2018 MotoGP

[Klyntonius]

Simeon got stuck in didn't he !!!

Yes, when he should really keep his head down. Got owned by Aleix!

 

[imadodgyumpire]

What was the relevant tweet?

 

[hey shorty]

What was the relevant tweet?

Something along the lines of Espargaro having a crack at Petrucci for his riding style being equally as dangerous as Marquez.

Simeon blasted him.

 

[Klyntonius]

What was the relevant tweet?

Espargaro complained that Petrucci hit him harder than Marquez did but got no penalty*. Simeon called him a whiner. Espargaro told Simeon pay riders should keep their mouth shut. Simeon didn't appreciate that!

*Someone went on to post half a dozen pictures of incidents where Petrucci had punted guys over the years but received no penalty. It's not the first time riders have complained about his riding. Eugene Laverty voiced his approval. The Pramac team principal disapproved and Espargaro told him to piss off!

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Oh man. Simeon got buuuurrrrrrrrrnnnnnnned!!!!!!!

 

[Klyntonius]

So the 2019 MotoGP shake up continues. After the announcement of Tech3 moving to KTM machinery, reports are saying the Marc VDS team have signed a three year deal with Suzuki. This is after it was expected they'd take on the Yamaha satellite gig. Apart appears to be the front runner for the Yamaha's now.

And there is plenty of speculation of rider movement.

After what is looking like a couple of dismal years at Ducati, there are strong rumours of a shift to Suzuki to replace iannone and partner Rins. His spot at Ducati would be taken by Petrucci with Miller likely gaining the factory spec bike at Pramac and Pecco Bagnaia is already a confirmed Pramac starter for next year.

It is almost certain that Marquez will have a new teammate next season in the form of Johann Zarco, thus seeing the end of Pedrosa's long tenure there. Dani is expected to land at KTM, likely replacing Bradley Smith.

Oliveira would step up to replace Zarco on the Tech3 KTM, presumably partnering Syahrin.

Can't really complain about MotoGP being stagnant and lacking in interest at the moment!!

 

[hey shorty]

So you're saying George to Suzuki ?? Wonder where Iannone goes.

 

[Klyntonius]

Dunno about Iannone. He's not very popular within his Suzuki garage according to reports with attitude issues. He missed the last day of pre-season testing with illness, rumoured to be alcohol induced. Maybe he gets a gig with the satellite Suzuki team if they want someone with experience on that bike when they change over or perhaps his raw ability will entice the likes of Team Nieto (or whoever ends up the last in line Ducati team) to throw him a lifeline in hopes of improved finishes.

Or maybe he's finished.

 

[carloss]

So the 2019 MotoGP shake up continues. After the announcement of Tech3 moving to KTM machinery, reports are saying the Marc VDS team have signed a three year deal with Suzuki. This is after it was expected they'd take on the Yamaha satellite gig. Apart appears to be the front runner for the Yamaha's now.

And there is plenty of speculation of rider movement.

After what is looking like a couple of dismal years at Ducati, there are strong rumours of a shift to Suzuki to replace iannone and partner Rins. His spot at Ducati would be taken by Petrucci with Miller likely gaining the factory spec bike at Pramac and Pecco Bagnaia is already a confirmed Pramac starter for next year.

It is almost certain that Marquez will have a new teammate next season in the form of Johann Zarco, thus seeing the end of Pedrosa's long tenure there. Dani is expected to land at KTM, likely replacing Bradley Smith.

Oliveira would step up to replace Zarco on the Tech3 KTM, presumably partnering Syahrin.

Can't really complain about MotoGP being stagnant and lacking in interest at the moment!!

Would be good to see Miller on the factory spec bike.

 

[Klyntonius]

Would be good to see Miller on the factory spec bike.

If he can carry on through the season with his early form then I think it would be guaranteed. His current contract is directly with Ducati, not with Pramac, so they obviously see something in him to poach him from Honda.

 

[Klyntonius]

Today marks fifteen years since the demise of Daijiro Kato.

 

[hey shorty]

He could have been a champion, he really could have been

 

[Klyntonius]

He could have been a champion, he really could have been

Should've been Rossi's first great rival. And I agree, he'd have taken titles off him.

 

[Klyntonius]

So, the MotoGP circus has headed to the Circuit Of The Americas this weekend and controversy has abounded everywhere.

