Test The Ashes First Test November 21-25 1300hrs @ Perth Stadium

[western royboy]

A lot of batsman said they found Garner the hardest to face.
Biggest problem with him was being so tall it was very difficult to actually pick up the length when he bowled.

Rarely bowled anything to hit and when it was it took out your toes

 

[swingdog]

“They tell me it’s a ‘moral pitch’, India says that, smart guys. I heard they had a bad pitch in Perth, terrible pitch - you know I’ve seen some bad pitches like in … and they were bad, but this is a bad pitch, maybe the worst. But the pitch in India is great, I know the guys, great guys

India's got enough problems with their own test team to worry about the Perth pitch.

That's five games in a row they've lost at home. In the old days crowds would have been burning effigies. Now, it seems more of a collective shrug and "well, at least the IPL starts soon" (can't lose an all Indian competition!).

 

[Westend]

Need a 2nd test thread

 

[Borisdog]

Yep, Big Bird and Marshall with Walsh and Ambrose. Bruises aplenty.

Garner and Ambrose never played a test together ( Fortunately for any opposition )

The series where Greig made those comments was the England home summer series of 1976, Joel hadn't played a Test at that point and Marshall was a long way away.

Didn't matter. Holding and Roberts were plenty.

 

[Borisdog]

Rarely bowled anything to hit and when it was it took out your toes

He just looked like he was in slow motion. It was pretty to watch. Wouldn't have been from 20 yards.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Wicket every 30.9 balls.
Perth was one every 26.4 balls.

But batsmen were trying to survive in Kolkata. They were trying to get out in Perth.

I agree there’s been worse pitches in India and the fact is that across the two sides there isn’t a single ‘notable’ player of spin bowling left anymore which doesn’t help. But they need to be conscious that a poor ‘low and spinning’ track, while some purists might actually enjoy watching it (I do) most people won’t. For starters it’s hard to score runs; Perth at least offset the apparent difficulty of staying at the crease by also making it easy to score if you were willing to attack. Unfortunately when it’s hard to survive on a spinning pitch it’s also very hard to score: the ball doesn’t fly around and give you pace or bounce to work with and give you SOMETHING back like some helpful fast bowling pitches might.

Worth noting that the fastest, and equal sixth fastest test centuries in history have come when a side was in all sorts of trouble at 4-nothing (McCullum’s) and in a game where 3 innings had been completed for 172 or less (Head’s) on pitches that were seemingly helping out anyone who was bowling at any sort of velocity

Listen, as much as I thought at the time I was genuine top end batsman, I wasn’t. But on seaming pitches, throwing caution to the wind served me fairly well. There is a method to being attacking on fast bowling friendly pitches - you just have to pick the shots you play.

 

[PhatBoy]

Listen, as much as I thought at the time I was genuine top end batsman, I wasn’t. But on seaming pitches, throwing caution to the wind served me fairly well. There is a method to being attacking on fast bowling friendly pitches - you just have to pick the shots you play.

I agree, I think you need to weigh up your relative strengths and weaknesses against what you’re up against.

I wasn’t technically sound outside of my back foot defence, especially if the ball was coming into me. I was far better off taking a few steps down the pitch and trying to whack the thing than trying to bunker down

 

[western royboy]

Yeah not to make this about my boy C Green again but he's similar, not as quick as Garner though. Morkel too would have been an absolute prick to face, even McGrath at his pace had an unconfortable short ball. Height definitely does help.

I had the honour of facing Marshall in a competitive match..even at half rat power it was still intimidating, he had all the tricks and fortunately was happy to show them off

 

[MarcMaverick]

Yeah not to make this about my boy C Green again but he's similar, not as quick as Garner though. Morkel too would have been an absolute prick to face, even McGrath at his pace had an unconfortable short ball. Height definitely does help.

Marco Jansen from South Africa too. Ruckman heights.

 

[010203]

Anyone actually surprised by this ranking - surely this was common sense

ICC hands down verdict on Perth pitch after rapid Ashes Test | cricket.com.au

The quickest Ashes Test in 137 years saw Australia take a 1-0 series lead inside two days, with 19...

www.cricket.com.au

Khawaja meanwhile described the Perth pitch as 'a piece of shit'.

