List Mgmt. 2009 Draft Selections

[goodoldcats]

Yes Bartel was a better player but every year there is players who win best and fairest in TAC cup who don't even get drafted. Ablett had the cleanest hands in Australia for his age. It was widely known. I am sure around Geelong other players were rated higher, there is probably players still dining out in Lambys about finishing ahead of him in b and f at the falcons but recruiters always loved Hodge first and then Ablett and Bartel second. That is fact.

you have NFI mate

 

[SJ]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...ded-for-the-winning-cream-20110726-1hylh.html

The Cats, though, were interested in participating only if the deal was going to work for them. It has. They chose Mitch Duncan, one of their three Rising Star nominees this year, with the pick - 28 - they weren't willing to part with. Both Allen Christensen and Nathan Vardy were in the bracket of players they were considering at pick 33, and they got them both anyway, with 40 and 42.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...ded-for-the-winning-cream-20110726-1hylh.html

 

[Partridge]

Even today in the media , a supposedly complementary article about Geelong being a Player Factory had to say this :
"A club once mocked for its heavy reliance on father-son selections has become a talent factory rivalled only by Collingwood."

Frankly this is just crap. There is one time we have gained a big advantage from FS and that was Selwood and Hawkins and after that the noisey complaints ensured they changed the system.

Even then though, people ignore the facts. Everyone forgets that no less than 6 clubs overlooked Selwood, despite all their retrospective genius about recruiting. Who's to say they wouldn't have done that again?

"Talent factory rivalled only by Collingwood" I like that, they've had more father/son selections than we have. Typical appalling journalism.

 

[johnsmith05]

Just having a look at our selections for the 2009 draft. Could it potentially be as good as 2001? I know it is early but Stephen Wells did a good job, as always.

#17 - Daniel Menzel
#28 - Mitch Duncan
$40 - Allen Christensen
#42 - Nathan Vardy
#56 - Josh Cowan

What a wank that is, Wells has way more misses then hits...and i highly doubt getting them was all his decision....Truth is, other clubs do get good ,if not better picks too.... what was so good about 01? we got bartel and kelly yes, but we also wasted a 1st round pick on charlie gardiner ahead of a string of players such as montagna and swan...sure these guys we think will be great. but i wouldnt link it to wells at all....

 

[Turbocat]

Even then though, people ignore the facts. Everyone forgets that no less than 6 clubs overlooked Selwood, despite all their retrospective genius about recruiting. Who's to say they wouldn't have done that again?

"Talent factory rivalled only by Collingwood" I like that, they've had more father/son selections than we have. Typical appalling journalism.

No problem with the fact that 6 others over looked Joel , but to get Hawkins as well as Joel was seen to many as "having one's cake and eating it as well".

Today's rules wouldn't allow it , someone would have bid for Hawkins and considering Hawthorn took Thorpe a tall KPP , I'm sure they would have bid to use pick 6 on Hawkins. Then Geelong would have had to choose to match it or not. Either way we wouldn't have had both players unless Selwood fell all the way to Geelongs next pick @p25.

It may be the same sort of situation next year. A very deep draft and a talented FS in Bourke. If someone calls his name before our R1 pick then we must choose and will miss on quite a bit of early talent.

 

[thecatattack]

What a wank that is, Wells has way more misses then hits...and i highly doubt getting them was all his decision....Truth is, other clubs do get good ,if not better picks too.... what was so good about 01? we got bartel and kelly yes, but we also wasted a 1st round pick on charlie gardiner ahead of a string of players such as montagna and swan...sure these guys we think will be great. but i wouldnt link it to wells at all....

WTF do you have against Wells mate? Did he call you a bad name or something? Everytime something comes up about Wells you're always the first to bag him!

 

[Pure_Ownage]

What a wank that is, Wells has way more misses then hits...and i highly doubt getting them was all his decision....Truth is, other clubs do get good ,if not better picks too.... what was so good about 01? we got bartel and kelly yes, but we also wasted a 1st round pick on charlie gardiner ahead of a string of players such as montagna and swan...sure these guys we think will be great. but i wouldnt link it to wells at all....

What a complete load of rubbish.

And given that your previous anti Wells rant thread showed you couldn't do enough research to identify that Prismall was not a first round pick, excuse me if I take the above with a grain of salt.

Every other club would employ Wells in a heartbeat, there's a reason he is so highly regarded even if you don't see it.

 

[Biggy_Boy]

What a wank that is, Wells has way more misses then hits...and i highly doubt getting them was all his decision....Truth is, other clubs do get good ,if not better picks too.... what was so good about 01? we got bartel and kelly yes, but we also wasted a 1st round pick on charlie gardiner ahead of a string of players such as montagna and swan...sure these guys we think will be great. but i wouldnt link it to wells at all....

