Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion Part II

[Blue Baggers]

I think you will find the "reality" is that Gibbs will most likely leave mate.

This has been the mail all year. From reliable posters.

Gibbs may leave but we won't be getting Hopper Kelly Lever Saad in exchange for him. We are likely to get a pick which we'll take to the draft. I just see posts with 6 trades that clearly favour us and think I want whatever they've been smoking.

 

[HalAlaric]

Very happy to read the article on the AFL website today in regards to our draft and trade strategy. I really think the team has done well in keeping their cards close to their chests and agree that a couple more mature midfielders （21-25y.o) are required to ease the burden on our youngsters.

Having a quick look at uncontracted players I would be surprised if we hadn't inquired about the services of several midfielders I would love to see in blue as well as a couple with some question marks over them. For this conversation I have left out the players already thrown around by many posters but I would love to hear peoples thoughts on whether the players below would be viewed as positive additions and what roles people think they would play in our young side.

Players I would be happy with the club targeting:
Brendon Ah Chee
Darcy Tucker
Ed Langdon
Harley Balic
Billy Hartung
Mitch Honeychurch

Player with question marks:
Cameron Ellis-Yolman
Jackson Merrett
Brandon Ellis

 

[HARKER]

Why is everyone putting up the most outlandish scenarios? The reality is Gibbs will stay, murphy will stay and we will take our picks to the draft, Cas may leave in which case we will get 2nd round at best and more likely 3rd round.. We may get Kelly but he will not be cheap and considering we're no longer going the messiah route I think we will tackle the draft with the the early pick and stick to the path we have sold to members and supporters. I know boring right, but closer to the truth than most of the other bullshit I'm seeing on here.

How is that scenario going to help us?
We've been thrilled with the way SOS trades, but we don't want to trade?

It was obvious that our trading commodity last year was Tuohy.
This year it's almost as clear that it has to be other senior players and we don't have anyone left, other that Gibbs & Murphy.
That's not to say it will happen but it has to be what we're planning for and if Casboult goes for a band 3, we take it and make it work.

You're right it is boring and that's not what we've seen of our rebuild to date, so why stop now?
We have to be bold. There's no other way.

 

[bluekidjoe]

This talk of Murphy being traded is interesting. Tigers would be the best fit. If Dusty goes the tigers would be in need of a mature mid to fill the void with their window open now. Murphy fits that bill. Tigers would get a pick straight after theirs for Dusty (13-18), this would be appropriate compo for Murphy's worth. The personal and club culture side of it is where I see more issues. A club getting rid of its captain? Well, if it happened Murph wouldn't want to leave Melbourne. Also, it would likely give Simmo a year as capo before Doc or Crippa take it.

In saying all that, I don't see it happening.

 

[HARKER]

This talk of Murphy being traded is interesting. Tigers would be the best fit. If Dusty goes the tigers would be in need of a mature mid to fill the void with their window open now. Murphy fits that bill. Tigers would get a pick straight after theirs for Dusty (13-18), this would be appropriate compo for Murphy's worth. The personal and club culture side of it is where I see more issues. A club getting rid of its captain? Well, if it happened Murph wouldn't want to leave Melbourne. Also, it would likely give Simmo a year as capo before Doc or Crippa take it.

In saying all that, I don't see it happening.

GWS would be the best fit, if Murphy was open to it.

1. Murphy would get a contract we won't be offering here. His contract expires next year.
2. If GWS do lose Kelly, Murphy would be a good replacement for him and would function better there than in our shallow midfield.
3. Speculation: Murphy may be happy to get out of Victoria for a while.
4. GWS may be happy to have his leadership and GWS are all about the now, whereas we're not.

If Murphy was to go, it may be sold that it was under his own steam. Neither Murphy nor the club would have to say it was the clubs wish.
See Tuohy last year and what came out of that? Win/Win

 

[Blue Baggers]

How is that scenario going to help us?
We've been thrilled with the way SOS trades, but we don't want to trade?

It was obvious that our trading commodity last year was Tuohy.
This year it's almost as clear that it has to be other senior players and we don't have anyone left, other that Gibbs & Murphy.
That's not to say it will happen but it has to be what we're planning for and if Casboult goes for a band 3, we take it and make it work.

