List Mgmt. 2024 List Management thread - Trade Targets

[Dayts]

If Tabs strings a few good games together and Darcy comes back do with we shift JT back or push Tabs out?

Be good to see what he could do back there.

And Adelaide desperately need a player like cox. Just sayin

 

[King Huskii]

Please quote me where i posted how good he is ?
I only ever posted his qualities and what he brings to the team

But he is certainly better than the bloke you guys gave the Pies and would be easily best 18 at freo
but thats for your list management to decide and we are just punters here

Is he worth our three first rounders and Jye Amiss? Would that be enough for him?

 

[King Huskii]

If Tabs strings a few good games together and Darcy comes back do with we shift JT back or push Tabs out?

Be good to see what he could do back there.

And Adelaide desperately need a player like cox. Just sayin

No, Cox is elite and Tabs is old and injury prone

 

[FreoGirl]

If Tabs strings a few good games together and Darcy comes back do with we shift JT back or push Tabs out?

Be good to see what he could do back there.

And Adelaide desperately need a player like cox. Just sayin

You will never split Ryan and Cox

 

[FreoGirl]

I think the mood on this thread week to week depends on whether we won or list the previous weekend.
Reading stuff like “Warner wouldn’t add much to us” makes me laugh. If we’d lost at the weekend it would be a very different attitude.

The truth? Chad Warner is an an elite gun that walks into our midfield. Don’t kid yourselves. We have some great young players but he adds something… different. Explosive and powerful. Burst midfielder from stoppage. Yeah he’s a bit iffy at times with ball use but still a class act.
If it’s a possibility, given his age, you do the deal without thinking.
that applies whether we win or lose this weekend!

we have to make the most of these rare moments

 

[Kapow!!!]

Please quote me where i posted how good he is ?
I only ever posted his qualities and what he brings to the team

But he is certainly better than the bloke you guys gave the Pies and would be easily best 18 at freo
but thats for your list management to decide and we are just punters here

I appreciate the level of good faith shown by you here despite facing some antagonising. It's always difficult discussing with fans about list management decisions. People tend to overrate their own, underrate opposing players and kick up a stink when talk of paying for good, honest role players when there's a shiny young star available elsewhere. The other problem is that when you have a war chest of first rounders to use: Everyone comes on trying to sell you magic beans for them.

I tend to think the biggest difficulty in assessing Baker between the 2 sides is that he's magnitudes more valuable at one club than the other at their current points in their list. A good leader who does his job well every week with a strong body is something that Richmond desperately need through the next few years with young talent needing to be nutured. To Richmond he is legitimately worth first rounders because in rebuild those players are priceless.

Freo on the other hand have spent the last 5 or so years developing them and are in the spot where they're ready to take the next step. Whilst a player with his character and ability would be quite handy to keep the culture, create consistency and increase pressure for positions, his value is definitely lower in terms of what you'd be willing to give up when there are other more important deficiencies/opportunities to bring in higher end talent. West Coast on the other hand would be far more in need of a Baker but would also be far more likely to put future list needs first and continue to value drafting the core of their next premiership tilt.

Freo also have the small interstate club tax: Not many players willingly come out this way so when one does they usually end up having to pay overs (usually this takes the form of heavily unbalanced media speculation over a trade situation putting pressure on list managers, increased cap spending to lure etc.). This isn't exactly fair, causes fan angst but it is the known situation. They have to balance what's best for the club with what is accessible sometimes.

For mine, where Freo's list is at I can definitely see the use of Baker in the same way I saw the use in Conca. At this point I really do think he'd be quite valuable in an understated kind of way (understated being a very Freo way as well). But sadly, I also agree that you don't spend first round picks on understated gems. I'm curious to see where this goes and am interested to see how he goes this season and will happily revisit my position later on down the line when more is known in regards to intentions

 

[pK75]

I appreciate the level of good faith shown by you here despite facing some antagonising. It's always difficult discussing with fans about list management decisions. People tend to overrate their own, underrate opposing players and kick up a stink when talk of paying for good, honest role players when there's a shiny young star available elsewhere. The other problem is that when you have a war chest of first rounders to use: Everyone comes on trying to sell you magic beans for them.