 

[the_interloper]

Khawaja meanwhile described the Perth pitch as 'a piece of shit'.

Is that why he seemingly didn’t want to bat on it?

 

[MarcMaverick]

Khawaja meanwhile described the Perth pitch as 'a piece of shit'.

"Anybodys fault but mine"

 

[Westend]

Khawaja meanwhile described the Perth pitch as 'a piece of shit'.

??? what really

 

[Westend]

‘I can’t stand up’: Khawaja breaks silence over Ashes drama with stunning details revealed

‘I can’t stand up’: Uzzie breaks silence over Ashes drama with stunning details revealed

www.foxsports.com.au

Honestly wtf ....

I’m really glad that we got (the match) done that night, because the next day, I already had the radiology booked … I was going to get an epidural in my back, so I can actually move somewhat,” Khawaja said.

“I had it booked in, ready to go, so if the team needed me, I was there again.”

Seriously you can't make this shit up...just F**ken retire

why the F**k are we even considering him in the squad its just makes no bloody sense

 

[MarcMaverick]

‘I can’t stand up’: Khawaja breaks silence over Ashes drama with stunning details revealed

‘I can’t stand up’: Uzzie breaks silence over Ashes drama with stunning details revealed

www.foxsports.com.au

Honestly wtf ....

I’m really glad that we got (the match) done that night, because the next day, I already had the radiology booked … I was going to get an epidural in my back, so I can actually move somewhat,” Khawaja said.

“I had it booked in, ready to go, so if the team needed me, I was there again.”

Seriously you can't make this shit up...just F**ken retire

why the F**k are we even considering him in the squad its just makes no bloody sense

"No! I was promised a send off at the SCG!"

 

[MarcMaverick]

Watching Wood and Archer bowl made me more appreciative of how fit Binga and Mitch Johnson were.

 

[010203]

"Anybodys fault but mine"

Is that why he seemingly didn’t want to bat on it?

??? what really

I was guilty of just looking at the headline - "day one wicket at (Perth) is a piece of s***, I’m happy to say that. It has been last year, it was this year", is a better representation of what he said.

 

[mumblingpie]

I’m assuming Cummins being left out is injury related?

 

[PhatBoy]

Marco Jansen from South Africa too. Ruckman heights.

Not saying he will because he’s already having some injury issues, but he has the potential to be better than just about all of them and many many other great fast bowlers. I saw a graphic after the test series against India comparing him to Bumrah at the same stage and he’s basically got him covered in every aspect except 5 wicket hauls (he’s one behind).
Hes 25 so he’s about to enter his prime by the time Australia and England tour there next year. Hes already shown he can run through a side in Asia (on a pitch where his own team made 500 and he himself made 93 mind you). Plus you’d have to assume he will probably make one or more test hundreds at some point.

Green will finish his career as a good batsman I don’t doubt that for a second. And he will have his moments along the way as a bowler if he ever gets fit though the likelihood of it ever being more than cameo level I think are dwindling.

But boy Jansen is going to, health and SA playing enough cricket permitting, have a bloody good career.

 

[Borisdog]

Not saying he will because he’s already having some injury issues, but he has the potential to be better than just about all of them and many many other great fast bowlers. I saw a graphic after the test series against India comparing him to Bumrah at the same stage and he’s basically got him covered in every aspect except 5 wicket hauls (he’s one behind).
Hes 25 so he’s about to enter his prime by the time Australia and England tour there next year. Hes already shown he can run through a side in Asia (on a pitch where his own team made 500 and he himself made 93 mind you). Plus you’d have to assume he will probably make one or more test hundreds at some point.

Green will finish his career as a good batsman I don’t doubt that for a second. And he will have his moments along the way as a bowler if he ever gets fit though the likelihood of it ever being more than cameo level I think are dwindling.

But boy Jansen is going to, health and SA playing enough cricket permitting, have a bloody good career.

He’s looked a really good bowler every time I’ve seen him play. He’s looked a struggled with the Yorker in the Indian second innings, he just couldn’t get it away from the legs of the lefties.

He does look a natural in swing bowler which makes it even more strange that he goes too far down leg to the lefties.

