Analysis 2016 List Management Discussion

[LordLucifer]

That's the only reason I bring it up - you do sometimes come out with info from a source.

To be clear, I look at what is or has been said by club officials in the media or online plus the trends they are adapting (ie. changes in draft philosophy etc) and then make a judgement based on those factors.

Some of it is commonsense too.

 

[LordLucifer]

Is that you DVB!

Same mother, different fathers.

 

[LordLucifer]

You do realise Sheik that the AFL promote the recruitment of "exotics".?

We are supposed to target some people from non-AFL sporting back grounds.

Of course they do, it's a great PR exercise when one of them make the grade.

 

[passmark]

Of course they do, it's a great PR exercise when one of them make the grade.

So you can name a dozen or so guys from the following criteria we should have taken.

• has not registered in an Australian Football competition for three years immediately before inclusion on the Rookie List;
• is an international player, meaning he is not an Australian citizen and has not lived in Australia for a substantial period;
• is a former NSW Scholarship player with that club;
• is a former International Scholarship player with that club;
• is a rookie Zone Selection for clubs based in NSW or Queensland.

 

[ShanDog]

To be clear, I look at what is or has been said by club officials in the media or online plus the trends they are adapting (ie. changes in draft philosophy etc) and then make a judgement based on those factors.

Some of it is commonsense too.

Understand all that but you've had sources before, so when you state something as a fact without any 'IMO' caveat it can make it seem like a source not an opinion. Anyway I'm about done with this... We are going in circles.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Wrong again, he played 24 WAFL senior games between 2011 & 2103.

During his Colts & Reserves games, he maintained the same level of output (around the 20-25 disposals per game) as he did upon making it in the seniors.

15 was a typo. I was the one who posted his stats when recruited.

His output rose considerably in his last year. Having low numbers at all levels earlier than that only serves to highlight his new found seriousness. Don't take it from me though. Take it from his coach.

Harding said Boekhorst was originally a 12-15 possession player in the WAFL, but had built his tank to ensure he became a big possession-winner last season.

“His greatest strength is his depth of kicking and vision, he just never had a real appetite to accumulate possessions,” Harding said.

“But last year he developed his running capacity and regularly hit the 25-30 possession mark.

“As soon as he was producing those numbers his impact on the game went to a new level.

 

[Blues90]

Should carlton make another play for tom mitchell?

 

[ShanDog]

Should carlton make another play for tom mitchell?

If the price is right, he'd be a great addition to our midfield.

 

[Cringle]

Doubt the price would be anything less than a first rounder.

 

[Blues90]

Doubt the price would be anything less than a first rounder.

With Thier academy could do a second and third

 

[LordLucifer]

Should carlton make another play for tom mitchell?

They can have Everitt back.

 

[LordLucifer]

A while back there were a number of posters concerned about the number of changes we were making to the playing list, I'd like them to now consider these facts :

(a) we turned over 15 players in the off-season, of those who were delisted, none of them were picked up by other clubs.

(b) three of them were traded, Menzel & Yarran didn't play for their new clubs in RD 1. whilst Henderson has had one kick in his Geelong debut.

 

[The Flying Doormat]

A while back there were a number of posters concerned about the number of changes we were making to the playing list, I'd like them to now consider these facts :

(a) we turned over 15 players in the off-season, of those who were delisted, none of them were picked up by other clubs.

(b) three of them were traded, Menzel & Yarran didn't play for their new clubs in RD 1. whilst Henderson has had one kick in his Geelong debut.

I thought Hendo was the sub.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

A while back there were a number of posters concerned about the number of changes we were making to the playing list, I'd like them to now consider these facts :

(a) we turned over 15 players in the off-season, of those who were delisted, none of them were picked up by other clubs.

(b) three of them were traded, Menzel & Yarran didn't play for their new clubs in RD 1. whilst Henderson has had one kick in his Geelong debut.

Bell was good but we never wanted him gone

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

A while back there were a number of posters concerned about the number of changes we were making to the playing list, I'd like them to now consider these facts :

(a) we turned over 15 players in the off-season, of those who were delisted, none of them were picked up by other clubs.

(b) three of them were traded, Menzel & Yarran didn't play for their new clubs in RD 1. whilst Henderson has had one kick in his Geelong debut.

I thought most were thrilled with the changes we made at the end of 2015.

The delistings in themselves were not that impressive. 1 cat b rookie, 3 cat a rookies, 3 retirements then Warnock, Watson, Holman and Giles delisted. Giles chronically injured, Warnock similar.

The trades were where it was at but 3 of them were forced on us. The Menzel one was a gutsy stand.

 

[HARKER]

A while back there were a number of posters concerned about the number of changes we were making to the playing list, I'd like them to now consider these facts :

(a) we turned over 15 players in the off-season, of those who were delisted, none of them were picked up by other clubs.

(b) three of them were traded, Menzel & Yarran didn't play for their new clubs in RD 1. whilst Henderson has had one kick in his Geelong debut.