I tend to think the biggest difficulty in assessing Baker between the 2 sides is that he's magnitudes more valuable at one club than the other at their current points in their list. A good leader who does his job well every week with a strong body is something that Richmond desperately need through the next few years with young talent needing to be nutured. To Richmond he is legitimately worth first rounders because in rebuild those players are priceless.

Freo on the other hand have spent the last 5 or so years developing them and are in the spot where they're ready to take the next step. Whilst a player with his character and ability would be quite handy to keep the culture, create consistency and increase pressure for positions, his value is definitely lower in terms of what you'd be willing to give up when there are other more important deficiencies/opportunities to bring in higher end talent. West Coast on the other hand would be far more in need of a Baker but would also be far more likely to put future list needs first and continue to value drafting the core of their next premiership tilt.

Freo also have the small interstate club tax: Not many players willingly come out this way so when one does they usually end up having to pay overs (usually this takes the form of heavily unbalanced media speculation over a trade situation putting pressure on list managers, increased cap spending to lure etc.). This isn't exactly fair, causes fan angst but it is the known situation. They have to balance what's best for the club with what is accessible sometimes.

For mine, where Freo's list is at I can definitely see the use of Baker in the same way I saw the use in Conca. At this point I really do think he'd be quite valuable in an understated kind of way (understated being a very Freo way as well). But sadly, I also agree that you don't spend first round picks on understated gems. I'm curious to see where this goes and am interested to see how he goes this season and will happily revisit my position later on down the line when more is known in regards to intentions

WC have just appointed new list manager and it really hinges on where some fresh eyes see their list at, if they genuinely believe they can climb back up in the next 3-4 years, trading for baker makes some sense, however if they think it’s more like 5-7 years it’s better to keep going to the draft hard before Tassie team compromises it. Either way Richmond should be ready for a second round pick at best if Baker does declare he wants to move home for “family” reasons at the end of the year.

 

[THE_GUN]

I appreciate the level of good faith shown by you here despite facing some antagonising. It's always difficult discussing with fans about list management decisions. People tend to overrate their own, underrate opposing players and kick up a stink when talk of paying for good, honest role players when there's a shiny young star available elsewhere. The other problem is that when you have a war chest of first rounders to use: Everyone comes on trying to sell you magic beans for them.

I tend to think the biggest difficulty in assessing Baker between the 2 sides is that he's magnitudes more valuable at one club than the other at their current points in their list. A good leader who does his job well every week with a strong body is something that Richmond desperately need through the next few years with young talent needing to be nutured. To Richmond he is legitimately worth first rounders because in rebuild those players are priceless.

Freo on the other hand have spent the last 5 or so years developing them and are in the spot where they're ready to take the next step. Whilst a player with his character and ability would be quite handy to keep the culture, create consistency and increase pressure for positions, his value is definitely lower in terms of what you'd be willing to give up when there are other more important deficiencies/opportunities to bring in higher end talent. West Coast on the other hand would be far more in need of a Baker but would also be far more likely to put future list needs first and continue to value drafting the core of their next premiership tilt.

Freo also have the small interstate club tax: Not many players willingly come out this way so when one does they usually end up having to pay overs (usually this takes the form of heavily unbalanced media speculation over a trade situation putting pressure on list managers, increased cap spending to lure etc.). This isn't exactly fair, causes fan angst but it is the known situation. They have to balance what's best for the club with what is accessible sometimes.

For mine, where Freo's list is at I can definitely see the use of Baker in the same way I saw the use in Conca. At this point I really do think he'd be quite valuable in an understated kind of way (understated being a very Freo way as well). But sadly, I also agree that you don't spend first round picks on understated gems. I'm curious to see where this goes and am interested to see how he goes this season and will happily revisit my position later on down the line when more is known in regards to intentions

Very good post and extremely well written and totally agree with most of what you have said
Fremantle have the beginnings of a very good side and list and you guys would know alot better than me or any other supporter what holes that need to be filled.