Firstly, there is the carry over tension from Argentina.
- Rossi accused Marquez of being dangerous and ruining MotoGP, stating he's scared to be on the same circuit as Marc.
- Marquez maintains it was just a mistake.
- both riders were excluded from the official press conference, I guess as a bid to calm things down, but then were each given their own standalone televised presser...
- there has been call from a number of riders for race direction to take stronger control of riding behaviour.
- Aleix Espargaro has continued to be vocal, suggesting they delete the black flag of it's not going to be used. He said flags are to protect riders. Blue flags to warn of faster riders, yellows for caution and black to remove dangerous riding.
- Zarco accused race direction of favoritism citing no black flag for Marquez in Argentina or for Rossi's kick in Sepang 2015 as examples.
- Jack Miller has called for calm, they are already riding their lives, they don't need the situation to be further inflamed. Cited Simoncelli and Pedrosa as an example.

In further news,
- Randy Mamola has been inducted as a legend, Zarco says he's not worthy.

The series came to the circuit with memories of last year and a track they found to be very bumpy. To rectify this, diamond grinding trucks have been used to shave down the bumps and smooth things out. But they've failed.
- the track is not only just as bumpy as before but maybe worse.
- in addition to the bumps, the shaved surfaces are said to be more abrasive with talk of potential mandatory pitstops.
- in addition to the bumps and abrasive surface, the grinding has left the circuit coated in a thick later of dust.
- the dust is so bad that the "roost" from another bike broke Jack Miller's screen!
- Miller said his bike is jumping the whole way down the back straight, the traction and wheelie control going haywire trying to figure out what is going on.
- tomorrow is forecast for rain, Miller is concerned riding will look like a Motocross race.

In terms of the actual riding, Iannone finished fastest but with Marquez and Viñales showing the best race pace.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Jesus! It's all happening in motogp!

I remember Kato, but don't remember getting as excited about him as you guys seem to. Do you really think he was that good?

I saw the Marquez/Rossi collision. It seemed plausible that Marquez could've made it, so I could believe a claim that it was a mistake.

Mamola inducted as a legend? Is that the same as getting in a HoF, or is it another level like legend status in the AFL? What was Zarco's reasoning before I agree or disagree?

 

[Klyntonius]

Kato was incredible. Only ride two years of 250GP, to four wins in this first year, obliterated the comp in his second year winning 11 of the 16 races and setting all sorts of records. 7th with two podiums in his debut MotoGP year, he really was set to be a perennial challenger and Japan's first truly elite to level talent.


Legend status is like the Hall Of Fame. Zarco thinks Mamola being in without a title is demeaning to champions. He has a point.
Two things of note, Simoncelli, Hayden and KRJr already lowered the note of "Legend status" and Biaggi being continually overlooked is a joke.

Marquez collision wasn't deliberate but it wasn't a mistake, it was reckless. Having already been penalised for an over the top move on Aleix Espargaro and going around 1.5 seconds a lap quicker than the rest of the field, his move on Rossi reeked of arrogance and disregard for others safety. Like a worse version of Verstappen.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Well. I'm not hugely bothered by the Marquez/Rossi collision atm.

Kato? I suppose maybe my memories are vague since I wasn't following closely as I was in the 90s.

Mamola? Zarco puts himself in a position where his record can be swiped at, particularly by Mamola. Does it demean champions? If it's put in context, I don't think so.

I only remember Mamola from the 92 season, so can't put the rest of his careerin context. However 4x2nd, 2x3rd and 13 wins is a substantial career. It's fair enough he gets in. All the champs should get in, regardless of how anyone can diminish their season, otherwise it then diminishes the accomplishment of winning a title.

But guys with a fair amount of wins and high places in the title are worthwhile as well. There's a grey line, so careers have to be put in context( particularly the riders who don't have much of a career in 500/motogp). Pedrosa would be in without question, Biaggi as well. But guys like Gibernau and Cadalora maybe just fallen a tad short. Simoncelli would be a sympathy entry, like Jason Richards in supercars.