Pick 8: Bartel
Pick 17: Kelly
Pick 23: Gardiner
Pick 24: Johnson
Pick 40: GAJ (FS)
Pick 41: Playfair
Pick 69: McCarthy
Pick 81: D. Johnson

Sure, we missed players. However, in hindsight we did better than most other clubs in the draft, many of which had higher draft picks.

Then there was '99, where we got:

Pick 8: Corey
Pick 31: Chapman
Pick 38: Ling
Pick 47: Enright

 

[bulletproof]

Two Brownlow medalists, a Norm Smith medalist and once Kelly gets the nod this year, 4 All Australians.

It is the finest day a recruiter has ever had at the draft. End of.

 

[johnsmith05]

What a complete load of rubbish.

And given that your previous anti Wells rant thread showed you couldn't do enough research to identify that Prismall was not a first round pick, excuse me if I take the above with a grain of salt.

Every other club would employ Wells in a heartbeat, there's a reason he is so highly regarded even if you don't see it.

He was Geelongs 1st pick...

 

[johnsmith05]

WTF do you have against Wells mate? Did he call you a bad name or something? Everytime something comes up about Wells you're always the first to bag him!

Nothing at all, just you seem to think his a gun recruiter when if you do the research he has not done any better then any other recruiter has? I don't regard him as a bad scout but i clearly don't rate him as high as you do. And im just going by facts, getting it right 2 times in 11 seasons its not a genius....dont you think it is more credit to the players aswell that year who are good footballers and the coaching staff that taught them how to play footy...

Look at Enright for a example...he was a late pick, he couldn't kick at the start of his career to AFL standard and they worked on him ...the coaches and he is now a gun....I DARE YOU TO challenge me on that one...i dare you! cos if u don't understand what i just said then you have completely no idea at all!

 

[Pure_Ownage]

He was Geelongs 1st pick...

Your thesis was that it was an example of one of many of Wells first round picks that you seem to have think he bombed. It wasn't. Prismall is pick 32. You also ought to actually look at the top 40 picks (at least) in any draft and see how they are doing before you bag (any) recruiter, had you done that you'd see the 04 draft was one of the worst drafts in recent memory. In context, Prismall at 32, actually showing some reasonable signs pre ACL, was a hell of a lot better than most clubs did out of that draft. Thank goodness Wells correctly assessed that and picked the right time to trade out 2 first round picks. He also picked up an all Australian defender at pick 62.

 

[Hinkley29]

Look at Enright for a example...he was a late pick, he couldn't kick at the start of his career to AFL standard and they worked on him ...the coaches and he is now a gun....I DARE YOU TO challenge me on that one...i dare you! cos if u don't understand what i just said then you have completely no idea at all!

I will challenge you on that one, because it is a complete load of crap.

The job of a good recruiter is not to draft on what a player is on draft day, it is their job to draft a player on what they could become. Wells picked Enright with a very low pick (47), and Enright turned into one of the most important players in (at least) 2 premierships. On that basis alone it is a recruiting masterstroke. If Enright was a rubbish kick when he started, Wells obviously saw past this deficiency and picked him on what he could become. Which is exactly what his job is.

By any definition, he is the best recruiter in the league, and we are extremely lucky to have him.

I suspect you have no idea what the job of a scout/recruiter is.

 

[Topper Harley]

Look at Enright for a example...he was a late pick, he couldn't kick at the start of his career to AFL standard and they worked on him ...the coaches and he is now a gun....I DARE YOU TO challenge me on that one...i dare you! cos if u don't understand what i just said then you have completely no idea at all!

So you've previously abused Wells for picking Gardiner, and have placed no blame on the coaching staff, you've also lauded the coaching staff for Enright, while giving little to no credit to Wells.

The issue is, your arguments aren't consistant.

Also, facts will tell you that Wells has one of the best track records, and you've got to acknowledge that it is a joint effort between the recruiter and the coaching staff.

 

[CatTricks]

wow. cant believe the crap i am reading

 

[Lager]

wow. cant believe the crap i am reading

Yes, but I'm finding it perversely enjoyable

 

[CF]

What a wank that is, Wells has way more misses then hits...and i highly doubt getting them was all his decision....Truth is, other clubs do get good ,if not better picks too.... what was so good about 01? we got bartel and kelly yes, but we also wasted a 1st round pick on charlie gardiner ahead of a string of players such as montagna and swan...sure these guys we think will be great. but i wouldnt link it to wells at all....

You can say this about any recruiter really. Just because someone is picked in the top 20 players doesn't mean they will be a success in the AFL. Plenty of top 20 failures out there. Also, you have to put it in context of what the club was after at the time. They badly wanted a KP forward, that's why they picked Gardiner ahead of those other players you mentioned.

Wells has picked some duds true, he has also recruited players that have won us 2 flags. So go easy on the guy eh?