Was never my intention to 'sell' baker to the freo supporters and basically came in here to see what was the opinion of the board in regards to his position and the need for baker but was tempted to reply to a post that asked what he would add to the list.

What he would be worth both picks and salary we all have opinions and usually pretty accurate or close enough but we have no influence and its silly to flex over the internet and argue with people you will never meet about something you have no control over.

But if the fremantle list management have identified Baker as a need and they would know his qualities and flaws and if they see a position for him onfield and or leadership.

1 poster mentioned "i want to sell baker" like i have that authority or anybody here has the ability to buy
only mentioning what sort of money he is on from reports over the last 2 years , What he adds to our team and the type of person player he is and most people say this but Richmond actually dont want to lose him and he will be a loss and thats why they have a very good long term offer for him to stay as im sure both WA teams also have.

All i will say is that where ever Baker does play next year he will be getting very well paid and probably around the 700k + range
sp what trade that attracts its debatable.

Cheers and good luck for the season

 

[Wray27]

If Tabs strings a few good games together and Darcy comes back do with we shift JT back or push Tabs out?

Be good to see what he could do back there.

And Adelaide desperately need a player like cox. Just sayin

Geez Cox is the longest contracted player at the club. He’s a Docker for life.

 

[Kapow!!!]

Very good post and extremely well written and totally agree with most of what you have said
Fremantle have the beginnings of a very good side and list and you guys would know alot better than me or any other supporter what holes that need to be filled.

Was never my intention to 'sell' baker to the freo supporters and basically came in here to see what was the opinion of the board in regards to his position and the need for baker but was tempted to reply to a post that asked what he would add to the list.

What he would be worth both picks and salary we all have opinions and usually pretty accurate or close enough but we have no influence and its silly to flex over the internet and argue with people you will never meet about something you have no control over.

But if the fremantle list management have identified Baker as a need and they would know his qualities and flaws and if they see a position for him onfield and or leadership.

1 poster mentioned "i want to sell baker" like i have that authority or anybody here has the ability to buy
only mentioning what sort of money he is on from reports over the last 2 years , What he adds to our team and the type of person player he is and most people say this but Richmond actually dont want to lose him and he will be a loss and thats why they have a very good long term offer for him to stay as im sure both WA teams also have.

All i will say is that where ever Baker does play next year he will be getting very well paid and probably around the 700k + range
sp what trade that attracts its debatable.

Cheers and good luck for the season

I cannot, and will not, argue/disagree with any of that. I also tend to think if Walls and co. value him with any sort of urgency I trust they've identified that need and will probably pay it because he is positive for cultural growth of a team (i.e. not a dickhead and trains like every week is just one win away from a premiership).

If there were questions over his professionalism or it was even considered a neutral trait of his I'd dare say a lot more dissent/critical questioning would be more justified but he's a guaranteed net positive (i.e. based on his trade and influence on the club alone, not based on the hypotheticals that 'could have happened' around him) wherever he ends up and players like that are not that common.

Best of luck with the Tiges this year mate, always enjoyed Richmond banter in an 'enemy of my enemy is my friend' kind of way and I truly wish the best for your mob

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

WC have just appointed new list manager and it really hinges on where some fresh eyes see their list at, if they genuinely believe they can climb back up in the next 3-4 years, trading for baker makes some sense, however if they think it’s more like 5-7 years it’s better to keep going to the draft hard before Tassie team compromises it. Either way Richmond should be ready for a second round pick at best if Baker does declare he wants to move home for “family” reasons at the end of the year.