You're right it is boring and that's not what we've seen of our rebuild to date, so why stop now?
We have to be bold. There's no other way.

There is being bold and there is being unrealistic, I'm not saying don't trade I'm saying stop posting fanciful scenarios

 

[HARKER]

It won't come to this, but I'd be thrilled should Gibbs & Murphy net us Kelly & Hopper.
Some more would have to go out, but it may not amount to this years first pick.

Would something like be a start point;
Gibbs (what we get from Adelaide) , Murphy and Carltons next years first and a salary dump for Kelly, Hopper and GWS's next years first?

 

[HARKER]

There is being bold and there is being unrealistic, I'm not saying don't trade I'm saying stop posting fanciful scenarios

I've put forward why I see it as feasible.
What have you got to say that it's fanciful? Why is it fanciful?

Is it because we're talking about a captain? Is that it?
What if Murphy wanted to leave?


EDIT: Murphy will want to negotiate a new contract. What should we do and would others offer more?
I reckon Murphy and the club would have already had this discussion.

 

[Aphrodite]

Blues on hunt for mids

http://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/2017-08-03/blues-on-hunt-for-mids


Welcome to Carlton Josh Kelly

Carlton will only trade its 2017 first-round draft pick for an elite youngster, but the Blues will separately target mature midfielders who can reduce their heavy reliance on Marc Murphy and Bryce Gibbs, CEO Steven Trigg says.

If the Blues finish the season in their current ladder position, 17th, they will take pick No.2 into November's NAB AFL Draft.

 

[BlackGoanna]

lol, now we are talking about trading Murphy on top of Gibbs and we already have the worst midfield in the AFL?

 

[Aphrodite]

lol, now we are talking about trading Murphy on top of Gibbs and we already have the worst midfield in the AFL?

You forgot Weiters!

 

[Blugazi]

Where has this Murphy talk originated?

 

[HARKER]

lol, now we are talking about trading Murphy on top of Gibbs and we already have the worst midfield in the AFL?

We're talking about tradable commodity.
We want to be bold, with a view to the future, so how do we do it?

How do we keep a strong footing in the draft, whilst attracting players like Kelly? Something has to give.

 

[Aphrodite]

Where has this Murphy talk originated?

#BigFootyTrades

 

[Cutz]

I think people are forgetting we are a bottom 3 list at the moment. How are we going to improve by keeping every player who is "not bad" or "can teach the kids?"

That list of players in your previous post is almost half of our list - good luck trying to move out of the bottom 4 with rabble like that getting games.

Spot on..POTY this.

If our second and third tier players dont push up...it will be the same group thats trying to win us the 5 games we win every year...!

 

[james Dean]

Trading Murphy and Gibbs? I know Cripps is a beast but he isn't big enough to carry an entire team on his shoulders.

 

[Aphrodite]

Updated Free Agency List:-

http://www.carltonfc.com.au/sites/Carlton/news/2017-08-03/blues-updated-free-agency-list

Carlton’s unrestricted free agents include Dennis Armfield, Levi Casboult, Matthew Kreuzer, Kade Simpson and Simon White.

Under the AFL Player Rules, an unrestricted free agent may automatically move to the club of his choice. An offer to a restricted free agent may be matched by his club, which has right of first refusal over his services. If the restricted free agent player does not wish to remain with his original club, he must enter the draft or seek a trade.
Compensation in the form of AFL allocated draft picks will apply to clubs with a net loss of free agents, based on the formula determined by the AFL.

 

[full on the fence]

Whats the go with Jaksch ?? He seems to always be in the best for Northerns but cant get a run, wouldnt he be worth a crack for the last few games to see how he goes ??

 

[Coona Blues]

GWS would be the best fit, if Murphy was open to it.

1. Murphy would get a contract we won't be offering here. His contract expires next year.
2. If GWS do lose Kelly, Murphy would be a good replacement for him and would function better there than in our shallow midfield.
3. Speculation: Murphy may be happy to get out of Victoria for a while.
4. GWS may be happy to have his leadership and GWS are all about the now, whereas we're not.

If Murphy was to go, it may be sold that it was under his own steam. Neither Murphy nor the club would have to say it was the clubs wish.
See Tuohy last year and what came out of that? Win/Win

This is pretty much the only scenario I see in which the skipper would be moved on.
Your #3 had occurred to me, as well as a premiership opportunity.

