Hawthorn’s 2019 Trade/FA - Targets/Incoming players discussion only

[Hawk Dork]

Would 100% trade our first round pick for Patton if it involved Coniglio offer not being matched

Doubt it would take that they will need salary cap relief

 

[COKEandCOLA]

I'm not against picking up Patten especially given his age. I'm not sure a 1st round pick would have to be the sweetener to get the deal over the line. And after today, the Giants showed they have a few young options to go forward.

Obviously given the concerns surrounding his injury history and his salary, the only way I'd be alright with it happening would be if GWS were to do the unthinkable and match.

Otherwise as I've posted previously, that 1st Round Selection COULD and SHOULD be used elsewhere.

In an ideal trade scenario he's worth no more than Tom Scully was.

I guess that only time will tell.

 

[COKEandCOLA]

Doubt it would take that they will need salary cap relief

But if they were in fact to let Coniglio leave why would they need salary cap relief?

With his wage off their books they'd have more than enough to pay Kelly what he'll no doubt be commanding.

Yes their younger players will soon be coming OOC soon enough and will also demand an increase in salary, but surely there's other players that GWS would let go first.

 

[TylerDurden]

Would 100% trade our first round pick for Patton if it involved Coniglio offer not being matched

Yep. I’m doing this too.

 

[mustang]

I wouldn’t be giving up our first round pick this year if we finish low on the ladder if we have a chance of getting Noah Anderson of course it depends where we finish.

 

[TylerDurden]

I wouldn’t be giving up our first round pick this year if we finish low on the ladder if we have a chance of getting Noah Anderson of course it depends where we finish.

We’d have to finish last mate.

 

[COKEandCOLA]

We’d have to finish last mate.

Either that or Anderson would have to have a VERY bad year.

Perhaps we could instruct him to pull a Wingard and advise the recruiters of the 17 other teams that if he's drafted by anyone other than HFC he'll seek a trade after 2 years.

 

[Jason Dunstall]

I would imagine it's because there's no guarantee he'll get back to his pre knee injury form.

He doesn't have to be a super star, just play a role. Clunk a few, bring the ball to ground etc etc.

Lewis may get there, he may not either, one of them has knee issues & is probably too heavy, but was a top draft pick, the other was a spec pick down the order who has been pretty injury free.

 

[Brishawk]

He doesn't have to be a super star, just play a role. Clunk a few, bring the ball to ground etc etc.

Lewis may get there, he may not either, one of them has knee issues & is probably too heavy, but was a top draft pick, the other was a spec pick down the order who has been pretty injury free.

I don’t know if you watched him but he struggled to get near it in the forward line last year before his knee injury. Based on last years form he would be a slight upgrade on Ceglar as a forward. My suspicion is his body isn’t up to afl and that it was already causing him to have limited impact before is third acl. Huge risk and I don’t think he has much upside left in him.

 

[4THAWN]

This talk of jon patton means nothing right now, we don't know what he'll be like when he returns. Reports say the Giants think he will play this year so we just need to see. Also on the cogs matter, in the days of free agency surely we'd much rather land our superstar through free agency and retain our ever limited draft picks to upgrade elsewhere.

 

[Spursfan]

I'm happy to look at Patton. My understanding is he has 1 year left on his contract at GWS (after this season) ? So we could negotiate a multi year deal at a lower rate - he can't possibly command 800k+.

 

[Topiary]

Plenty of players get dropped, it doesn't mean they are done as players. He has kicked 38 and 45 goals the 2 previous seasons whilst also being a decent 2nd option ruck. He wouldn't be coming in to be a superstar but he could absolutely be a role player type that absolutely makes us a better team.

The word is STRUCTURE.

 

[Brishawk]

The word is STRUCTURE.

The other word is treacle. And another word is managed loads for rest of career. Max bailey managed to get one full season out of his legs after 3 acls. And that was when we had Andrew Russell. I don’t doubt his talent just his body.

 

[tommyk72]

I don’t see AC going for a big marking forward. He clearly believes the % is in getting the ball in and keeping it in. Unless the tall marking forward wins x% of their ‘go to’ entries into the F50 (maybe 40%+) clarko isn’t interested. Purely because he feels he’s done the numbers and gets more returns from keeping the ball in.

Don’t reckon we’ll go anywhere near Patton. Not enough upside to negate his downside.

 

[burner1]

Start of next season our kpfs will likely be Nash, Lewis, Tob and shoey (and the last two might not be on list). That’s probably the worst in the league.

If we think we can fix Patton and he comes cheap we’d have to take a look. A fit Patton would likely get a game next year. Yes he’s slow but if he can take marks or bring ball to ground he’ll be useful.

 

[Alite]

Cool so are you gonna play full forward for us when Roughie retires?

Cool, Walker plays full forward. The guys hands are solid. Height be damned. Speed, smarts and strong hands will win the day from full forward.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

I don’t see AC going for a big marking forward. He clearly believes the % is in getting the ball in and keeping it in. Unless the tall marking forward wins x% of their ‘go to’ entries into the F50 (maybe 40%+) clarko isn’t interested. Purely because he feels he’s done the numbers and gets more returns from keeping the ball in.

Don’t reckon we’ll go anywhere near Patton. Not enough upside to negate his downside.

You don't need to lock it in if your forward marks it. We've got no one bar McEvoy that can do that in a contested situation. Big key forwards that can take marks can also bring the ball to ground for others to lock it in.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Start of next season our kpfs will likely be Nash, Lewis, Tob and shoey (and the last two might not be on list). That’s probably the worst in the league.

