List Mgmt. 2015 Trade, Draft, Rookie Draft and FA Megathread

[sauce_head]

I just don't think we're going challenge for a flag without making a few bold moves... I really have no idea how messed up his life is, but I would certainly be exploring the option of recruiting him.
Pretty unfortunate to have those photos circulated when I suspect many many AFL footballers have been upto the same antics.
If after serious due diligence he's too risky then we leave him, but he's too good a player to not spend serious time investigating.

Our due diligence this time needs to more than ask the club who is trading him whether or not he's a good bloke.

 

[BrianSpeaking]

Joey didn't set fire to a dwarf. Bennell is a dickhead, couldn't give a stuff if he is the next Gary Ablett, he can play in the NTFL.

 

[andy_cav]

Are you joking? Talk about being over dramatic. Sure he messed up and got busted doing drugs, 2 years ago mind you but what the hell are all the signs he can't change?
This is such a non incident it's not even funny, I think the worst thing to come out of this is the incredibly moronic comments people are making about writing him off.
A change of scenery could be exactly what he needs, and I for one would 100% back our club to be that change.

I'd say being publicly shamed in front of the entire country, going on national tv and pleading for a last chance and saying that you will repay the club, and then getting involved in this (after a series of previous indiscretions, including another alcohol-related one this year) is a fairly clear indicator.

 

[Joffaboy]

Completely agree that the club will have to make some big decisions in order to challenge for a flag, and also that many many other players in the comp (likely St Kilda players too) would also be taking recreational drugs. But the fact that he was caught and publicly shamed, pleaded on national tv for one last chance and said it had been the final wake up call after a series of regular stuff ups throughout his career, and yet STILL got involved in something like this, should be setting off every possible alarm bell. It's really not that hard to not get involved in an argument with with a bouncer and knock a ciggie out of his hand....

Sorry, was he caught with drugs again?

The guy is 22 and can go out for a few drinks.

Lets hear the full story before crucifying the guy. Maybe the steroid filled hate machine with the lung buster singled him out because he is an aboriginal or a footballer or maybe both.

Incredible that the likes of Hodge is free to play arte endangering lives on the road, Franklin had to get injunctions from the club regarding a policy that will not be named for legal reasons, and also smashes a bunch of cares in Sydney because of bad driving (yep) but he is a superstar and Teflon.

We had a someone play for us for ten years who has pleaded guilty to sexual assault, we had players setting fire to dwarfs. They all played and nothing was spoken about "brand"

Gardiner, was caught consorting with crims, best mate with an ice addict, got pissed and crashed his car, but came to St.Kilda and played seasons with no problem.

But that's OK, we will get some GOP like Tucker and Bennell will go to Collingwood or Richmond and help them win a flag

 

[Joffaboy]

Joey didn't set fire to a dwarf. Bennell is a dickhead, couldn't give a stuff if he is the next Gary Ablett, he can play in the NTFL.

That's right it was cj, and he was immediately sack from the club.

Wasn't he?

 

[joop]

I'd say being publicly shamed in front of the entire country, going on national tv and pleading for a last chance and saying that you will repay the club, and then getting involved in this (after a series of previous indiscretions, including another alcohol-related one this year) is a fairly clear indicator.

Getting involved in 'this'? What an argument with a bouncer? Bloody hell crucify the kid.

 

[Defacto]

Sorry, was he caught with drugs again?

The guy is 22 and can go out for a few drinks.

Lets hear the full story before crucifying the guy. Maybe the steroid filled hate machine with the lung buster singled him out because he is an aboriginal or a footballer or maybe both.

Incredible that the likes of Hodge is free to play arte endangering lives on the road, Franklin had to get injunctions from the club regarding a policy that will not be named for legal reasons, and also smashes a bunch of cares in Sydney because of bad driving (yep) but he is a superstar and Teflon.

We had a someone play for us for ten years who has pleaded guilty to sexual assault, we had players setting fire to dwarfs. They all played and nothing was spoken about "brand"

Gardiner, was caught consorting with crims, best mate with an ice addict, got pissed and crashed his car, but came to St.Kilda and played seasons with no problem.

But that's OK, we will get some GOP like Tucker and Bennell will go to Collingwood or Richmond and help them win a flag

why do you think bennell will get to the saints and suddenly change his attitude? he was extremely poor on field this year until he decide to "change" that lasted less then 2 months.

the earlier form wouldnt get him a game in the saints side with richos need for effort

 

[Half Back Pocket]

Port Adelaide get - Bennell
GCS get - Pick 5
St Kilda get - Ollie Wines

 

[okeydoke7]

Bennell could damage our brand or he could do wonders for our brand.

On the one hand, he could continue to act as he has at the GCS and tarnish our brand, culture and decision-making/recruiting.

On the other hand, he could do as many young men do and turn things around while continuing to develop into a superstar footballer. St Kilda would be lauded for "taking the punt" and having a culture strong enough to support a guy to turn his life around (I mean that simply in terms of becoming more professional). The best thing for a brand is winning. Becoming successful. Prime time, attractive footy.