Note GWS seen to be facing the prospect of Kelly and maybe Hopper, Smith, Whitfield, and even Kennedy
looking for greener pastures. Then in a couple of years Free Agency could hit them very hard. New wave of
Taranto, Setterfield and friends are going to take time to reach optimum. Not beyond the realms of possibility
they go flagless for a significant length of time.

Johnson and Shaw on their last legs, Griffen likely done and Deledio fragile, father time pressing Mummy.
Experience is going to be a premium quality for them very soon. Ward, Coniglio types provide leadership,
but may be a bit thin in that area.

Our skipper would be very attractive to them, as would Rayner in the draft, his tank not as big an issue to
them as it would be to us needing genuine mids.

The Gibbs scenario is intriguing. I am sure SOS would love the avenue to picks, although a single digit
draft pick would probably get it done alone given McGovern and Lever situations (possibly Cameron to
Brisbane too). Suspect Gibbs more about $'s and is a Blue. A little pay increase would likely convince
him to hang around if it was our preference given our "glut" of cap space.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Why would we pay Gibbs more?

He's got 2 years of a fat contract that he happily signed 3 years ago...weird

 

[BluesRule]

Very happy to read the article on the AFL website today in regards to our draft and trade strategy. I really think the team has done well in keeping their cards close to their chests and agree that a couple more mature midfielders （21-25y.o) are required to ease the burden on our youngsters.

Having a quick look at uncontracted players I would be surprised if we hadn't inquired about the services of several midfielders I would love to see in blue as well as a couple with some question marks over them. For this conversation I have left out the players already thrown around by many posters but I would love to hear peoples thoughts on whether the players below would be viewed as positive additions and what roles people think they would play in our young side.

Players I would be happy with the club targeting:
Brendon Ah Chee
Darcy Tucker
Ed Langdon
Harley Balic
Billy Hartung
Mitch Honeychurch

Player with question marks:
Cameron Ellis-Yolman
Jackson Merrett
Brandon Ellis

All good prospects but will come down to how SOS see's them in helping our cause and the trade cost. Do not want VFL players.

Really want to keep early picks as their is supposedly not much after the top 30 in the AFL draft, so we could trade in a few talented youngsters using later picks/$$$.

What about Hugh Greenwood (adelaide) = Big bodied 190+cm 25 year old midfield rookie, who is a bit player for Adelaide. I think he has a lot of upside and we know Adelaide are tight for cash. Would want to trade him in cheaply, maybe as steak knifes in Gibbs deal. Tasmanian boy. Imagine a bit more size in the middle.

or Bailey Dale (Dogs) is out of contract. Showed good signs in our game with Dogs but is not a lock for midfield games at the Dogs. Is developing and may have upside. Would cost our third round pick and $50K-$100K pa more than Dogs are offering. Would upgrade our midfield depth and would get games in 2018.

 

[1981]

What's everyone's thoughts on Doc? Specifically so we think he ends up a mid FT? He's moved in there lately but that might be more because we are short of numbers right now?

Personally I see him as a mid but we'd have to unearth some excellent HBs to replace he and Simmo.

 

[Carl Tone]

could we if we ever are going to trade Murphy I would say trade him to Brisbane a win win situation if you ask me we gain a high draft pick or picks and they get Murphy I only say Brisbane because of his dad playing at Fitzroy

So which paper do you write for? Just read your last 10 post. Every bit a fisherman.

 

[Carl Tone]

It won't come to this, but I'd be thrilled should Gibbs & Murphy net us Kelly & Hopper.
Some more would have to go out, but it may not amount to this years first pick.

Would something like be a start point;
Gibbs (what we get from Adelaide) , Murphy and Carltons next years first and a salary dump for Kelly, Hopper and GWS's next years first?

That, in a heart beat.

 

[HARKER]

What's everyone's thoughts on Doc? Specifically so we think he ends up a mid FT? He's moved in there lately but that might be more because we are short of numbers right now?

Personally I see him as a mid but we'd have to unearth some excellent HBs to replace he and Simmo.

I feel that his best will be in the back-line, by way of performance and by way of direction, but having him involved in the middle won't hurt either.
He's likely to be the player running that back-line and if not next year, then likely the next, with Simpson gone.