 

[Klyntonius]

In isolation I wouldn't be too bothered by the Marquez-Rossi coming together either. It's just another incident. But given his career history of recklessness, it makes it not just another incident. People are saying Verstappen needed to be punished for the Vettel incident because it was his third incident in three races. Well, this was Marquez third penalty in one race! That's on top of a number of close calls in the practice sessions as well. It was like Moto2 Marquez had returned. He deserved every bit of the spotlight he received from his riding.

In terms of Mamola and the MotoGP legends, I'm not vehemently for or against. On one hand, Hall of fames are for those who you remember twenty or thirty years lately and think, wow, that guy was just amazing. Is that Mamola? I dunno but perhaps he gets extra credit for his excellent ambassadorship over the last 25 years.

To me to include every title winner as a hall of fame rider is like adding every best and fairest winner to a clubs Hall of fame. I dunno about you but I wouldn't call David Teague an all time great.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

I don't agree with that comparison. If you're not putting in 500/MotoGP champions automatically, then you're not rating the accomplishment of winning the WC in the top class.

 

[Klyntonius]

You're equally not rated it by putting guys in who couldn't win it.

 

[Klyntonius]

MotoGP qualifying results:

193Marc MARQUEZHonda2'03.658
225Maverick VIÑALESYamaha2'04.0640.4060.406
329Andrea IANNONESuzuki2'04.2090.5510.145
45Johann ZARCOYamaha2'04.2100.5520.001
546Valentino ROSSIYamaha2'04.2290.5710.019
699Jorge LORENZODucati2'04.2940.6360.065
735Cal CRUTCHLOWHonda2'04.4560.7980.162
84Andrea DOVIZIOSODucati2'04.8651.2070.409
926Dani PEDROSAHonda2'04.9631.3050.098
109Danilo PETRUCCIDucati2'05.0581.4000.095
1142Alex RINSSuzuki2'05.2601.6020.202
1244Pol ESPARGAROKTM2'05.8292.1710.569
Q1 Results:
Q244Pol ESPARGAROKTM2'05.169
Q29Danilo PETRUCCIDucati2'05.2450.0760.076
1330Takaaki NAKAGAMIHonda2'05.4570.2880.212
1453Tito RABATDucati2'05.6860.5170.229
1538Bradley SMITHKTM2'05.7610.5920.075
1655Hafizh SYAHRINYamaha2'05.8730.7040.112
1721Franco MORBIDELLIHonda2'05.9430.7740.070
1843Jack MILLERDucati2'05.9660.7970.023
1941Aleix ESPARGAROAprilia2'06.0350.8660.069
2012Thomas LUTHIHonda2'06.2221.0530.187
2119Alvaro BAUTISTADucati2'06.2961.1270.074
2245Scott REDDINGAprilia2'06.3701.2010.074
2317Karel ABRAHAMDucati2'06.5371.3680.167
2410Xavier SIMEONDucati2'06.7261.5570.189



Note: Race direction have followed through on the riders call for greater control and issued 3 place grid penalties on Marc Marquez and Pol Espargaro for riding like googs and dawdling on the race line. Marquez will start the race from fourth, Espargaro from 15th.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Hang on. There are guys who've had substantial career without winning a championship (I'm only including guys in the top class). I didn't see Mamola, so can't put his career in context. But like Biaggi and Pedrosa, he's finished in the top 3 in the standings 6 times. Despite not winning a title, that's a lot of success. You're genuinely a prominent rider that could be considered for a HoF type status.

 

[Klyntonius]

Nah, you're saying that to elevate the rating of a world championship the rider should automatically go into a hall of fame but also riders who couldn't win it all can also go. That's contradictory to me.
Also, Biaggi is a four time world champ, Pedrosa three times so they're deserving for that alone.

Anyway, we clearly have different ideas of what a hall of fame should be.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Hang on. We can still carry on with this.

Being a WC in classes below 500/Motogp doesn't really count as an elite, hof level rider. Below 500/Motogp, you're avoiding the harder bikes and better riders. 250/moto2/125/moto3 titles are pretty good, but it's not as good as finishing top 3, maybe even top6 of 500/motogp.

I didn't even think about Biaggi being a 4x250 champ or Pedrosa'a titles. Overall, those competitions are stepping stones on the way to joining the big dogs, even though they're on the same calendar/race meetings.

 

[hey shorty]

For mine Biaggi should be in there, Pedrosa not so much. Dani has had the benefit of the best equipment for most of his career and really failed to do much with it.