It's a risk, but this latest incident does not change the risk discussion in my opinion. We knew all of this already. I think the comparisons to Lovett are a little unfair to be honest. I know we were burnt when taking a similar risk, but Lovett isn't the only bloke teams have taken risks on. We took a risk on Weller, from the GCS, who had a questionable reputation. It has worked, so far. We held onto and supported Milney, Gehrig, Fisher, etc etc etc (as mentioned before) in separate incidents.

It's a really tough call. Really tough. But if we were having discussions about it PRIOR to this incident, I don't see how this latest indiscretion really changes much (apart from making him a little cheaper, potentially).

 

[sauce_head]

Sorry, was he caught with drugs again?

The guy is 22 and can go out for a few drinks.

Lets hear the full story before crucifying the guy. Maybe the steroid filled hate machine with the lung buster singled him out because he is an aboriginal or a footballer or maybe both.

Incredible that the likes of Hodge is free to play arte endangering lives on the road, Franklin had to get injunctions from the club regarding a policy that will not be named for legal reasons, and also smashes a bunch of cares in Sydney because of bad driving (yep) but he is a superstar and Teflon.

We had a someone play for us for ten years who has pleaded guilty to sexual assault, we had players setting fire to dwarfs. They all played and nothing was spoken about "brand"

Gardiner, was caught consorting with crims, best mate with an ice addict, got pissed and crashed his car, but came to St.Kilda and played seasons with no problem.

But that's OK, we will get some GOP like Tucker and Bennell will go to Collingwood or Richmond and help them win a flag

Think that was franklins Mrs. Hodge would have passed the sobriety test in a number of western counties with that reading.

 

[Joffaboy]

Think that was franklins Mrs. Hodge would have passed the sobriety test in a number of western counties with that reading.

So what, he lives in Australia and was on the road driving under the influence.

OK for him? Why is that? Franklin is known for his extra curricular activities.

Caroline Wilson made veiled allegations about Sam Fisher and illicit drugs.

Sounds like certain players have a blind eye turned to while others don't.

 

[Present Not Past]

Bloody hell, Gilbo was embroiled in a scandal banging 16 y.o.s. Milne played for us for ten years and has been convicted to sexual assault. There have been big ???? over Sam Fisher and his dabbling in certain substances, Gehrig was too pissed for Bangkok. Joey set fire to a Dwarf FFS.

We don't get Bennell because he is a risk? Give me a break

Exactly. Our Club's history is full of incidents like these and they have taken it's toll.
We need another one like we need a bullet to the head.

 

[andy_cav]

Sorry, was he caught with drugs again?

The guy is 22 and can go out for a few drinks.

Lets hear the full story before crucifying the guy. Maybe the steroid filled hate machine with the lung buster singled him out because he is an aboriginal or a footballer or maybe both.

Incredible that the likes of Hodge is free to play arte endangering lives on the road, Franklin had to get injunctions from the club regarding a policy that will not be named for legal reasons, and also smashes a bunch of cares in Sydney because of bad driving (yep) but he is a superstar and Teflon.

We had a someone play for us for ten years who has pleaded guilty to sexual assault, we had players setting fire to dwarfs. They all played and nothing was spoken about "brand"

Gardiner, was caught consorting with crims, best mate with an ice addict, got pissed and crashed his car, but came to St.Kilda and played seasons with no problem.

But that's OK, we will get some GOP like Tucker and Bennell will go to Collingwood or Richmond and help them win a flag

I'm not sure where you were living when all of these problems such as the Milne rape allegations, Mad Monday dwarf incident, 'St Kilda school girl' and Andrew Lovett dramas occurred, but the whole reason people are so against getting Bennell to the Saints is because we had one if, if not THE, worst reputations and 'brands' in the comp a year or two ago. People were crucifying the club, to the point where the entire playing group made a video that was circulated to members declaring that they wouldn't allow any further stuff ups. We are the absolute last club that can afford another off-field issue. And for what it's worth, I agree that Hodge and Franklin definitely got off lightly. But part of that is because Hawthorn and especially Sydney have a strong recent history in terms of off-field behaviour, and so rightly or wrongly, the media tends to gloss over such indiscretions.
Unfortunately footy these days is a business, with clubs dependent on sponsors and memberships like never before. If Bennell were to come to us and stuff up, it would be a disaster that the club literally could not afford.

 

[Winners Only]

Not interested in Bennell, the guy will damage our brand waaaaaaaay too much.

Tend to agree now! He says he loves the GCS and wanted to stay and the he goes out and does the latest? The kid has major issues which stem from psychological scarring from a young age IMO, is too damaged for the Saints to take the risk.

 

[Joffaboy]

Exactly. Our Club's history is full of incidents like these and they have taken it's toll.
We need another one like we need a bullet to the head.

So why did we take Weller? Why is Gilbo still on the list? Why is Fisher still on the list? How did Gardiner turn out?

We have some shrinking violets as supporters.

May thought we would have won a flag with Ben Cousins on the list (I don't BTW that guy still is an addict)

Unless we take a risk, we cant compete with the AFL franchise clubs like GWS and Sydney who will always get a leg up compered to us.