Coincidentally the WC list manager is from Richmond…

I would be legitimately interested to know if they think they can actually be competing within 3-4. I know the general public don’t fully understand how long full AFL rebuilds take (it’s literally like 10 years) but surely the club does. Baker is a waste of time for them but they are welcome to flush capital on him if they want

 

[Ge3ks]

Coincidentally the WC list manager is from Richmond…

Yes and that has me thinking WC will be keen to trade him in. I don't necessarily agree that Baker is a waste of time for them. Their list needs a couple of players with Bakers attitude and experience to help guide their young guns, and reduce their loss margins. From Baker's POV, he would be offered a really generous salary and gets to settle back into family life. Maybe he is Captain material, too. Shuey 2.0

 

[Docker82]

Coincidentally the WC list manager is from Richmond…

I would be legitimately interested to know if they think they can actually be competing within 3-4. I know the general public don’t fully understand how long full AFL rebuilds take (it’s literally like 10 years) but surely the club does. Baker is a waste of time for them but they are welcome to flush capital on him if they want

I think a well done rebuild if you have decent KPPs already can take around 4-5 years tbh.

For us we’ve basically, outside of Pearce, needed to recruit KPPs from scratch. Also we’ve lost a lot of good players to trade.

A few good free agency gets and good drafting could see West Coast being pretty decent in 2-3 years IMO. Thing is that basically relies on them nailing everything which they won’t. As much as the AFL is trying to stop Tasmania impacting the rest of the competition it’s quite likely it ends up being wasted draft outside of one player for their perspective.

The issue they have too is they’ll have similar F/S and academy luck to us - SFA. Their second rounder if they finish last will probably be beyond 30.

We rebuilt a list in 2-3 years around 2008-2011 but our KPPs were already there and our recruitment of state league players was borderline being historically good over that period. They need soooo much to go right - basically to nail every move they make - to play finals within 5 years. Don’t see the talent their fans do though beyond their top 15 picks tbh. Their spine if they get English as a free agent won’t take much to fix though.

 

[Paracleet]

Coincidentally the WC list manager is from Richmond…

I would be legitimately interested to know if they think they can actually be competing within 3-4. I know the general public don’t fully understand how long full AFL rebuilds take (it’s literally like 10 years) but surely the club does. Baker is a waste of time for them but they are welcome to flush capital on him if they want

10 years come on that's ludicrous. 3 or 4 years if you have some good players to carry through (Example: Freo announced they were rebuilding after missing the finals in 2007, played finals in 2010.). 5 or 6 if you don't. Sure Brisbane and Melbourne took 10 plus years but that because they did it twice! You could argue our most recent was a semi double dip rebuild too.

Like or not WC finished second last in 2022 and they'll have finished cycling the list by the end of next year. 4 full drafts. Their 22/23/24 players will all be beyond 100/50 games by the end of '26. If they have chosen well and luckily they could be back in finals contention as soon as then, certainly the year after. Of course we all hope they have chosen IndianaJones&TheLastCrusade.gif

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

10 years come on that's ludicrous. 3 or 4 years if you have some good players to carry through (Example: Freo announced they were rebuilding after missing the finals in 2007, played finals in 2010.). 5 or 6 if you don't. Sure Brisbane and Melbourne took 10 plus years but that because they did it twice! You could argue our most recent was a semi double dip rebuild too.

Like or not WC finished second last in 2022 and they'll have finished cycling the list by the end of next year. 4 full drafts. Their 22/23/24 players will all be beyond 100/50 games by the end of '26. If they have chosen well and luckily they could be back in finals contention as soon as then, certainly the year after. Of course we all hope they have chosen IndianaJones&TheLastCrusade.gif

A full rebuild (to actually compete for a flag) takes about 10 years. You can restump / rewire quicker if you’ve been good about it but not a full rebuild.

You can make finals in those 10 years but you’re not an actual premiership threat until that first key player you drafted is about 28. Carlton drafted Cripps in 2013, Melbourne draft Gawn in 2009, Freo with Darcy and Ryan in 2016.

West Coast are in full rebuild, if they are lucky and draft really well, Ginbey and Hewitt will be the guns that let them actually compete for a flag in 2031

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I think a well done rebuild if you have decent KPPs already can take around 4-5 years tbh.

For us we’ve basically, outside of Pearce, needed to recruit KPPs from scratch. Also we’ve lost a lot of good players to trade.

