there's also the risk it won't work out and it'll be a repeat of the Smith experiment so I'd be totally fine with them just replacing Khawaja with a specialist and not rocking the boat.

 

[JackOutback]

Renshaw can both open and bat middle order if they decide to continue with the Head experiment. Think it’s time to pull the trigger, given Khawaja isn’t going g to get any better against express pace.

 

[Juddy88]

We should be using Usman's injury as a golden opportunity to move him on without admitting to making a mistake picking him this series.

No disrespect, he's had a fantastic career, especially as an opener but we shouldn't allow these farewell summers to be the new norm.

I'd be totally fine with either of Renshaw getting a go or just leaving Head to open and bringing in Webster or really anyone into the middle order.

The interesting thing about Head's innings, is he played the dream knock that everyone wanted Sam Konstas to play, and he did it opening. I've always felt he's been a little bit too inconsistent at number 5 but if he performed his feast or famine role as an opener that would be gold and would also allow Green to move in to his old spot.

That said, there's also the risk it won't work out and it'll be a repeat of the Smith experiment so I'd be totally fine with them just replacing Khawaja with a specialist and not rocking the boat.

It's funny that in the post match when Isa asked Head how long he'd been wanting to open for her said "two years" then said "nah just kidding". He clearly likes the ball coming on, and has shown how good he can be inthat role now in test and white ball cricket. I think it would be unwise to move him back to 5 considering he's been barely able to hit the ball off the square for a while now. Then we have to blood a new opener for the pink ball test. It's highly likely a lose-lose scenario.

Although it could just be the knock he needs to go back to 5 and dominate again. Only time will tell.

 

[sr36]

Another historically false statement.

Bancroft wasn’t “burnt”; he’s had two extended runs—he simply didn’t do enough.

Renshaw had early success (184* in India as a 20-year-old), then poor form + COVID messed up his rhythm. He wasn’t “burnt”, he just hasn’t nailed it yet.

Neither were treated unusually harshly compared to other nations’ selection standards.

On what planet have we burnt Renshaw? He's dominating domestic cricket after struggling at international level, and then dealing with personal issues. If anything, he's the player he is now because he went back and worked on his game ala Damien Martyn (who was also arguably unfairly dropped). No reason not to go with a genuine bat who can open or bat 5.

Webster was solid, not spectacular, and his ceiling as a Test batter is still unknown.

Webster has - one good Test innings vs India. A good Shield record recently. But bats 6/7 for Tasmania, not 5. He is only in the discussion because he bowls useful overs. He's never been selected as a specialist bat.

There certainly is a reason not to select Webster - selecting a No.7 bowling all-rounder to bat No.5 makes zero structural sense. No top Test side does that. Test sides pick a genuine specialist bat at 5 (Renshaw / Inglis / Patterson / Ward). If Khawaja retires, you don’t replace him with a 6/7 all-rounder unless your goal is to unbalance the side.

Webster should absolutely be in the Test mix — just not as the replacement for an opener or number 5. Just because we are struggling to replace Khawaja doesn’t mean we force a bowling all-rounder into a top-five role.
Pick players in their actual positions, not out of convenience. And we saw what shuffling the order out of (forced) convenience does in the first innings.

I'd like Renshaw to get another chance soon. He's had type of apprenticeship that guys like Langer, Martin and Hayden had. Early games - didn't do enough. Went back and developed their game. I think it's time.

 

[sr36]

Like Warne he was probably more handy with the bat than his record suggested.

He was an awesome ball striker. He smashed the ball.

 

[sr36]

Agreed.

Starc has never really had Wasim's consistency, even though he's definitely faster than Wasim was at the same age.

Wasi was the Bumrah of his era. He could bowl everything.

 

[reggie]

Another historically false statement.

Bancroft wasn’t “burnt”; he’s had two extended runs—he simply didn’t do enough.

Wasn't burnt but only had one extended run of 8 Tests - 5 Ashes Tests followed by 3 v SA - then the ban and returned for the first two Tests of the next Ashes before being dropped

 

[Juddy88]

Wasn't burnt but only had one extended run of 8 Tests - 5 Ashes Tests followed by 3 v SA - then the ban and returned for the first two Tests of the next Ashes before being dropped

Ah, that's right. Thought he played a couple more than two on return. Averaged mid 20s from 18 innings. Far from burnt.

 

[010203]

Haven't read anything on here so this may have been covered.
1. Head and Marnus was a carbon copy of the partnership in the WC 2 years back. Trav blasting the opposition and Trav playing the anchor but rotating the strike and notching a well deserved half century.
2. Head did not play one drive on the up. He drove when the ball was full ans cut and pulled short or short of a length. Was insane but also measured.
3. The sheer arrogance of Stokes to dismiss questions of preparation and shot selection just saying, our preparation is right. The absolute blind ego is breathtaking
To compound it, he refuses to play under lights in Canberra going into a pink ball match.
The disrespect he and McCullum shows to Test cricket, like results are like ODI's or T20 is disgusting and history wont be kind to their cultish kool aide drinking.

Ahead of the 2010-11 series, England came here a month early, played 2 state games (albeit 3 days long but that's still something) and a 4 day match against Australia A in Hobart. Even if they didn't win that series, they could at least look themselves in the mirror and say that preparation wasn't the issue. They also played a tour match against Victoria in between the Perth and Melbourne Tests.

What do this lot do in comparison? Play some hit and giggle games in New Zealand, 3 ODI matches in Kiwiland and a scratch match against the England Lions in Lilac Hill. Not the preparation for an away Ashes series. As the saying goes, 'fail to prepare, prepare to fail'.

Admittedly, their preparation for the 2013-14 series was pretty good in terms of the volume of cricket they played leading up to the 1st Test. They were just on the receiving end of Mitch Johnson being basically unplayable, which can happen.

It's not the first time he's been dismissive during a post match interview - did the same thing Mike Atherton when questioned him on whether England could have done things differently during the Old Trafford Test and the 2023 series on the whole. He's been an absolute tosser from the 2023 Lord's Test onwards.

 

[reggie]

Ah, that's right. Thought he played a couple more than two on return. Averaged mid 20s from 18 innings. Far from burnt.

Was actually our top run scorer in the SA series despite being banned for the last Test. Had started to find his feet at the level and then...

 

[010203]

Senuran Muthusamy scored 109 runs for South Africa against India off 206 balls, meaning he faced more deliveries himself than England did in their entire 1st innings of the Perth Test.

 

[010203]

Not sure if this has been posted, but this comment from Head comes across as such a mature mindset and regardless of where the opening partnership goes from here, this feels like what we'd want to see from the senior player in our opening partnership while we try to get this settled at the top of the order

That's leadership and taking responsibility.

 

[revo333]

No disrespect, he's had a fantastic career, especially as an opener but we shouldn't allow these farewell summers to be the new norm.

Understandable the normal fan on social media being very critical of him but I didn't expect so many in the media to be as well considering how likeable he is.

 

[Lunchtime]

Like Warne he was probably more handy with the bat than his record suggested.

Warne scored 6,919 runs in First-Class cricket at an average of 19.43. He scored two 100s and twenty six 50s.

 

[sabso]

lolzak

"We believe he is a quality player," McCullum said, when asked if Crawley was undroppable. "Particularly in these conditions against this sort of opposition. How many balls did he face? 10 or 11? He got out cheaply, but we believe in Zak.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/ashes-1st-test-mccullum-backs-crawley-amid-calls-for-greater-conviction-1512469