Let's be honest though;

1. Who expected a first rounder (that turned into a #8) for Henderson?
2. Who expected we'd lose Bell for a #21 which then along with our second, we converted into Curnow?
3. Who thought we'd get Kerridge, Plowman and Phillips for Menzel?
4. We even got the guy we were aiming for with the return we received for Yarran.

We didn't want to get bent over on trades but we sure made the most of what could have previously been a trading disaster.

 

[LordLucifer]

I thought most were thrilled with the changes we made at the end of 2015.

I think most were but, there were certainly a number of people who thought we should of retained Giles or given Warnock another year and we all know Cringle's views on Watson etc.

The point I'm making there is that even though people were worried about the heavy number of changes or a particular individual player lost, nothing thus far has come back to bite us on the bum.

I'm expecting another 10-12 changes next year and when that happens, based on what was achieved recently, there should be nothing but strong faith in those doing the hackwork whilst d a respecting the decisions they make in regards to the players they move in and out of the club.

 

[HARKER]

I'm expecting another 10-12 changes next year and when that happens, based on what was achieved recently, there should be nothing but strong faith in those doing the hackwork whilst d a respecting the decisions they make in regards to the players they move in and out of the club.

Maybe not next year but this year is a clear possibility.

 

[LordLucifer]

Maybe not next year but this year is a clear possibility.

You know what I meant ..........

 

[4thchicken]

Let's be honest though;

1. Who expected a first rounder (that turned into a #8) for Henderson?
2. Who expected we'd lose Bell for a #21 which then along with our second, we converted into Curnow?
3. Who thought we'd get Kerridge, Plowman and Phillips for Menzel?
4. We even got the guy we were aiming for with the return we received for Yarran.

We didn't want to get bent over on trades but we sure made the most of what could have previously been a trading disaster.

The above would be what I'd normally expect at the trade table (although turning 28 into the GWS 4 was above and beyond what was to be expected).

Given the above though, one has to wonder what we should have gotten for players that we got rid of under the previous regime? what would garlett, robinson and laidler have been worth post 2015? (or in ladler's case, 2014, his first year at the swans)

For myself, all 3 players should have netted an end of first round-mid 2nd round pick (and similarly the betts FA compo) - potentially we could have ended up with hartung (betts), taylor (laidler), goddard/laverde (garlett) and menadue (robinson)...

 

[Old navy]

What have they got to do with the price of fish in China ?? Irrelevant to the issue, they are part of the bigger picture.



When I use the term "exotic", I'm referring to players from non-traditional Aussie Rules backgrounds, we had that Fraser Russell bloke also in that category. There is a much lower probability of them becoming genuine players due to not being exposed to it so early.

Sheehan is No. 3 in the Irish pecking order and is hardly getting on the park, he will be moved on in the club's pursuit of building a playing list of depth & talent. We don't know the actual answer to this but who knows if Sheehan would of survived if SOS was able to find another suitable trade, free agent or trade to take his place, it may have been just circumstance that save his bacon (or potato).

Walsh was deemed too slow when the clear message was they wanted to bring in players with genuine leg speed.

IMO it was a combo of leg speed poor kicking and a lack of height that sealed Walsh's fate.
You can be short and slow, but you best be able to kick a footy left and right foot Sam Mitchell style.
Wasn't really that surprised with the call on Walsh. The call on Giles was more of a shock TBH.
Injury must have been very serious.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Walsh wasn't an issue. The issue is that if SOS and Bolts didn't rate Sheehan, don't like players from outside traditional football backgrounds, and feel he has deficiencies they dont want to work with, he would have gone before Walsh who is younger, only had 1 year to show something and has a decent junior pedigree.

The fact that he was retained IMO shows they were willing to give him an opportunity to come back from injury and repeat his late 2014 form.

 

[HARKER]

The above would be what I'd normally expect at the trade table (although turning 28 into the GWS 4 was above and beyond what was to be expected).

Given the above though, one has to wonder what we should have gotten for players that we got rid of under the previous regime? what would garlett, robinson and laidler have been worth post 2015? (or in ladler's case, 2014, his first year at the swans)

For myself, all 3 players should have netted an end of first round-mid 2nd round pick (and similarly the betts FA compo) - potentially we could have ended up with hartung (betts), taylor (laidler), goddard/laverde (garlett) and menadue (robinson)...

You honestly expected a pick #8 for 2015 Henderson?

I think those others were a bit of a reach also 4thchicken but that's only because of where they were led to. History now.

 

[4thchicken]

You honestly expected a pick #8 for 2015 Henderson?

I think those others were a bit of a reach also 4thchicken but that's only because of where they were led to. History now.

Not pick 8 specifically but yes, I'd have expected a first round pick. Particularly once future trading came into place (henderson was future 1st round rather than pick 8).

 

[HARKER]

Not pick 8 specifically but yes, I'd have expected a first round pick. Particularly once future trading came into place (henderson was future 1st round rather than pick 8).

Seems to me that the pick came into being as a direct result of the Henderson trade..........so pick #8 it is. GWS just hedged their bets

That's what a good chess player does........thinks several moves ahead and wins.