 

[Exhale You]

we also wasted a 1st round pick on charlie gardiner

Incorrect.

ahead of a string of players such as montagna and swan....

Um, neither Montagna or Swan were considered top prospects, in fact in Swan's case, he wasn't even a certainty to be drafted.

BTW St.Kilda chose four players prior to taking Montagna, amongst them were Xavier Clarke and Matt Maguire, whilst before Collingwood took Dane Swan they selected Richard Cole, Tom Davidson and Mark McGough.

The basis for your current criticism of Wells is both ridiculous and clearly ill-conceived, and that's being polite.

 

[johnsmith05]

I will challenge you on that one, because it is a complete load of crap.

If Enright was a rubbish kick when he started, Wells obviously saw past this deficiency and picked him on what he could become. Which is exactly what his job is.

By any definition, he is the best recruiter in the league, and we are extremely lucky to have him.


I suspect you have no idea what the job of a scout/recruiter is.

OK challenge me, put it this way, that is a exact direct quote ...the bit about Enrights kicking from as close to the inner sanctum as you can...someone regarded as one of the best coaches in the AFL...so you got absolutely no idea mate at all.

And with the Wells seeing Enright could of been a great player ect....are you saying he personally told you that? because your saying it as if it is a fact....and its a hein seight reaction saying he new....like thats just rubbish, you cant prove that....

I suspect you got no idea about what football really is, your just an outsider who has got absolutely no idea about the variables.

 

[johnsmith05]

Incorrect.

Um, neither Montagna or Swan were considered top prospects, in fact in Swan's case, he wasn't even a certainty to be drafted.

The basis for your current criticism of Wells is both ridiculous and clearly ill-conceived, and that's being polite.

So what your saying is, the Collingwood and St.Kilda recruiters are masterminds? because they new they were going to be guns? that's the way you think of your own recruiter?

the basis of your current theory is purely one eyed. I have been a Geelong fan my whole life but im not one eyed, i dont just say shit cos there from my own club.

 

[johnsmith05]

You can say this about any recruiter really. Just because someone is picked in the top 20 players doesn't mean they will be a success in the AFL. Plenty of top 20 failures out there. Also, you have to put it in context of what the club was after at the time. They badly wanted a KP forward, that's why they picked Gardiner ahead of those other players you mentioned.

Wells has picked some duds true, he has also recruited players that have won us 2 flags. So go easy on the guy eh?

Exactly right...All im saying is getting it from both perspectives and not being one eyed...that's why when people say Wells is a great recruiter, can be said about every recruiter. That my only point, sure he is good, but he hasn't done anything better then anyone else. As i said above, if we talk about Grand Finals, then why isn't the Collingwood scout considered the best, delivering Dane Swan so late who is a star, better then any of the or most of the late picks Wells got....Sam Mitchell, is the Hawks scout a star for picking him up late? premiership captain...late pick...

 

[Hood007]

Exactly right...All im saying is getting it from both perspectives and not being one eyed...that's why when people say Wells is a great recruiter, can be said about every recruiter. That my only point, sure he is good, but he hasn't done anything better then anyone else.

Ah, yes he has.
The players he's picked have played in premierships.
He's clearly demonstrated he knows how to put together the list of a premiership winning club. Not every other recruiter has done that.

And in Enright's case, of course coaches helped him become the player he is, that goes without saying.
But they wouldn't have been able to do that if Wells hadn't picked him...

 

[DanA]

OK challenge me, put it this way, that is a exact direct quote ...the bit about Enrights kicking from as close to the inner sanctum as you can...someone regarded as one of the best coaches in the AFL...so you got absolutely no idea mate at all.

And with the Wells seeing Enright could of been a great player ect....are you saying he personally told you that? because your saying it as if it is a fact....and its a hein seight reaction saying he new....like thats just rubbish, you cant prove that....

I suspect you got no idea about what football really is, your just an outsider who has got absolutely no idea about the variables.

So a 5 minute conversation with a top coach makes you an expert in drafting?

Bottom line is the Cats are a successful team and most would say have drafted well. Some of that is undoubtedly player development but I think are strike rate is too high for drafting not to have an influence.

Almost all of our mature age recruits work out well and I'd guess we'd have the highest number of draftee to play AFL of any club in the AFL. Even most of our failures find new homes at clubs.

 

[Exhale You]

So what your saying is, the Collingwood and St.Kilda recruiters are masterminds? because they new they were going to be guns? that's the way you think of your own recruiter?

Ah, dear me.

the basis of your current theory is purely one eyed. I have been a Geelong fan my whole life but im not one eyed, i dont just say shit cos there from my own club.

What theory would that be?
My post made no comment about Stephen Wells, my post did however not only prove you wrong but also show your justification for denigrating Wells to be as ridiculous as it was baseless.

 

[CatTricks]

Why do people even bother arguing with this ass clown?