 

[Joffaboy]

Tend to agree now! He says he loves the GCS and wanted to stay and the he goes out and does the latest? The kid has major issues which stem from psychological scarring from a young age IMO, is too damaged for the Saints to take the risk.

You know his background do you Winners Only?

From someone I know in Perth, this is far from reality. But it makes a cool story.

 

[sauce_head]

So what, he lives in Australia and was on the road driving under the influence.

OK for him? Why is that? Franklin is known for his extra curricular activities.

Caroline Wilson made veiled allegations about Sam Fisher and illicit drugs.

Sounds like certain players have a blind eye turned to while others don't.

I'm just giving context, not an opinion.

 

[Present Not Past]

So why did we take Weller? Why is Gilbo still on the list? Why is Fisher still on the list? How did Gardiner turn out?

We have some shrinking violets as supporters.

May thought we would have won a flag with Ben Cousins on the list (I don't BTW that guy still is an addict)

Unless we take a risk, we cant compete with the AFL franchise clubs like GWS and Sydney who will always get a leg up compered to us.

Because the Club doesn't need to take another risk on a player like Bennell at this stage of it's rebuild.
The Club is better off taking another talented youngster with their first round pick this time rather than on a damaged established player.

 

[L_W_P]

So we get scared off Bennell while a club like Richmond, Hawthorn, Collingwood or Sydney take the risk and reap the benefits. Geez we are a gutless club sometimes... I know that is harsh but it seems like every talented player on the market (Dixon, Yarran, Henderson, Carlisle...) has flaws and thus we don't want to touch them.

Eventually we have to take a chance on a talented, but troubled, player. The longer we go without taking that risk the harder it gets to pull the trigger. No-one at the club (coaches, recruitment, list managers etc) wants to be seen as the one who rocks the boat and so this culture of playing it safe continues to grow.

That's all well and good but how many teams have won premierships with 22 'nice' players running out?

Hodge, Mitchell, Lewis, Buddy, Lake...
Goodes, Buddy, Tippett, Mumford...
Swan, Lumumba, Jolly, Didak...
Stevie J, Milburn, Ling, Chappy, Mackie...

Plenty of dickheads, distractions, thugs, cheats etc helping their teams win flags and make Grand Finals in recent times.

 

[#gosaintas]

Geez who hasn't abused a bouncer in his time. This will hopefully give us a better chance of landing him.

 

[Winners Only]

You know his background do you Winners Only?

From someone I know in Perth, this is far from reality. But it makes a cool story.

Read Loris's posts over on Saintsational. He came from a family with significant issues and was taken on by an elder Bennell woman (grandmother) and raised by her. His surname is not Bennell he took on the surname after living withn the family. Sounds like he always had behavioural issue is just that he could play footy.

I would one of the strongest campaigners to give the indigenous kids a go - he has had chances and is not learning, hence he is too big of a risk for the Saints in this time of their list rebuild. The club needs and deserves certainties with their 1st round draft choices there is no room for error!

 

[sauce_head]

So we get scared off Bennell while a club like Richmond, Hawthorn, Collingwood or Sydney take the risk and reap the benefits. Geez we are a gutless club sometimes... I know that is harsh but it seems like every talented player on the market has flaws and thus we don't want to touch them.

Eventually we have to take a chance on a talented, but troubled, player. The longer we go without taking that risk the harder it gets to pull the trigger. No-one at the club (coaches, recruitment, list managers etc) wants to be seen as the one who rocks the boat and so this culture of playing it safe continues to grow.

That's all well and good but how many teams have won premierships with 22 'nice' players running out?

Hodge, Mitchell, Lewis, Buddy, Lake...
Goodes, Buddy, Tippett, Mumford...
Swan, Lumumba, Jolly, Didak...
Stevie J, Milburn, Ling, Chappy, Mackie...

Plenty of dickheads, distractions, thugs, cheats etc helping their teams win flags and make Grand Finals in recent times.

But we HAVE taken past chances. People sound like they don't wat to again on something that sounds like it's a guaranteed car wreck.

 

[Cannavaro20]

Einstein's view of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome. If we think he is a lovett.... we need to ask ourselves are we insane?

 

[BrianSpeaking]

Bennell is 23 not 19, remember how talented Cupido was? Clubs need to protect their brand, it's a competitive environment out there in corporate land in regards to finding sponsorships of real value.

Having said all of that, our opinions don't matter, the club will do their due diligence and make the decision.

 

[Joffaboy]

Read Loris's posts over on Saintsational. He came from a family with significant issues and was taken on by an elder Bennell woman (grandmother) and raised by her. His surname is not Bennell he took on the surname after living withn the family. Sounds like he always had behavioural issue is just that he could play footy.

I would one of the strongest campaigners to give the indigenous kids a go - he has had chances and is not learning, hence he is too big of a risk for the Saints in this time of their list rebuild. The club needs and deserves certainties with their 1st round draft choices there is no room for error!

Fair enough response.