A few good free agency gets and good drafting could see West Coast being pretty decent in 2-3 years IMO. Thing is that basically relies on them nailing everything which they won’t. As much as the AFL is trying to stop Tasmania impacting the rest of the competition it’s quite likely it ends up being wasted draft outside of one player for their perspective.

The issue they have too is they’ll have similar F/S and academy luck to us - SFA. Their second rounder if they finish last will probably be beyond 30.

We rebuilt a list in 2-3 years around 2008-2011 but our KPPs were already there and our recruitment of state league players was borderline being historically good over that period. They need soooo much to go right - basically to nail every move they make - to play finals within 5 years. Don’t see the talent their fans do though beyond their top 15 picks tbh. Their spine if they get English as a free agent won’t take much to fix though.

Yeah but that’s why I said full rebuild (as in restart the whole list) and gave the examples I gave above

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Another perfect example for my point - Richmond - Rance and Cotchin in 2007 / Riewoldt 2006. Full rebuilds take a long time because you have to draft 6-7 core elite players and they have to hit 27/28 before you can do anything. This goes doubly for pleb clubs in WA and SA who historically don’t get academy or F/S leg ups and it’s also why those systems are ****ed

 

[blue shark]

A full rebuild (to actually compete for a flag) takes about 10 years. You can restump / rewire quicker if you’ve been good about it but not a full rebuild.

You can make finals in those 10 years but you’re not an actual premiership threat until that first key player you drafted is about 28. Carlton drafted Cripps in 2013, Melbourne draft Gawn in 2009, Freo with Darcy and Ryan in 2016.

West Coast are in full rebuild, if they are lucky and draft really well, Ginbey and Hewitt will be the guns that let them actually compete for a flag in 2031

I would suggest that the talent unavailable to WC, and the fact the Tassie team will be up and running, that they will go
hard at trading in as many players available.
Their talent identification has been rather poor after the 2018 win, and the recruitment team should have been retired years
ago.
I still think that Simmo is gone ASAP, and their plans will revolve around a new coach and his asssessment of the list.
They traded for Yeo, Redden, Jetta Vardy and Cripps into their best 22.

 

[wakojako]

I really like Logan Mcdonald, I'm just concerned that Logan can't provide what Treacy does. Treacy brings the following to the team:

• Backup ruck which is important for Darcy
• Strength to brush off tackles
• Tackling pressure and speed
• Chemistry with Amiss

Logan has his own strengths that Treacy doesn't have but I feel like Josh has really contributed to both of our wins this season.

 

[Sturty2Hurty]

Throw some cash at Tom Powell, kid was very impressive today

 

[go_the_dockers]

I really like Logan Mcdonald, I'm just concerned that Logan can't provide what Treacy does. Treacy brings the following to the team:

• Backup ruck which is important for Darcy
• Strength to brush off tackles
• Tackling pressure and speed
• Chemistry with Amiss

Logan has his own strengths that Treacy doesn't have but I feel like Josh has really contributed to both of our wins this season.

I think we have too many weaknesses to do the minor upgrade of Treacy out of McDonald.


We badly need to upgrade our small forwards (Walters is still critical for us), we need some more speed and class through the midfield, and maybe another very quick and skillful half back.

I really hope some small forwards and outside mids rise up the draft rankings, because at the moment it is dominated by pure mids.

 

[Big Flappy]

How much could we throw at Hugh McCluggage

6

Hugh Mccluggage

Age

26

Ht

185cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.3

5star

K

11.4

4star

HB

7.9

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.0

5star

CL

2.2

4star

D

19.0

4star

K

12.0

5star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

2.0

4star

D

13.2

4star

K

7.8

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

4.2

4star

T

1.8

4star

CL

0.6

3star

?

 

[Joao]

How much could we throw at Hugh McCluggage?

Did cross my mind. Surely we asked the question even if it is ludicrously unlikely. Return the Neale favour.

 

[FreoGirl]

was annoying listening to commentators on the pre Sydney game salivating over the KP players from WA

 

[FD2646]

was annoying listening to commentators on the pre Sydney game salivating over the KP players from WA

Who did they mention?