If we think we can fix Patton and he comes cheap we’d have to take a look. A fit Patton would likely get a game next year. Yes he’s slow but if he can take marks or bring ball to ground he’ll be useful.

That would most certainly be the worst, no arguments.

 

[tommyk72]

Start of next season our kpfs will likely be Nash, Lewis, Tob and shoey (and the last two might not be on list). That’s probably the worst in the league.

If we think we can fix Patton and he comes cheap we’d have to take a look. A fit Patton would likely get a game next year. Yes he’s slow but if he can take marks or bring ball to ground he’ll be useful.

I guess time will tell. Personally, I don't think even a fit Patton would get a gig - particularly post 3 knee recos.

That being said - your point is valid. Nash is not a KPF either. Big boy? Ceglar? Sicily? Gunston? Reeves!?!? All options, but nothing really tailor made. Will be interesting to watch this space.

 

[tommyk72]

You don't need to lock it in if your forward marks it. We've got no one bar McEvoy that can do that in a contested situation. Big key forwards that can take marks can also bring the ball to ground for others to lock it in.

Yeah, I get that. That being said, I reckon clarko will have looked very hard at the %'s re: marking vs goals from locking in vs lack of opportunity for the other team when it's down our forward 50. Like I said in a subsequent post, our backs are against the wall with KPFs. Will be super interesting to see what AC does.

 

[Hawk_francais]

It's hard to see Clarko going for a player like Patton - who is a good mark but that's about it. Doesn't kick a lot of goals, moves like a glacier and he has some serious set-shot difficulties. May as well recruit Levi Casboult (not meant to be disparaging, their careers are statistically similar). We would only recruit Patton if we thought that he could stay on the park AND improve his game.

Start of next season our kpfs will likely be Nash, Lewis, Tob and shoey (and the last two might not be on list). That’s probably the worst in the league.

Beginning of last season we would've said that a forward-line of Cox, De Goey, Mihocek, Thomas, Elliot and Stephenson was probably the worst in the league.

We've got a whole season to see how Nash, Lewis, and TO'B develop. They are all young, therefore there will be surprises good and bad. Even Schoey is still only around 28 and has been dealt more injuries than slack. Look at Chris Mayne, then tell me it's not possible.

As for recruiting new forwards, we only need to look at the forward lines of the last three premiers to see that there are no rules about which type of forwards are needed to win, and how many of each kind. What is important is depth across every line. The on-ball department is where we are seriously lacking both those things, I think it will be one (or two) midfielders who we target. Another one or two young project forwards wouldn't go amiss.

 

[TylerDurden]

Start of next season our kpfs will likely be Nash, Lewis, Tob and shoey (and the last two might not be on list). That’s probably the worst in the league.

If we think we can fix Patton and he comes cheap we’d have to take a look. A fit Patton would likely get a game next year. Yes he’s slow but if he can take marks or bring ball to ground he’ll be useful.

Take Nash out, as he’s plays small.

TOB and Schoe will most likely be delisted.

Rough retires.

That leaves you with Lewis. Who is untried.

Just wow.

 

[Brishawk]

Take Nash out, as he’s plays small.

TOB and Schoe will most likely be delisted.

Rough retires.

That leaves you with Lewis. Who is untried.

Just wow.

And kosi

 

[Leather Poisoning]

It's hard to see Clarko going for a player like Patton - who is a good mark but that's about it. Doesn't kick a lot of goals, moves like a glacier and he has some serious set-shot difficulties. May as well recruit Levi Casboult (not meant to be disparaging, their careers are statistically similar). We would only recruit Patton if we thought that he could stay on the park AND improve his game.



Beginning of last season we would've said that a forward-line of Cox, De Goey, Mihocek, Thomas, Elliot and Stephenson was probably the worst in the league.

We've got a whole season to see how Nash, Lewis, and TO'B develop. They are all young, therefore there will be surprises good and bad. Even Schoey is still only around 28 and has been dealt more injuries than slack. Look at Chris Mayne, then tell me it's not possible.

As for recruiting new forwards, we only need to look at the forward lines of the last three premiers to see that there are no rules about which type of forwards are needed to win, and how many of each kind. What is important is depth across every line. The on-ball department is where we are seriously lacking both those things, I think it will be one (or two) midfielders who we target. Another one or two young project forwards wouldn't go amiss.

And you're talking about a coach that turned Mark Williams into a Coleman medallist.

But I think whatever Clarko can do with an understocked cabinet is very different to making sure the cabinet is well stocked.

 

[HODGEYROAD]

It's hard to see Clarko going for a player like Patton - who is a good mark but that's about it. Doesn't kick a lot of goals, moves like a glacier and he has some serious set-shot difficulties. May as well recruit Levi Casboult (not meant to be disparaging, their careers are statistically similar). We would only recruit Patton if we thought that he could stay on the park AND improve his game.



Beginning of last season we would've said that a forward-line of Cox, De Goey, Mihocek, Thomas, Elliot and Stephenson was probably the worst in the league.

We've got a whole season to see how Nash, Lewis, and TO'B develop. They are all young, therefore there will be surprises good and bad. Even Schoey is still only around 28 and has been dealt more injuries than slack. Look at Chris Mayne, then tell me it's not possible.

As for recruiting new forwards, we only need to look at the forward lines of the last three premiers to see that there are no rules about which type of forwards are needed to win, and how many of each kind. What is important is depth across every line. The on-ball department is where we are seriously lacking both those things, I think it will be one (or two) midfielders who we target. Another one or two young project forwards wouldn't go amiss.

LOL