He’s got plenty of talent with the bat, and is clearly a decent ground fieldsman. The catch he took to end the second Test was as good an outfield catch as I’ve seen for a long while.

Against him is he’s a stick insect. We’ll see how the wear and tear goes.

All things going for him, he should be some sorta player. Hopefully SAF get a good exposure to the top tier sides. They’re a great side at the minute, and really can’t see anyone beating them at home for a bit given the pace battery they have at their disposal at home. Probably half the side that touched up the Indians wouldn’t get a gig at home.

 

[Around the Wicket]

I don’t reckon the change to the cricket ball few years ago gets enough attention, main contributor why batsmen are struggling so much imo

 

[PhatBoy]

He’s looked a really good bowler every time I’ve seen him play. He’s looked a struggled with the Yorker in the Indian second innings, he just couldn’t get it away from the legs of the lefties.

He does look a natural in swing bowler which makes it even more strange that he goes too far down leg to the lefties.

He’s got plenty of talent with the bat, and is clearly a decent ground fieldsman. The catch he took to end the second Test was as good an outfield catch as I’ve seen for a long while.

Against him is he’s a stick insect. We’ll see how the wear and tear goes.

All things going for him, he should be some sorta player. Hopefully SAF get a good exposure to the top tier sides. They’re a great side at the minute, and really can’t see anyone beating them at home for a bit given the pace battery they have at their disposal at home. Probably half the side that touched up the Indians wouldn’t get a gig at home.

Jansen has an identical twin brother who plays exactly the same role as him as well. Not with the same proficiency but his record is not the worst.

Imagine that from both ends.
He could do with 10kg though.

I would guess that De Zorzi is a potential out for the home games - they’ve already spoken about him being a horses for courses selection. Muthusamy might hold his spot as a batsman. Rabada would be a straight swap for one of the two spinners in Harmer/Maharaj, and probably Ngidi or one of the real quicks like Burger or Coetzee would be vying with Mulder and Bosch or Muthusamy for a spot. I’d like to see them give Brevis or Pretorius a few more looks

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I don’t reckon the change to the cricket ball few years ago gets enough attention, main contributor why batsmen are struggling so much imo

Poor technique is more important than a ball. Too often players these days struggle leaving 3-4 balls and wonder why they nick off

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Poor technique is more important than a ball. Too often players these days struggle leaving 3-4 balls and wonder why they nick off

I think that's an inevitability given T20 cricket exists. Even primary Test players who train a lot with the bat with a Test mindset can never fully remove even one net session with a T20 mindset that they've developed. Old Test batters who had better techniques probably couldn't hit it off the square if you forced them to come up with solutions to modern T20 bowling, wide yorkers and such.

In some respects I find it quite incredible that e.g the same Pat Cummins with the bat won an IPL game for his team in 2022 scoring 56 off 15 balls, but played an incredibly controlled (if not slow, still controlled) innings to win Australia the 1st test in the 2023 Ashes, batting for over an hour and a half. They're two completely different skillsets.

 

[Borisdog]

Jansen has an identical twin brother who plays exactly the same role as him as well. Not with the same proficiency but his record is not the worst.

Imagine that from both ends.
He could do with 10kg though.

I would guess that De Zorzi is a potential out for the home games - they’ve already spoken about him being a horses for courses selection. Muthusamy might hold his spot as a batsman. Rabada would be a straight swap for one of the two spinners in Harmer/Maharaj, and probably Ngidi or one of the real quicks like Burger or Coetzee would be vying with Mulder and Bosch or Muthusamy for a spot. I’d like to see them give Brevis or Pretorius a few more looks

De Zorzi for any of the good upper order players they have. There’s plenty.

Muthusamy won’t keep his place at home in the face of 4 quicks. He competes with Maharaj, and if I was a selector Maharaj wouldn’t get a game at home given what the Saffers turn out as home decks.

That leaves Harmer out, stiff - but that’s the way it rolls.

Moulder, meh, one knock. Maybe he stays.

So that’s 4, maybe 5, I’ve jettisoned.

The difference between me and the average BF selector is that the Saffers actually have options, genuinely viable options.

I’ve said upthread somewhere that they selected really well for this Indian tour. Full credit to both the selectors and the side. Really fantastic result for them.